The Middle Distance Thread

Sacksian

Chivito550 wrote: »

Going to wait to new year to race. Unlikely I'll bother with NIA this year. Good meets but an absolute nightmare to get to from work by public transport at peak hour. Did one last year and it took me 90 minutes to get there from town and I arrived 20 mins before my race was scheduled and I had to rush through my warm up. I then had to scramble for a lift off any randomer who was going back my direction. Not really worth the trek for me.

Public transport and traffic are hideous heading out that way.

But if you wait until about 7 and get a 38a instead of a 38 (which takes a long detour around Castleknock estates), the traffic from NCR to Navan Road has more or less disappeared and it only takes about 30 minutes to get to the stop nearest the Aquatic Centre.

Or, if you need to get there earlier and you don't mind switching, you can get a Luas to Broombridge, train from Broombridge to Navan Road parkway and a 38a for the rest (about 7 stops).

Ideally, they'd stick a stop on campus or open up an entrance closer to the NIA or XC course, particularly ahead of Euro Cross.

pconn062

I won't make the 17th but hoping to do the first meet in January all going well.

Timmaay

We got a few graded 1mile races on the greystones track next Friday if anyone is interested.
https://m.facebook.com/events/1307516449427226

overpronator

Not posted in here before, am a lapsed marathon runner/road slogger and a very flaky training log poster.

Yesterday's national masters was the first indoor season in the books for me, really enjoyed it and it went better than I had expected, although I'd no idea what to expect from it all. The plan in December was simple, to try and crack a sub 5 mile in the NIA before March.

Managed to open with a 4.57 in Jan so just kept at it and got down to 4.53 over another couple of races. Jumped in the national masters at weekend in the 1500 and ran 4.29.00 so shaved another few seconds off, think it's a 4.49 mile conversion.

Hope to continue into the summer for the graded, run a 3k and keep at the 1500 also. 800 seems like torture so that can wait until next year (or never!).

I definitely enjoy mid distance training alot more than the marathon stuff and once I keep reasonable mileage up to jump into cross country and the occasional 5k here and there I'm happy. The training group in my club is great also, some v good masters athletes to drag me along.

Theres been some very interesting reading in this thread, would be great if it came alive again so thought I'd prod gently now as indoors are over!

Sacksian

Your summer starts here! Here's a few dates for your calendar:

April 19 AAI Road Relays - Raheny
April 23 D&DAC Graded 1 - 400m, 1500m, 5000m
April 29 Dublin Graded 1 - Morton - 800m, 3000m
May 2 IMC GV Ryan - Morton
May 13 Dublin Graded 2 - Tallaght - 1500m, 5000m
May 17 AAI National League, Round 1
May 23 IMC - Le Cheile
May 27 Dublin Graded 3 - Irishtown - 400m, 800m, 10000m
May 31 Leinster JSM Outdoor T&F Championships - Tullamore
June 3 IMC - Dunboyne
June 4 D&DAC Graded 2 - 800m, 3000m
June 10 Dublin Graded 4 - Morton - 400m, 1500m
June 20 IMC - Belfast
June 21 AAI National League, Round 2
June 24 Dublin Graded 5 - Tallaght - 800m, 5000m
June 27/28 National Senior Outdoor T&F Championships - Morton
July 2 D&DAC Graded 3- 400m, Mile
July 8 Dublin Graded 6 - Irishtown - 800m, 3000m
July 22 Dublin Graded 7 - Morton - 1500m
Aug 5 Dublin Graded 8 - Tallaght - 400m, Mile, 3000m
Aug 16 National Masters Outdoor T&F Championships - Tullamore

overpronator

Also, Athlone is far easier on the lungs than Abbotstown. Ive been like an1870s coal miner witha bad dose of the black lung the day after every NIA, today, no bother at all.

pconn062

DDAC dates are 23rd April, 4th June, 2nd July.

Down South

overpronator wrote: »

Also, Athlone is far easier on the lungs than Abbotstown. Ive been like an1870s coal miner witha bad dose of the black lung the day after every NIA, today, no bother at all.

Same here. Why is that?

Down South

overpronator wrote: »

Also, Athlone is far easier on the lungs than Abbotstown. Ive been like an1870s coal miner witha bad dose of the black lung the day after every NIA, today, no bother at all.

Same here. Why is that?

overpronator

Down South wrote: »

Same here. Why is that?

No real idea, youd imagine the dryness is down to the air circulation and how much moisture is in it but I'm guessing.

Chivito550

Sacksian wrote: »

Your summer starts here! Here's a few dates for your calendar:

April 19 AAI Road Relays - Raheny
April 23 D&DAC Graded 1 - 400m, 1500m, 5000m
April 29 Dublin Graded 1 - Morton - 800m, 3000m
May 2 IMC GV Ryan - Morton
May 13 Dublin Graded 2 - Tallaght - 1500m, 5000m
May 17 AAI National League, Round 1
May 23 IMC - Le Cheile
May 27 Dublin Graded 3 - Irishtown - 400m, 800m, 10000m
May 31 Leinster JSM Outdoor T&F Championships - Tullamore
June 3 IMC - Dunboyne
June 4 D&DAC Graded 2 - 800m, 3000m
June 10 Dublin Graded 4 - Morton - 400m, 1500m
June 20 IMC - Belfast
June 21 AAI National League, Round 2
June 24 Dublin Graded 5 - Tallaght - 800m, 5000m
June 27/28 National Senior Outdoor T&F Championships - Morton
July 2 D&DAC Graded 3- 400m, Mile
July 8 Dublin Graded 6 - Irishtown - 800m, 3000m
July 22 Dublin Graded 7 - Morton - 1500m
Aug 5 Dublin Graded 8 - Tallaght - 400m, Mile, 3000m
Aug 16 National Masters Outdoor T&F Championships - Tullamore

Its a thin calendar this year for seniors. No AAI Games, no Ton le Gaoithe, no IMC Greystones, no IMC Drogheda. There's a new IMC in Dunboyne, but Wednesday night out in Dunboyne is a shocking call and won't suit a good chunk of usuals who race IMC meets., those of us who work in town and don't have a car with us when working.

Then there's the usual senseless clashes, such as IMC Belfast yet again clashing with an AAI meet, this time the league. (same weekend)

This is my first year as a master but Northern Ireland Masters is same day as National Seniors (which us early because of Olympics) , so won't be heading up to Belfast which I was looking forward to doing. I'm not seeing very many weekend meets in July other than Munsters. Then there's a crazy long wait for National Masters, which is on AFTER the World Masters which makes no sense. I won't be able to do it now as its the day after I'm due to fly back from Tokyo, and I'll have been 3-4 weeks into a break by then.

All in all a messy season.

Timmaay

Down South wrote: »

Same here. Why is that?

Make sure you warm up outside, and only come back in the very last minute for your race.

dna_leri

overpronator wrote: »

Also, Athlone is far easier on the lungs than Abbotstown. Ive been like an1870s coal miner witha bad dose of the black lung the day after every NIA, today, no bother at all.

It varies in Athlone, maybe due to weather and crowd size. Two weeks ago it was very dry there for Connaughts, not so bad this week. Still prefer it to the outdoor wind and rain

overpronator

How are people feeling about training at the moment with running importance certainly put into proper persepctive?

Had a couple of very easy weeks after nat indoors, just ran when I felt like it, all easy aside from one run where I did about 8 or so miles around marathon effort just to keep the aerobic clock ticking. No Garmin or split watching, just chugging along. Was actually surprised how fresh my legs felt into the second week with lower miles and no sessions. I guess it shows the rest wasnt a bad idea. Definitly felt pretty battered in the two weeks before Athlone.

Our group is having sessions prescribed from this week on, will be mostly strength/base type work for the next 5-6 weeks, tempos, mile reps at 10k effort etc. Naturally this will be all solo. It's a few years since I've done that so will be interesting to see how the head is with it. Overall motivation isnt great but I always improve that aspect once I get a couple of weeks down hoping this pans out the same.

Sacksian

overpronator wrote: »

How are people feeling about training at the moment with running importance certainly put into proper persepctive?

Had a couple of very easy weeks after nat indoors, just ran when I felt like it, all easy aside from one run where I did about 8 or so miles around marathon effort just to keep the aerobic clock ticking. No Garmin or split watching, just chugging along. Was actually surprised how fresh my legs felt into the second week with lower miles and no sessions. I guess it shows the rest wasnt a bad idea. Definitly felt pretty battered in the two weeks before Athlone.

Our group is having sessions prescribed from this week on, will be mostly strength/base type work for the next 5-6 weeks, tempos, mile reps at 10k effort etc. Naturally this will be all solo. It's a few years since I've done that so will be interesting to see how the head is with it. Overall motivation isnt great but I always improve that aspect once I get a couple of weeks down hoping this pans out the same.

I'm still hopeful there might be a track race or two this summer, even if it's a lot later than usual. And I'm enjoying not having a race coming up because it's helping me to think longer term. We'll see how long that novelty lasts, but hoping to get the most out of the next few months.

Thinking longer-term is also a chance to think about more ambitious targets than I might normally do when we're shuffling from season to season!

If you're feeling motivation is a bit low, just ease into the sessions - same as you did with running after Athlone - and let it come back to you. It's a bit of a luxury having a month or two of strength/base stuff without having to think about road relays, 5ks, gradeds starting in a couple of weeks.

IvoryTower

Just started back, happy to train away in the mornings on my own, it brings a bit of normality to the madness. Will bash a few time trials out throughout the season. I don't expect there to be any track races or for me to attend them even if there is.

Chivito550

I've contacted AAI proposing a July to September season rather than May to July. I've posted about it on Twitter too to try gather momentum.

A decision on this needs to be made quickly.

Oiriallach

Chivito550 wrote: »

I've contacted AAI proposing a July to September season rather than May to July. I've posted about it on Twitter too to try gather momentum.

A decision on this needs to be made quickly.

That makes sense in principle, but it's probably too early yet to make any detailed plans, especially as we don't know when we'll be able to resume competition.

If the European Champs in Paris go ahead as scheduled, I would expect the National Seniors to move to the weekend of 15/16 August as 16 August is the last day for posting qualifying standards. Other domestic events could then be scheduled around that.

The National Masters were originally scheduled for 16 August - let's hope the AAI don't just move them to the following weekend as they would then clash with the rescheduled Scottish Masters (22 August) and the British Masters (22/23 August).

Chivito550

Oiriallach wrote: »

That makes sense in principle, but it's probably too early yet to make any detailed plans, especially as we don't know when we'll be able to resume competition.

If the European Champs in Paris go ahead as scheduled, I would expect the National Seniors to move to the weekend of 15/16 August as 16 August is the last day for posting qualifying standards. Other domestic events could then be scheduled around that.

The National Masters were originally scheduled for 16 August - let's hope the AAI don't just move them to the following weekend as they would then clash with the rescheduled Scottish Masters (22 August) and the British Masters (22/23 August).

Maybe too early to make specific plans, but not too early to tell us that the season WILL be pushed back, rather than keeping athletes guessing.

Dubh Geannain

Thanks to @MY BAD for pointing it out but NIA Live is back... for now.

NIA Live | Athletics Ireland

Distances up to a mile are available. When I registered last night for the men's mile on December 8th there was 28/36 entries filled. The mixed mile is available too. I wasn't able to view the female entries so don't know the uptake there.

I should add. It's now run by Athletics Ireland so the entry for me was a little arduous as you need an AAI number.

MrSkinny

This happened a few days ago but I only came across the news today - remarkable longevity and consistency:

https://worldathletics.org/news/feature/nick-willis-four-minutes-20-consecutive-years

There's a video of the event up on YT: Men's Wanamaker Mile | 2022 Millrose Games - YouTube

and a nice interview with the man afterwards: Nick Willis after breaking 4:00 for 20th straight year - YouTube

Dubh Geannain

Big Bump. I've run multiple 1,500m races this year, no mile races and (surprisingly) not a single 800m. Once I realised I couldn't make the National Masters date I kind of just stayed tipping along with how I've been training this year. Following the Easy Interval Method and I've felt I've steadily improved this year over the slightly longer distances of 5k and 10k.

Missed the Griffith Avenue mile this year. But it looks like my time from last year would have found me a lot further down the field than the high position I got in 2022. It's a great race.

Ran the Clonliffe 2 mile last month. Another great race and the oldest road race in Ireland so should be one for people's calendars.

Into Cross Country season now but I'd love a 3k race if anyone knows of one, as Clonliffe reminded me I've yet to race a 3k and set an official PB for it. I'm wondering if the NIA indoors will be the place to grab a race unless anyone knows of any others?

DangerMouse27

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121334119#Comment_121334119

Probably going to be a Baseline meet in AIT first. Early December I'd say. 600/1000. I reckon.

I was running 200/400 last couple of years but I'm up to 400/800 now. Enjoying training that bit more.

Dubh Geannain

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121336670#Comment_121336670

Never heard of the Baseline Meet before. Thanks, I'll keep an eye out for it.

You've touched on something mentioning 400s though. Something I'm considering for 2024 and that's to run a few 400m races. Set a time and see if I can improve by doing a little specific training for that distance. A few reasons

(1) I think I should be just about sub 60 already and would be disappointed if I wasn't.

(2) Kids are starting doing a bit of athletics now so it would be fun to train some fast stuff myself and maybe learn together.

(3) I've never trained for sprinting before. Health note: I'm a Masters athlete

Would you recommend any specific training plans worth looking at?

DangerMouse27

There can be no better feeling than setting a time and then either chipping away at it or knocking chunks off it.

1) sub 60 is a quick enough time, in relative terms. You could be Billy Lightening though, so it could be within your wheelhouse to easily run sub 60 but it might also not be. Don't be discouraged if you don't hit it immediately.

2) getting them into drills for form will really help their running. It's fun to do together because everyone is self conscious about them at the beginning. But they are reasonably essential for trying to run faster.

3) I'm 43 and I've learned the hard way that as a Masters athlete, recovery is key. Can't be putting hard sessions back to back anymore. Especially if your working on lactic threshold/speed endurance or speed.

Specific plans.. that's actually a tough one. I've had lots of coaches throughout the years and trained with Olympians and National Senior Champions and still, I get it very wrong. I have the odd few sessions that I lean into at this time of the year to build fitness for the 400m.

12x200m @38-40 with 2 minutes recovery (active but no big deal if not). Your just looking to develop patter/pace control.

Within 4 weeks, you'd be looking to take that down by a second or two and even reduce it to 10 reps, and so on.

I'll run hill repeats too. Good for leg strength and turnover. You probably do hills but your looking to get a good little patter going, almost a slow sprinting style and then just maintain the pace. First few steps in hills are key to the rest of them. No big long strides.

Weights. Take it or leave it. Save your knees and just keep it to hills. But if you must. Bodyweight squats/Lunges, Frontal/Medial raises. You can add a bit of weight but you don't have to. People really lose the run of themselves with weights and then pay some sort of price at some stage. Either in the joints or just losing a running session as a result of a weights related strain.

Brianmac.co.uk is probably the best coach around with his sessions that can be tailored to your needs. You just enter in your hopeful/predicted time and it will spit out your sessions. The site itself is very detailed but once you get the hang of it, it's a really good resource. I got chatting to him years ago, and discovered he absolutely knew his stuff in person. Finding stuff like that online, you have a tendency to not believe any of it so it was reassuring to discover that he was absolutely legit.

Dubh Geannain

Wow loads there, thanks. I did a few plyometrics last Thursday with the kids (about 12 minutes worth) and was still feeling it in my quads on Monday so recovery requirements are well noted 😂

One of the EIM sessions (was planning on doing it again today) is 16x200 w/ 200 recovery (takes around 70-75s). Goal pace is to start at mile pace and work down to 800. I usually run them at 800 or faster (low 30s) so no doubt overcook them a little but I enjoy the effort. Recovery from these the day after hasn't been a issue.

Just on the hills, how long and steep? I certainly don't do near enough hills.

Dubh Geannain

Also, Track and Field Live(formerly NIA) just launched its Winter Programme -

https://www.athleticsireland.ie/news/track-and-field-live-is-back/

2023/2024 Season

• 29th Nov – Sport Ireland NIA (Entries open)
• 7th Dec – TUS Athlone
• 13th Dec – Sport Ireland NIA
• 10th Jan – Sport Ireland NIA
• 25th Jan – TUS Athlone
• 3rd Feb – Nenagh (Juvenile Only Event)
• 7th Feb – Sport Ireland NIA
• 28th Feb – Sport Ireland NIA

Dubh Geannain

Looks like the Baseline meet on December 1st is running a 3k. The time might be a little too early in the evening for me to make it. But there's also the 800m running later.

Dubh Geannain

The kid done good. Been following Fog on YouTube for a few years. What a rise it's been.

He'd a decent race a few weeks back but still never guessed he'd nail such a time.

A much longer than normal video from him. I'll have to let him off on that 😏

https://youtu.be/tlFaGPTQtaM?si=rmBMkhtwbJU7iuF2