Leinster Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread IV

Glass Prison 1214

Anyone know what's up with Ross and Kearney?

Glass Prison 1214

Sir Chops wrote: »

Is that tomorrow's lineup?

Yes.

From the Leinster website http://www.leinsterrugby.ie/news/11824.php#.U0-17PldUgg

yuinc

9,10,11 aren't exactly the most exciting trio.. #mocball

former legend

Strong enough team, no major complaints.

Gopperth ahead of Madigan; no surprise there, Jimmy is now the #1, the debate is over.

Where is Reddan? I don't think he's injured and he's been on fire the last few months. Good to see Luke McGrath involved, hopefully the game will be wrapped up early enough for him to get some decent gametime.

Ruddock, Murphy and Heaslip is a mouth-watering backrow.

Presume Ross, D'Arcy and Dave K are just rested.

.ak

yuinc wrote: »

9,10,11 aren't exactly the most exciting trio.. #mocball

Funny that Gopperth is actually playing more exciting rugby than Madigan, in terms of running the ball and scoring tries.

That pack tho... Serious power.

LostArt

yuinc wrote: »

9,10,11 aren't exactly the most exciting trio.. #mocball

Pretty much exactly what I thought when I saw the team.

Jimmy is now our first choice 10.
Glad to see Jordi start, he deserves a run now imo.
Hopefully McGrath gets decent time too.

yuinc

.ak wrote: »

Funny that Gopperth is actually playing more exciting rugby than Madigan, in terms of running the ball and scoring tries.

That pack tho... Serious power.

Jimmy kicks the ball an awful lot.. but that's MOC's modus operandi it seems.

CatFromHue

That's an exciting back row and with Ryan on the bench it looks like a case of old man Heaslip!

yuinc

that should be the backrow for the rest of the season.

.ak

yuinc wrote: »

Jimmy kicks the ball an awful lot.. but that's MOC's modus operandi it seems.

Yeah I'd be surprised if the stats actually showed JG kicks the ball more than IM. I imagine both of them are asked to kick it if the game plan calls to it.

yuinc

No idea what Fanning brings apart from being massive...

LostArt

yuinc wrote: »

No idea what Fanning brings apart from being massive...

he's been good his last few games to be fair, but yeah I'd prefer his gametime to go to a younger player

.ak

Yeah SCM has impressed me in his senior games, and Boyle looked great in the A game.

.ak

a further two changes in the back row with Rhys Ruddock and Jordi Murphy starting in place of the injured Kevin McLaughlin and Shane Jennings.

Are Locky and Jennings injured?

yuinc

If McLaughlin is injured, it would explain his horrible form for the past 4 months..

He was so off the pace last weekend it was almost embaressing

CIARAN_BOYLE

yuinc wrote: »

If McLaughlin is injured, it would explain his horrible form for the past 4 months..

He was so off the pace last weekend it was almost embaressing

Supposedly his form is due to an injury that he has been carrying.

IMO if its that bad he should have gone for surgery rather than pospone till the end of the season. Ruddock, Ryan, and Murphy would all do a better job at 6 than him in his current form

MattD

Macken's in the squad, there must have been a pileup in the training camp carpark or something to get MOC to pick him.

LeeroyJones

It looks as though Fanning and Kirchner flanking BOD on their respective wings is an attempt to close up shop against Campagnaro and McLean.

I'd say we'll be looking to smother them for 50+ mins, knock over a few kicks, perhaps drive over a try or two and hopefully run a bit more from the hour mark with McGrath and Madigan coming off the bench

chancer12

former legend wrote: »

Strong enough team, no major complaints.

Gopperth ahead of Madigan; no surprise there, Jimmy is now the #1, the debate is over.

Where is Reddan? I don't think he's injured and he's been on fire the last few months. Good to see Luke McGrath involved, hopefully the game will be wrapped up early enough for him to get some decent gametime.

Ruddock, Murphy and Heaslip is a mouth-watering backrow.

Presume Ross, D'Arcy and Dave K are just rested.

Jimmy might be MOC's no 1 but that isn't the long-term solution for Leinster. What is Madigan to do, wilt on the bench? Really disappointed by the way the flyhalf issue has been handled this year and fed up to the teeth of looking at Jimmy Gopperth. There's little between them in terms of ability, other than Mads has potential - with good coaching. Gopperth has shown his level and its not what we need. It worrying if this is indicative of MOCs vision for Leinster

yuinc

LeeroyJones wrote: »

It looks as though Fanning and Kirchner flanking BOD on their respective wings is an attempt to close up shop against Campagnaro and McLean.

I'd say we'll be looking to smother them for 50+ mins, knock over a few kicks, perhaps drive over a try or two and hopefully run a bit more from the hour mark with McGrath and Madigan coming off the bench

Neither Fanning or Kirchner are strong defenders.. both are big and good under a high ball though and that really suits MOCball.

Buer

Looks like MOC wants to win the Pro12 pretty badly. Very strong team. It's interesting that Reid is starting again. He's surely being lined up for a significant role within the team at this stage.

After today, Leinster have only one last scheduled game at home currently. That's a maximum of 240 minutes left of Brian O'Driscoll left in Dublin if we get a home semi final and make a home final. Worth going along and soaking it in just for that.

SaveOurLyric

Why the pfeque is this game on at 5pm ?
Surely they should be making it suitable to as many people as possible rather than loosing the attendance of those who have work to do on Friday afternoon?

CatFromHue

Buer wrote: »

Looks like MOC wants to win the Pro12 pretty badly. Very strong team. It's interesting that Reid is starting again. He's surely being lined up for a significant role within the team at this stage.

After today, Leinster have only one last scheduled game at home currently. That's a maximum of 240 minutes left of Brian O'Driscoll left in Dublin if we get a home semi final and make a home final. Worth going along and soaking it in just for that.

It's a strong team all right but we've a week off next weekend so why wouldn't he name a strong one?

Larbre34

SaveOurLyric wrote: »

Why the pfeque is this game on at 5pm ?
Surely they should be making it suitable to as many people as possible rather than loosing the attendance of those who have work to do on Friday afternoon?

Nobody important is working tomorrow. Let the bars throw open at 3.30 and the sun drenched game commence!

Seriously though it is daft scheduling, unless for some reason they dont want to clash with Glasgow V Ulster as its a playoff clash, but that hasnt arisen before

molloyjh

.ak wrote: »

Funny that Gopperth is actually playing more exciting rugby than Madigan, in terms of running the ball and scoring tries.

That pack tho... Serious power.

What pisses me off about this is that Mads was showing signs of coming terms with what he was being asked to do against Munster. He looked a lot more composed and assured in that game and progress was being made. Since then he's had a grand total of 13 minutes in a game that was well and truly over when he came on. I've no real issue with Gopperth but I think the last 6-7 weeks has shown some really bad management of the out half position.

Not starting or even playing Gopperth for weeks before Toulon (I don't count those 8 minutes against Zebre) and then asking him to take over the most important position on the field in our most important game, and then not involving a guy he'd dedicated weeks to in any significant way thereafter (we'll see how much time he gets tomorrow) is seriously poor management. No?

chancer12 wrote: »

Jimmy might be MOC's no 1 but that isn't the long-term solution for Leinster. What is Madigan to do, wilt on the bench? Really disappointed by the way the flyhalf issue has been handled this year and fed up to the teeth of looking at Jimmy Gopperth. There's little between them in terms of ability, other than Mads has potential - with good coaching. Gopperth has shown his level and its not what we need. It worrying if this is indicative of MOCs vision for Leinster

Can we really say that we know Gopperth has reached his peak? If Mads can improve "with good coaching" then why can't Gopperth? I think it's very unfair holding both to different standards. For all the issues I have with things at the moment I wouldn't be writing Gopperth off like that.

Buer

Larbre34 wrote: »

Nobody important is working tomorrow. Let the bars throw open at 3.30 and the sun drenched game commence!

Seriously though it is daft scheduling, unless for some reason they dont want to clash with Glasgow V Ulster as its a playoff clash, but that hasnt arisen before

Kids are all off and the earlier kick off ties in with their availability. Parents will be delighted to get them out of the house to something.

In all honesty, I don't think the scheduling will affect the attendance much. I don't expect there to be a big showing because of the opposition and it being a bank holiday weekend though.

SaveOurLyric

Buer wrote: »

Kids are all off and the earlier kick off ties in with their availability. Parents will be delighted to get them out of the house to something.

In all honesty, I don't think the scheduling will affect the attendance much. I don't expect there to be a big showing because of the opposition and it being a bank holiday weekend though.

I'm the only one bummed that I wont be there so I guess. Normal time, I would. Silly time, I have to miss it.

.ak

molloyjh wrote: »

What pisses me off about this is that Mads was showing signs of coming terms with what he was being asked to do against Munster. He looked a lot more composed and assured in that game and progress was being made. Since then he's had a grand total of 13 minutes in a game that was well and truly over when he came on. I've no real issue with Gopperth but I think the last 6-7 weeks has shown some really bad management of the out half position.

Not starting or even playing Gopperth for weeks before Toulon (I don't count those 8 minutes against Zebre) and then asking him to take over the most important position on the field in our most important game, and then not involving a guy he'd dedicated weeks to in any significant way thereafter (we'll see how much time he gets tomorrow) is seriously poor management. No?



Can we really say that we know Gopperth has reached his peak? If Mads can improve "with good coaching" then why can't Gopperth? I think it's very unfair holding both to different standards. For all the issues I have with things at the moment I wouldn't be writing Gopperth off like that.

True. You also have to consider though why wasn't Madigan in the squad last weekend? I'd wager he has a niggle or something.

molloyjh

SaveOurLyric wrote: »

I'm the only one bummed that I wont be there so I guess. Normal time, I would. Silly time, I have to miss it.

I will be there as I'm off. I still think it's a stupid time to have it though. It's prohibitive, and that's the last thing that it should be. It's not like the Treviso games are packed to the rafters normally anyway.

.ak wrote: »

True. You also have to consider though why wasn't Madigan in the squad last weekend? I'd wager he has a niggle or something.

Another thing pissing me off. We simply don't know because he wasn't even mentioned in the squad announcement. While some of the "week too soon" things were annoying last season this black out type carry on is far more annoying. I'm not sure who is responsible for that, but there's no need for it really.

CatFromHue

molloyjh wrote: »

I will be there as I'm off. I still think it's a stupid time to have it though. It's prohibitive, and that's the last thing that it should be. It's not like the Treviso games are packed to the rafters normally anyway.



Another thing pissing me off. We simply don't know because he wasn't even mentioned in the squad announcement. While some of the "week too soon" things were annoying last season this black out type carry on is far more annoying. I'm not sure who is responsible for that, but there's no need for it really.

Luke Fitzgerald didn't make it this week, I'd forgotten about him til I red your post

Tox56

Madigan must be injured or something, as much as I haven't been convinced by MOC surely his hands were tied in terms of starting Madigan in Toulon/bringing him off the bench. He only came on in Toulon as a last resort, didnt seem to be getting anywhere near normal power on his kicks and then didn't feature at all last week when the back up 10 was Noel Reid. He must be carrying something.

I still reckon MOC sees Madigan as the 10 with more potential and wanted to start him in Toulon after giving him so much time to prove himself the previous 2 weeks

Tox56

Also nice to see McGrath on the bench again, hopefully a very strong starting team (great to see Reid surrounded with experience, would have been perfect with SCM ahead of Fanning but you can't have everything) wraps up the BP and result early on and he'll get a good 20-25 minutes

molloyjh

Tox56 wrote: »

Madigan must be injured or something, as much as I haven't been convinced by MOC surely his hands were tied in terms of starting Madigan in Toulon/bringing him off the bench. He only came on in Toulon as a last resort, didnt seem to be getting anywhere near normal power on his kicks and then didn't feature at all last week when the back up 10 was Noel Reid. He must be carrying something.

I still reckon MOC sees Madigan as the 10 with more potential and wanted to start him in Toulon after giving him so much time to prove himself the previous 2 weeks

You're looking for these?

.ak

Anyone else think that looks like the 7-Up guy?

Tox56

molloyjh wrote: »

You're looking for these?

Yeah I suppose, the whole thing just seems too unbelievable to be true for me.

To go from trusting him to play all 80 minutes in the most important league game of the season to not even trusting him to come off the bench when things were going wrong in Toulon until there was literally no other option? And on the back of a fairly mediocre performance in that game Gopperth is pencilled in as definitive first choice?

Like, why wasn't Madigan in the squad last week when he otherwise packed the team with experience?

chancer12

Tox56 wrote: »

Madigan must be injured or something, as much as I haven't been convinced by MOC surely his hands were tied in terms of starting Madigan in Toulon/bringing him off the bench. He only came on in Toulon as a last resort, didnt seem to be getting anywhere near normal power on his kicks and then didn't feature at all last week when the back up 10 was Noel Reid. He must be carrying something.

I still reckon MOC sees Madigan as the 10 with more potential and wanted to start him in Toulon after giving him so much time to prove himself the previous 2 weeks

Seemed to be taking a full part in training and not mentioned in the bulletin for injury

.ak

chancer12 wrote: »

Seemed to be taking a full part in training and not mentioned in the bulletin for injury

In fairness when are either of those things an actual good reference? Ref Fitz.

Larbre34

Buer wrote: »

Kids are all off and the earlier kick off ties in with their availability. Parents will be delighted to get them out of the house to something.

In all honesty, I don't think the scheduling will affect the attendance much. I don't expect there to be a big showing because of the opposition and it being a bank holiday weekend though.

With the bars open Id expect a full house regardless!

Last time there was an A game against Munster on a Good Friday something like 5,500 turned up cos the bars were open

molloyjh

.ak wrote: »

In fairness when are either of those things an actual good reference? Ref Fitz.

Anything that we conclude will be nothing short of guesswork though as we've heard no official word at all. In fact we've heard no half decent rumour either. It's all just speculation on our part. Maybe he had a niggle, maybe he had a falling out with MOC, maybe MOC wanted to look at other options in other areas of the park, maybe he was being rested, maybe he had feckin' jury duty to attend, maybe, maybe, maybe....

In short I'm not sure you can blame people for assuming he was dropped any more than they can blame you for assuming he was injured.

stephen_n

Now we are assuming JG was injured and no one said for the month running up to the Toulon game and IM is injured now and nobody is saying anything, seems a bit odd tbh, just seems like an awful rotation policy by MOC really.

Kanrith

Hmmmm, this game would be much better for Madigan. Also BOD normally plays better with him starting than Goperth.

Heroditas

CatFromHue wrote: »

Luke Fitzgerald didn't make it this week, I'd forgotten about him til I red your post

They actually said "this game comes a week too soon for Luke Fitzgerald" on FM104 or 98FM at lunchtime. :rolleyes:

former legend

Just in case anyone needs to be reminded; Matt O'Connor has previously confirmed that Gopperth is his #1 and Madigan has a lot of developing still to do:
http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/rugby/matt-o-connor-defends-selection-of-jimmy-gopperth-for-toulon-game-1.1754886

The reality is that Jimmy is a very experienced bloke who provides us with X. Ian is a young player who needs to get better at managing the front end of the game. It’s no bigger issue than that

I'd love there to be some neat explanation whereby Madigan has some niggling injury that kept him on the bench in Toulon but I don't think there is any.

stephen_n

former legend wrote: »

Just in case anyone needs to be reminded; Matt O'Connor has previously confirmed that Gopperth is his #1 and Madigan has a lot of developing still to do:
http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/rugby/matt-o-connor-defends-selection-of-jimmy-gopperth-for-toulon-game-1.1754886



I'd love there to be some neat explanation whereby Madigan has some niggling injury that kept him on the bench in Toulon but I don't think there is any.

That still doesn't explain not playing Goperth for a month up to the game though.

Tox56

former legend wrote: »

Just in case anyone needs to be reminded; Matt O'Connor has previously confirmed that Gopperth is his #1 and Madigan has a lot of developing still to do:
http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/rugby/matt-o-connor-defends-selection-of-jimmy-gopperth-for-toulon-game-1.1754886



I'd love there to be some neat explanation whereby Madigan has some niggling injury that kept him on the bench in Toulon but I don't think there is any.

As said above, the strangest thing by far is that Madigan played all 80 minutes in the 3 games before Toulon, including games against 2 of the top 4 in the league.

To not only drop out of the starting team, but to be not trusted as an alternative on the bench until it really was roll the dice time, is just bizarre.

Possible of course that Gopperth was always number 1 in MOC's mind, but if that was the case I'd find the preparation for the Toulon match pretty mind boggling.

And the other question I need answering in all this is why Madigan wasn't involved in the squad at all last week, which would have just been weird if he was fully fit

rockbeast

Hey,

I've two boozing passes/Leinster tickets, going for tomorrow if someone wants to take them off my hands.

Gratis, of course.:)

Anglesea Stand, Block B.

Two projects due on Tuesday, unfortunately:(

PM if you want them.

rugby addict

Hopefully Luke MCGrath gets 20 mins, Boss and Reddan are going to get auld someday soon

former legend

stephen_n wrote: »

That still doesn't explain not playing Goperth for a month up to the game though.

No it doesn't but if you read the article MOC didn't seem too worried about that aspect. Maybe he'd decided that Gopperth was the man and he didn't want to risk an injury to him against Munster?

rockbeast

former legend wrote: »

No it doesn't but if you read the article MOC didn't seem too worried about that aspect. Maybe he'd decided that Gopperth was the man and he didn't want to risk an injury to him against Munster?

Perhaps it should concern us that he didn't?

There's battle-hardened, battle-fatigued and then just plain battle-undercooked...

former legend

rockbeast wrote: »

Perhaps it should concern us that he didn't?

There's battle-hardened, battle-fatigued and then just plain battle-undercooked...

No, I wouldn't agree with his tactics at all, just that he did acknowledge it.

And Gopperth was the least of our problems in Toulon really.