Be still my beating heart

AuldManKing

Firedance wrote: »

yes I was, was out marshalling then went in for some cake :-) I did see AMK but was not certain if it was him so chickened out of saying hi, we really gotta get a secret boards something or other so we can recognise each other!! Well done again :-)

Say hello next time

RedRunner

A lot of positives to take from that today A. Tough windy day so a great session if nothing else. Race experience under the belt. Signs of mental strength that is O so important.

You'll conquer the nerves with more experience don't worry. They won't disappear but you will embrace them and use them to your advantage . Well done on a good honest effort.


....The only real negative from today.....Well..... I wasn't there ;-)

Gavlor

This is not going to be a popular post in this particular training log.

You've stated before that you get really nervous before races, to be honest I have no idea why a mid pack runner like you or me would get nervous before a race but that's not my point here. Your coach, knowing your pre race jitters, made a point of analysing every mile, what to in the wind, what if your lace opens, what if your hair goes into your mouth etc etc. That type of advice will always feed your nerves, it adds to the tension.

You should try ignore that advice and ignore boards before your next race as it doesn't help you one bit.

I've prob wasted my time posting this but I think you need a break from the back slapping.

annapr

AuldManKing wrote: »

Say hello next time

Might be time to post that pin up picture again

Dubgal72

Gavlor wrote: »

This is not going to be a popular post in this particular training log.

You've stated before that you get really nervous before races, to be honest I have no idea why a mid pack runner like you or me would get nervous before a race but that's not my point here. Your coach, knowing your pre race jitters, made a point of analysing every mile, what to in the wind, what if your lace opens, what if your hair goes into your mouth etc etc. That type of advice will always feed your nerves, it adds to the tension.

You should try ignore that advice and ignore boards before your next race as it doesn't help you one bit.

I've prob wasted my time posting this but I think you need a break from the back slapping.

Hi Gavlor, I think you snipped half your post...the 'constructive advice bit' is missing...

Ososlo

Gavlor wrote: »

This is not going to be a popular post in this particular training log.

You've stated before that you get really nervous before races, to be honest I have no idea why a mid pack runner like you or me would get nervous before a race but that's not my point here. Your coach, knowing your pre race jitters, made a point of analysing every mile, what to in the wind, what if your lace opens, what if your hair goes into your mouth etc etc. That type of advice will always feed your nerves, it adds to the tension.

You should try ignore that advice and ignore boards before your next race as it doesn't help you one bit.

I've prob wasted my time posting this but I think you need a break from the back slapping.

ah no it wasn't like that at all. it was just a bit of friendly advice. I also consulted with the other weatherman in my life and he also gave me a few tips.

BTW I did try and ignore Boards before this race!!!!! I posted Monday and my plan was not to post until after the race, however, I had a little visitor in the meantime and I couldn't hold back from responding. Therein lies my weakness.

I'm not inviting backslapping and I abhor that term.
Your comments are always welcome.

Gavlor

Dubgal72 wrote: »

Hi Gavlor, I think you snipped half your post...the 'constructive advice bit' is missing... [/


That pretty much sums up what's wrong with boards.



As the saying goes, if you always do what you've always done you'll always get what you've always got.

Dubgal72

Hey A, fwiw, I think you're doing a grand job. You're aware of all the areas that need work and I can see incremental improvements each time. Your inner strengths for facing your demons is 'wow', time after time you do it. Well done on resisting a dnf too. Perhaps you spent too much time in the car? It's a tricky one to call: I would absolutely hate to get to a race with only *just enough* time to register, warm up etc but on the other hand, there is such a thing as too early....
Onwards and like everyone here, love and appreciate the honesty. Do not change that!

Dubgal72

Gavlor wrote: »

Dubgal72 wrote: »

Hi Gavlor, I think you snipped half your post...the 'constructive advice bit' is missing... [/


That pretty much sums up what's wrong with boards.



As the saying goes, if you always do what you've always done you'll always get what you've always got.

perhaps our humours are a little divergent.

Firedance

Gavlor wrote: »

Dubgal72 wrote: »

Hi Gavlor, I think you snipped half your post...the 'constructive advice bit' is missing... [/


As the saying goes, if you always do what you've always done you'll always get what you've always got.

do you mean repeating the same mistakes? probably something I'd be guilty of.. the older you get, the harder it is to change... and I'm only speaking for myself in that in that comment!

Duanington

Fair play to you A - I think we all underestimate just how big the mental side of this running\training\racing craic is - obviously for some, its no bother at all...they just rock up to the start line and run. For the rest of us mortals, there's usually a whole range of conversations to be had with those doubting devils that lurk in the shadows!

I don't know what your various running targets were for the day but to be honest, the actual running result should come secondary.... overcoming the situation that unfolded by finishing as strong as you did HAS to be a good result. Well done.

AuldManKing

Duanington wrote: »

Fair play to you A - I think we all underestimate just how big the mental side of this running\training\racing craic is - obviously for some, its no bother at all...they just rock up to the start line and run. For the rest of us mortals, there's usually a whole range of conversations to be had with those doubting devils that lurk in the shadows!

I don't know what your various running targets were for the day but to be honest, the actual running result should come secondary.... overcoming the situation that unfolded by finishing as strong as you did HAS to be a good result. Well done.

+1

Murph_D

Another tough day, O. I share your disappointment because I can see plainly that you're not doing yourself justice when it comes to race day - and that's when it's all supposed to come together if you've got things right. So something is not right, that's for sure. And you're the best placed person to know what that is. I'm sure you'll figure it out, and I look forward to seeing you enjoy a race, which is supposed to be the reward for all the work you are doing, and doing well.

The most obvious suggestion has been made many times and I think it's still the best: parkrun.

Ososlo

Murph_D wrote: »

Another tough day, O. I share your disappointment because I can see plainly that you're not doing yourself justice when it comes to race day - and that's when it's all supposed to come together if you've got things right. So something is not right, that's for sure. And you're the best placed person to know what that is. I'm sure you'll figure it out, and I look forward to seeing you enjoy a race, which is supposed to be the reward for all the work you are doing, and doing well.

The most obvious suggestion has been made many times and I think it's still the best: parkrun.

Thanks D and congrats on your half.
Yes lots of Parkruns in my future for sure. I'll be pacing someone in one next week and will fit in another one where I'm racing it towards the end of the April. Need a few weeks to get over the trauma of today first!:o

TRR_the_turd

Park runs are a good start but even better are BHAA races. Really sociable but competitive. I'd actually recommend the bhaa races more. Same faces at them all the time so you can swap war stories with fellow competitors over a cup of tea every couple of weeks. Regards nerves we all get them. Have been close to pulling a couple of times myself in the past.

TRR_the_turd

Ha ha I'm on my phone that should real puking above

RedRunner

TRR_the_turd wrote: »

Park runs are a good start but even better are BHAA races. Really sociable but competitive. I'd actually recommend the bhaa races more. Same faces at them all the time so you can swap war stories with fellow competitors over a cup of tea every couple of weeks. Regards nerves we all get them. Have been close to pulling a couple of times myself in the past.

+1 to that.

menoscemo

I think Gavlor is being misconstrued here (we all know him he is a straight shooter and has good intentions).
Sometimes I do think there is way too much backslapping on a lot of logs and I don't think it does anyone any good. When something is not going right, people should feel free to point it out without being rounded on. You guys should have seen the logs a few years ago, way more debate and calling people out when appropriate.

Anyway, unlucky today, it think it was pretty windy which wouldn't have helped times. Just on training; I notice you do most sessions well above actual race pace. While I know you are doing them on feel and would like to be racing faster, maybe it would be an idea to dial back the pace on sessions a tad to reflect actual paces? I think sometimes taking one step back like that can help you take 2 steps forward.

Ososlo

Comments all noted and appreciated. Thanks!

Pacing Mule

menoscemo wrote: »

I think Gavlor is being misconstrued here (we all know him he is a straight shooter and has good intentions).
Sometimes I do think there is way too much backslapping on a lot of logs and I don't think it does anyone any good. When something is not going right, people should feel free to point it out without being rounded on. You guys should have seen the logs a few years ago, way more debate and calling people out when appropriate.

Anyway, unlucky today, it think it was pretty windy which wouldn't have helped times. Just on training; I notice you do most sessions well above actual race pace. While I know you are doing them on feel and would like to be racing faster, maybe it would be an idea to dial back the pace on sessions a tad to reflect actual paces? I think sometimes taking one step back like that can help you take 2 steps forward.

Big +1

And that's from personal experience of logging here. Sometimes a valid point being made against a tide of positivity looks like a grenade being thrown in. Likewise those more experienced members here who perhaps see things that could be improved can see nothing but positives as a back slapping procession.

Personally (not claiming to be one of those experienced members) it's clear to me that you love running but its also creating huge negativity and drama in your life when it comes to racing in particular. You're out here in public logging it and fair play to you for continuing to do so but it's also fair to say the training history, coaching and methods are a source of big interest to the forum here. So you spend a lot of time justifying the training and then feeling big pressure on race day. If your instinct was to stay away from boards in the run up to the race that says a lot about how the log here maybe isn't really helping you.

I do hope you get over the drama of the race day experience and get to enjoy a stress free PB soon.

walshb

4 miles in 33 mins on that Dunboyne course with that wind? Sounds fine and good to me. Well done.

Hannibal Smith

Hi Os

Sorry you didn't get the result you wanted. I wonder is it possible to look at the race winner and see what their time was like and using all the Jedi information you guys seem to be able to pull together from your secret athletics underworld to find out if the conditions had an effect on them? Might add more perspective to yesterday?

As for the stressing out. Its like any other situation...how would you handle a situation stressing you? You'd look at why its having that effect on you and what you can do to ADDRESS those reasons...not ignore them. At the end of the day all the distraction in the world might get you to the start line, but when you're actually at the start line, those demons are staring you right in the face and there's no avoiding them. So be honest about why races stress you out and address those why's (i dont mean on here i mean with yourself). If its not getting a good time...if its fear of not finishing... If its fear of stitches. Tbh if its the last two you got over it all pretty well yest and continued on. So you have that worry answered for next time.

Won't go there on running advice coz I have none

RacoonQueen

Hey O

I can relate to alot of what has been posted here. I've always been terrible at racing, I can probably count on one hand the amount of races I've run that I was happy with...there's a theme to them also about why I ran well in them - there was no pressure (self inflicted pressure).

No disrespect to your training regime or your coach - but I really think you need to start running with other people if you want to improve in races. An interval session or tempo run with people around your level is a huge learning curve and really helps you get your racing confidence and get your head a bit more prepared for racing IMO. Made a huge difference to me and I ran much better races off it, you will learn to push yourself more in training to within your limits and that will pay off on race day - one of the things that helps there is if you are doing the same race as people you are running with in training, know what times they run for that distance, know they're up ahead or beside you...and go with them...after a couple of minutes you'll get into your stride, you'll get your confidence up etc...

IMO, running with a club (or even with others on a similar plan to you) will be far more beneficial to you. I think you need to be running with other people on a regular basis that you can work off and that can work off you. There is nothing like chasing someone or being chased to get you strong and confident...especially when the person you were chasing for weeks, is now chasing you. Bringing that into a race is a huge confidence boost.

demfad

Hi Ososlo.

Your log is brilliant!

The race results will come. Your training is good.
Your breaking new ground here.

Looking at it: Your training is developing your aerobic abilities: the high mileage is improving and developing capilliaries, mithochondria...your LT is being improved, your AT is being improved. Your speed is being improved.
Youre training at all paces. And most importantly you are being consistant.
You are going to make a breakthrough. Ive seen it so often that I know its not in doubt. All you have to do is keep consistant. Its hard but dont be disheartened. You can feel your fitness improve with the training.

I've one bit of advice. Well two...

I do training not dis-similar to yours. When I'm in (relatively for me) big mileage, I always run the first portion of the race relatively steady to make sure I settle in to the race. If I dont, then I dont settle. Not everyone is like that but I am, and I think you might be too.
For me (I usually run 5ks during big mileage) that would mean running the first 1-1.5k at 10k effort. That would mean in a 4miler, running the first mile at slightly slower than 10k effort. A pace that allows you to feel settled into the race. At this point youll know instinctively what to do for the remainder and youll do fine. That will allow you to get a decent race or two in the bag. But run it by your coach.

Also: Those 40s long strides you do. Maybe 2 of those before 2-3 normal strides as a warm up. Again run it by your coach if you like the idea.

You'll get a lot of advice here. I actually like the positive advice. I think its really helpful. But take the coaching advice with a pinch of salt (mine included!), especially advice which tell you not to listen to your coach.

IMO The key to improvements is consistant good training. YOuve got that. Just keep it up!

Edit: Just saw RacoonQueens post. That's a great idea. You could still keep your training, but as someone who clearly loves running, spending more time with other runners is always a great idea. Im with a club and run with groups too. I just tinker with the training schedule a little to allow for it.

Chivito550

I get nervous before every single race. This is normal. Sure it's not fun, but necessary. You are not alone in feeling nervous about races. Every single athlete in the world feels like this before a race. So stop thinking that this is a problem, when it isn't. The key is to channel those nerves in the right way, to get the best out of yourself on race day, something that can only come with race experience.

Ronan O'Gara has mentioned that he would actually vomit with nerves before every match he played. How many games has he played in his life? The nerves never went away, nor should they.

I also agree on the benefits of joining a club, running with other people, and having a coach there in person to yell at you when you are doing something wrong, backing off when you need to push on etc.

I've had the fortune the last year of getting to train with one of Ireland's best female 400 runners the last year. She'd always be a bit ahead of me, so training with her would force me to find that bit extra in training that I thought I didn't have, and certainly that bit extra I would not have found running on my own.

Running is not as individual a sport as some make out.

walshb

There's two types of nerves, adrenalin and excitement and dreaded fear. You get both in boxing. The main reason for me was the fear of losing, not even getting hurt, losing in one on one combat.

As to racing. The nerves with me were will I finish or will I pace correctly or will I blow up near the end. The not knowing nerves! These big races for most are you against the clock, or against some randomer who is ahead of you. No big deal at all.

Reading the race report I thought Ososlo was being to led to the gallows. It has to impact your race. A serious chill out is needed. That would be my advice. Maybe easier said than done, but it's just a race, you against a clock. That can't be all that nerve wracking.

Ososlo, next race and you start feeling really uptight, just ask yourself what's the worst thing that can happen, or think of all the things to be positive about, like being able to even enter a race. Watch Pollyannna. What a feel good film. Works every time for me. I say this with only good intentions. 33 mins considering everything is a bonus if you ask me.

I enjoyed the race report. Next time I want to see fire!:)

walshb

Chivito550 wrote: »

Running is not as individual a sport as some make out.

It is for many people in these types of races.

eldiva

Ososlo wrote: »

All good except for a near fatal collision with a Clon Harrier. There will be death on the paths of Santry yet I tells ya. The groups seem to be getting bigger and taking over even more space. If I was a club coach I'd tell my athletes when sending them off onto public roads and paths to not run more than 2 abreast (single file if very narrow path) and to be very aware of their surrounding with other path users. But I guess the coaches don't feel they should have to tell grown adults how to behave on a public thoroughfare.
Rant over.
9:55 avg pace

Took your advice and took a break from boards. Feels great. You can really give out to a group of club runners running in a pack, it's not like cycling. I'm sure they acknowledged you and said hello and a brief wave.

Anyway well done on the time on Dunboyne. I heard it was very windy so that will certainly add the minutes on.y only criticism is that I think you train to hard and when it comes to racing you find it hard to replicate that form. I would dial things back a bit in training.Ypur coach should be telling you at each session whether you are going to easy or hard. Thats what he is there to do. Use a HR strap as it's an invaluable tool.

demfad

Chivito550 wrote: »

...........
I've had the fortune the last year of getting to train with one of Ireland's best female 400 runners the last year. She'd always be a bit ahead of me, so training with her would force me to find that bit extra in training that I thought I didn't have, and certainly that bit extra I would not have found running on my own.

Running is not as individual a sport as some make out.

Just a point there. Aerobic training is very different from anaerobic training. Finding "that little bit extra in training" is one of the most common mistakes in aerobic training. The best advice is often to run at a gear below what you think you need to run to get the correct aerobic intensity. The progression is slower but is a lot greater. The exception might be for specific sessions which should be a little tougher.

As Ososlo seems to be a building phase this might apply to her. Club/group training is great for consistancy, enjoyability and generally makes it easier but for aerobic training the danger is training to hard and not progressing: not the other way around.

NetwerkErrer

demfad wrote: »

Just a point there. Aerobic training is very different from anaerobic training. Finding "that little bit extra in training" is one of the most common mistakes in aerobic training. The best advice is often to run at a gear below what you think you need to run to get the correct aerobic intensity. The progression is slower but is a lot greater. The exception might be for specific sessions which should be a little tougher.

As Ososlo seems to be a building phase this might apply to her. Club/group training is great for consistancy but for aerobic training the danger is training to hard and not progressing: not the other way around.

I think O's approach is a la Canova to a certain extent without the specific phase from what I've seen since I started posting. It's a long term approach where the focus is always largely on aerobic development. It's a good approach but I feel missing out on that heavy specific phase is going to leave you lacking in short-term races. Yes, you will improve greatly with just aerobic training but it's always going to be difficult to get the absolute best out of yourself in a race situation without it.

I can see the merit in the approach as it's probably the best way to train but it takes a lot of patience, long term vision and short term result sacrificing to approach training in this way and I think that is what she needs to know when training like this. The results aren't going to come quickly but you are setting yourself up for down the road.

That's my opinion anyway!

Chivito550

demfad wrote: »

Just a point there. Aerobic training is very different from anaerobic training. Finding "that little bit extra in training" is one of the most common mistakes in aerobic training. The best advice is often to run at a gear below what you think you need to run to get the correct aerobic intensity. The progression is slower but is a lot greater. The exception might be for specific sessions which should be a little tougher.

As Ososlo seems to be a building phase this might apply to her. Club/group training is great for consistancy, enjoyability and generally makes it easier but for aerobic training the danger is training to hard and not progressing: not the other way around.

Well Yeh, I meant for sessions, speed work, hard days etc. Obviously the easy days must remain easy.

demfad

Chivito550 wrote: »

Well Yeh, I meant for sessions, speed work, hard days etc. Obviously the easy days must remain easy.

I was talking about club training sessions not easy running days. If its a specific session for race preparation then that is different.

The majority of training sessions for longer distance events should not be extremely hard, you should not be digging deep for "that extra bit". They should be controlled and measured. Once the session ceases to be aerobic the aerobic benefits not only stop but can recede. You're quickly into the realm of diminishing returns, instead of sustainable progression.

demfad

NetwerkErrer wrote: »

I think O's approach is a la Canova to a certain extent without the specific phase from what I've seen since I started posting. It's a long term approach where the focus is always largely on aerobic development. It's a good approach but I feel missing out on that heavy specific phase is going to leave you lacking in short-term races. Yes, you will improve greatly with just aerobic training but it's always going to be difficult to get the absolute best out of yourself in a race situation without it.

I can see the merit in the approach as it's probably the best way to train but it takes a lot of patience, long term vision and short term result sacrificing to approach training in this way and I think that is what she needs to know when training like this. The results aren't going to come quickly but you are setting yourself up for down the road.

That's my opinion anyway!

I agree with you and I'm sure shes well aware of that. Its nice to get race feedback too though and its possible.

As I said, I do the first section of the race relatively steady in these situations. I also have the race in a lower distance week. Similar prep for every development race.

Heres why:

1. There are no specific sessions in base phases (as you said) so a flat out effort over the full race distance is an extremely difficult ask.

2. After settling in to the race this way the runner instinctively knows how much is in the tank and the progressive pacing for the remainder takes care of itself. i.e consistant reasonably good development races.

3. A very good training stimulus.

4. There will be consistant positive feedback from race to race.

5. It helps with the specific stuff in that phase (later in the summer I guess)

6. The race when executed this way, helps with the next development race (every 3-4 weeks)

Its right to build aerobically as Ososlo is doing so methodically. You also need a little feedback in terms of something to measure improvement. And its a great buzz to see improvement in a race.

Doing the development races in the manner I described ticks these boxes.

You can progress in training and see the progress in races.

When she goes specific of-course shell blow everyone out of the water.:)

Gavlor

demfad wrote: »

I agree with you and I'm sure shes well aware of that. Its nice to get race feedback too though and its possible.

As I said, I do the first section of the race relatively steady in these situations. I also have the race in a lower distance week. Similar prep for every development race.

Heres why:

1. There are no specific sessions in base phases (as you said) so a flat out effort over the full race distance is an extremely difficult ask.

2. After settling in to the race this way the runner instinctively knows how much is in the tank and the progressive pacing for the remainder takes care of itself. i.e consistant reasonably good development races.

3. A very good training stimulus.

4. There will be consistant positive feedback from race to race.

5. It helps with the specific stuff in that phase (later in the summer I guess)

6. The race when executed this way, helps with the next development race (every 3-4 weeks)

Its right to build aerobically as Ososlo is doing so methodically. You also need a little feedback in terms of something to measure improvement. And its a great buzz to see improvement in a race.

Doing the development races in the manner I described ticks these boxes.

You can progress in training and see the progress in races.

When she goes specific of-course shell blow everyone out of the water.:)

That's a very 'systematic' approach.

Quite familiar infact.

demfad

Gavlor wrote: »

That's a very 'systematic' approach.

Quite familiar infact.

Not quite sure what you're getting at? Its only systematic in that I've listed the benefits of doing development races in this way (starting steady) as points.

For the actual race itself all you have to do is go out at a pace slower than race pace (maybe one race distance up), wait till you settle in, feel comfortable and have a fair idea about whats in the legs, and progress and finish the race based on that.

That makes it more likely for the runner to have a good race. In my opinion, positive feedback from races helps greatly as a stimulus for the next block of training. (does for me anyway).

As Netwerk error said Ososlo is training for the bigger picture. I think elites might be able to see the distant goal towering over the horizon. Harder for us recreational runners though.

As for how the races develops: The first race you may get 50% + of the race done at race pace (the last 50%). Second race you'll manage 60%, 70% etc.

Thats what I do in base training and it works well. I also mentioned a possibility of doing a few of her long strides before the start, before a few normal strides. Doing so will mean her legs are ready for a fast turnover. At the lower starting intensity, it will feel very comfortable, but she'll be well warmed up to go at an OK clip too. Makes a positive race more likely.

The wind looks like it played havoc with all the times in comparison to 2014. Ososlos run is starting to look pretty decent.

Ososlo

demfad wrote: »

Not quite sure what you're getting at? Its only systematic in that I've listed the benefits of doing development races in this way (starting steady) as points.

Hi demfad. What I think Gavlor is getting at is that you're my coach - ex-poster Stazza. I'd be here all day trying to explain the history re - Stazza/Boards so won't even bother if that's ok. I just want to train and move on and I wish everyone else could too.

Gavlor, I can assure you that demfad is not John. I don't know who he/she is but I am enjoying his/her recent contributions to the forum and this log.
Thanks for the input demfad and NE. You're both on the money regarding my training and base phase and a long term approach and needing to be more patient with results etc. It's very interesting to read your posts regarding my training as I'm on a big learning curve and it's good to hear this stuff.
Apparently John's approach for me is less Canova and more 'Tuva'. But as I said before, I just do what I'm told and run so am not in a position to debate methods etc.
thanks again everyone for the constructive contributions. Not sure where I'll go with the log if anywhere but sure we'll see.

HelenAnne

demfad wrote: »

I also mentioned a possibility of doing a few of her long strides before the start, before a few normal strides. Doing so will mean her legs are ready for a fast turnover. .

Sorry if this is OT, but what are 'long strides', Ososlo & demfad? I've only very recently started doing any sort of strides before racing, and while I'm not even sure if I'm doing them right (I just run fast for a count of about 30, then slow for the same, then fast etc etc) I do find them really good for getting my heart rate up.

Is there a special way of doing long strides?

Also, well done in Dunboyne, Ososlo - it was a tough weekend for racing, I was miles off my goal time in the BHAA race on Saturday - I just didn't post before now as I felt you were deluged with feedback and advice.

Clearlier

Ososlo wrote: »

Hi demfad. What I think Gavlor is getting at is that you're my coach - ex-poster Stazza. I'd be here all day trying to explain the history re - Stazza/Boards so won't even bother if that's ok. I just want to train and move on and I wish everyone else could too.

FWIW, Stazza wasn't who I was thinking of but I'm fairly useless at that kind of game so should probably steer clear.

I'm only following your log for a couple of months Ososlo but I'm astonished at how much debate and advice you get on it. I think that you're remarkably resilient to keep going. From what I can see you've got a good plan and you're making steady progress. Try not to beat yourself up too much about results. You seem to be doing pretty well to me.

demfad

HelenAnne wrote: »

Sorry if this is OT, but what are 'long strides', Ososlo & demfad? I've only very recently started doing any sort of strides before racing, and while I'm not even sure if I'm doing them right (I just run fast for a count of about 30, then slow for the same, then fast etc etc) I do find them really good for getting my heart rate up.

Ill answer HelenAnne

Think you're spot on. I count to 30 or 35. then jog back or jog the same. Long strides just means longer than the usual 10-15 secs or so.
Just run them fast, good form etc.

When I do the shorter ones I never get as well warmed up.

I do about 2-3 of them. Then a few short ones with whatever time is left before the race. So no secret, I reckon you're doing them right if they are getting the HR up.

I also do a session of long strides every 2 weeks. (I'm base building now)
They are magic for leg speed when on relatively high mileage.

Here's a description: (For 200m read 30-40 secs)

2-3 sets of 5-6 x 200 meters starting at about 5K race pace and going roughly 1 second faster on each successive rep (with the wind if any), jog 200 between reps, jog 1/2 mile to 1 mile between sets. Each set can be started with a 200 at about 1 second faster than the first 200 in the previous set.
Reps run in this fashion are often called "cut-downs". They are not buildups; a continuous speed should be maintained throughout each 200. They are also not meant to be specific training for any particular event, or even any precise speed, for that matter. What they do is recruit all manners of muscle fibers at many different speeds, while keeping lactate production to a minimum.

pistol_75

Clearlier wrote: »

FWIW, Stazza wasn't who I was thinking of but I'm fairly useless at that kind of game so should probably steer clear.

I'm only following your log for a couple of months Ososlo but I'm astonished at how much debate and advice you get on it. I think that you're remarkably resilient to keep going. From what I can see you've got a good plan and you're making steady progress. Try not to beat yourself up too much about results. You seem to be doing pretty well to me.

I think you've pretty much hit the nail on the head here. It amazes me the interest this log produces and the people that are queuing up to offer advice both good and bad on all aspects of Ososlo's training and racing. I think deep down this is having an affect on you and possibly contributing to pressure you might be feeling in advance of races. Yes we all feel nervous before races, that is only natural, it is also natural that we feel like stopping sometimes when we hit a rough spot in a race or session.

It is also completely normal to have bad races and plenty of them, or what we perceive as bad races. These are what make the days when everything clicks so much better. These are not goal races as you have said so don't get too hung up on the results.

Whatever you feel you need to do about your training/log then do it, but I would agree with you that you are getting great advice regarding training outside of boards (from John) and you shouldn't let any comments on here cloud that judgement.

Keep doing what your doing and all will be good in the long run. Just watch out for the snipers

TRR_the_turd

I'm just waiting for the book/novel/fairy tale!

kit3

TRR_the_turd wrote: »

I'm just waiting for the book/novel/fairy tale!

As for the film - wonder who'll play the villain ???

Ososlo

TRR_the_turd wrote: »

I'm just waiting for the book/novel/fairy tale!

kit3 wrote: »

As for the film - wonder who'll play the villain ???

Not sure what you're referring to here? Book? Film?
What's this got to do with my training?

kit3

Ososlo wrote: »

Not sure what you're referring to here? Book? Film?
What's this got to do with my training?

I would think that the book refers to the research the 'running master' was doing with his involvement with this forum - he openly admitted that he was using the forum for research. Who knows, if the book is good it might well be made into a film :rolleyes: - hence my tongue in cheek comment I presume when you ask what this has to do with your training you are asking why the book was referenced in your log - that would be because of the reference to the 'master' above I presume. Anyway, since he was doing his research here on the forum you never know who will feature (be it in the role of hero or villain)

Ososlo

kit3 wrote: »

I would think that the book refers to the research the 'running master' was doing with his involvement with this forum - he openly admitted that he was using the forum for research. Who knows, if the book is good it might well be made into a film :rolleyes: - hence my tongue in cheek comment I presume when you ask what this has to do with your training you are asking why the book was referenced in your log - that would be because of the reference to the 'master' above I presume. Anyway, since he was doing his research here on the forum you never know who will feature (be it in the role of hero or villain)

It's this kind of sh1t stirring that has my log the way it is.
Can I suggest you just ignore me and my log from now on and I'll do the same with you. It's the constant passive aggressiveness I get from you that really bothers me. You never offer me anything constructive except have snide digs here and there and manage to thank every single post that says anything negative about me/my training/my coach.
You offer me nothing positive ever.... so I can just do without it.
Thanks.

kit3

Ososlo wrote: »

It's this kind of sh1t stirring that has my log the way it is.
Can I suggest you just ignore me and my log from now on and I'll do the same with you. It's the constant passive aggressiveness I get from you that really bothers me. You never offer me anything constructive except have snide digs here and there and manage to thank every single post that says anything negative about me/my training/my coach.
You offer me nothing positive ever.... so I can just do without it.
Thanks.

Hey, You asked what book/film was being referred to - I genuinely thought you didn't know. By the way, you may not realise this but we never had a cross word until I disagreed with you about whether a walker should have a plan for the Women's Mini Marathon - just a few weeks ago. I have absolutely no personal issue with you at all. If you check my profile you will see that I've thanked 500 posts - they certainly all don't relate to you - I thank posts I agree with (as I'm sure is the same for everyone else here). I thought this was a public forum where diverse opinions were allowed. I respect your opinions, I just don't always agree with them.

Ososlo

pistol_75 wrote: »

I think you've pretty much hit the nail on the head here. It amazes me the interest this log produces and the people that are queuing up to offer advice both good and bad on all aspects of Ososlo's training and racing. I think deep down this is having an affect on you and possibly contributing to pressure you might be feeling in advance of races. Yes we all feel nervous before races, that is only natural, it is also natural that we feel like stopping sometimes when we hit a rough spot in a race or session.

It is also completely normal to have bad races and plenty of them, or what we perceive as bad races. These are what make the days when everything clicks so much better. These are not goal races as you have said so don't get too hung up on the results.

Whatever you feel you need to do about your training/log then do it, but I would agree with you that you are getting great advice regarding training outside of boards (from John) and you shouldn't let any comments on here cloud that judgement.

Keep doing what your doing and all will be good in the long run. Just watch out for the snipers

Hey P.
Thanks for the post.
Hope you’re dealing with things ok...
Your bad news last week really puts stuff into perspective regarding my "problems". Hope things are going ok for you.

Chivito550

A lot of info to take on board for sure. I'm sure everyone means well. I remember getting a barrage of criticism on my marathon log years ago, and I fought tooth and nail against some of them. It can be a grind alright, but looking back the advice was correct. Now I have a sprinter log so I avoid all that as bugger all people here understand sprinting!

Main thing is to keep enjoying the running. But once you start to race more you will realise how enjoyable it is. As mentioned Parkruns are a good start. It's not a real race and it is almost impossible to come last in it the standard is that low. But really look into some great road races. The ones that put on those epic post race spreads. Such a great community feel to them. That's one thing (the only thing) I miss about distance running. No free grub and post race banter with your competitors in sprinting!

menoscemo

Chivito550 wrote: »

A lot of info to take on board for sure. I'm sure everyone means well. I remember getting a barrage of criticism on my marathon log years ago, and I fought tooth and nail against some of them. It can be a grind alright, but looking back the advice was correct. Now I have a sprinter log so I avoid all that as bugger all people here understand sprinting!

Haha!! When I mentioned earlier about the criticism on old logs being much more vocal I was thinking of your old marathon log.
Man it was brutal!! I bet younused to hate Village Runner!!:p

AuldManKing

Chivito550 wrote: »

Now I have a sprinter log so I avoid all that as bugger all people read it

FYP :pac: