The Tipperary GAA (Club and intercounty) Discussion thread 2014

Paarthurnax

malistheman wrote: »

We didn't deserve to be that close. We wasted so many chances for goals by trying to walk it in. Stuck in traffic getting out at the moment but it was an embarrassment to be outnumbered by limerick supporters in our own stadium, shocking turnout from tipp supporters.

The support the most disappointing part of the day,sounds a bit cliched but Limerick won the game from the stands and terraces, when we needed to get behind the team there was barely an acknowledgement of a score or a tackle that what really turned the tide against us. We all can share some of the blame rather than blaming the easier targets. We have massive highs and gut wrenching lows but would you swap your county for any other. No other game in the world like this,and still amateur.

Blondie919

Deleted User wrote: »

I will say though that Bergin who is normally solid, had an off day.

Bergin was awful in the 1st half but at least he improved a bit in the 2nd. I thought Noel McGrath should have been taken off in the 2nd half. He had a nightmare of a game.

Someone said it earlier about some strange decisions on the sideline, well we should have brought on subs earlier than we did. Strange taking Dwyer off and him scoring 5 points and leaving McGrath on who was anonymous for much of the game.

I watched the match at my folks place as I'm visiting for the weekend. I've never heard my aul fella swear as much as he did today! I shared his pain and disappointment today. I'm very pessimistic about this Tipperary team ever winning the All Ireland again. We haven't a hope through the back door this year.

If only we had 14 more Bonnars, we'd be laughing now. But we don't and we're not! :mad:

tippspur

Very disappointing display again today,getting sick of going to games and watching gutless performances,we need a miracle in the play offs but I can't see it happening,management has to go as far as I'm concerned.

The Lost Sheep

Disappointing display with some of the more senior players disappointing Noel McGrath especially.
Lot to improve on for next time out. which is when????

Ompala

Deleted User wrote: »

Donie Nealons wife passed away. RIP

Thanks for clearing that up, very sad news, RIP.

tippspur wrote: »

Very disappointing display again today,getting sick of going to games and watching gutless performances,we need a miracle in the play offs but I can't see it happening,management has to go as far as I'm concerned.

Need the draw to be kind to us if we are to have any chance.
Anyone else think Gleeson could have done better for both Limerick goals, particularly the 2nd?

evolving tipperary

Abolutely did not say nothing - reread my first paragraph again - I judge Seamus by his potential and standards he sets - there is no reason why he cannot be as good as any forward in the country -

He ran himself ragged today against a verry good full back in my opinion - I was happy with that performance - is he a full forward - for me? no - corner or wing

evolving tipperary

Deleted User wrote: »

Woody was a big big loss today but i have to say Shane McGrath played reasonably well. I will say though that Bergin who is normally solid, had an off day.

I think Shane Mac was good with ball in hand - playing with the ball - fantastic - without the ball - defensively his game is quite poor - and he's not the only one there - too many lads want to play sexy hurling without putting their body on the line - Noelie had a shocker - O'Shea should have had the balls to withdraw him at half time - taking off before bubbles mind boggling....

Brendan Maher a princely hurler with the ball - not a man to command the center...

I've said it before and I'll say it - Curran at full back and O'Mahony at 6 - big intelligent men who know how to play - when to foul and when not to - that second limerick goal the player should have been sent out of the stadium with a shoulder into the chest or dragged down - three points up and you don't give away frees.....joke defensive intelligence

Oh championship hurling how I love thee...my voice is gone....but **** that league lads....

Bergin....not a midfielder....has he performed in championship? has he ever? when? he's solid in teh league...i don't blame Bergin for anything...but jesus let the lad settle wing back where he looked good....

Padraic maher out the wing

Bill Walsh....a sub on teh intermediates - came on and caught ball after ball - i know its only intermediate...but he needs to start learning his trade on the senior panel ASAP - he's striking might not be the best - looks a beast though

evolving tipperary

When Cahill got injured - i was like - right okay - big loss - but we have saint - well able for this crowd - then i couldn't believe my eyes....

evolving tipperary

Congratulations to Limerick - a team with real fight and guts.

Fireball07

Ye won the football deservedly, think we deserved it today. I thought ye were going to pull away, but a spectacular goal from Dowling made the win possible.

O'Shea seems like a very nice man, but you'd have to question him a bit now- Championship is the time to perform and he has to be getting better performances from some of those players.


Although... I have to take my hat off to Bonner Maher, he is an incredible player. Absolutely destroyed us. Won ball after ball, and our backline were shítting themselves, every time he went on a run. If you could clone him, ye'd be sorted. Think we need to get Downes performing a similar role.

evolving tipperary

Fireball07 wrote: »

Ye won the football deservedly, think we deserved it today. I thought ye were going to pull away, but a spectacular goal from Dowling made the win possible.

O'Shea seems like a very nice man, but you'd have to question him a bit now- Championship is the time to perform and he has to be getting better performances from some of those players.


Although... I have to take my hat off to Bonner Maher, he is an incredible player. Absolutely destroyed us. Won ball after ball, and our backline were shítting themselves, every time he went on a run. If you could clone him, ye'd be sorted. Think we need to get Downes performing a similar role.

Yes- O'Shea will be questioned and rightly so. The substitutions were poor. Changes should have been made in the first half. Tactics that worked in the league will not work in the championship.

I asked had we showed our hand in the league final on this thread. Lads, didn't seem to agree or felt we hoped we had such was the belief in the league final perfomance!!!! It's shadow boxing. O'Shea will have to start with fresh tactics and make changes. He is gone unless they make the AL final

varberg

Back were under a lot of pressure as the forwards found it hard to win their own ball. The two midfielders left the half back line very open and limericks midfield ran through us offloading and winning frees. Not starting dennis maher when woodlock was out proved costly and callanan was well marshalled by macarthy. We will need our best player michael cahill back playing and maybe even bring him out to help the midfield if paddy stapleton could slot in corner back for the rest of the championship.

Limerick brought a lot of intensity and it was so like a rerun of last years game. Hard to believe there wasnt a plan made to counteract limericks style in the last 12 months. They overran us again when the game was in the melting pot. Too many not playing well, the long route now.

Well done Limerick had the measure of us.

Paarthurnax

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

Lot to improve on for next time out. which is when????

Sat 28th or July 5th. Two games on each weekend i think. 4 Losing Semi finalists one of which is (Tipp + (Galway or KK/Offally) + (Wexford or Dublin) +(Clare or Cork/Waterford) and 4 qualifiers from quarter final defeats (Laois, Antrim (Cork or Waterford) or (Offaly or Kilkenny). I could be wrong though, still some big games before we play again.

tippspur

tippspur wrote: »

Very disappointing display again today,getting sick of going to games and watching gutless performances,we need a miracle in the play offs but I can't see it happening,management has to go as far as I'm concerned.

Id admittedly have been a big advocate of O'Shea but his record in Championship hurling speaks for itself - W0 L3

All year we've been hearing from him about how June 1st is the ultimate target only to witness the same gutless shíte.

I dont agree in changing management right now at this point but i agree they are hanging on by a thread. Ultimately though i think the players have let him down badly and to be honest its looking as if Declan and Tommy had alot to contend with too. Though if the manager cannot influence the team then ultimately he is not up to the job and judging by the no shows it seems that he cant.

That all said, yesterday highlighted the unappreciated importance of James Woodlock. That game was made for him. A crying shame he didn't play. The normally good Bergin had an off day. I do think Shane Mcgrath battled well though. No faults there.

While the nature of hurling and soccer are different there are several similarities between Tipperary hurling and Arsenal. Alot of talent on disposal but ultimately a soft centre within the team and a manager who is showing blind loyalty to tried, tested and failed players

evolving tipperary

evolving tipperary wrote: »

Abolutely did not say nothing - reread my first paragraph again - I judge Seamus by his potential and standards he sets - there is no reason why he cannot be as good as any forward in the country -

He ran himself ragged today against a verry good full back in my opinion - I was happy with that performance - is he a full forward - for me? no - corner or wing

I defended Callanan in the build up to this match but at one stage i witnessed his man get sprint in front of him while Seamie stood still. I thought McCarthy had him in his pocket to be honest.

He also had his hands on his hips for most of that game feeling sorry for himself. He scuffed several chances. As far as im concerned he didn't do enough but Noel was arguably worse. Im amazed Bubbles managed four points. He was dreadful but of course a real opportunist with the ball in hand.

Ompala

Ompala wrote: »

Thanks for clearing that up, very sad news, RIP.



Need the draw to be kind to us if we are to have any chance.
Anyone else think Gleeson could have done better for both Limerick goals, particularly the 2nd?

I wouldnt blame Gleeson for the second to be honest. Backs need to be marking up there. First was a complete bullet. No chance

evolving tipperary

evolving tipperary wrote: »

I think Shane Mac was good with ball in hand - playing with the ball - fantastic - without the ball - defensively his game is quite poor - and he's not the only one there - too many lads want to play sexy hurling without putting their body on the line - Noelie had a shocker - O'Shea should have had the balls to withdraw him at half time - taking off before bubbles mind boggling....

Brendan Maher a princely hurler with the ball - not a man to command the center...

I've said it before and I'll say it - Curran at full back and O'Mahony at 6 - big intelligent men who know how to play - when to foul and when not to - that second limerick goal the player should have been sent out of the stadium with a shoulder into the chest or dragged down - three points up and you don't give away frees.....joke defensive intelligence

Oh championship hurling how I love thee...my voice is gone....but **** that league lads....

Bergin....not a midfielder....has he performed in championship? has he ever? when? he's solid in teh league...i don't blame Bergin for anything...but jesus let the lad settle wing back where he looked good....

Padraic maher out the wing

Bill Walsh....a sub on teh intermediates - came on and caught ball after ball - i know its only intermediate...but he needs to start learning his trade on the senior panel ASAP - he's striking might not be the best - looks a beast though

I agree with your post but I dont feel the current back six is a problem to be honest. No backline would cope with the way our forwards are carrying on.

I thought Brendan was right to foul for the 21 as it was a certain goal if the Limerick forward continued his run but generally we need to be cuter on certain things.

Not marking up from sideline balls is ridiculous to be honest. We've been caught in the 2011 All Ireland final, the league final this year and yesterday to name a few occasions. Just not good enough.

Bill Walsh was unreal yesterday. Lacks an end product but caught absolutely everything. Arguably kept us in that game. For me as well, i think try and get O'Riordan onto the panel for the next game. We need ball winners. Bonnar cant do it all on his own.

Thought Niall o'Meara done very well yesterday. Why Denis Maher didnt start is beyond me. Made loads of catches and turnovers in the league.

Conelan

That all said, yesterday highlighted the unappreciated importance of James Woodlock. That game was made for him. A crying shame he didn't play.

[/QUOTE]

Agree absolutely. Woodlock is a fella who has grown in my estimation over the last year. Fellas will say x,y and z are better hurlers but at least this fella thunders into it and runs at defences at pace and gives 110%. Limerick were in panic at the back when Bonner was running through yesterday, if only we had someone else doing the same.
Just a question; is McGeeney still involved in the set up?? Cos if he is no more money should be wasted on that. Even after last years game against the same opposition who played in a similar "blood and guts" kind of way (that's no disrespect to Limerick, only wish we had bit more of it) I feel we still weren't prepared for the mental intensity required.
And finally, just a word on Eoin Kelly. Surely worth a few mins on the field yesterday at the end at a time when experience and leadership required. League final incl extra time and first championship gone through and the man hasn't seen the field of play.

Conelan

Conelan wrote: »

Agree absolutely. Woodlock is a fella who has grown in my estimation over the last year. Fellas will say x,y and z are better hurlers but at least this fella thunders into it and runs at defences at pace and gives 110%. Limerick were in panic at the back when Bonner was running through yesterday, if only we had someone else doing the same.
Just a question; is McGeeney still involved in the set up?? Cos if he is no more money should be wasted on that. Even after last years game against the same opposition who played in a similar "blood and guts" kind of way (that's no disrespect to Limerick, only wish we had bit more of it) I feel we still weren't prepared for the mental intensity required.
And finally, just a word on Eoin Kelly. Surely worth a few mins on the field yesterday at the end at a time when experience and leadership required. League final incl extra time and first championship gone through and the man hasn't seen the field of play.

Agree 100% with McGeeney. We should have tried to obtain Caroline Currids services this year. That lady has the magic touch.

On EK, I have to say i think its an indication of perhaps how weak the panel is if we're still persisting with Eoin and John O'Brien. Pa Bourke has his crtics but can feel hard done by really. Definately better then several of our benchmen yesterday. From the point of view that there is no point having him on the panel if your not going to play him id agree that Eoin should be at least tried but personally i felt Eoin and Johno's days are over. Lar still has quite a bit to offer. Curran im not so sure about. Will have to see him play.

evolving tipperary

The things about Seamus is you cannot have him as the epicenter of our forward line....he is not a full forward or a leader...building tactics around him is crazy - I'd rather see bubbles in that position than Callinan as he scores a lot more from play and he won't die psychologically - Bubbles is not a wing forward - the closer to goal the better - I don't think there is room for both Callinan and Bubbles - it's one or the other- There's not room for Noelie, Bubbles, and Callinan -

There is certainly a togetherness about Limerick that is not evident in Tipp's play

How bad is Cahill's injury?

While Denis did well to get on ball - and score a point - he did drop balls short and send them wide - he's still a project - but that's a field he has played on since a nipper...pressure is an amazing obstacle - maybe he could be tried at full forward - but i mean that would be a two year project for him to get to grips with - he's not going to start dominating inter county full backs anytime soon

Woodlock would have improved things - but he is no world beater either - let's not cod ourselves - he is a good honest player- however he is not a dominant midfielder

We need a dominant wing forward and midfielder - and we don't have them yet - that's clear - there might be young lads who might develop into those roles - we're still in transition

Limerick forwards are hardly amazing...yet they created chances and ran at us - we're not strong enough in the center positions - Padraic mixed the good with the bad - brendan not strong enough for the center

evolving tipperary

http://thescore.thejournal.ie/tipperary-eamon-oshea-1496264-Jun2014/?utm_source=twitter_self#comments

evolving tipperary

KK League final....pipped at the post...

Limerick pip second year in a row...

you could see heads and bodies drop after teh second limerick goal


the young players damaged again - psychologically - exposed to the mental weakness of giving in - it's a virus. lads!!!!

evolving tipperary

evolving tipperary wrote: »

http://thescore.thejournal.ie/tipperary-eamon-oshea-1496264-Jun2014/?utm_source=twitter_self#comments

I feel bad at times for O'Shea having to face the media after yet another collapse from his team but with each painful defeat his post match interviews are getting cringier and cringier. take for example our championship exit last year. He labelled his team 'Men of honour' :rolleyes: Not even their mothers would believe a statement like that

He's big flaw has been his loyalty. Pat Gilroy for example came into Dublin and got rid of the shapers and got Dublin to graft. Last year O'Shea needed to be cold and ruthless and yet the inconsistent few still remain within the setup.

evolving tipperary

Deleted User wrote: »

I feel bad at times for O'Shea having to face the media after yet another collapse from his team but with each painful defeat his post match interviews are getting cringier and cringier. take for example our championship exit last year. He labelled his team 'Men of honour' :rolleyes: Not even their mothers would believe a statement like that

He's big flaw has been his loyalty. Pat Gilroy for example came into Dublin and got rid of the shapers and got Dublin to graft. Last year O'Shea needed to be cold and ruthless and yet the inconsistent few still remain within the setup.

Well he ha sto publicly support the players to the media - I respect that - but if he plays three luxury players again in the forward line - in the shape of Bubbles, Noelie, and Seamie - he has lost it

Pick one - or two at the very most

evolving tipperary

evolving tipperary wrote: »

Well he ha sto publicly support the players to the media - I respect that - but if he plays three luxury players again in the forward line - in the shape of Bubbles, Noelie, and Seamie - he has lost it

Pick one - or two at the very most

Myself and my friend were only discussing on the drive to Thurles about the risks of having too many luxury players on the team at a time. If they all play bad then your pretty much fúcked unless you have grafters on the bench to come in instead. I realise you cant have a team of Bonnar Mahers, but look at Clare at the moment for example. Podge, Tots, Shane O'D, Conor Mcgrath, all willing to die for the cause and all very skilful hurlers. It proves that individual players can marry skill with desire no matter what size. Kilkenny are the opitimy of class and hard work

Truth is though im sick of praising other counties for these feats relative to ours. Why cant we have nice things?

dirtyden

evolving tipperary wrote: »

Well he ha sto publicly support the players to the media - I respect that - but if he plays three luxury players again in the forward line - in the shape of Bubbles, Noelie, and Seamie - he has lost it

Pick one - or two at the very most

I agree with your point on defending the players and have a lot of respect for him for that.

Tactically he has fallen well short of what is needed. He set the team up incorrectly yesterday and never changed it. We were being murdered at midfield. Paudie should have been moved out, with omahony back to full back, moving Brendan to midfield and persisting with the sweeper was absolutely mindless. How Noel stayed on yesterday is another mystery, contributed nothing and was cleaned by everyone on him. Starting bonner full forward, in spite of the goal was a nonsense. The easy ball Limerick got in their half back line set them up for a lightning start to the game.

Mcgeeney cant be adding anything, the mentality to close the game out was not their yesterday, Limerick showed a will to win and to be honest it seemed like Tipp were nervous with a narrow lead in the last 10 mins. If McGeeney is there for the psychology its money wasted.

All is not lost though, lessons can and should be learned from yesterday.

dirtyden

dirtyden wrote: »

I agree with your point on defending the players and have a lot of respect for him for that.

Tactically he has fallen well short of what is needed. He set the team up incorrectly yesterday and never changed it. We were being murdered at midfield. Paudie should have been moved out, with omahony back to full back, moving Brendan to midfield and persisting with the sweeper was absolutely mindless. How Noel stayed on yesterday is another mystery, contributed nothing and was cleaned by everyone on him. Starting bonner full forward, in spite of the goal was a nonsense. The easy ball Limerick got in their half back line set them up for a lightning start to the game.

Mcgeeney cant be adding anything, the mentality to close the game out was not their yesterday, Limerick showed a will to win and to be honest it seemed like Tipp were nervous with a narrow lead in the last 10 mins. If McGeeney is there for the psychology its money wasted.

All is not lost though, lessons can and should be learned from yesterday.

That's the worrying thing though. Lessons are not being learned. Still being caught out at stupid amateur stuff like not marking from a sideline and allowing the Limerick wing back the whole field to distribute the ball. As well as that we are panicky and jittery on the ball. No fluidity whatsoever.

Mullane let rip today...Cant blame him if im being honest

http://www.hoganstand.com/ArticleForm.aspx?ID=217452

John Mullane cannot see a way back into this year's hurling championship for Tipperary after their late collapse against Limerick.

Writing in his Irish Independent column, the former Waterford star claimed Tipp lack the leadership that's needed to be All-Ireland contenders.

"I've defended Tipperary's senior hurlers in the past, but I honestly don't think you can defend the performance they delivered against Limerick yesterday," he reflected.

"Like a lot of the Tipp fans who streamed disappointed out of Semple Stadium, I think I've finally given up on them. If I was supporting Tipp in Thurles, I'd have been pulling my hair out. The performance was heartless and too casual.

"Since Liam Sheedy left as manager after the 2010 All-Ireland success, they've missed the energy he used to bring to the dressing-room and the sideline.

"I don't think the standard was great yesterday - Tipp had 12 wides and Limerick 11. Were Limerick at their best? No. But they still won the game. Why? Because they had heart, guts and a manic aggression. In your face, typical Limerick.

"I should have seen this coming and the Limerick display was typified by that full-back line - Tom Condon, Richie McCarthy and Séamus Hickey. That's what missing in the Tipp forward line - the kind of character those Limerick lads bring.

"I felt sorry for 'Bonner' Maher - he kept plugging away, but he was the only fella that could say he brought those qualities to the table today in the Tipp attack.

"I thought Pádraic Maher and Mickey Cahill did well, before he got injured, and young Cathal Barrett had a fine game. But Tipp's Achilles heel is a lack of leadership in attack. When the game is in the melting pot, a lot of their big players go missing."

Mullane continued: "Where do they go from here? That's a huge question. Is there a way back for Tipperary? I doubt it very much.

"It's going to be very hard for Eamon O'Shea to lift this ship. They came back from losing to Cork in 2010 to win the All-Ireland, but I don't think the quality or the leadership is there to turn this around."

buggy beag

Deleted User wrote: »

Mullane let rip today...Cant blame him if im being honest

bang on the money

evolving tipperary

James Ryan actually had more possessions than the other two Tipp midfielders put together....

and it gets worse James Browne had 1 and half more than the next team tipp midfielder

RYAN - 23 POSSESSIONS
BROWNE - 15
TIPP GUYS - TEN OR LESS