[Superthread] Mayweather vs Pacman **NO STREAMING REQUESTS**

T-K-O

cowzerp wrote: »

MMA fighters no nothing about Boxing, that's like saying the Dublin GAA team thought Liverpool should have won, means nothing



Bob Arum said Manny was afraid of needles to stop the fight happening, you can try hide the truth but it's hardly news, Bob obviously forgot Manny was full of tattoos



Manny fought like a coward, he didn't attack because he knew he'd be knocked out, the dull fight was all Manny's fault, Floyd done what he always done, Manny changed his way of fighting due to fear

Nonsense, it takes two to tango. In every great Pacquiao fight the other guy also wanted to fight.
Pac did attack PBF and it cost him the fight. It was Manny on the front foot for the majority of that fight.

Of course, Floyd reduced his output, that is a PBF trait but to say the fought like a coward is one of the dumbest statements i have read on here.

walshb

cowzerp wrote: »

Manny fought like a coward, he didn't attack because he knew he'd be knocked out, the dull fight was all Manny's fault, Floyd done what he always done, Manny changed his way of fighting due to fear

I just can't get behind this at all. Manny tried, and almost threw as much as Floyd. Of course he was not going to fight Floyd like others. That doesn't mean that translates to him being a coward. Had he tried to fight others like Floyd he may well have gotten hit a lot more, and people would be saying that he fought dumb.

The overall fight and movement and flow was the same for both. They equally made for a stinker and let down, but the fact remains that the so called GOAT, who was bigger and more natural at the weight fought a whole lot less like the GOAT or the naturally bigger man. One could more apply the coward term to him. Manny was the one who for the most part made a fight of it.

T-K-O

walshb wrote: »

I just can't get behind this at all. Manny tried, and almost threw as much as Floyd. Of course he was not going to fight Floyd like others. That doesn't mean that translates to him being a coward. Had he tried to fight others like Floyd he may well have gotten hit a lot more, and people would be saying that he fought dumb.

The overall fight and movement and flow was the same for both. They equally made for a stinker and let down, but the fact remains that the so called GOAT, who was bigger and more natural at the weight fought a whole lot less like the GOAT or the naturally bigger man. One could more apply the coward term to him. Manny was the one who for the most part made a fight of it.

This.

For those who follow other sports, John Jones / Anderson Silva / Tiger Woods / Barca / Reger Federer - that is what the GOAT looks like.

PBF is a great fighter with some of the best defense I have seen. It ends there. I just hope he retires in Sept.

Panic E

Gee lads. Calling Pacquioa a coward for having an injured shoulder is a bit too steep!

What about the list of fighters that Mayweather ducked? Surely that's more to form.

walshb

Panic E wrote: »

Gee lads. Calling Pacquioa a coward for having an injured shoulder is a bit too steep!

What about the list of fighters that Mayweather ducked? Surely that's more to form.

It's more calling him a coward for not fighting. That's how I interpreted the claim. Shoulder injury or not.

walshb

cowzerp wrote: »

Manny fought like a coward, he didn't attack because he knew he'd be knocked out, the dull fight was all Manny's fault, Floyd done what he always done, Manny changed his way of fighting due to fear

BTW, if you were to criticize Floyd or post where he maybe let you down from the fight what would it be? Isn't it best to maybe judge both men and give + and - for both?

cowzerp

walshb wrote: »

BTW, if you were to criticize Floyd or post where he maybe let you down from the fight what would it be? Isn't it best to maybe judge both men and give + and - for both?

floyd won 10 of the 12 rounds, i judged it as a judge at the time and when i heard 2 judges gave manny 4 rounds i thought it was stupid tbh
if you're talking from a spectators point of view i would have liked to see him go attack and KO Manny, as i think he could have, from a coaches point of view, he didn't need too, Manny simply didn't try

Manny fought different to usual not Floyd, The more pressure Manny put on the more countering Floyd would have done, that;s the nature of counter fighting!

Also the fans are seriously talking pony saying how Manny walke him down, he simply didn't, how there was so much hugging, was actually very little for a Floyd fight, how it was dirty! c'mon it wasn't a dirty fight, it was simply Floyd beating him most rounds by landing more, at 3-0 up after the 1st 3 the onus was on Manny to turn it, he did for 1 round then bottled it

walshb

Floyd Senior as his coach wasn't all that impressed judging by the comments between rds. He wanted Floyd to start seizing the fight.

HigginsJ

I see Paulie Maliganaggi has had a real go at Pacquiao.

At first he [Pacquiao] tried to say he won the fight. He didn’t even mention an injury

He then gets out of the ring and must have seen how ridiculous that he must have sounded that he thought he had won the fight, so he comes up with another excuse on the fly. So he went from ‘I thought I won the fight’ to the crazy injury that he’d injured his shoulder.”

“For me it’s disgusting,”

“You’re [Pacquiao] still bringing negative attention to the fight. Just go home, go back to the Philippines, go hang out with your family, get a big check. That’s it. For the first time in your life stop being such a narcissistic [expletive].”

Bit surprised to see Paulie being so forceful in his comments.

Johner

Paulie is a huge believer that Pacman has cheated his way to the top(drugs). Always very vocal about it on Twitter.

HigginsJ

Johner wrote: »

Paulie is a huge believer that Pacman has cheated his way to the top(drugs). Always very vocal about it on Twitter.

That explains it, I knew they hadn't fought so I couldn't understand what was up with Paulie.

Talib Fiasco

Paulie would still jump at the chance of fighting Manny for a pay day. I think there are only a handful of guys in Boxing I hate more than him...nothing more than a c*cky loud mouth who thinks he knows a lot more than he does.

HigginsJ

Talib Fiasco wrote: »

Paulie would still jump at the chance of fighting Manny for a pay day. I think there are only a handful of guys in Boxing I hate more than him...nothing more than a c*cky loud mouth who thinks he knows a lot more than he does.

I like him, he is a good co-commentator on the fights I have seen him do. I can see why the whole "cocky loud mouth" stuff would grate though.

Panic E

Johner wrote: »

Paulie is a huge believer that Pacman has cheated his way to the top(drugs). Always very vocal about it on Twitter.

That's a bit rich coming from someone who is working with Memo Heredia?

pac_man wrote: »

I was going to say that them comments come with an agenda in the form of Al Haymon

Got it in one man. His opinions on everything changed once he signed up.

Talib Fiasco

HigginsJ wrote: »

I like him, he is a good co-commentator on the fights I have seen him do. I can see why the whole "cocky loud mouth" stuff would grate though.

He does make some good points in fights but I always feel he has to have his voice heard and is too loud for my liking...much prefer the more relaxed and more calculated Roy Jones Jr, Al Bernstein who've I've grown to like and I really enjoy Andre Ward when he commentates.

Panic E

Talib Fiasco wrote: »

much prefer the more relaxed and more calculated Roy Jones Jr, Al Bernstein who've I've grown to like

x2, good combination there. Really liking Bernstein lately too actually

Halloween Jack

pac_man wrote: »

I don't think there's concrete proof that he is working with him. Heredia has stated that he wasn't working with him.

I saw Paulie refer to heredia as a 'genius' on Twitter.

Working with him or not, whoever labels that man a genius has no right to be wading in to a debate around drugs in sport.

Talib Fiasco

Heredia is up there with Don King etc. in terms of people most responsible for poisoning Boxing :pac:... ah yeah a little extreme but this man is doing Boxing and indeed sport no good.

Halloween Jack

Panic E wrote: »

What do you all think of this Angel Heredia dude working with fighters in boxing anyway???

And do you all know his history, I'm presuming most do. I knew nothing about PED's in sport.

Then he started working with Floyd, all the YTBC went ape and I learned a lot. That was comical!

Deeply troubling is what I think of that guy sniffing around boxing.

he's toxic and I find it strange that he seems to operate openly in the fight game. I know bolt's people, for example, were very quick to deny he had ever worked with this guy a few years ago...

walshb

Just to keep going on this::)

I'd add in the point that all 3 judges were U.S. judges.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/boxing/article-3077424/The-punch-statistics-prove-Floyd-Mayweather-fortunate-beat-Manny-Pacquiao-unanimous-decision.html

The conclusions here include:

1) The fight was far closer than the judges, especially Moretti, and most pundits perceived

2) Many rounds were exceptionally difficult if not too close to call.

3) The punch stats as counted in the heat of the night are profoundly suspect (one US commentator who had Pacquaio winning asked if they were compiled by ‘kids from the HBO and Showtime offices’ and was told ‘Yes.’)

4) Pacquiao’s claim that he had won the fight was reasonable, not outrageous as the in-ring interviewer implied.

5) If watching on television, maybe better to mute the sound commentary.

6) Mayweather is very wise to keep insisting on home-town advantage in Las Vegas, which benefits from the huge economic impact of his fights.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/boxing/article-3077424/The-punch-statistics-prove-Floyd-Mayweather-fortunate-beat-Manny-Pacquiao-unanimous-decision.html#ixzz3ZvTkJHiz
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

Bubor

Mayweather won that fight clearly but he's still a mere shadow of his peak self, it seems like he's afraid to hurt his hands when he punches so he never puts his weight being them as much as he used to.

Did anyone else notice Burger King in his entourage?

walshb

pac_man wrote: »

His analysis is based on boxingnews24,seriously? The epitome of lazy journalism but I wouldn't expect any different from The Daily Mail.

You haven't said anything, other than to dismiss a report. Let's dismiss compu box on the night then?

It's Jeff Powell reporting. That is all. The Daily Mail has nothing to do with it. Powell is quite a respected boxing reporter.

Anyway, it's interesting that the compu box on the night was so skewed in Floyd's favor. I had a feeling it was well off, and this backs that feeling up. Ridiculous analysis on fight night.

walshb

The PPV buys exceeds 4 million buys and the live gate exceeded 70 million dollars. Not bad for a night of tag boxing!

http://www.news.com.au/sport/boxing/floyd-mayweather-vs-manny-pacquiao-official-pay-per-view-numbers-are-staggering/story-fndkzthy-1227352853214

SHOVELLER

I enjoyed the fight and IMO talk of it being boring and doing nothing for the sport is missing the point. No surprise with the decision at all. Mayweather as a champion has the right to defend himself and try and not to get hit!

Did people really expect a war here?!

Rematch next April could be the perfect ending for a 50-0.

walshb

SHOVELLER wrote: »

Did people really expect a war here?!

No, I didn't think we did. I didn't. I knew that their styles would likley make for a pretty tame affair, but I did hope that we would see some effective offense. We got next to nothing. They are touted as the two best of their generation and they sparred and tipped each other for 12 rds.

walshb

Petroleum Jelly wrote: »

What do you expect, they are both well past their best.

Well past their best is a separate argument. Past their best or not we got a stinker of a fight as regards offensive output and substance. Floyd not wanting to make much of a fight, and Manny happy to coast along with the odd attack here and there. Add in a lot of threatening and posturing and there's your 500 million dollar extravaganza.

Joeseph Balls

pac_man wrote: »

What's the story with the ticket? Did you pay $30 to watch the fight in a pub?

I'd say so Pac man, pubs in the US were charging anything up to 1k in for it.

SHOVELLER

pac_man wrote: »

What's the story with the ticket? Did you pay $30 to watch the fight in a pub?

$33 with tax. Standard in NYC that weekend. Still with fair drink promotions the total was less than paying the PPV price.

Some bars were charging 3k for VIP packages!

Going back to the fight Manny didnt seem too upset to lose. Waving and smiling after and the bizarre scene pre fight when Roach took a selfie walking to the ring:eek:

cowzerp

walshb wrote: »

we got a stinker of a fight as regards offensive output and substance. Floyd not wanting to make much of a fight, and Manny happy to coast along with the odd attack here and there.

Bren it's not fair and very biased of you, Floyd's output will always be related to his opponents and we knew that from the start, and Manny was the one who changed up his usual self and didn't look to win and done pretty much 2 attacks in a 12 round match

If you cant see Manny been the reason this was a stinker then it's either biased or just silliness

Manny was the big let down who didn't do what he is loved for, Floyd done exactly what Floyd does

SHOVELLER

pac_man wrote: »

Why is it expensive? Is it standard practice to charge for ppv in pubs in the states? I remember reading an article saying that it costs pub a fair bit to get a fight in but can't remember if that was hotels looking for exclusivity in Vegas.

Not really. This fight was the exception. For example for the last Maidana fight bars were not charging in but still had specials.

As an aside to watch the rugby in Manhattan bars will charge $20 at the door as they get in Premium Sports but that's a scam as you can watch it in bars in DC for free.

walshb

cowzerp wrote: »

Bren it's not fair and very biased of you, Floyd's output will always be related to his opponents and we knew that from the start, and Manny was the one who changed up his usual self and didn't look to win and done pretty much 2 attacks in a 12 round match

It's not biased. I was clear in my criticisms of both men for the makings of a pretty poor spectacle. Criticizing just Manny is where the bias is, as well as the inaccuracy. Big time. Manny tried to fight, and Floyd did what he does. They both played a part in it. Manny not trying hard enough, and Floyd not trying hard enough, but you're making excuses for Floyd's part in it. That's where the bias is!

Mister Vain

walshb wrote: »

It's not biased. I was clear in my criticisms of both men for the makings of a pretty poor spectacle. Criticizing just Manny is where the bias is, as well as the inaccuracy. Big time. Manny tried to fight, and Floyd did what he does. They both played a part in it. Manny not trying hard enough, and Floyd not trying hard enough, but you're making excuses for Floyd's part in it. That's where the bias is!

He did enough to win the fight so you can't really accuse him of not trying hard enough. It may have been a dull spectacle but it was never going to live up to the hype anyway.

walshb

Mister Vain wrote: »

He did enough to win the fight so you can't really accuse him of not trying hard enough. It may have been a dull spectacle but it was never going to live up to the hype anyway.

Not in everyone's eyes he didn't win. And in saying this then I feel it's valid to criticize both men for failing to try hard enough. I saw a tag boxing match/spar. Both made it that way.

cowzerp

walshb wrote: »

Criticizing just Manny is where the bias is, as well as the inaccuracy. Big time. Manny tried to fight, and Floyd did what he does. They both played a part in it. Manny not trying hard enough, and Floyd not trying hard enough, but you're making excuses for Floyd's part in it. That's where the bias is!

Bren seriously this is like talking to someone who started watching Boxing last week!


Manny changed his style, Floyd didn't. That is the fact of the matter and what made this fight uneventful

walshb

cowzerp wrote: »

Bren seriously this is like talking to someone who started watching Boxing last week!


Manny changed his style, Floyd didn't. That is the fact of the matter and what made this fight uneventful

I am well aware of their styles and their history. I have watched them many times. Bottom line is that last week both made for a stinker. Both. Neither man looked like they wanted to really take the fight and win it. It was a glorified spar! I feel you are far too pro Floyd, and always have been, not allowing you to be in any way subjective.

BTW, I don't think Manny changed his style at all. Did he change his style in fight IV vs. JMM? The man in front of you has a lot to do with that. Manny's style is speed and volume, but against punchbags that can look spectacular. It doesn't work like that against all opponents, and especially not ones like Mayweather.

Mayweather made it very difficult for Manny to get off his combinations in rhythm and fluidity, and fair play to Floyd for that, but Floyd also didn't punish Manny at all in retaliation. Like I said, both made for a stinker. Had Floyd stood his ground more and countered more off Manny's attacks then we would have had a better fight, and IMO a firm Mayweather win. For whatever reason Mayweather didn't feel up to that, and instead he moved a lot and flicked and swiped and didn't get any impacting offense off.

Mayweather fight fans, and I would include myself as one, should really be let down by Floyd's display. I am sort of surprised that you weren't let down. It's almost like you don't want to admit that he was very disjointed and off. Winner or not. Remember, you did predict an easy win for Floyd. Did you really believe that he would barely put a mark on Manny's face? Surely you were expecting or hoping for a bit of a one sided beating? That did not happen.

cowzerp

it was an easy win, and if Manny had tried to win it would have been the same easy with Manny bust up bad.

ps. where am i saying it was awesome etc, I'm simply saying the hatred for Mayweather and fools blaming him when he done as expected to do is embarrassing to say the least

Halloween Jack

walshb wrote: »

I am well aware of their styles and their history. I have watched them many times. Bottom line is that last week both made for a stinker. Both. Neither man looked like they wanted to really take the fight and win it. It was a glorified spar! I feel you are far too pro Floyd, and always have been, not allowing you to be in any way subjective.

BTW, I don't think Manny changed his style at all. Did he change his style in fight IV vs. JMM? The man in front of you has a lot to do with that. Manny's style is speed and volume, but against punchbags that can look spectacular. It doesn't work like that against all opponents, and especially not ones like Mayweather.

Mayweather made it very difficult for Manny to get off his combinations in rhythm and fluidity, and fair play to Floyd for that, but Floyd also didn't punish Manny at all in retaliation. Like I said, both made for a stinker. Had Floyd stood his ground more and countered more off Manny's attacks then we would have had a better fight, and IMO a firm Mayweather win. For whatever reason Mayweather didn't feel up to that, and instead he moved a lot and flicked and swiped and didn't get any impacting offense off.

Mayweather fight fans, and I would include myself as one, should really be let down by Floyd's display. I am sort of surprised that you weren't let down. It's almost like you don't want to admit that he was very disjointed and off. Winner or not. Remember, you did predict an easy win for Floyd. Did you really believe that he would barely put a mark on Manny's face? Surely you were expecting or hoping for a bit of a one sided beating? That did not happen.

Decent post. I still think it's that poxy zero that has prevented mayweather becoming as good as he could have been.

He wasn't too keen on taking any shots (and in fairness manny definitely buzzed him once) with the zero in mind.

If floyd already had a couple of defeats he'd probably take a few more risks and we'd have a more entertaining fighter.

That being said if they were to fight again Id predict the type of mayweather victory we expected first time out.

T-K-O

cowzerp wrote: »

it was an easy win, and if Manny had tried to win it would have been the same easy with Manny bust up bad.

ps. where am i saying it was awesome etc, I'm simply saying the hatred for Mayweather and fools blaming him when he done as expected to do is embarrassing to say the least

Tell us again how the most ~aggressive fighter of a generation is a coward, after all, tis the weekend and time for laugh.

FTA69

Again, nobody said this was a fight for the ages, rather just pointing out that Floyd won it and landed more scoring shots. There is absolutely no argument whatsoever that Floyd didn't win it, none. The only people I've seen even attempting to make such a farcical point have been on here.

Panic E

Lewis Hamilton thought that Pacquaio won it

Joeseph Balls

Panic E wrote: »

Lewis Hamilton thought that Pacquaio won it

Lewis should stick to driving and blaming others when he dosnt win.

cowzerp

T-K-O wrote: »

Tell us again how the most ~aggressive fighter of a generation is a coward, after all, tis the weekend and time for laugh.

he wasn't brave in the Mayweather fight.
my comment was based on that 1 night and it still stands

efb

Are we still on this?

walshb

efb wrote: »

Are we still on this?

It seems so. As the thread is abut the fight, and still open, I am surprised you are surprised?

T-K-O

cowzerp wrote: »

he wasn't brave in the Mayweather fight.
my comment was based on that 1 night and it still stands

So he should have walked him down ala Cotto , Dela Hoya etc. He wasn't fighting those guys and it would have been stupid and reckless if he fought that way.

Pac hasn't displayed that aggression in a few years. The fire is gone, sadly.

walshb

T-K-O wrote: »

So he should have walked him down ala Cotto , Dela Hoya etc. He wasn't fighting those guys and it would have been stupid and reckless if he fought that way.

Pac hasn't displayed that aggression in a few years. The fire is gone, sadly.

And cowzerp thinks that had Manny tried harder he would have gotten knocked out, correct me if I am wrong, Paul? So Manny can't get any credit here. He doesn't "try" hard enough to attack against a defensive fighter and mover like Floyd he gets criticized, (called cowardly) and if he tries harder and becomes more gung ho he gets knocked out, and he gets criticized. It's a no win situation for Manny in some people's eyes.

Bottom line is that there is no way Manny gets the same volume and aggression against a fighter like Mayweather compared to some other punch bag type fighters that he has fought. Floyd takes that away from Manny. That's Floyd's talent!

T-K-O

Exactly, Cowzerp has no interested in Manny putting in an aggression performance. He wanted Manny to be stupid. We all have our favorites and there are no prizes for guessing which camp cowzerp falls in to.

Fact of the matter is, he's not the Pac that beat up Oscar, Cotta, Margarito et al and he was fighting PBF, those two combined = less shots thrown and landed.

Panic E

Yeah cowzwerp, what are ya like man :rolleyes: Fred Mayweather is the total goose


'Lewis Hamilton should stick to race cars & Evander Holyfield is punch drunk'

And Shane Mosley? Lemme guess, "don't know skit about boxing" I'm takin it


Anyway Pacquioa maintains if you score the fight that he won it 7-5 just sayin

T-K-O

If he wasn't before, he is now

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2015/05/17/mitt-romney-lasts-2-rounds-with-evander-holyfield-in-charity-boxing-match/

Panic E

I'm only having the craic. Yeah seen that! Fair play to Romney