[Superthread] Mayweather vs Pacman **NO STREAMING REQUESTS**

Panic E

Panic E wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IDFkDdgKJVw

Halloween Jack wrote: »

That's 69 seconds of my life I ain't getting back...

What about the previous 5 years of listening to crap about this fight?!


That may well be just some ape with a speech impediment in his bedroom…

…Yet you will struggle to find a more accurate and concise prediction elsewhere!

Panic E

RoryMac wrote: »

If the injury was that bad he shouldn't have fought, simple as that.

I think they agreed to fight based on the medical treatment they were taking, which was then denied on fight night.

cowzerp

The whole hugging thing is funny, for a floyd fight the hugging was actually to a minimum
He didn't even back up to much, Manny just done nothing nada zilch

RoryMac

walshb wrote: »

The injury may have worsened through the fight. May have bee passed fit to fight but that doesn't mean an old or recent injury cannot come back to haunt you.

True but but you weight up the risks and if you step into the ring you take your chances, no point bringing it up as an excuse after

Panic E wrote: »

I think they agreed to fight based on the medical treatment they were taking, which was denied on fight night.

Where are you getting that information from?

Emmo-m-

It takes two to tango as they say.

Some people have short memories , maidana 1 , he forced Floyd to fight rough and dirty , closed the ring off and backed Floyd up to the ropes and forced him to fight and he damn sure gave him a better fight than Manny. Not enough credit was given to Maidana after that performance , people were too busy detracting from Floyd saying his legs were gone etc etc. But even so Floyd found a way to win like he always does.

Manny was too small and light to give Floyd any trouble , he was trying to box his way in which is pointless because nobody is outboxing Floyd , that's just how it is.

The fight went exactly as anyone who watches boxing and seen Mayweather fight before. Manny was just another fighter who was confused and completely out of his depth when boxing Floyd. He took his best asset away from him and completely neutralized his offense. As he says "They all think they have the game plan until they get in the ring".

walshb

RoryMac wrote: »

True but but you weight up the risks and if you step into the ring you take your chances, no point bringing it up as an excuse after



Where are you getting that information from?

It's reported on Eastside Boxing

http://www.boxing247.com/boxing-news/pacquiao-and-top-rank-make-statement-about-mannys-shoulder-injury/41054

Panic E

RoryMac wrote: »

Where are you getting that information from?

The internet?! It was nothing short of a sabotage, according to Pacquaio…

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lnBkwfD8DWY

Apart from that it was discussed at the post fight conference, articles etc...

TheNap

TheNap wrote: »

Its funny .

Why is all the talk about Mayweather.

Why isn't all the talk about the shocking performance Manny gave us.

It really was terrible.

because everyone accepts mannys performance was terrible what is there to talk about in that regard.

the talk is about mayweather because peoples opinions range from genius/goat to fraud and anywhere in between

walshb

Emmo-m- wrote: »

It takes two to tango as they say.

Some people have short memories , maidana 1 , he forced Floyd to fight rough and dirty , closed the ring off and backed Floyd up to the ropes and forced him to fight and he damn sure gave him a better fight than Manny. Not enough credit was given to Maidana after that performance , people were too busy detracting from Floyd saying his legs were gone etc etc. But even so Floyd found a way to win like he always does.

Manny was too small and light to give Floyd any trouble , he was trying to box his way in which is pointless because nobody is outboxing Floyd , that's just how it is.

The fight went exactly as anyone who watches boxing and seen Mayweather fight before. Manny was just another fighter who was confused and completely out of his depth when boxing Floyd. He took his best asset away from him and completely neutralized his offense. As he says "They all think they have the game plan until they get in the ring".

You are saying a lot but it still doesn't change the fact that Floyd never dominated the offense. He landed no better than Manny in that fight. I could easily argue that Manny neutralized a lot of Floyd's strengths as well. People are focusing far too much on Floyd neutralizing Manny. I don't see moving backwards and hugging and ducking real low as neutralizing. I see it as more desperation and spoiling. I don't reward him for it. I can praise him for being hard to hit, but that's nothing much.

I thought Floyd would dominate and beat Manny a lot more convincingly. He didn't.

walshb

Naomi Inexpensive Meteorology wrote: »

because everyone accepts mannys performance was terrible what is there to talk about in that regard.

the talk is about mayweather because peoples opinions range from genius/goat to fraud and anywhere in between

I don't accept that it was terrible. When your opponent is Floyd and when your opponent is very cagey and intent on defending more than attacking then almost anyone will have issues. Saying Manny was terrible makes Floyd's performance even worse, as a terrible Manny still barely took a decent punch all night.

Manny was terrible and stuill Floyd looked very off as regards his performance and offnsive output,. Is that what people are saying?

cowzerp

walshb wrote: »

But as a huge Floyd fan, what did you make of the shots supposedly landed? What did you make of Floyd's offensive output?

Floyd done enough to win most rounds, I think you need to rewatch it as your talking very unsure on it, Manny was dire and could have made Floyd do more, We may not like it but Floyd done enough to comfortably win most rounds

walshb wrote: »

The injury may have worsened through the fight. May have bee passed fit to fight but that doesn't mean an old or recent injury cannot come back to haunt you.

Manny literally lost the 3 1st rounds very easily, he done ok the 4th round so from the off he was non existent, Manny should be the 1 getting the stick as he's the scrapper, he's the 1 that was going to ko Floyd, He's the 1 that was accepting losing rds and not pushing the pace to try get some success, Manny is the reason the fight stunk.

RoryMac

Panic E wrote: »

The internet?! It was nothing short of a sabotage, according to Pacquaio…


Apart from that it was discussed at the post fight conference, articles etc...

Yeah right

But if it is true that they agreed to allow the medication in the lead up and on the day of the fight but then the Nevada commission wouldn't allow it then someone has a bit of explaining to do.

walshb

cowzerp wrote: »

Floyd done enough to win most rounds, I think you need to rewatch it as your talking very unsure on it, Manny was dire and could have made Floyd do more, We may not like it but Floyd done enough to comfortably win most rounds



Manny literally lost the 3 1st rounds very easily, he done ok the 4th round so from the off he was non existent, Manny should be the 1 getting the stick as he's the scrapper, he's the 1 that was going to ko Floyd, He's the 1 that was accepting losing rds and not pushing the pace to try get some success, Manny is the reason the fight stunk.

The 1st rd was tame and very uneventful. Don't see how he lost it easily. Barely a punch was landed.

Panic E

efb wrote: »

Avoiding being hit- clinching

That must be a new rule so…

Marquess of Queensberry rules

1. To be a fair stand-up boxing match in a 24-foot ring, or as near that size as practicable.
2. No wrestling or hugging allowed.
3. The rounds to be of three minutes' duration, and one minute's time between rounds.
4. If either man falls through weakness or otherwise, he must get up unassisted, 10 seconds to be allowed him to do so, the other man meanwhile to return to his corner, and when the fallen man is on his legs the round is to be resumed and continued until the three minutes have expired. If one man fails to come to the scratch in the 10 seconds allowed, it shall be in the power of the referee to give his award in favour of the other man.
5. A man hanging on the ropes in a helpless state, with his toes off the ground, shall be considered down.
6. No seconds or any other person to be allowed in the ring during the rounds.
7. Should the contest be stopped by any unavoidable interference, the referee to name the time and place as soon as possible for finishing the contest; so that the match must be won and lost, unless the backers of both men agree to draw the stakes.
8. The gloves to be fair-sized boxing gloves of the best quality and new.
9. Should a glove burst, or come off, it must be replaced to the referee's satisfaction.
10. A man on one knee is considered down and if struck is entitled to the stakes.

RoryMac

walshb wrote: »

The 1st rd was tame and very uneventful. Don't see how he lost it easily. Barely a punch was landed.

Mayweather caught Manny with a solid right around 2 mins in and I think that may have put a bit of doubt in Manny's mind about rushing in. I think another right from Mayweather were the only 2 good shots of the round but Manny threw nothing.

TheNap

walshb wrote: »

I don't accept that it was terrible. When your opponent is Floyd and when your opponent is very cagey and intent on defending more than attacking then almost anyone will have issues. Saying Manny was terrible makes Floyd's performance even worse, as a terrible Manny still barely took a decent punch all night.

Manny was terrible and stuill Floyd looked very off as regards his performance and offnsive output,. Is that what people are saying?

I dont know what point you're trying to make .

Mayweather fought his biggest foe.

Numerous boxers and journalists picked Manny to win.

The odds in the bookies reflected this.

He won without breaking a sweat.

I dont know how anyone can have anything negative to say about Mayweather.


Its like Barcelona playing Real Madrid . Real Madrid not having a shot at goal and people slate Barcelona because they only won 2 nil.

walshb

pac_man wrote: »

@walshb; Remind me again in case I've missed it, what was your exact scoring of the fight?

You didn't miss it. I didn't give a score. I am debating the whole masterclass and Floyd won easily and Floyd was amazing brigade. Floyd was far from it.

Hand on heart at this moment a draw wouldn't be far off the mark. Floyd didn't show me winning rds with winning offense. I don't know how they scored it but from what I saw live I didn't see winning offense from Floyd or Manny.

TheNap

Imagine fighting a hall of famer .

One of the best of this generation.

The most dangerous . The quickest. The most unorthodox .

And winning very easily without breaking a sweat and only getting caught flush once in 36mins .


Call me mad.

But IMO that is genius.

walshb

TheNap wrote: »

I dont know what point you're trying to make .

Mayweather fought his biggest foe.

Numerous boxers and journalists picked Manny to win.

The odds in the bookies reflected this.

He won without breaking a sweat.

I dont know how anyone can have anything negative to say about Mayweather.


Its like Barcelona playing Real Madrid . Real Madrid not having a shot at goal and people slate Barcelona because they only won 2 nil.

My point is clear. I didn't think Manny was terrible. Not any more terrible than his opponent. They both played a part in that stinker. BTW, you have typos I assume in your post?

You want to throw all the negative criticism at Manny, and find it hard to believe that Mayweather is immune?

The Barca-Madrid analogy is ridiculous. Manny had plenty of shots at goal, and landed plenty to Mayweather.

walshb

walshb wrote: »

I don't accept that it was terrible. When your opponent is Floyd and when your opponent is very cagey and intent on defending more than attacking then almost anyone will have issues. Saying Manny was terrible makes Floyd's performance even worse, as a terrible Manny still barely took a decent punch all night.

Manny was terrible and stuill Floyd looked very off as regards his performance and offnsive output,. Is that what people are saying?

dont think floyds performance was good either i criticised him at length earlier in this thread but that does not make mannys ok he needed to attack mayweather and he really didn't. i think both fighters landed about than 10 legit punches between them both fought poor fights

efb

Panic E wrote: »

That must be a new rule so…

Marquess of Queensberry rules

1. To be a fair stand-up boxing match in a 24-foot ring, or as near that size as practicable.
2. No wrestling or hugging allowed.
3. The rounds to be of three minutes' duration, and one minute's time between rounds.
4. If either man falls through weakness or otherwise, he must get up unassisted, 10 seconds to be allowed him to do so, the other man meanwhile to return to his corner, and when the fallen man is on his legs the round is to be resumed and continued until the three minutes have expired. If one man fails to come to the scratch in the 10 seconds allowed, it shall be in the power of the referee to give his award in favour of the other man.
5. A man hanging on the ropes in a helpless state, with his toes off the ground, shall be considered down.
6. No seconds or any other person to be allowed in the ring during the rounds.
7. Should the contest be stopped by any unavoidable interference, the referee to name the time and place as soon as possible for finishing the contest; so that the match must be won and lost, unless the backers of both men agree to draw the stakes.
8. The gloves to be fair-sized boxing gloves of the best quality and new.
9. Should a glove burst, or come off, it must be replaced to the referee's satisfaction.
10. A man on one knee is considered down and if struck is entitled to the stakes.

Once one hand is free- it's OK, break after a prolonged clinch

walshb

pac_man wrote: »

I needed a laugh today. Thanks for providing it.

Well, I will await a highlight reel from Mayweather fans showing me his masterclass or dominant and clear win. Many rds were stinkers and difficult to award to any man. So, to me a draw is possible.

A bigger laugh was you seeing Lucas-Ruslan 114/114 as fair.

TheNap

walshb wrote: »

My point is clear. I didn't think Manny was terrible. Not any more terrible than his opponent. They both played a part in that stinker. BTW, you have typos I assume in your post?

You want to throw all the negative criticism at Manny, and find it hard to believe that Mayweather is immune?

The Barca-Madrid analogy is ridiculous. Manny had plent of shots at goal, and landed plenty to Mayweather.

Mayweather did what he had to do . Won easily . Im sure if Manny brought more to the table Mayweather would of engaged more . Bottom line was he didnt have to . He cruised to a win.


Manny was 1/18 in the bookies to throw the most punches . 1/18 !!!

And he didnt

Madness

Pathetic performance IMO

FTA69

walshb wrote: »

Hand on heart at this moment a draw wouldn't be far off the mark.

Ah will you ever go on. There's no talking to you if you can watch that fight and call it a draw. I was watching the fight in a Filipino restaurant and even those fanatics wouldn't have gone as far as to say it was a feckin draw.

Emmo-m-

walshb wrote: »

You are saying a lot but it still doesn't change the fact that Floyd never dominated the offense. He landed no better than Manny in that fight. I could easily argue that Manny neutralized a lot of Floyd's strengths as well. People are focusing far too much on Floyd neutralizing Manny. I don't see moving backwards and hugging and ducking real low as neutralizing. I see it as more desperation and spoiling. I don't reward him for it. I can praise him for being hard to hit, but that's nothing much.

I thought Floyd would dominate and beat Manny a lot more convincingly. He didn't.

He landed 148 to Manny's 81. Floyd had 81 power punches along with 67 jabs compared to Manny's pathetic 18.

Manny destroys all these bigger guys for years , everybody calls him a killer and the man to destroy Mayweather. Yet when they fight Floyd out throws , out lands and reduces Manny to an average of 6 punches landed per round and thats not dominant? Maybe not in your eyes but for the purists out there that seems pretty dominant to me.

No matter when , where or how Floyd beats these guys people just cant give him credit. Nobody has done it his way , take the least amount of punishment possible and still remain undefeated for 19 years. People may not like this style but they should at least give the guy some credit.

walshb

Emmo-m- wrote: »

He landed 148 to Manny's 81. Floyd had 81 power punches along with 67 jabs compared to Manny's pathetic 18.

Compu box is not everything. Can be very misleading.

cowzerp

walshb wrote: »

The 1st rd was tame and very uneventful. Don't see how he lost it easily. Barely a punch was landed.

He landed 8 to mannys 3, and a couple of the 8 were good solid ones too

walshb

cowzerp wrote: »

He landed 8 to mannys 3, and a couple of the 8 were good solid ones too

8-3 on compu box? The rd was tame. I scored it a draw. Slightly leaning with Floyd. You said it was easily a Mayweather rd. I don't see that.

RoryMac

walshb wrote: »

My point is clear. I didn't think Manny was terrible. Not any more terrible than his opponent. They both played a part in that stinker. BTW, you have typos I assume in your post?

You want to throw all the negative criticism at Manny, and find it hard to believe that Mayweather is immune?

The Barca-Madrid analogy is ridiculous. Manny had plenty of shots at goal, and landed plenty to Mayweather.

I'd agree with most of your posts on the fight but it's this idea that Manny did what he could that gets me.

Manny knew going in that he needed to put pressure on Mayweather, cut off the ring and pin him down on the ropes to make a fight of it but spent most of the night plodding around with no real purpose.

If someone had claimed here before the fight that Mayweather would throw and land more shots than Manny they've have been laughed out of the place

cowzerp

walshb wrote: »

8-3 on compu box? The rd was tame. I scored it a draw. Slightly leaning with Floyd. You said it was easily a Mayweather rd. I don't see that.

Bren Manny didn't land a meaningful punch for 3 rds, Mayweather landed 2 in that 1st round, you can't score rds a draw because 1 lad was only landing double the punches, As low scoring as it was, it was a clear won rd

efb

walshb wrote: »

8-3 on compu box? The rd was tame. I scored it a draw. Slightly leaning with Floyd. You said it was easily a Mayweather rd. I don't see that.

8/3 is fairly cleat nearly 3-1 shots landed

Emmo-m-

walshb wrote: »

Compu box is not everything. Can be very misleading.

No matter which way you spin it , throwing 18 jabs against Floyd is pathetic. Where was Manny's angles? His big combinations? He was already thinking twice after the first two rounds , couldn't hit Floyd when he got the chance and was afraid to try again because he would be countered.

A pitiful performance from Manny whichever way you want to look at it. I'm obviously a massive Mayweather fan and always have been and I was really hoping Manny would bring the best out of Floyd to really show who was the better boxer but Floyd showed that anyway without even breaking a sweat.

Emmo-m-

Aggression wins rounds. Ineffective aggression does not. And that pretty much sums up Manny's entire night.

cowzerp

Thing is, I felt if Manny pushed the pace he would be bust up bad, Roach obviously felt the same way and was happy for Manny literally to do nothing, Floyd done his normal so i don't see why he get's the blame, Manny was the 1 who chose to fight different to usual

watch the fight again Bren, it was not close to been close

Panic E

RoryMac wrote: »

Yeah right

But if it is true that they agreed to allow the medication in the lead up and on the day of the fight but then the Nevada commission wouldn't allow it then someone has a bit of explaining to do.

Actually he didn't say that himself, that was the reporters but thats how it is being perceived I guess?

It was discussed at the post fight presser by Team Pacquaio then a guy from the NAC came up at the end to refute what had happened.

He admitted they denied him treatment. I agree with you, however the NAC appear to be going on the offensive and may sanction Pacquaio.

walshb

RoryMac wrote: »

I'd agree with most of your posts on the fight but it's this idea that Manny did what he could that gets me.

Manny knew going in that he needed to put pressure on Mayweather, cut off the ring and pin him down on the ropes to make a fight of it but spent most of the night plodding around with no real purpose.

If someone had claimed here before the fight that Mayweather would throw and land more shots than Manny they've have been laughed out of the place

I would not at all have laughed at Mayweather landing more. Mayweather was a deserved favorite. I expected a clear and convincing and obvious win. I didn't see that. I am assuming the posters here are seeing it based off actual landed and clean punches landed? I didn't see that at all. Are they looking at compu box and basing it off this?

You say Manny spent most of the night plodding around with no real purpose. But what was Floyd doing that was so much more appealing and better? And, if Manny was so terrible, as some are suggesting, how did he not get whupped? Surely Floyd could have exposed a terrible Manny? He did not expose him. A plodding and purposeless Manny surely would have been taken apart by the so called TBE?

Also, why is Manny getting all the criticism for failing to make a fight of it? As mentioned, it take two to tango. Mayweather for a lot of that fight didn't want to bloody fight, yet it's Manny who gets called terrible and plodding.

walshb

cowzerp wrote: »

Thing is, I felt if Manny pushed the pace he would be bust up bad, Roach obviously felt the same way and was happy for Manny literally to do nothing, Floyd done his normal so i don't see why he get's the blame, Manny was the 1 who chose to fight different to usual

watch the fight again Bren, it was not close to been close

I will try watch it again. I always said that Manny needed to be less gung ho and more intelligent. Him being all attack attack attack could have seen him walk into a KO counter. I felt Manny fought well, and defended well, but is not getting praised for it, yet Floyd defends and ducks and he gets hailed a hero. Manny did better than I expected. I thought Floyd would break him down and really impose his dominance. Far from it.

Both men threw almost the same number of punches according to compubox. The real debate is what landed and how they landed and how clean they landed. That is where compu box becomes very muddy.

TheNap

walshb wrote: »

I would not at all have laughed at Mayweather landing more. Mayweather was a deserved favorite. I expected a clear and convincing and obvious win. I didn't see that. I am assuming the posters here are seeing it based off actual landed and clean punches landed? I didn't see that at all. Are they looking at compu box and basing it off this?

You say Manny spent most of the night plodding around with no real purpose. But what was Floyd doing that was so much more appealing and better? And, if Manny was so terrible, as some are suggesting, how did he not get whupped? Surely Floyd could have exposed a terrible Manny? He did not expose him. A plodding and purposeless Manny surely would have been taken apart by the so called TBE?

Also, why is Manny getting all the criticism for failing to make a fight of it? As mentioned, it take two to tango. Mayweather for a lot of that fight didn't want to bloody fight, yet it's Manny who gets called terrible and plodding.

He didnt have to expose Manny. He didnt have to do anything except cruise to victory.

Yes it was a terrible fight.

A terrible fight that Floyd won clearly.

Floyd had no reason to make it a great fight when he could win so easily without getting hit.

He is not stupid.

walshb

pac_man wrote: »

Far from a masterclass but to state a draw could have been possible is a pisstake. The Skip Bayless of boards.ie.

Re Lucas-Ruslan: Out of the three judges, two had it 115-113 and the other had it a draw.Hardly laughable when my score was similar to the professionals.
One thing for sure, there's absolutely no comparison between the two fights.

Yes, way more laughable than a possible draw in the fight the other night. At least in the fight with Lucas you could clearly see the punches landing. Pro judges or not they were well off the mark. Well off.

walshb

TheNap wrote: »

He didnt have to expose Manny. He didnt have to do anything except cruise to victory.

Yes it was a terrible fight.

A terrible fight that Floyd won clearly.

Floyd had no reason to make it a great fight when he could win so easily without getting hit.

He is not stupid.

Cruise to victory by just cruising it seems. Not actually landing punches. At least not anything more obvious than Manny's punches.

efb

walshb wrote: »

Cruise to victory by just cruising it seems. Not actually landing punches. At least not anything more obvious than Manny's punches.

So everyone but you is wrong that believes Floyd landed the most punches?

Panic E

walshb wrote: »

Also, why is Manny getting all the criticism for failing to make a fight of it? As mentioned, it take two to tango. Mayweather for a lot of that fight didn't want to bloody fight, yet it's Manny who gets called terrible and plodding.

Exactly. The fight should be scored on it's merit's, not what we knew beforehand or expected from either guy.

And that usually always favors the aggressor, certainly where any round is close it should do or used to at least.

walshb

efb wrote: »

So everyone but you is wrong that believes Floyd landed the most punches?

No, not wrong, but far from so bloody clear and certain. Compu box is not an exact science. Far from it. From my viewing the landed punch tally was a lot closer than compu box. So, saying this and from the flow of action in the ring I thought the fight was close. Neither man impressed or dominated. Not close.

Panic E

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sg4NR6nkSfI

pac_man wrote: »

Far from a masterclass but to state a draw could have been possible is a pisstake.

It was close. Holyfield didn't actually say whats attributed to him in the title, but when pressed he said he thought Pacquaio won.

efb

walshb wrote: »

No, not wrong, but far from so bloody clear and certain. Compu box is not an exact science. Far from it. From my viewing the landed punch tally was a lot closer than compu box. So, saying this and from the flow of action in the ring I thought the fight was close. Neither man impressed or dominated. Not close.

Obvious enough to thr judges at ringside and most here on the night

walshb

efb wrote: »

Obvious enough to thr judges at ringside and most here on the night

I don't think many shots thrown by either man were obvious or clear landed and scoring shots. Compu box (people) tallied them up nonetheless.

cowzerp

walshb wrote: »

I felt Manny fought well, and defended well, but is not getting praised for it, yet Floyd defends and ducks and he gets hailed a hero.

Bren only for i know you know Boxing I'd genuinely think you watched your 1st Boxing match the other night, Manny didn't fight and didn't defend well, he done feck all and when he did he got countered and missed his own shot's, Manny in my recollection landed 1 good punch, Mayweather land several even though he was under no pressure

Admit it Bren, you were locked out of your head!!

Panic E

efb wrote: »

Obvious enough to thr judges at ringside and most here on the night

Remind me why everyone in the crowd and around the world were booing again?

walshb

cowzerp wrote: »

Admit it Bren, you were locked out of your head!!

Jeez, you have me thinking now.

But, you are generally anti Pacman and Pro Mayweather through the past 5-6 years. I was buckled, but you were too, on bias!

We need to be objective.

efb

Panic E wrote: »

Remind me why everyone in the crowd and around the world were booing again?

It was a dull fight, they were cheering for Manny and he lost. Simple