Football Championship 2014

keane2097

Nidgeweasel wrote: »

It's their arrogance too. Good arrogance by the way, this isn't a slight on them by any means.

Kerry go to croke park and it's their stadium. The tradition they have and what have you seems to get more out of them when you'd think they're in for a mauling. Although as is always said tradition only gets you so far.

JOC was sensational at the Munster final but Cork didn't exactly cover themselves with glory. With the right draw they could stroll into the last 4 but beyond that, I think Mayo, Donegal, Dublin would all be in a position to beat them.

The bold is definitely correct (although more than likely we can only meet Mayo or Cork at that stage) but it's a great improvement in our fortunes to be in a situation where we look capable of being in something close to a coinflip at the semi-final stage now from a position where it looked like the year was set to be a write-off a couple of months ago.

I think I've said it before but the Munster final could be our Mayo vs Galway moment where our young players go from commendable effort (2012 for Mayo) to really serious contenders seemingly overnight.

A Kerry-Mayo semi-final would be a superb test for both teams for different reasons.

PaddyCar

Anyone know what games are on the box this saturday?

PaddyCar

Ah just seen Armagh Roscommon is live on Sky on Saturday

Coillte_Bhoy

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

Definitely the weekend on 2nd 3rd, but no guarantee of the day.

Possibly they will play a Rnd 4 B with each QF thus making it a two day event, but if not it will be Sunday 3rd.

Any word of when they will be announcing full details?

Fr Tod Umptious

Coillte_Bhoy wrote: »

Any word of when they will be announcing full details?

No idea

The Rnd 3 B games are on at the weekend and as are the provincial games that will determine their opponents

So maybe as soon as Monday they will schedule the Rnd 4 B games, and we will know then if they are to be mixed with the Munster\Connaught v Rnd 4 A winners

The location of Munster\Connaught v Rnd 4 A winners is certainly Croke Park so hopefully they will not wait until the Rnd 4 A winners are determined on July 26th\27th to schedule those games.

Fr Tod Umptious

keane2097 wrote: »

The bold is definitely correct (although more than likely we can only meet Mayo or Cork at that stage) but it's a great improvement in our fortunes to be in a situation where we look capable of being in something close to a coinflip at the semi-final stage now from a position where it looked like the year was set to be a write-off a couple of months ago.

I think I've said it before but the Munster final could be our Mayo vs Galway moment where our young players go from commendable effort (2012 for Mayo) to really serious contenders seemingly overnight.

A Kerry-Mayo semi-final would be a superb test for both teams for different reasons.

Not sure if I am reading this right but are you suggesting that the 2012 Mayo became really serious contenders seemingly overnight ?

I'd tend to disagree with that.
I've said it before here that I think that Mayo v Kerry in 2011 showed me that Mayo would be serious contenders for 2012, even though they lost by 9.
I have never left a game that Mayo have lost with so much optimism. From the way they performed I had a fair idea that they were a team that would be in the very same place and would go even further in 2012

You mentioned before that a possible Mayo v Kerry in 2014 would be a role reversal of 2011, the young inexperienced Kerry v the established Mayo.
It will be interesting how it pans out if it does indeed come to pass.

keane2097

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

Not sure if I am reading this right but are you suggesting that the 2012 Mayo became really serious contenders seemingly overnight ?

I'd tend to disagree with that.
I've said it before here that I think that Mayo v Kerry in 2011 showed me that Mayo would be serious contenders for 2012, even though they lost by 9.
I have never left a game that Mayo have lost with so much optimism. From the way they performed I had a fair idea that they were a team that would be in the very same place and would go even further in 2012

You mentioned before that a possible Mayo v Kerry in 2014 would be a role reversal of 2011, the young inexperienced Kerry v the established Mayo.
It will be interesting how it pans out if it does indeed come to pass.

I don't really think Mayo improved massively in 2012 compared to 2011 even though they got to the final they were still operating on a similar level. I think last year they became a different animal, which they signalled by destroying Galway.

Nidgeweasel

keane2097 wrote: »

I don't really think Mayo improved massively in 2012 compared to 2011 even though they got to the final they were still operating on a similar level. I think last year they became a different animal, which they signalled by destroying Galway.

I disagree. I think the start of 2012 they['d upped it. IN 2013 they seem to come back bigger (and angrier).

They're not a million miles off an all ireland.

Dubliner28

Hopefully Tipp will get through. Would love to see them in Croker and give Mayo a decent game of football,

klairondavis

If Tipp get through they will probably play Kerry. If Cork beat Sligo they will have to play Mayo because they cannot face Kerry again in the quarters.

Dubliner28

Ah right there goes that idea so. Kerry will beat Tipp. Cork and Mayo would be a decent game so.

Fr Tod Umptious

keane2097 wrote: »

I don't really think Mayo improved massively in 2012 compared to 2011 even though they got to the final they were still operating on a similar level. I think last year they became a different animal, which they signalled by destroying Galway.

Ok I get where you are coming from now.

You are suggesting that the Kerry win v Cork this year is similar to the Mayo win v Galway in 2013 in the sense that it is an example of a team making a larger progression in development than expected.

It may be the case all right, and if it is then Kerry are a few years more developed than I expected them to be, but I think there are still some differences between both events.

Mayo’s progression from 2011 has been gradual, 2011 showed potential, 2012 built on it.

That team of 2012 had already made a mark by beating Down (a county similar in ability to Galway) by 12pts in the 2012 QF.
The team that played that day, and back in the 2011, was very similar to the team that appeared in May 2013.
There were only 4 players that played v Down that did not appear v Galway, 3 due to injury, 1 dropped.
And there was one starter v Galway that had little or no championship experience (C Carolan)

In 2013 I always argued that Mayo did not need a ‘test’ to verify their All Ireland contender credentials. This was based on the fact that what we saw in 2013 was an improvement on 2012 and 2011 with very little squad turn over, rather than some relatively new or inexperienced team appearing from nowhere.

Plus Mayo had decent league performances in spring 2012 (final) and spring 2013 (semi-final)

I think Kerry 2014 are different from the Mayo situation that I have described above.

There is far more personnel turnover in Kerry
There were 7 players that played v Dublin in 2013 that took no part v Cork in 2014 (3 retired, 4 injured/dropped).
4 players with little or no championship experience started v Cork in 2014.

Kerry have had poor league performances in 2013 and 2014

The theory that Kerry need to be ‘tested’ is to some extent a valid one, this is a relatively new and inexperienced team, and a lot has been made of the Cork performance on the day.

So looking at it from the outside I think it is a bit early to come to the conclusion that this team have young players going from commendable effort to really serious contenders seemingly overnight.

keane2097

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

Ok I get where you are coming from now.

You are suggesting that the Kerry win v Cork this year is similar to the Mayo win v Galway in 2013 in the sense that it is an example of a team making a larger progression in development than expected.

It may be the case all right, and if it is then Kerry are a few years more developed than I expected them to be, but I think there are still some differences between both events.

Mayo’s progression from 2011 has been gradual, 2011 showed potential, 2012 built on it.

That team of 2012 had already made a mark by beating Down (a county similar in ability to Galway) by 12pts in the 2012 QF.
The team that played that day, and back in the 2011, was very similar to the team that appeared in May 2013.
There were only 4 players that played v Down that did not appear v Galway, 3 due to injury, 1 dropped.
And there was one starter v Galway that had little or no championship experience (C Carolan)

In 2013 I always argued that Mayo did not need a ‘test’ to verify their All Ireland contender credentials. This was based on the fact that what we saw in 2013 was an improvement on 2012 and 2011 with very little squad turn over, rather than some relatively new or inexperienced team appearing from nowhere.

Plus Mayo had decent league performances in spring 2012 (final) and spring 2013 (semi-final)

I think Kerry 2014 are different from the Mayo situation that I have described above.

There is far more personnel turnover in Kerry
There were 7 players that played v Dublin in 2013 that took no part v Cork in 2014 (3 retired, 4 injured/dropped).
4 players with little or no championship experience started v Cork in 2014.

Kerry have had poor league performances in 2013 and 2014

The theory that Kerry need to be ‘tested’ is to some extent a valid one, this is a relatively new and inexperienced team, and a lot has been made of the Cork performance on the day.

So looking at it from the outside I think it is a bit early to come to the conclusion that this team have young players going from commendable effort to really serious contenders seemingly overnight.

I don't disagree with any of that and of course it's not a perfect comparison in the here and now, I suppose I'm saying we might end up looking back at the Munster final in the future as being the time this Kerry team emerged as a real team, like I would say the Galway game is a post hoc line in the sand for Mayo. People still had doubts about Mayo up to probably the Donegal game, but looking back now you can say the Galway game showed how good they were, regardless of how good or bad Galway were. You could envisage something similar if Kerry were to go on to beat Mayo in a SF - we weren't sure after the Munster final how good Kerry were, but looking back they really showed what they were about that day...

I always agree with you on the "test" thing because what people always mean about it is basically "I hope we play bad enough to nearly lose to a **** team before the All Ireland semi-final".

When I talk about a test in the context of Kerry vs Mayo, it's not that Kerry or Mayo "need" a test so I hope the game goes a particular way, it's that that game will BE a test regardless - a test of whether Kerry are really a force, whether Mayo really bottle it when they see green & gold in Croke Park etc.

Boom__Boom

Clare 0-7 Kildare 0-4 at HT - looking like a big shock could be on the cards.

Clare started the year in Division 4 and Kildare in Division 1

Frankie Lee

Not that big a shock really, a poor division 2 team against an improving division 3 team.

Boom__Boom

Frankie Lee wrote: »

Not that big a shock really, a poor division 2 team against an improving division 3 team.

Ah still - it would be notable enough if Clare got the win.

keane2097

Frankie Lee wrote: »

Not that big a shock really, a poor division 2 team against an improving division 3 team.

Will you stop, it would be one of the biggest shocks of the last number of years.

How are Kildare already a poor Division 2 team when they haven't even played in Division 2 yet?

Frankie Lee

keane2097 wrote: »

Will you stop, it would be one of the biggest shocks of the last number of years.

How are Kildare already a poor Division 2 team when they haven't even played in Division 2 yet?

Kidlare were close to getting hammered by an average division 2 team in Meath 3 weeks ago, they are miles away from the good teams in the championship.

keane2097

Frankie Lee wrote: »

Kidlare were close to getting hammered by an average division 2 team in Meath 3 weeks ago, they are miles away from the good teams in the championship.

Grand, fair play for not being surprised.

Frankie Lee

keane2097 wrote: »

Grand, fair play for not being surprised.

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=91258543&postcount=2286

I kind of called it/ wasn't anyway confident. Clare have the wind in the second half, Kissane has Clare extremely fit so I'd expect them to pull further clear.

Boom__Boom

Clare 0-12 Kildare 0-6 after 45 minutes.

Clare driving for home.

Frankie Lee

It mightn't be unexpected but it is the biggest embarrassment for a Kildare team since the preMcGeeney days.

Boom__Boom

Boom__Boom wrote: »

Clare 0-12 Kildare 0-6 after 45 minutes.

Clare driving for home.

Clare 0-12 Kildare 0-10 54mins

Kildare digging deep.

tanko

Boom__Boom wrote: »

Clare 0-12 Kildare 0-10 54mins

Kildare digging deep.

Any update on this?

Frankie Lee

Clare 1 point ahead, Hurley and Brophy on for Kildare, some good young players need to show leadership.

Boom__Boom

Still Clare 0-12 Kildare 0-11 61 minutes

Sounds like Kildare subs have made a difference.

Boom__Boom

Clare 0-12 Kildare 0-13 63 mins

Hammer Archer

Kildare leading by a point now. Clare without a score for 20 minutes.

Boom__Boom

Boom__Boom wrote: »

Clare 0-12 Kildare 0-13 63 mins

67 mins Still the same.

Frankie Lee

McQuillin will get Clare ahead here.

tanko

Extra time?

Boom__Boom

Injury time
Kildare still a point up

dmc17

All over

Frankie Lee

Unlucky for Clare, Kildare will get one more game.

Boom__Boom

FT Kildare 0-13 Clare 0-12.

glued

Joe McQuillan is an awful referee. Shocking that he's still getting games.

Hammer Archer

Assuming Dublin win tomorrow, Kildare will play the losers of the Ulster final. Can't see them beating either.

Frankie Lee

Hammer Archer wrote: »

Assuming Dublin win tomorrow, Kildare will play the losers of the Ulster final. Can't see them beating either.

Clutching at straws but when Kildare have made 1/4 finals in recent years they usually have a lucky win over relative minnows like Cavan, Limerick and Antrim along the way. I'd rather play Monaghan. Kildare obviously massive underdogs.

Hopefully the minors give a good account of themselves tomorrow as there is an obvious need for new players to come through.

Boom__Boom

Of the 12 teams left in the Championship now, 5 are from Division 1, 5 from Division 2, 1 from Division 3 and 1 from Division 4.

Could well be the case when it goes down to 10 next week it could be all 10 from Division 1 and Division 2.

Squatman

After this weekends play, my prediction for the all ireland final is the same as last year. Im predicting a Mayo Dublin final, with Dublin to steal it again this year. Donegal failed to impress against monaghan yesterday, and meath failed to show up against dublin. Kerry whopped cork, but had a hard task against Clare in the weeks before. I think mayo will beat donegal, kerry, and cork/sligo, and i expect dublin to beat anyone that have the misfortune of going up against them... including mayo. What are your thoughts?

yop

Squatman wrote: »

After this weekends play, my prediction for the all ireland final is the same as last year. Im predicting a Mayo Dublin final, with Dublin to steal it again this year. Donegal failed to impress against monaghan yesterday, and meath failed to show up against dublin. Kerry whopped cork, but had a hard task against Clare in the weeks before. I think mayo will beat donegal, kerry, and cork/sligo, and i expect dublin to beat anyone that have the misfortune of going up against them... including mayo. What are your thoughts?

Donegal aren't on Mayos side of the draw I think? Mayo will be playing either Cork or Sligo and then Kerry if they come through.

Donegal impressed plenty yesterday, without McFadden and Murphy they were still well ahead of Monaghan.

Moneymaker

Squatman wrote: »

After this weekends play, my prediction for the all ireland final is the same as last year. Im predicting a Mayo Dublin final, with Dublin to steal it again this year. Donegal failed to impress against monaghan yesterday, and meath failed to show up against dublin. Kerry whopped cork, but had a hard task against Clare in the weeks before. I think mayo will beat donegal, kerry, and cork/sligo, and i expect dublin to beat anyone that have the misfortune of going up against them... including mayo. What are your thoughts?

Steal it?

Prop Joe

1/4 finals are looking like

Cork v Mayo
Kerry v Galway

Dublin v Monaghan
Donegal v Armagh

keane2097

Two very tough tests for Dublin before they would get to a final. It'll be a well won All Ireland for whoever emerges at this stage. Would love to see Dublin really stretched, just to see how good they can be.

Fr Tod Umptious

Prop Joe wrote: »

1/4 finals are looking like

Cork v Mayo
Kerry v Galway

Dublin v Monaghan
Donegal v Armagh

Not sure how people are assuming a Cork win v Sligo.

Cork are a shambles, they scraped past Tipp, they were destroyed by Kerry, nothing they have done points to their continued participation in the championship.

Even though Sligo have only beaten Wicklow and Limerick they have some momentum.

Unless Cork have a serious look at themselves and decide that they want to be involved , for another round at least, I think this one will be going the way of Sligo.

Moneymaker

Galway beating Tipp isn't exactly a gimme either.

Squatman

Moneymaker wrote: »

Steal it?

I knew someone would pick up on that.
But in all honesty, the do seem like the best team this year.

even without diarmuid Suarez connolly

Squatman

yop wrote: »

Donegal aren't on Mayos side of the draw I think? Mayo will be playing either Cork or Sligo and then Kerry if they come through.

Donegal impressed plenty yesterday, without McFadden and Murphy they were still well ahead of Monaghan.

Oh righteo, i didnt know that, i though it was only the next round that was confirmed yet. Should be a very interesting development so. Mayo very rarely have beaten Kerry, but i think they have the skill to put them away this year.

keane2097

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

Not sure how people are assuming a Cork win v Sligo.

Cork are a shambles, they scraped past Tipp, they were destroyed by Kerry, nothing they have done points to their continued participation in the championship.

Even though Sligo have only beaten Wicklow and Limerick they have some momentum.

Unless Cork have a serious look at themselves and decide that they want to be involved , for another round at least, I think this one will be going the way of Sligo.

I would submit that Sligo's form this year is worse than Cork's. Lost four out of seven in Division 3, beaten pretty comfortably by a Galway team rated no better than Tipp by the bookies before limping past Wicklow and Limerick.

You can call Cork a shambles based on form if you insist I suppose, but implying Sligo's form is any major encouragement seems like using the same metric the opposite way around for two teams based on the conclusion you had already reached.

Fr Tod Umptious

keane2097 wrote: »

Two very tough tests for Dublin before they would get to a final. It'll be a well won All Ireland for whoever emerges at this stage. Would love to see Dublin really stretched, just to see how good they can be.

Yes a couple of games v nordies will be interesting for Dublin.

They have meet with pretty tame opposition thus far.