Dublin GAA Discussion Thread MOD WARNING POST #2944

MayoAreMagic

Billy Mays wrote: »

It's completely irrelevant because, and bear with me here, Manchester United and Manchester United reserves do not compete in the same competitions against each other which is what you're arguing for here with a Dublin A and B team.

So the entire debate revolves around how man utd put their teams out... The gaa cant develop and/or grow because man utd and man utd reserves are not in competition with each other.

How about Barcelona? They have a B team... :rolleyes:

MayoAreMagic

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

I did answer your questions and other posters also cogently answered your questions.

Then when those questions were answered you quickly searched for another angle to "debate"/"bait".


Jayus if the Mayo football were as good at making points and looking for angles as you are the "mayo famine" would have been over years ago

You addressed some points early on. But I don't agree that other posters answered my questions, they tried to dismiss them, or tried to discredit the guy asking them. Truth be told, if what people are claiming is correct, then my posts should be getting picked apart. They aren't.

gormdubhgorm

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

So the entire debate revolves around how man utd put their teams out... The gaa cant develop and/or grow because man utd and man utd reserves are not in competition with each other.

How about Barcelona? They have a B team... :rolleyes:

Yes but the Barcelona B team cannot be promoted and they are basically an u21 team Dublin already have an u21 team.

In fact in this years u21 championsjip Dublin fielded an entire team of u21s none of which were in the senior panel at time.

Unlike other teams like Mayo who played senior panel members Loftus and D.O'Connor. :eek:

Squareball

Where do people find the time???????????????????????

MayoAreMagic

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

Ok mayo magic I will tell why Dublin football does not need a second team/development team:


1) It will only end up being a glorified u21 team or worse still a team full of non-Dubs who are sick of playing for thier own counties, thereby killing football in thier former county.

As I pointed out to jaden, transfer issues isn't specific to Dublin 2nds. As for glorified u21s, that isnt who took the field at the weekend...

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

2) A new Dublin development team would need a home ground - since most of the lack of football development is on the the Southside in Soccer/Rugby areas a new "home ground" will have to be built.

Double-headers with Dublin 1st team, and then the idle parnell park for other games.

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

3) If this new Dublin development team is created it will play at a lower league level taken up a spot on another county. Can you imagine the furor from the county that is relegated as a result?

If Dublin B relegate mayo, I'll be blaming mayo, not Dublin B, so no, no furore...

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

4) The issue of resources will be discussed AGAIN as the argument will be that the GAA should be concentrating on other counties and not Dublin

I would completely disagree on that. Surely this would be seen as a way of balancing things up a bit by other counties? However, you should probably realise, resources are going to be discussed for as long as there is an imbalance in them, and so they should be to be honest about it.

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

5) It would just turn into a blue elephant as there is no real need to further develop county football in Dublin.

A crazy assertion in my eyes. A football mad county, that boasts 1/5 of the population, which only togs out 15 players to represent it... Development is needed there man.

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

If you were on about the restructuring of clubs in Dublin and the creation of more I would understand based on demographics and population, makes sense. If you were on about the development of hurling in Dublin it would make sense like the Fingal team, grand

But surely counties are de facto large scale clubs. How can the logic be ok for clubs but not for counties when they are in essence the same thing on different scales?

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

6) Dublin have minor/u21/O'Byrne Cup/League and the Leinster championship to try out players of various stages of development and ability already.

They also have, by a distance the biggest population of footballers who are good enough to play intercounty football, but never will play intercounty football.

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

7) The last thing that the lesser lights in Gaelic football need is a Dublin development team it has the potential to destroy Carlow/Kildare/Meath/Louth/Wicklow et al.

Surely that only proves that these lads deserve to play intercounty football? Why would you prevent them doing that?

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

8) Who will support this Dublin development team they will have no fans/no fanbase?

Are you saying the dubs wouldn't support their own team?

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

9) It will just add another layer to Dublin GAA cost money, serve no real purpose and will just be another team for the sake of it.

It serves the purpose of getting high level footballers playing intercounty football. That is what the game is about at the top level.

gormdubhgorm

Squareball wrote: »

Where do people find the time???????????????????????

High unemployment rate in Mayo? :rolleyes:

Godge

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

You hire a second management team, same as any club team do when they start a second or third team.
As for cost difficulties - ah come on, if Leitrim can tog a county team every year, Dublin could tog a second team. We both know you are reaching with this 'times are hard' spiel. We all know Dublin have the resources to put out a second side without hindering the first side.

.

This is one of the biggest (of many) flaws in your argument.

Dublin may well have the money, but your suggestion just reflects the ignorance that is widespread around the country about what Dublin invests money in.

Dublin doesn't waste money on the county team with warm-weather training every couple of months the way some county teams that haven't won an All-Ireland for decades do. Instead the resources generated in Dublin go into the club scene, into providing opportunities for kids, for club players, for training and upskilling and for developing club facilities. This investment at club level is aimed at driving participation and making GAA the sport of choice of ordinary people in Dublin.

I would not want to see resources taken away from clubs and devoted to the preparation of an unnecessary second county team. Much better that the money is spent at local level.

Godge

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

It serves the purpose of getting high level footballers playing intercounty football. That is what the game is about at the top level.

Yes, but the Dublin County Board isn't about the game at the top level, it is about driving participation rates upwards and encouraging the game at club level, particularly the juveniles.

gormdubhgorm

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

As I pointed out to jaden, transfer issues isn't specific to Dublin 2nds. As for glorified u21s, that isnt who took the field at the weekend...

It was a large percentage of u21s mixed with minors playing in the "ultra competitive" world of the O'Byrne cup :rolleyes:

Double-headers with Dublin 1st team, and then the idle parnell park for other games

A pitch on the southside would be needed as this would be the area Dublin GAA would need to target

A second county board would need to be formed and this would drain the resources of the GAA further

If Dublin B relegate mayo, I'll be blaming mayo, not Dublin B, so no, no furore...

You would be blaming the curse no doubt....

I would completely disagree on that. Surely this would be seen as a way of balancing things up a bit by other counties? However, you should probably realise, resources are goig to be discussed for as long as there is an imbalance in them, and so they should be to be honest about it.

How would it balance things up a bit it would only make things worse as I said a second dublin team in whatever guise would dominate the lower echelons of the GAA.

A crazy assertion in my eyes. A football mad county, that boasts 1/5 of the population, which only togs out 15 players to represent it... Development is needed there man.

You erroneously assume that 1/5 of the population has an interest in the GAA.

But surely counties are de facto large scale clubs. How can the logic be ok for clubs but not for counties when they are in essence the same thing on different scales?

Because a club serves a community an identity .

A county team is NOT like a club team any GAA person will tell you that neighbours, brothers, uncles, cousins primary school friends who all grew up together play for clubs. Any GAA person will tell you that.

To say that a county team is a defacto club team just with a larger scale is a very un-GAA thing to say.

They also have, by a distance the biggest population of footballers who are good enough to play intercounty football, but never will play intercounty football.

Bring in a Granny rule for other counties like the rule Leitrim have Declan Darcy etc in the 90s. Then they could play in any county that they are eligible for.

Surely that only proves that these lads deserve to play intercounty football? Why would you prevent them doing that?

As I said Granny rule Dub with Mayo Granny can play for Mayo if he has not played senior for Dublin, Dub with Carlow Granny play for Carlow and so on

Are you saying the dubs wouldn't support their own team?

Yes it is not thier own team it is a manufactured team.

No identity, no history, nothing

It serves the purpose of getting high level footballers playing intercounty football. That is what the game is about at the top level.

It would suck players from other counties into "the team". Even if there was a rule where only Dubs could play for "second team" do you think u21s and minors would take pride in playing for the second rate team? When if they were good enough they could already progress through the age groups

Billy Mays

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

So the entire debate revolves around how man utd put their teams out... The gaa cant develop and/or grow because man utd and man utd reserves are not in competition with each other.

How about Barcelona? They have a B team... :rolleyes:

You took that from what I posted?



3/10 must try harder

Jaden

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

But you are assuming that this resource pool is the same as the pool of your rivals, and so splitting it would be weakening the team. Dublin have 10 times the population of their 2 closest rivals. They have the resources to spend twice what they currently spend on their football team and more.

I made no such comparison. I will state my point of view plainly once more:
If Dublin field a second senior football team, it will by it's very existence weaken the prospects of the first. Other counties are not relevant to this statement. Do you accept that this assertion is true? If not, there is no point in continuing.

I'm unsure what use population comparisons are to this, population is no indication of playing pool.

Mayo have approx 130K people living in the county (2011 figure).
Dublin have approx 1.35M people living in the county. (2016 figure).

However:
Mayo have 10,645 registered players in the county. 1:13 ratio.
Dublin have 39,197 registered players in the county. 1:33 ratio.
(Cork have 33,832, our nearest rivals).

So Dublin have an advantage of about 15% over the county with the next highest player pool.

The player resources gap is nowhere near what you claim it to be. In fact, your population statement is grossly misleading. What is listed above, is accurate and far more relevant. End of.

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

I would disagree. Players would emerge from the B team and challenge on the first team - the Fentons of this world. Having 60 guys involved in intercounty football would be a good thing for Dublin. The second team would develop players for the first team.

It's fine to disagree, but this whole point is just an opinion, you provide no evidence to support it. In fact, if you thought this would help the squad, you'd be pushing for the Mayo seniors to adopt this idea. To be honest, Mayo's shortcomings have roots in the lack of depth of the squad, it would probably be of more value to their setup than Dublins.

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

You hire a second management team, same as any club team do when they start a second or third team.
As for cost difficulties - ah come on, if Leitrim can tog a county team every year, Dublin could tog a second team. We both know you are reaching with this 'times are hard' spiel. We all know Dublin have the resources to put out a second side without hindering the first side.

You are confusing couldn't with shouldn't. Dublin could certainly do this, but for reasons listed in point one, they shouldn't. End of.

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

But you aren't dividing an existing one... You are discounting the first 30 odd guys and going again. The same fans can follow both.
Amalgamating is wrought with difficulties in comparison. Both are possible, but then why would you want to stop guys playing intercounty football, instead of getting more guys playing intercounty football? Surely the inclusive move is to get more teams involved rather than join up teams that can field teams as they are?

Yet again I swill state, you are dividing the resources available to our Senior team - this is a bad thing for Dublin. Case closed.

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

If you find it distasteful, you dont have to tog out. You can ignore them when they take to the field to represent you also if you like. But there are plenty guys out there who would love a chance at playing intercounty football and I don't think you finding it distasteful would really bother them. What is to be gained by stopping them for the sake of it?

You should really take this up with Kilkenny, seeing as they deliberately deny the prospect of Senior IC football to EVERY SINGLE PLAYER IN THE COUNTY. Would this not be the appropriate place to start on the crusade to ensure players get a chance to play for their counties? I'm touched that you are so concerned for the plight of Dublin players, but are you sure your concerns are of pure intention?

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

As for transfers, well that is open to debate, but for arguments sake, we can say that once you are named in the first team squad, you stay in that team for the year. Same as the club system - i.e. the well developed and already existing model of my suggestion...

So the rules would be the same as they are for any IC transfer?

There we have it, in no uncertain terms, you are calling for Dublin to be split in two.
Tres Drole.

corny

Will this obvious trolling, wrapped as spirited debate lark be tolerated indefinitely?

BonnieSituation

Probably until the league starts.

gormdubhgorm

BonnieSituation wrote: »

Probably until the league starts.

I suppose it is like the O'Byrne Cup it is only treated as a warm up then the refs try out new rules later on in the year.

I find it amusing though as any fella with a username MayoAreMagic posting in a Dublin forum is only there to kill time between sheep dips.

It can't be taken too seriously.

By the same token though I think a lot of what s/he said could be applied to the Dublin hurlers.

I would like more money resources lashed into hurling and more things tried.

Similar to the Fingal thing except on a bigger scale.

Because I think it would be an awful shame to let the recent achievements of Dublin hurling just fizzle out.

More attention needs to be given to the Dublin hurlers especially since the footballers are going so well and naturally taking all the limelight.

It might be more aspirational then reality, but a Cuala all-Ireland win could be the real shot in the arm Dublin hurling needs.

MayoAreMagic

Curious that fair and reasonable points are cast as 'trolling'
Surely that type of purposely dismissive attitude to fair points is the textbook definition of what trolling actually is...

I am just seeing the same points being repeated despite them being countered already... That makes this feigned indignation all the more ridiculous. I had hoped people might be able to respond objectively but there has been little of it; just the same tired, myopic rhetoric.

Godge

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

I am just seeing the same points being repeated despite them being countered already...

I have exactly the same problem:

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

With that many players in the county there must be a lot of guys who could make it but don't get the same chance they might get elsewhere.

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

Surely more guys getting exposed to intercounty football within a county is a good thing for that county?

.

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

. Just a second selection from Dublin, say outside the first 30 or whatever, putting in a team. Basically Dublin B for want of a better term.
.

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

It isn't though, it isn't splitting the county at all, it is getting more guys exposed to top level football. .

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

The give more people, who already have the ability to do so, a chance to showcase and develop their skills at the top level?

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

But you aren't dividing an existing one... You are discounting the first 30 odd guys and going again.
. But there are plenty guys out there who would love a chance at playing intercounty football . What is to be gained by stopping them for the sake of it?

.

It gets boring after a while, doesn't it?

gormdubhgorm

Godge wrote: »

I have exactly the same problem:














It gets boring after a while, doesn't it?

Mayo are used to Déjà vu, in fairness....

MayoAreMagic

Jaden wrote: »

Mayo have 10,645 registered players in the county. 1:13 ratio.
Dublin have 39,197 registered players in the county. 1:33 ratio.
(Cork have 33,832, our nearest rivals).

Can we see some background on these figures please?

The rest of your post I have already disproven...

MayoAreMagic

Godge wrote: »

It gets boring after a while, doesn't it?

If it can be shown to be wrong, I have no problem dropping it.
Ball is in your court godge...

Godge

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

If it can be shown to be wrong, I have no problem dropping it.
Ball is in your court godge...

You keep repeating the same argument, despite it being repeatedly debunked. You place an importance on playing county football that nobody else on this thread has agreed with. You confuse club and county football as being the same.

County football is not the main purpose of the GAA and is certainly not the main focus of the Dublin County Board. Increasing participation, particularly at juvenile level is the main purpose of Dublin's expenditure on GAA.

You just don't get it, hence you repeat the same tired argument. Any money spent on a second county team would take money from the club scene in Dublin and that is unacceptable to me and most Dublin supporters.

Dyr

Sure the fingal project was put on ice because it was messing up club fixtures

Anyone who thinks dublin clubs would tolerate a second inter county team pulling their players away needs their head checked

MayoAreMagic

Godge wrote: »

You keep repeating the same argument, despite it being repeatedly debunked. You place an importance on playing county football that nobody else on this thread has agreed with. You confuse club and county football as being the same.

County football is not the main purpose of the GAA and is certainly not the main focus of the Dublin County Board. Increasing participation, particularly at juvenile level is the main purpose of Dublin's expenditure on GAA.

You just don't get it, hence you repeat the same tired argument. Any money spent on a second county team would take money from the club scene in Dublin and that is unacceptable to me and most Dublin supporters.

That is the thing though, nothing I have said has been debunked. Rowing the wagons doesn't change that fact.

Re placing importance on getting guys playing football, you all know what I am saying is right (the majority of you are probably from clubs that do it already), but you just don't want to admit it because in your minds, that is the first step to splitting Dublin up, even though it isn't. That is your issue, you aren't really interested in developing the gaa, you just want a winning intercounty team, even if that means gaa in the county is held back because of it.

Look at the bigger picture for a second. Mayo - a fairly backward spot relatively speaking, that has very little going on and where the majority of young people have to leave, with very limited historic success, are able to put out a team of a similar level to yours, with 1/10th of your population and an even smaller fraction of your resources. That is a pretty damning indictment of gaa in Dublin to be honest with you, and in all honesty, that should never be happening.

This move would actually help develop Dublin, but it is now clear that this isn't in the interests of the Dublin fans, and it will probably be the county's downfall

Godge

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

That is the thing though, nothing I have said has been debunked. Rowing the wagons doesn't change that fact.

Re placing importance on getting guys playing football, you all know what I am saying is right (the majority of you are probably from clubs that do it already), but you just don't want to admit it because in your minds, that is the first step to splitting Dublin up, even though it isn't. That is your issue, you aren't really interested in developing the gaa, you just want a winning intercounty team, even if that means gaa in the county is held back because of it.

Look at the bigger picture for a second. Mayo - a fairly backward spot relatively speaking, that has very little going on and where the majority of young people have to leave, with very limited historic success, are able to put out a team of a similar level to yours, with 1/10th of your population and an even smaller fraction of your resources. That is a pretty damning indictment of gaa in Dublin to be honest with you, and in all honesty, that should never be happening.

This move would actually help develop Dublin, but it is now clear that this isn't in the interests of the Dublin fans, and it will probably be the county's downfall

You are completely ignoring my point that the priority is the club scene rather than a second county team.

You can disagree with that and say you believe differently, but you cannot say that your points have been unanswered. You just don't like the answer.

I feel quite sorry for you as it seems to me that you have an unhealthy focus on the county scene, possibly caused by desperation at the lack of Mayo success. A bit of time getting involved with your local club might help you to gain a bit of perspective.

Jaden

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

Can we see some background on these figures please?

I think you may already be familiar with the article I pulled them from:
https://www.balls.ie/gaa/gaa-investment-in-dublin-348120

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

The rest of your post I have already disproven...

I'm not exactly sure what you think you have disproven. Let's make this easy by discussing one topic at a time.

You seem make the claim that 10 times the population equates to 10 times the player resource pool available (otherwise why would you reference population at all?).

First of all, do I understand you correctly, when I state this? If not, what is your stance on this?

Billy Mays

How many days is this now?


The commitment to the wind up is admirable if not completely tragic.

MayoAreMagic

Jaden wrote: »

I think you may already be familiar with the article I pulled them from:
https://www.balls.ie/gaa/gaa-investment-in-dublin-348120

What is interesting is you select cork as opposed to selecting the average. Surely averages is what you should be dealing in here?
As regards cork, well they are a bit of a basket case at the minute. But, like Dublin before them, the rest of the gaa world are willing to turn a blind eye to their advantages until such time as they are competitive, because that is for the good of the game as a whole. They are also a proper duel county, which I wouldn't consider Dublin to be honest about it.
Mayo are a good county to compare against as they have the average population of the country.

Jaden wrote: »

I'm not exactly sure what you think you have disproven. Let's make this easy by discussing one topic at a time.

You seem make the claim that 10 times the population equates to 10 times the player resource pool available (otherwise why would you reference population at all?).

First of all, do I understand you correctly, when I state this? If not, what is your stance on this?

But surely getting people out playing is the responsibility of each county? Like if Kerry can get 8 out of every 10 young lads out playing football, then it falls within Dublin's remit to do the same, or at least get more players out. You talk like your inability to get people to partake is someone elses fault.

MayoAreMagic

Billy Mays wrote: »

How many days is this now?


The commitment to the wind up is admirable if not completely tragic.

This is a gaa discussion. That is what the board is for man.

You don't have to part take if you don't want to, particularly if you think the Dublin gaa page is tragic...

Past30Now

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

They are also a proper duel county, which I wouldn't consider Dublin to be honest about it.

Dublin are clearly a dual county. Our current senior champions are in the AI club semi final, our clubs have won a number of Feile Division 1 hurling titles over the last ten years, our Senior Hurlers compete in Division 1. If we're not a dual county, who is, and what criteria do you use to make that judgement?

MayoAreMagic

Past30Now wrote: »

Dublin are clearly a dual county. Our current senior champions are in the AI club semi final, our clubs have won a number of Feile Division 1 hurling titles over the last ten years, our Senior Hurlers compete in Division 1. If we're not a dual county, who is, and what criteria do you use to make that judgement?

They are trying to promote hurling, and that is a good thing. But that cant be confused with an actual bona fide duel county. When you get to the business end there is only one show in town in Dublin - it is a football county. You couldn't say the same about cork, or indeed galway, who most would consider genuine duel counties.

Past30Now

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

They are trying to promote hurling, and that is a good thing. But that cant be confused with an actual bona fide duel county. When you get to the business end there is only one show in town in Dublin - it is a football county. You couldn't say the same about cork, or indeed galway, who most would consider genuine duel counties.

You haven't answered my question. What criteria are you using to describe a county as being a dual county, or Dublin as not being a dual county?

Slattsy

Oh the lols.

I'm enjoying this lad running rings around himself tbh.

I'll hold off on the ignore button a while longer.

DoctaDee

MOD

There is an unspoken rule that we generally don't moderate our own county thread. However due the number of posts being reported it's time to intervene. A county discussion thread doesn't confer any special obligation that all posts must be positive in nature, it is acceptable to pass a critical observation. The problem now is that the thread is being monopolised to the detriment of other discussion on subjects that have been brought up beforehand in other threads (funding, splitting Dublin etc). The fact that one poster has adopted the role of protagonist (without 2nd guessing any ulterior motives) means the dynamics of the debate are being personalised.

So I'll make this clear - discussion regarding funding, splitting Dublin etc should be continued in any number of threads that were created for that purpose. It is no longer appropriate to post them here and will result in further action been taken. Thanks

MayoAreMagic

Past30Now wrote: »

You haven't answered my question. What criteria are you using to describe a county as being a dual county, or Dublin as not being a dual county?

The level of interest in the sport in the county, relevant to football. I would consider them the inverse of Tipperary. I suppose you would call them developing counties.

Don't get me wrong, I think it is a good thing, but you cant be expecting to be considered on a par with cork or galway at this stage. Or do you?

Anyways, that is a different argument.

Godge

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

The level of interest in the sport in the county, relevant to football. I would consider them the inverse of Tipperary. I suppose you would call them developing counties.

Don't get me wrong, I think it is a good thing, but you cant be expecting to be considered on a par with cork or galway at this stage. Or do you?

Anyways, that is a different argument.

Speaking as a Dublin fan, I would take a Cuala win in the club championship and a Hurling Leinster Final win over Kilkenny ahead of another All-Ireland for the footballers if I had a choice.

I am sure there are others like me.

MayoAreMagic

Godge wrote: »

Speaking as a Dublin fan, I would take a Cuala win in the club championship and a Hurling Leinster Final win over Kilkenny ahead of another All-Ireland for the footballers if I had a choice.

I am sure there are others like me.

Would that be the common consensus pre 2011 though? Or even 2013? I would very much doubt it.

Changing your focus to hurling, because you have won a few in football, wouldn't constitute being a duel county in the eyes of most people.

If people are upset to the point of reporting posts - posts that for me are not saying anything untoward or illogical, then Im not really interested in continuing. As the saying goes, that just isn't cricket. But if I had one observation that people would take on board it would be to maybe try to view things as more of a gaa person, rather than a Dublin gaa person. The world doesn't begin and end with your county winning a trophy, there is a bigger picture at play.

Kavrocks

Godge wrote: »

Speaking as a Dublin fan, I would take a Cuala win in the club championship and a Hurling Leinster Final win over Kilkenny ahead of another All-Ireland for the footballers if I had a choice.

I am sure there are others like me.

Definitely, the hurling Leinster win in 2013 is still the highlight of the last 10 years for me and the hurling league win in 2011 before that was the highlight of that year too.

It annoys me to see good hurlers like Reddin and Hudson continuing to try with the footballers but get nowhere instead of playing hurling. They would have definitely made the hurling panel a few years ago. I also don't think Brady should have ever switched codes, I know he got his All-Ireland medal, but I just don't think he is a good footballer at all. He has a good engine but doesn't have the skill and struggles when kicking the ball in my opinion.

I have resigned myself to the fact that the hurlers will always play second fiddle to the footballers whilst they are winning All Irelands. It's great for the county as a whole but we could see Dublin lose their division 1 hurling status this year which I think might be quite detrimental to the county. One very interesting point that I haven't seen mentioned about the hurlers chances of staying in division 1 is the lack of a relegation play off this year. If Dublin finish bottom there is no second chance and there's no possibility of the Cuala lads coming in and rescuing us.

Jaden

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

What is interesting is you select cork as opposed to selecting the average. Surely averages is what you should be dealing in here?
As regards cork, well they are a bit of a basket case at the minute. But, like Dublin before them, the rest of the gaa world are willing to turn a blind eye to their advantages until such time as they are competitive, because that is for the good of the game as a whole. They are also a proper duel county, which I wouldn't consider Dublin to be honest about it.
Mayo are a good county to compare against as they have the average population of the country.

Given that you haven't refuted the numbers, we can take this to imply that you agree they are both accurate and relevant.

If you wish to use Mayo as an example to measure by, then let us compare how they fare against similar counties - Donegal and Kerry for example.

If you want to compare Dublin and Mayo, then let's do that.

Number of registered GAA players:
Mayo: 10,635.
Dublin: 39,197.
Conclusion - Dublin have four times the number of registered players than Mayo have.

Penetration of GAA within a county:
Mayo: 1 in 13 people are registered as GAA players.
Dublin: 1:32 people are registered as GAA players.
Conclusion - Mayo has three times the ratio of Dublin as regards registered GAA players within the general population.

Intercounty Spend by County:
Mayo: €610K (2015)
Dublin: €1,556K (2015).
Conclusion - Dublin spend two and a half times more on Intercounty setup than Mayo.
(Source: http://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/cost-of-running-county-teams-at-record-levels-34513426.html)

While Dublin have undeniable numeric advantages over Mayo, they are nowhere near the levels you have implied. You may either accept this, or refute it. I think you may choose to simply ignore it.

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

But surely getting people out playing is the responsibility of each county? Like if Kerry can get 8 out of every 10 young lads out playing football, then it falls within Dublin's remit to do the same, or at least get more players out. You talk like your inability to get people to partake is someone elses fault.

Once again, a clear question, clarifying your position has been asked, and you have not answered it. Do you intend to?

Seeing as you have asked me a question, I will answer.
The GAA's founding principle is the preservation and cultivation of our national sports. It delgates this responsibility to each county board specifically, is responsible in turn, for developing games, from both a quality and quantity perspective within their area.

The DCB are making great strides in this regard. I am very, very proud of what they have achieved, and how they have gone about it. The general health of GAA within Dublin has never been better. And yet, there is more to be done.

Never have I stated that relatively low penetration rates of GAA in Dublin is someone else's "fault"- there is no blame here. You have completely fabricated my opinion.

Where are you getting this 8/10 figure from? How does it compare nationally? Sources? It seems to be a little makey-uppy, but I'm happy to be corrected on that.

Dyr

Slattsy wrote: »

Oh the lols.

I'm enjoying this lad running rings around himself tbh.

I'll hold off on the ignore button a while longer.

Sure just wait till the discussion hits the 70 post mark, and the poor lad will fade off

Dyr

Jaden wrote: »

Where are you getting this 8/10 figure from? How does it compare nationally? Sources? It seems to be a little makey-uppy, but I'm happy to be corrected on that.

I'm going off topic here but you've been around since 98 and have less than 2000 posts. That has to be the lowest post count per day on here. Impressive stuff. I thought Pepe le frites was the king of that

Jaden

To us Feb 98ers, all you guys are filthy noob pleabs.
I'm more of a quality over quantity kinda guy.

Paulzx

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

. But if I had one observation that people would take on board it would be to maybe try to view things as more of a gaa person, rather than a Dublin gaa person. The world doesn't begin and end with your county winning a trophy, there is a bigger picture at play.

Ehhhh....this is the Dublin GAA thread. If people can't comment as a "dublin gaa person" on this thread then where can they?

There are loads of threads to discuss general gaa themes without a county bias. I wouldn't consider this such a thread or for example the Mayo GAA thread as one.

For you to even think like that leads me to believe that you are slightly out of touch with the theme of the thread.

Dyr

Kavrocks wrote: »

Definitely, the hurling Leinster win in 2013 is still the highlight of the last 10 years for me and the hurling league win in 2011 before that was the highlight of that year too.

It annoys me to see good hurlers like Reddin and Hudson continuing to try with the footballers but get nowhere instead of playing hurling. They would have definitely made the hurling panel a few years ago. I also don't think Brady should have ever switched codes, I know he got his All-Ireland medal, but I just don't think he is a good footballer at all. He has a good engine but doesn't have the skill and struggles when kicking the ball in my opinion.

I have resigned myself to the fact that the hurlers will always play second fiddle to the footballers whilst they are winning All Irelands. It's great for the county as a whole but we could see Dublin lose their division 1 hurling status this year which I think might be quite detrimental to the county. One very interesting point that I haven't seen mentioned about the hurlers chances of staying in division 1 is the lack of a relegation play off this year. If Dublin finish bottom there is no second chance and there's no possibility of the Cuala lads coming in and rescuing us.

tbh I'm not sure of the wisdom of putting huge efforts into lads who are playing both codes. Most clubs in dublin are primarily oriented towards football and will always steer their best athletes towards football over hurling.

Need to look at a more greenfield approach. Lots of areas in dublin that have no eggball or even proper soccer presence, where you could spread the gospel of the small ball on its own.

Slattsy

Eggball is getting bigger and bigger and I don't like it!!

Jaden

Slattsy wrote: »

Eggball is getting bigger and bigger and I don't like it!!

Especially in Connacht!

Dyr

Slattsy wrote: »

Eggball is getting bigger and bigger and I don't like it!!

Eggball does'nt really exist in a lot of daycent working class areas. Nor does the big ball. Soccer is the default sport but the FAI are a fiasco. Ideal for a shneaky hurling incursion :cool:

Dyr

This remind's me I was hearing a conversation in work between two very precious mummies about one of the little darlings who was going to the right school and had started rugby. The other one will goes "I'd say it will be great for him, getting out meeting everyone" and yer wan goes "I know, it will be faboolous for him for like networking and contacts"

There's the rise of rugby in Dublin right there

DoctaDee

One thing I've noticed coaching over the last few years is that Gaelic and Rugby have a relatively happy coexistence - the rugby season runs Sept-March or so which is generally the down time for Juvenile GAA with a slight overlap. We have a number of lads playing rugby which keeps them ticking over and also provides a good deal of physicality to their game, on the other hand we're seeing a number of rugby players coming on board with the focus on their ball handling and footwork.

Soccer, (and I like soccer) is designed to keep their participation exclusively to that game, very little leeway to introduce those players to a new game even on a partime basis

Past30Now

We've a few lads doing Rugby aswell. It's been brilliant for them in terms of their physicality. We're U15 this year, so the Junior Cup 1st round match takes place midweek following our first league game. They're not expected to have a second round match!

MayoAreMagic

Jaden wrote: »

Given that you haven't refuted the numbers, we can take this to imply that you agree they are both accurate and relevant.

If you wish to use Mayo as an example to measure by, then let us compare how they fare against similar counties - Donegal and Kerry for example.

If you want to compare Dublin and Mayo, then let's do that.

Number of registered GAA players:
Mayo: 10,635.
Dublin: 39,197.
Conclusion - Dublin have four times the number of registered players than Mayo have.

Penetration of GAA within a county:
Mayo: 1 in 13 people are registered as GAA players.
Dublin: 1:32 people are registered as GAA players.
Conclusion - Mayo has three times the ratio of Dublin as regards registered GAA players within the general population.

Intercounty Spend by County:
Mayo: €610K (2015)
Dublin: €1,556K (2015).
Conclusion - Dublin spend two and a half times more on Intercounty setup than Mayo.
(Source: http://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/cost-of-running-county-teams-at-record-levels-34513426.html)

While Dublin have undeniable numeric advantages over Mayo, they are nowhere near the levels you have implied. You may either accept this, or refute it. I think you may choose to simply ignore it.

I was under the impression that any further talk of resources would result in the guy getting in trouble?

But just to clarify for you, Dublin do have an advantage of 10-1 over Mayo (the county with average population). Dublin's are currently unable to get a decent percentage of these people playing, but that doesn't mean you discount the 10-1 advantage, as that could change - in fact it is changing if you look at the level of kids out playing the game. Therefore whittling down to the level you have isn't something I would accept as reasonable. That is really the thing - mayo are probably close to their optimum, Dublin are miles from theirs. If that is left unchecked the game suffers. We are often told the best period of football was the 90s. The reason being so many different teams capable of winning. That is something worth considering.

Jaden wrote: »

Once again, a clear question, clarifying your position has been asked, and you have not answered it. Do you intend to?

I have answered enough questions without receiving many genuine answers for my own.

Jaden wrote: »

Seeing as you have asked me a question, I will answer.
The GAA's founding principle is the preservation and cultivation of our national sports. It delgates this responsibility to each county board specifically, is responsible in turn, for developing games, from both a quality and quantity perspective within their area.

The DCB are making great strides in this regard. I am very, very proud of what they have achieved, and how they have gone about it. The general health of GAA within Dublin has never been better. And yet, there is more to be done.

Never have I stated that relatively low penetration rates of GAA in Dublin is someone else's "fault"- there is no blame here. You have completely fabricated my opinion.

Where are you getting this 8/10 figure from? How does it compare nationally? Sources? It seems to be a little makey-uppy, but I'm happy to be corrected on that.

I actually would like to discuss some of this with you, but if I do I will get a raft of sarky responses and guys reporting posts for no reason - quite schoolyard-esque. If you look at the mod note the reason given was that no actual issue was found - it was just the amount of reports made that was the issue. Therein lies the problem here.

DoctaDee

Most of our lads are playing U17 rugby and fielding U16/15 in GAA - my main concern is that all but 1 of the lads has taken up rugby in the last 2 years - so there's a coaching gap of 6-7 years on the lads they're playing against - ultimately this could manifest itself in a right doing in a poorly executed tackle or the general dark arts around the breakdown - thankfully nothing too serious as yet - we find the chicken fillet roll and any number of chocolate shíte after a game a big plus for them - how can ya compete with that. Word on the street is that a game in Navan RFC is fine dining