Is the Bechdel test sexist?

tritium

Reekwind wrote: »

Name me a mainstream film that is sexist in its portrayal of men. I honestly can't think of one

Nice way to ignore the question I posed and then reask the one I addressed. Here we go so for examples of movies that stereotype other groups.

I love you Philip morris: gay men
Die hard: one dimensional male stereotype
Sex and the city: unrealistic view of one dimensional male characters
One flew over the Cuckoos nest: view of mental illness
Home alone: children stereotyped as destructive imps
(See what I did there? Gee think ill make up a bull**** test now and become famous)

The presence of a male character is irrelevant: the 'test' looks at the roles that female characters have in the film to gauge (roughly) how the latter portrays women. That's all

I think you'll find that's the op point- the test is sexist because it only considers if the women in a movie are stereotyped. I'm afraid you're violently agreeing with the op whether you realise it of not

Yes. First of all, the notion that the 'test' is "sexist" because it's "one-sided" is silly. This is not some scientific examination as to the fender balance of a film; it's a rough pass/fail guide to sexist portrayals of women. It's not sexist to call out sexism in the film industry

It is sexist though (and dishonest) to use a pseudo scientific piece of voodoo to give you the answer you want to this question then whine that its clear evidence of a problem

You probably didn't do yourself any favours by suggesting that the latter (sexism in Hollywood) is "irrelevant"

I think you'll find that the most relevant aspect of Hollywood is the dollar sign. If this distresses you take your money elsewhere maybe? Just don't point to some hocus pocus self serving crap "test" as your reason, because its nonsense

kiffer

Just apply the rule and it's obvious male related equivalent to the next few films you watch...

Do any women talk to each other about anything other than a male character?
Do any men talk to each other about anything other than a female character?

I think you could be hard pressed in finding a film that would fail the second test...

I read through the thread and people were talking about stereotyping... it's not testing that sort of thing, you'd need a much more complex and subjective judgement based rule to work that out...

Imagine a scene, two women in torn clothes are fleeing a burning building with Hero McWalnutjaw, while go getter male solves escape puzzle in the next room, one woman cries out suddenly, "Gah! I've broken a nail!", the other replies, "when we get out of here let's get manicures", to which the first says "and pedicures! *te he he*".
This passes the test but doesn't mean they aren't stereotyped...
and just because Hero McWalnutjaw gets to solve every problem and kill all the bad guys and talk to men and women about the plot and the car parking and everything else doesn't mean he isn't stereotyped as a man with basically two modes, "killing/solving problems" and "time to get the ride"

tritium

kiffer wrote: »

Just apply the rule and it's obvious male related equivalent to the next few films you watch...

Do any women talk to each other about anything other than a male character?
Do any men talk to each other about anything other than a female character?

I think you could be hard pressed in finding a film that would fail the second test...

I read through the thread and people were talking about stereotyping... it's not testing that sort of thing, you'd need a much more complex and subjective judgement based rule to work that out...

Imagine a scene, two women in torn clothes are fleeing a burning building with Hero McWalnutjaw, while go getter male solves escape puzzle in the next room, one woman cries out suddenly, "Gah! I've broken a nail!", the other replies, "when we get out of here let's get manicures", to which the first says "and pedicures! *te he he*".
This passes the test but doesn't mean they aren't stereotyped...
and just because Hero McWalnutjaw gets to solve every problem and kill all the bad guys and talk to men and women about the plot and the car parking and everything else doesn't mean he isn't stereotyped as a man with basically two modes, "killing/solving problems" and "time to get the ride"

Really struggling from your post to understand which side of the debate you're aligning yourself with?

Anyway, on your first point, the analogous 'test' (I use the term loosely) doesn't simply replace 'woman' with 'man' (though sex and the city would likely fail your criteria)

To illustrate how flawed the test is let's expand your mcWalnutjaw example- do the Mexican looking baddies have deep meaningfuls about their children? Does mcWalnutjaws tough all american black ops team discuss their feelings in depth? Unlikely I'd guess.

Why? Because the bulk of a films cast are basically padding. You don't get character development in 90 minutes- and thats actually fine since they're peripheral to the main story. All we see of most characters is a simplistic snapshot. Hollywood thrives on putting stereotypes of every social group on the screen, and people go to see it and lap it up.

If you want to change the paradigm by all means make your own movies and see if the public want change. Just don't try to enforce social engineering on the back of a bull**** test and faux outrage.