Charlatan "girl against flouride" finally exposed

Lefticus Loonaticus

Chancer3001 wrote: »

All that says is you can't give people "medicine" that hasn't been tested.

Fluoride has been tested over and over again.

Shows it's fine.

We've been over that a zillion times in this thread.

The seventh paragraph of the link provided.

".....the toxicology of hexafluorosilicic acid used for water fluoridation in ireland and its hexafluorosilicate compounds are unknown and completely uninvestigated."

Didnt know it was mentioned earlier in thread.

Chancer3001

The hexa.... We use is the exact same as the stuff they use in America.

So yes. It has been investigated. Over and over.

Just because that guy says it hasn't, doesn't mean all the research never happened.

Chancer3001

http://whqlibdoc.who.int/trs/WHO_TRS_846.pdf

A pretty great read if you're into this sort of thing.

It's a solid, well written report by The World Health Organisation on how they prefer flouride be delivered, pros, cons, testing etc etc.

Lefticus Loonaticus

Chancer3001 wrote: »

The hexa.... We use is the exact same as the stuff they use in America.

So yes. It has been investigated. Over and over.

Just because that guy says it hasn't, doesn't mean all the research never happened.

Hang on a second. I just realized this is afterhours, and im allowed to take the savage piss.

News Report!!!!!!

'Corporate america produces investigative results which approves its own practice of dumping toxic waste into the water supplies of its own people to gain even more profits for itself.'

'Ireland, like an idiot, still goes along with the practice even though its been completely exposed and discredited.'

What a surprise!

(Note: Declan Waugh has more credibility than the combined total of every tard in the dail who voted down sinn feins bill.)

Canis Lupus

Lefticus Loonaticus wrote: »

Hang on a second. I just realized this is afterhours, and im allowed to take the savage piss.

News Report!!!!!!

'Corporate america produces investigative results which approves its own practice of dumping toxic waste into the water supplies of its own people to gain even more profits for itself.'

'Ireland, like an idiot, still goes along with the practice even though its been completely exposed and discredited.'

What a surprise!

(Note: Declan Waugh has more credibility than the combined total of every tard in the dail who voted down sinn feins bill.)

Taking the 'savage piss' might make you feel good about yourself but it makes your argument that flouride is bad, look weak.

Capt'n Midnight

Lefticus Loonaticus wrote: »

2005, European Court of Justice. No medical product may be given to consumers without appropriate scientific risk assessments.

The fact that there are legal limits implies that risk assessment was carried out. Again a reminder that natural water in many parts of the world would be illegal here because of the amount of fluoride.

Also you don't need to specifically test everything. Many things were grandfathered in because they were safe.
http://www.fda.gov/Food/IngredientsPackagingLabeling/GRAS/

"GRAS" is an acronym for the phrase Generally Recognized As Safe. Under sections 201(s) and 409 of the Federal Food, Drug, and Cosmetic Act (the Act), any substance that is intentionally added to food is a food additive, that is subject to premarket review and approval by FDA, unless the substance is generally recognized, among qualified experts, as having been adequately shown to be safe under the conditions of its intended use, or unless the use of the substance is otherwise excluded from the definition of a food additive.

Under sections 201(s) and 409 of the Act, and FDA's implementing regulations in 21 CFR 170.3 and 21 CFR 170.30, the use of a food substance may be GRAS either through scientific procedures or, for a substance used in food before 1958, through experience based on common use in food.

Under 21 CFR 170.30(b), general recognition of safety through scientific procedures requires the same quantity and quality of scientific evidence as is required to obtain approval of the substance as a food additive and ordinarily is based upon published studies, which may be corroborated by unpublished studies and other data and information.
Under 21 CFR 170.30(c) and 170.3(f), general recognition of safety through experience based on common use in foods requires a substantial history of consumption for food use by a significant number of consumers.

Since the fluoride band wagon started we've banned many things that have caused real health issues because there was real evidence.

And again fluoride is just deflecting attention from real issues. People are dying ever day from preventable stuff like road traffic accidents, suicide, cuts to health spending etc. And all the time dragging up an anti-communist phobia from the 1940's is delaying discussion and action on those.


It's very simple. If you don't want fluoride buy a filter or drink bottled water. Do it that way and you don't impose a health burden on the rest of us.

deisedevil

Wurly wrote: »

link?


link?


How do you know that vaccinations are not toxic to the human body? How do you know that flouride isn't really bad news for us either?

http://howdovaccinescauseautism.com/

Tipsy McSwagger

melissak wrote: »

What does any of this prove? She is entitled to have opinions about whatever she likes. How do you know vaccinations are good for you? "They" said thalidomide was good for pregnant women. "They" said pesticides were safe.

Scientists, doctors etc have said a lot that has been since proven untrue. How do you know castor oil isn't great for you? Have you studied it?? I have no idea either as I haven't heard of it before but that doesn't mean that i could categorically say that it is true or not. The point is that a huge amount of scientists worldwide have concluded that fluoridation is not good for you. That's why they don't fluoridate water in other countries.
My main concern with fluoride is the effect it may have on bottlefed babies and young children. I personally cannot see how it would be good for their underdeveloped systems and as a parent i believe that people have a right to demand what they believe is healthier for their children, whatever that may be according to their informed opinion.

I think fair play to this girl to put her money where her mouth is as it were and to get up and make a stand about something she feels strongly about instead of just accepting it when she genuinely believes people are being poisoned. Goes to show those who can do and those who can't bitch and moan and criticize those who do. Go ahead drink the fluoridated water, that choice is your right. Just the same as those who choose to have clean water also have rights. That's the joy of democracy.

You're entitled to your own opinions but you are not entitled to your own facts.

Filibuster

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

The fact that there are legal limits implies that risk assessment was carried out. Again a reminder that natural water in many parts of the world would be illegal here because of the amount of fluoride.

Also you don't need to specifically test everything. Many things were grandfathered in because they were safe.
http://www.fda.gov/Food/IngredientsPackagingLabeling/GRAS/



Since the fluoride band wagon started we've banned many things that have caused real health issues because there was real evidence.

And again fluoride is just deflecting attention from real issues. People are dying ever day from preventable stuff like road traffic accidents, suicide, cuts to health spending etc. And all the time dragging up an anti-communist phobia from the 1940's is delaying discussion and action on those.


It's very simple. If you don't want fluoride buy a filter or drink bottled water. Do it that way and you don't impose a health burden on the rest of us.

Legal limits don't mean a thing in a mass medication program like flouridation. One person in this county could drink 8litres of flouridated tap water a day while their neighbour drinks none.

Flouride is toxic and a poison and affects brain development.

Please note the following research which was published in the Journal Environmental Health Perspectives (One of the worlds leading public health journals, has a higher impact factor that the WHO - World Health Organisation):

Developmental Fluoride Neurotoxicity: A Systematic Review and Meta-Analysis


Results: The standardized weighted mean difference in IQ score between exposed and reference populations was –0.45 (95% confidence interval: –0.56, –0.35) using a random-effects model. Thus, children in high-fluoride areas had significantly lower IQ scores than those who lived in low-fluoride areas. Subgroup and sensitivity analyses also indicated inverse associations, although the substantial heterogeneity did not appear to decrease.

Conclusions: The results support the possibility of an adverse effect of high fluoride exposure on children’s neurodevelopment. Future research should include detailed individual-level information on prenatal exposure, neurobehavioral performance, and covariates for adjustment.


http://ehp.niehs.nih.gov/1104912/

http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/news/features/fluoride-childrens-health-grandjean-choi/

Jonny7

Filibuster wrote: »

Flouride is toxic and a poison and affects brain development.

*stops brushing teeth, looks at toothbrush... oh my god

Filibuster

Jonny7 wrote: »

*stops brushing teeth, looks at toothbrush... oh my god

“If you accidentally swallow more than used for brushing, seek professional help or contact a poison control center immediately.” - from the back of your toothpaste box

P. Breathnach

Filibuster wrote: »

...
Please note the following research which was published in the Journal Environmental Health Perspectives (One of the worlds leading public health journals, has a higher impact factor that the WHO - World Health Organisation):

The report deals with levels of flouride significantly higher than found in flouridated domestic water systems:

... the NRC report examined the potential adverse effects of fluoride at 2–4 mg/L in drinking water and not the benefits or potential risks that may occur when fluoride is added to public water supplies at lower concentrations (0.7–1.2 mg/L)...

Jonny7

Flouride is just internet alarmism, and deflects from very real problem chemicals like Dihydrogen Monoxide

to quote:

"Dihydrogen monoxide:

is called "hydroxyl acid", the substance is the major component of acid rain.
contributes to the "greenhouse effect".
may cause severe burns.
is fatal if inhaled.
contributes to the erosion of our natural landscape.
accelerates corrosion and rusting of many metals.
may cause electrical failures and decreased effectiveness of automobile brakes.
has been found in excised tumors of terminal cancer patients.

Despite the danger, dihydrogen monoxide is often used:

as an industrial solvent and coolant.
in nuclear power plants.
in the production of Styrofoam.
as a fire retardant.
in many forms of cruel animal research.
in the distribution of pesticides. Even after washing, product remains contaminated by this chemical.
as an additive in certain "junk-foods" and other food products."

Corkfeen

Filibuster wrote: »

“If you accidentally swallow more than used for brushing, seek professional help or contact a poison control center immediately.” - from the back of your toothpaste box

I just checked two different packets of toothpaste,neither have that written on them. :rolleyes:

Filibuster

P. Breathnach wrote: »

The report deals with levels of flouride significantly higher than found in flouridated domestic water systems:

Eh that was a different study (NRC 2006) then the one I referenced. The sentence you quoted just says that that particular study (NRC 2006) didn't look at the potential effect of of exposure to lower levels of flouride concentration. Nothing else. You then omitted the very next sentence:

In conclusion, our results support the possibility of adverse effects of fluoride exposures on children’s neurodevelopment.

http://ehp.niehs.nih.gov/1104912/

rawn

Filibuster wrote: »

“If you accidentally swallow more than used for brushing, seek professional help or contact a poison control center immediately.” - from the back of your toothpaste box

Erm I'm sure that the amount of fluoride in toothpaste is in way higher concentration than in water, hence the warning

Filibuster

rawn wrote: »

Erm I'm sure that the amount of fluoride in toothpaste is in way higher concentration than in water, hence the warning

Yeah I don't care about flouride in toothpaste. You're not supposed to ingest it hence the warnings about only giving a child a pea sized amount of toothpaste etc. I would however prefer if the state didn't medicate me without my wishes with a neurotoxic poison.

jh79

Filibuster wrote: »

Yeah I don't care about flouride in toothpaste. You're not supposed to ingest it hence the warnings about only giving a child a pea sized amount of toothpaste etc. I would however prefer if the state didn't medicate me without my wishes with a neurotoxic poison.

It's not a neurotoxin at 1ppm so nothing to worry about.

Muise...

Filibuster wrote: »

Yeah I don't care about flouride in toothpaste. You're not supposed to ingest it hence the warnings about only giving a child a pea sized amount of toothpaste etc. I would however prefer if the state didn't medicate me without my wishes with a neurotoxic poison.

Dosage is what makes poison. You know, like the way homeopathic cyanide is completely safe. Oh, wait, is that a thing of yours too?

rawn

Filibuster wrote: »

Yeah I don't care about flouride in toothpaste. You're not supposed to ingest it hence the warnings about only giving a child a pea sized amount of toothpaste etc. I would however prefer if the state didn't medicate me without my wishes with a neurotoxic poison.

They're whole stance on that is that it's free and you're not being forced to drink it. The only good thing about water charges coming in is you will have a better leg to stand on when asking them to remove it from the water. I'm not sure I buy into the supposed dangers of it but I do know that tap water is fooking rank and if I'm gonna pay for it the quality better improve!

Billy86

Corkfeen wrote: »

I just checked two different packets of toothpaste,neither have that written on them. :rolleyes:

Details shmetails, buddy!

Jonny7

Filibuster wrote: »

Yeah I don't care about flouride in toothpaste. You're not supposed to ingest it hence the warnings about only giving a child a pea sized amount of toothpaste etc. I would however prefer if the state didn't medicate me without my wishes with a neurotoxic poison.

What about the flouride that naturally occurs in water, is that a neurotoxic poison?

Lefticus Loonaticus

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

It's very simple. If you don't want fluoride buy a filter or drink bottled water. Do it that way and you don't impose a health burden on the rest of us.

Right. Let me try to make sense of what you have just said.

You are saying that, because you are so incompetent that you cant brush your own teeth, that the government has a right to buy industrial waste and dump it into the entire public water supply, on the basis that its going to find its way all the way to your teeth, and that by arguing against this, I, am effectively causing a health burden to you and the rest of the country.

Now, ive never really been a proponent of the 'fluoride makes you stupid argument', but by gawd........ i think we may have stumbled upon actually evidence supporting that theory.

Muise...

Lefticus Loonaticus wrote: »

Right. Let me try to make sense of what you have just said.

You are saying that, because you are so incompetent that you cant brush your own teeth, that the government has a right to buy industrial waste and dump it into the entire public water supply, on the basis that its going to find its way all the way to your teeth, and that by arguing against this, I, am effectively causing a health burden to you and the rest of the country.

Now, ive never really been a proponent of the 'fluoride makes you stupid argument', but by gawd........ i think we may have stumbled upon actually evidence supporting that theory.

No, I think the good captain is saying that because you are so gullible and neurotic, you should buy your own water and leave the rest of us in peace.

Jonny7

Lefticus Loonaticus wrote: »

Right. Let me try to make sense of what you have just said.

You are saying that, because you are so incompetent that you cant brush your own teeth, that the government has a right to buy industrial waste and dump it into the entire public water supply, on the basis that its going to find its way all the way to your teeth, and that by arguing against this, I, am effectively causing a health burden to you and the rest of the country.

Now, ive never really been a proponent of the 'fluoride makes you stupid argument', but by gawd........ i think we may have stumbled upon actually evidence supporting that theory.

If you drink natural water anywhere in the world you are being flourided.

Chancer3001

FLOURIDE IS INDUSTRIAL WASTE!!!!!!!

So?

It's no more industrial waste than say buying egg whites from a company that only uses the yolk.

Ahhhhh that industry doesn't want the whites and they're going to waste. Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.

Frynge

Jonny7 wrote: »

Flouride is just internet alarmism, and deflects from very real problem chemicals like Dihydrogen Monoxide

to quote:

I see what you did there.

Jonny7

I'm gonna start a new one

CHLORINE - THE SILENT KILLER

Chlorine, we're well familiar, it's in all the nation's pool, and "they" tell us to put in our pools.. but little did you know, IT WAS USED AS A CHEMICAL WARFARE AGENT..

and your kids, are swimming in it!

Lefticus Loonaticus

Muise... wrote: »

No, I think the good captain is saying that because you are so gullible and neurotic, you should buy your own water and leave the rest of us in peace.

Its quite the opposite really. People who want to consume fluoride can go source it themselves and sprinkle it on their toast without dosing the rest of us with it.

Lefticus Loonaticus

Jonny7 wrote: »

I'm gonna start a new one

CHLORINE - THE SILENT KILLER

Chlorine, we're well familiar, it's in all the nation's pool, and "they" tell us to put in our pools.. but little did you know, IT WAS USED AS A CHEMICAL WARFARE AGENT..

and your kids, are swimming in it!

Theres good reason to put chlorine in the water. Theres fuk all reason to keep fluoride in.

Canis Lupus

Lefticus Loonaticus wrote: »

Theres good reason to put chlorine in the water. Theres fuk all reason to keep fluoride in.

Yes there is.

jh79

Lefticus Loonaticus wrote: »

Theres good reason to put chlorine in the water. Theres fuk all reason to keep fluoride in.

So why not base your argument against fluoridation around this point rather than pretending there are health risks involved?

Canis Lupus

jh79 wrote: »

So why not base your argument against fluoridation around this point rather than pretending there are health risks involved?

Because his argument is less effective if it doesn't cause fear.

Muise...

Canis Lupus wrote: »

Because his argument is less effective if it doesn't cause fear.

fear and lulz.

Lefticus Loonaticus

Canis Lupus wrote: »

Yes there is.

Theres reason to have fluoride topically applied to teeth. Whether agree or disagree like some do.

Theres no reason at all to put it into the public water supplies, no reason to ingest it, no reason to have it in our food, our alcohol, no reason to use it on plants or gardens or in the wider agricultural use, no reason to shower in it, no reason to continue the policy.

From the indo today ->

http://www.independent.ie/lifestyle/argument-for-fluoridation-doesnt-hold-water-30033931.html

"This poison, banned by the EU in 2006, is a component of toxic waste industrial chemicals. Yet it's been pumped into our water since 1964 to reduce dental decay. This despite the fact that experts now cite that fluoride works only on the surface of your teeth. Which means drinking it to prevent tooth decay is akin to swigging sunscreen to prevent sunburn.


Furthermore, this non-biodegradable and highly corrosive acid is contaminated with a number of heavy metals, including arsenic, aluminium, lead and mercury. It is known to be a risk factor in the development of many serious health problems, including cardiovascular and neurological disease, type 1 diabetes, osteoporosis, chronic fatigue and depression."

(Edit; Hmmm, if the indo are hiring gullible and neurotic people to write mad crazy articles to whip up public hysteria i might drop in a CV.)

Canis Lupus

Lefticus Loonaticus wrote: »

Theres reason to have fluoride topically applied to teeth. Whether agree or disagree like some do.

Theres no reason at all to put it into the public water supplies, no reason to ingest it, no reason to have it in our food, our alcohol, no reason to use it on plants or gardens or in the wider agricultural use, no reason to shower in it, no reason to continue the policy.

From the indo today ->

http://www.independent.ie/lifestyle/argument-for-fluoridation-doesnt-hold-water-30033931.html

"This poison, banned by the EU in 2006, is a component of toxic waste industrial chemicals. Yet it's been pumped into our water since 1964 to reduce dental decay. This despite the fact that experts now cite that fluoride works only on the surface of your teeth. Which means drinking it to prevent tooth decay is akin to swigging sunscreen to prevent sunburn.


Furthermore, this non-biodegradable and highly corrosive acid is contaminated with a number of heavy metals, including arsenic, aluminium, lead and mercury. It is known to be a risk factor in the development of many serious health problems, including cardiovascular and neurological disease, type 1 diabetes, osteoporosis, chronic fatigue and depression."

It's good for your teeth and not harmful at the levels used. What's to complain about. I love it.

ClovenHoof

mango salsa wrote: »

Basically she has no credible recognised qualifications despite claiming to be a qualified scientist. Her campaign team believe in crap like the pill causes gayness and castor oil mixed with urine cures cancer. Her and her campaign are also anti vaccination. As well as that the critiques of the Waugh report show that it lacks any serious scientific credibility.

She never said anything like this from what I've read? Why the hatred? All she wants is for Fluoride to be a topical treatment like it is in most of Europe and not ingested.

How is this so appalling to you?

jh79

Lefticus Loonaticus wrote: »

Theres reason to have fluoride topically applied to teeth. Whether agree or disagree like some do.

Theres no reason at all to put it into the public water supplies, no reason to ingest it, no reason to have it in our food, our alcohol, no reason to use it on plants or gardens or in the wider agricultural use, no reason to shower in it, no reason to continue the policy.

From the indo today ->

http://www.independent.ie/lifestyle/argument-for-fluoridation-doesnt-hold-water-30033931.html

"This poison, banned by the EU in 2006, is a component of toxic waste industrial chemicals. Yet it's been pumped into our water since 1964 to reduce dental decay. This despite the fact that experts now cite that fluoride works only on the surface of your teeth. Which means drinking it to prevent tooth decay is akin to swigging sunscreen to prevent sunburn.


Furthermore, this non-biodegradable and highly corrosive acid is contaminated with a number of heavy metals, including arsenic, aluminium, lead and mercury. It is known to be a risk factor in the development of many serious health problems, including cardiovascular and neurological disease, type 1 diabetes, osteoporosis, chronic fatigue and depression."

(Edit; Hmmm, if the indo are hiring gullible and neurotic people to write mad crazy articles to whip up public hysteria i might drop in a CV.)

How come you posted an opinion piece from the lifestyle section rather than actual scientific papers ? Would it be that no research actually backs these opinions?

jh79

ClovenHoof wrote: »

She never said anything like this from what I've read? Why the hatred? All she wants is for Fluoride to be a topical treatment like it is in most of Europe and not ingested.

How is this so appalling to you?

She has on facebook. She is dangerous plenty of gullible people out there if they believe her crap on fluoride god knows what else they could be taken in by.

ClovenHoof

Amazingfun wrote: »

It's hard to believe this weak thread was started by a Mod. But I guess that explains why it's still going.....

I think that says more about Boards than anything else. Shocking.

ClovenHoof

jh79 wrote: »

She has on facebook. She is dangerous plenty of gullible people out there if they believe her crap on fluoride god knows what else they could be taken in by.

I was told a person on Facebook claimed they saw a cow being blown into the sky by the wind.

Without a screen shot of her saying this on Facebook. You are just a Conspiracy Theorist yourself.

If you want to see dangerous, gullible people damaging the country look no further than the average Irish FF, FG, Lab, SF voter.

The_Captain

Fúcks sake, if I had known that mixing castor oil and urine caused cancer, I wouldn't have drank so much of it

jh79

ClovenHoof wrote: »

I was told a person on Facebook claimed they saw a cow being blown into the sky by the wind.

Without a screen shot of her saying this on Facebook. You are just a Conspiracy Theorist yourself.

If you want to see dangerous, gullible people damaging the country look no further than the average Irish FF, FG, Lab, SF voter.

Her opinions on fluoride are crazy enough for me and people believe those not hard to imagine she has other crazy ideas . She is "qualified" in some crazy alt medicine nonsense too so she fits the stereotype.

Muise...

ClovenHoof wrote: »

She never said anything like this from what I've read? Why the hatred? All she wants is for Fluoride to be a topical treatment like it is in most of Europe and not ingested.

How is this so appalling to you?

1. In many European countries it is added to food, not water.

2. What is appalling to me is that if the campaign is successful -and I can only see this happening on the abstract, ethical, argument of fluoridation being a medication rather than a nutritional additive - those flibbertibbets of woo will think that they have a handle on reality and we'll live in a land of dreamcatchers and illness.

seano12

http://www.infowars.com/harvard-study-fluoride-lowers-childrens-intelligence-by-7-iq-points/


Wake Up

The Nazis used fluoride in the concentration camps too

Google Dental fluorosis

fluorosilicic acid is toxic waste

Corkfeen

ClovenHoof wrote: »

I was told a person on Facebook claimed they saw a cow being blown into the sky by the wind.

Without a screen shot of her saying this on Facebook. You are just a Conspiracy Theorist yourself.

If you want to see dangerous, gullible people damaging the country look no further than the average Irish FF, FG, Lab, SF voter.

Luke Flanagan actually had to disassociate himself from her because of some of their more bizarre statement.

Jonny7

Lefticus Loonaticus wrote: »

From the indo today ->

http://www.independent.ie/lifestyle/argument-for-fluoridation-doesnt-hold-water-30033931.html

Heavily editorialised opinion piece

It simply does what I demonstrated earlier in this thread using the same techniques

As another poster pointed out, dosage is absolute key

For example, lack of sodium chloride and you die, too much and you die

Correct dosage of sunlight.. beneficial.. higher dosage of sunlight, dangerous

There are so many examples of this but fundamentally, it seems, that some simply cannot understand this concept and cling to the dogmatic belief that "poison is poison"

Which bears repeating, if you drink non-fluoridated water - it's still fluoridated naturally!.. in some cases so high that it's dangerous because of...

Dosage.

Capt'n Midnight

P. Breathnach wrote: »

The report deals with levels of flouride significantly higher than found in flouridated domestic water systems:

They are not just "significantly higher", in the EU they are illegal.

ClovenHoof

Corkfeen wrote: »

Luke Flanagan actually had to disassociate himself from her because of some of their more bizarre statement.

Do you have a link for his dissociation from her?

Lefticus Loonaticus

Muise... wrote: »

1. In many European countries it is added to food, not water.

In many(if not all!) european countries the idea of forcing medication on people through tap water would be considered a fascist policy. The utter disrespect and contempt held in this country for the anti-fluoride campaign is doing more to increase the resistance than the campaign itself!

How dare irish people have their own opinions!