The Tipperary GAA (Club and intercounty) Discussion thread 2014

varberg

Id like to see o shea continue but if he doesnt donal og cusack would be the best choice for the job either as manager or trainer. If o shea is going then go soon and give the new managment a chance rather than waste the next month finding a replacement. preparations for next year would have to start right away. No point diddering away and deciding in november he wont do it. Make up his mind now and think of next year.

Declan fanning, michael cleary and eddie enright too would be good men to have involved. Someone living locally who would take it for longer than 2 years if asked would be ideal. At this stage id hardly ask sheedy or english they are happy to knock in their media jaunts and seem comfortable as commentators without putting themselves in the front line where a lot of hard work and long hours getting things right would be needed. Appointing managers living outside the county means long travel and short stints as a manager.

robbiezero

varberg wrote: »

Id like to see o shea continue but if he doesnt donal og cusack would be the best choice for the job either as manager or trainer. If o shea is going then go soon and give the new managment a chance rather than waste the next month finding a replacement. preparations for next year would have to start right away. No point diddering away and deciding in november he wont do it. Make up his mind now and think of next year.

Declan fanning, michael cleary and eddie enright too would be good men to have involved. Someone living locally who would take it for longer than 2 years if asked would be ideal. At this stage id hardly ask sheedy or english they are happy to knock in their media jaunts and seem comfortable as commentators without putting themselves in the front line where a lot of hard work and long hours getting things right would be needed. Appointing managers living outside the county means long travel and short stints as a manager.

Has Cusack any form or experience of management?

varberg

Watched the game again and found it hard to believe no media picked up of the foul by power on bergin before the kilkenny goal as the ball was in the air and dropping. I thought it was a definate free out and it would take the butt of the hurley or an elbow from power to make bergin go down.

Surprised it wasnt picked up by the tv and a point made of it. It was clearly a free out if the rule book was applied.

buggy beag

Have any of the so called big 3 ever had And outside manager ?

buggy beag

buggy beag wrote: »

Have any of the so called big 3 ever had And outside manager ?

Never, and i doubt ever will. The reason for this is typically given as "oh sure only a Tipperary/Kilkenny/Cork man would have true passion for the job" but for me thats not the real reason and also if it was its a load of bs in my opinion. Id say that they are really afraid as they think it shows a sign of weakness within their county and will be used as a stick to beat them with forever more. Quite frankly i think this another load of nonsense.

Actually reading Donal Og's book at present and the one thing i cant fault him about is his desire for perfect meticolous preparation and he is pretty open miinded and visionary in terms of advances in training methods and preparation.

That all said he does perhaps lack experience a little while to be fair he has no shortage of wisdom and insight. I do also think we have a few young enthusiastic men in our own county who could bring alot to a management setup. Willie Maher, Declan Fanning, Noel Morris, TJ Connolly, Brian Horgan and Brendan Cummins are a few names we should be sounding out for the future.

If O'Shea goes id give consideration with regards to keeping Paudie O'Neill and Michael Ryan on at the very least. A total exodus like four years ago would be disaster and we would be going into the unknown yet again just as fruit was appearing on the tree.

dirkmeister

evolving tipperary wrote: »

I think if O'Shea can improve as much as he from year 1 to year 2 in year 3 - he will be a massive manager...

Another factor - I suppose - as I know myself working in the same university - Once September hits O'Shea would have been very very very busy - no matter how people covered for him...

Whereas Cody is a retired principal...now that's an advantage...

Cody's not retired. He is still working away.

evolving tipperary

Principle of a primary school - he might as well be retired in terms of job demands in comparison to O'Shea - who has a very demanding job - hence why O'Shea said there's more to life to winning. O'Shea is doing very important and hard research.

He has had over 70 papers published in peer-reviewed journals, including publications in top-ranked journals such as: the Journal of Health Economics, Social Science and Medicine, Cambridge Journal of Economics, Age and Ageing, Ageing and Society, Health Policy, International Journal of Health Technology Assessment, European Journal of Health Economics, International Journal of Geriatric Psychiatry and the Journal of Mental Health Policy and Economics. He has authored/co-authored 15 books and monographs, mainly in the field of ageing and social policy. He has been responsible for numerous reports commissioned by national and international agencies, including: the National Council on Ageing and Older People, The Department of Health and Children, the Health Research Board, the European Commission and the European Council. Professor O’Shea has also contributed 25 plus chapters to various books, mainly on ageing and inequality issues. His work has been influential in setting the agenda for the ongoing reform of the long-stay sector in Ireland, particularly in relation to funding, priority-setting and dementia. His current research is focused on: the economics of dementia, health care evaluation and rural ageing.

evolving tipperary

And there you have it - one side of our forward line completely dominated - no scores from that side of the field -

http://www.gaa.ie/gaa-news-and-videos/daily-news/1/3009141145-kilkenny-v-tipperary-a-statistical-breakdown/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

tippspur

varberg wrote: »

Watched the game again and found it hard to believe no media picked up of the foul by power on bergin before the kilkenny goal as the ball was in the air and dropping. I thought it was a definate free out and it would take the butt of the hurley or an elbow from power to make bergin go down.

Surprised it wasnt picked up by the tv and a point made of it. It was clearly a free out if the rule book was applied.

Yep,Power nearly took the head off Bergin.

evolving tipperary

Sheedy left Tipp after the big win - showed a lack of ambition - was not hard nosed enough to make it work - not hungry enough....now he chose life and his family - fair enough - some guys are more ruthless - but the fact of the matter is - he didn't lead them on - and it set that group of players back ....

Maybe, that streak within Sheedy meant he never achieved as a player with the county - had only one solid run with the county and yes made all ireland final - but lost....


The high standards of high achievement in sport are ruthless - ruthless. That's not in Sheedy or English.

It's in Cody. That said I wouldn't go for a pint with Cody. Boring and stubborn. I'd go for a pint with Sheehy or English though!!!!

evolving tipperary

evolving tipperary wrote: »

Sheedy left Tipp after the big win - showed a lack of ambition - was not hard nosed enough to make it work - not hungry enough....now he chose life and his family - fair enough - some guys are more ruthless - but the fact of the matter is - he didn't lead them on - and it set that group of players back ....

Maybe, that streak within Sheedy meant he never achieved as a player with the county - had only one solid run with the county and yes made all ireland final - but lost....

Hold on now thats an outrageous remark.

Dont forget that the man that you are defending, Eamon O'Shea, who was part of the same setup had also walked that same year after winning the All Ireland.

Sheedy, like Eamon, Michael Ryan or Nicky English had no shortage of ambition and done absolute wonders with Tipp. In fact ive never seen a man as energised and commited on the line as Sheedy. He'd wake the dead.

The man has a demanding role with his employers and left to fulfil an even more demanding role from what i gather and best of luck to him in whatever he does. I will always be grateful for what he did for Tipperary hurling. He is a legend. He thought that he was leaving Tipperary in good hands but as it transpired, it wasnt to be the case. Dont forget also that Liam Sheedy was involved in managing various Tipperary panels in 3 different grades between 2002 and 2010.

Intermediate manager in 2002
Senior selector in 2003
Minor manager from 2004-2006
Senior manager from 2008-2010

Also he played masters for Tipperary in 2003 in between these spells and has since coached the Munster railway cup team and took a few training sessions with us this year.

Your argument is a total contradiction. So Eamon O'Shea is a busy man but Liam Sheedy just didnt have the ambition?

evolving tipperary

I stand by argument - I said judging him by the most ruthless standards - of hungry for medals - winning at all costs. Judging Sheedy by those standards he is not ruthless - he left. He is not Davy Fitz - he is not Brian Cody - I also hinted he shouldn't want to be.

I'm talking about obsession here. Ruthless obsession where nothing but winning matters. That's not in Sheedy. It's just not.

Look at people like Shankly - "Some people believe football is a matter of life and death, I am very
disappointed with that attitude. I can assure you it is much, much more
important than that."

""Of course I didn't take my wife to see Rochdale as an anniversary present.
It was her birthday. Would I have got married in the football season? Anyway,
it was Rochdale reserves."

And, no, Sheedy's job in a bank is not the same level of running a center and researching all over the world. O'Shea went to America the following year - researching - he probably would have stayed if Sheedy had.

I'm not slighting Sheedy - I'm just calling it as I see it. Sport should not be everything, for some people it is. for, Sheedy and O'Shea, it's not. For other managers... it is...

Passion is another thing...different from ruthlessness...

evolving tipperary

Ruthless - is all about winning - there is no beauty in the game - there is no life outside it. Ruthless is obsession - where nothing but winning matters...

evolving tipperary

evolving tipperary wrote: »

I stand by argument - I said judging him by the most ruthless standards - of hungry for medals - winning at all costs. Judging Sheedy by those standards he is not ruthless - he left. He is not Davy Fitz - he is not Brian Cody - I also hinted he shouldn't want to be.

I'm talking about obsession here. Ruthless obsession where nothing but winning matters. That's not in Sheedy. It's just not.

Look at people like Shankly - "Some people believe football is a matter of life and death, I am very
disappointed with that attitude. I can assure you it is much, much more
important than that."

""Of course I didn't take my wife to see Rochdale as an anniversary present.
It was her birthday. Would I have got married in the football season? Anyway,
it was Rochdale reserves."

And, no, Sheedy's job in a bank is not the same level of running a center and researching all over the world. O'Shea went to America the following year - researching - he probably would have stayed if Sheedy had.

I'm not slighting Sheedy - I'm just calling it as I see it. Sport should not be everything, for some people it is. for, Sheedy and O'Shea, it's not. For other managers... it is...

Passion is another thing...different from ruthlessness...

Utter horseshít.

Firstly the Shankly comparison is a very flawed argument considering that he was involved in a professional sport and Sheedy involved in an amateur sport. And the way you mention Davy Fitz one would think he has a dozen all irelands won. This 'winner' suffered two unbelievably heavy defeats with Waterford in both a Munster and All Ireland final and while he thinks his own players should put Clare hurling 100% before anything else, he is off galavanting on Ireland's fittest family on RTE so its perfectly ok for him to have his hands in as many pies as he likes while the players apparently should live and breed Clare hurling. He is taking the credit for alot of hard work that underage coaches in Clare have undertaken in bringing this team to where they are.

Sheedy's job involved alot of travelling on behalf of the bank as he was a representative of a whole region. Not everyone does academic research for a living but that doesnt mean that their jobs are any less demanding.

As for Sheedy not being ruthless enough, ask Cian O'Neill and he will recall the grilling he received upon being interviewed for the role of fitness trainer with Tipperary prior to 2008.
O'Neill is akin to O'Shea in that he is heavily respected in his field of expertise but Liam Sheedy wanted to ensure that O'Neill was aware that he was to enter a culture where nothing but winning All Ireland titles was good enough.

evolving tipperary

Then why does he only have one....

Regardless of professionalism or amateurism - ruthlessness is an attitude - something inherent. Cody displays those levels. Regardless of Davy's tv career...the man drives himself to the limit...he has had heart surgery - a failed marriage...he is married to hurling - obsessed with sport - i never mentioned success in relation to Davy - Davy is a very young manager so don't write him off for lots of success yet. He had a lot of success not just with Clare but with sixmilebridge, and LIT - clubs which had won nothing before he came on the scene. I'm not saying he's Cody nor is he as obsessed as Cody...maybe...he's also not unfortunate to live in KK...

Regardless, Cody didn't walk away...Fitzgerald does not walk away...they strive and strive - manically for success. OBSESSION....your changing the terms of argument from my point....

evolving tipperary

evolving tipperary wrote: »

Then why does he only have one....

Regardless of professionalism or amateurism - ruthlessness is an attitude - something inherent. Cody displays those levels. Regardless of Davy's tv career...the man drives himself to the limit...he has had heart surgery - a failed marriage...he is married to hurling - obsessed with sport - i never mentioned success in relation to Davy - Davy is a very young manager so don't write him off for lots of success yet. He had a lot of success not just with Clare but with sixmilebridge, and LIT - clubs which had won nothing before he came on the scene. I'm not saying he's Cody nor is he as obsessed as Cody...maybe...he's also not unfortunate to live in KK...

Regardless, Cody didn't walk away...Fitzgerald does not walk away...they strive and strive - manically for success. OBSESSION....your changing the terms of argument from my point....

Cody's circumstances help him to continue his role as Kilkenny manager. Lives in Kilkenny, works in Kilkenny. No slight on him but id say the travelling involved with managing Kilkenny and teaching local is pretty minimum id imagine.

Liam Sheedy is a travelling rep for bank of ireland from what i understand. Now im not going to get into whether its more demanding then Eamon O'sheas role in NUIG or not, but both jobs have huge demands id imagine so its probably unfair of you to give right of pass to one and yet state that the other is not ambitious enough. These are amateur men. The job must come first regardless of their level of ambition. Ideally if i was good enough to manage Tipperary id only love to win loads upon loads upon loads with them but ultimately id pick a job and food on the table if it came down to it without hesitation. Luckily for Brian Cody, he doesnt have to make that decision. Eamon AND Liam do. i cant fathom how you think Eamon is hard done by with his circumstances in terms of blocking his sporting ambitions but you seem to somehow think Sheedy had a range of options available to him?

evolving tipperary

You do realize that a large quantity of obsessed GAA men pick their jobs according to their suitability to gaa success...

Tony Browne didn't have a job for a number of years - that's an extreme example...but...it does happen. Sheedy and O'Shea don't have their careers blocked...they have ambitions outside of sport...

They are not men who have a tunnel vision of sport that is obsession - that is life or death - that is their life - they have passion for life I'd imagine...that includes outside of sport

You seem to think I'm insulting them...I'm not...quite on the contrary...

evolving tipperary

evolving tipperary wrote: »

Then why does he only have one....

Regardless of professionalism or amateurism - ruthlessness is an attitude - something inherent. Cody displays those levels. Regardless of Davy's tv career...the man drives himself to the limit...he has had heart surgery - a failed marriage...he is married to hurling - obsessed with sport - i never mentioned success in relation to Davy - Davy is a very young manager so don't write him off for lots of success yet. He had a lot of success not just with Clare but with sixmilebridge, and LIT - clubs which had won nothing before he came on the scene. I'm not saying he's Cody nor is he as obsessed as Cody...maybe...he's also not unfortunate to live in KK...

Regardless, Cody didn't walk away...Fitzgerald does not walk away...they strive and strive - manically for success. OBSESSION....your changing the terms of argument from my point....

Course they dont. Their roles allow them to be able to stay on and do what they love in their spare time

evolving tipperary

evolving tipperary wrote: »

You do realize that a large quantity of obsessed GAA men pick their jobs according to their suitability to gaa success...

Tony Browne didn't have a job for a number of years - that's an extreme example...but...it does happen. Sheedy and O'Shea don't have their careers blocked...they have ambitions outside of sport...

They are not men who have a tunnel vision of sport that is obsession - that is life or death - that is their life - they have passion for life I'd imagine...that includes outside of sport

You seem to think I'm insulting them...I'm not...quite on the contrary...

And a large quantity of them dont id imagine. Its just happenstance if they do fall into management and sometimes you fall into careers by accident too. There is a GAA/Business coach up in IT Carlow for example and id imagine some could go on to be brilliant coaches while some may never have been cut out for it in the first place.

It would be very strange indeed if every GAA intercounty manager was a primary school teacher. A good lot are to be fair but there is a wide range of careers id imagine in the GAA. If a man has a talent for two things then it doesnt mean he lacks the ambition for GAA management if he happens to want to be a long haul Airline pilot. It might make it tougher but he might be no different in terms of ambition then Brian Cody. Circumstance just may not allow him to fulfill those ambitions

ReacherCreature

Hello, folks.

Ah here, evolving_tipperary, not sure if I'm getting your point through the last couple of pages but I think you're giving Sheedy a hard time if you're saying he has a lack of obsession or passion or ruthlessness. Just because Sheedy isn't sending his heart rate into oblivion on the sidelines or whatever doesn't mean he has a lack of obsession or passion. People can be quiet and still be obsessive. Look at Henry Shefflin, as tipp_Gunner will allude to, in Donal Og's book, Shefflin is cool, calm, polite and will shake your hand, but he'd gut you (hurling-wise, naturally) in an instant.

I'd be sad to see O' Shea going because his managerial record is on an upward curve. We were inches from an All-Ireland. My worry is if we got someone new in would it wobble what is a steady ship? ANY new manager will look to come in and put his own stamp on the team.

While on that topic, I think this refusal to hire from outside the county is rubbish. I'm all for "foreign" managers to come in and manage. Daly in Dublin, Allen in Limerick, why not? Looking within, you're restricting your talent pool significantly.

I won't lie, I was pretty despondent leaving Croke Park on Saturday and being in a Kilkenny dominated section (bought tickets off a Kilkenny guy) made it all the more worse as well as the displeasure of sitting near some thoroughly arrogant Kilkenny supporters (one turned around and smiled broadly at me when they got their two goals. Classy). But, in my eyes, it was a largely successful season. We went from a potential relegation to All-Ireland finalists.

While we still had problems conceding, the attack flourished and our midfield got together well. Callanan has fulfilled the promise that he was on the brink of for years. Brendan Maher was a rock solid presence in defines, James Woodlock continues to make me look a fool for me calling for him to be dropped. Shane McGrath was excellent after a seriously rocky year last season (see what I did there?). Bonner got his form of a couple of years ago back and was dominant and discovered he can score a couple of goals here and there. Bubbles is a magnificent hurler. Cathal Barret was terrific and a definite Young Hurler of the Year. Paudie was excellent and James Barry also really good. I am no doubt missing other positives.

Gleeson got better as the year went on and despite some good puck outs and saves I think we have to wait a couple of years to see what he really has. Pity Michael Cahill was out so much and I'm not sure if Noel McGrath has done enough? He is inconsistent but there were flashes of brilliance. Lar also had his flashes and ran rampant when he could but faded in and out of games. Our bench isn't that strong. I think we've seen the last of Eoin Kelly, John O' Brien (potentially) and Paul Curran? Their positions look locked up by others?

I think it was a good year, albeit not as spectacular as it could have been. From witnessing the horror shows in the League to the magnificent comebacks versus Galway and Kilkenny and the utter demolition of Cork, it was a really, really exciting season.

As a small aside in something I'm interested in, I was reading in the programme before the match, Brendan Cummins is playing centre forward for his club and has been reported as very good. How is this possible?! The man spent his entire career (county) in nets and goes to club and dominates on the forward line. Can anyone shed any light on his performances?

evolving tipperary

That was not my argument at all...you should probably read what I've said first!!! Give me a fair go!

To boil my argument to a sentence - Sheedy and English are not ruthless to the extent of Cody or Loughane as they have other life interests and goals. I would also say that Cody is more ruthless than Loughnane and I would not relate that to medals. That's to put it very simplistically but lads don't seem to want to read what I have written - no bother! I don't blame ye! At a high level ruthlessness - and no I don't equate Sheedy's job achievements with O'Shea's research. I just don't...it's pretty valuable work for old people and disease suffers in society.

My argument was ruthlessness and obsession are not terms you could apply to figures in Tipperary hurling right now....that's just a fact. You'd have to go to the 60s for ruthlessness in Tipperary Hurling. The Famed Hell's Kitchen - ruthlessness gets results. My brother said to me the beauty of Tipperary is they try to out hurl Kilkenny - that is beauty and Tipp play amazing hurling to watch - but its not a ruthless game plan... - Playing total hurling - creating space rather than going into lock down - shutting up space is the smart and ruthless thing to do. More mistakes and things can go wrong when you trying an elaborate system of play rather than a simplified to the point game-plan - shut down a style of play.

There is a morality in sport - a respect. But, the record books do not record respect or the beauty of play. It records results. What will last from this year...well, I think rather showing KK lift the cup in high light reels they'll be showing Ritchie Hogan, and Seamie Callinan clips as long as hurling is around....

Sean Moran wrote in the Irish Times today -
The disheartening American football precept of “show me a good loser and I’ll show you a loser” appears within Gaelic games to have fostered a corollary: “show me a graceless winner and I’ll show you a winner”.
It’s almost as if winning All-Irelands has become a licence to say what you want. A year ago Dublin football manager Jim Gavin after winning the All-Ireland was highly critical of what he felt was an inexplicable disparity between frees conceded by his team and those awarded to them.

The Lost Sheep

evolving tipperary wrote: »

That was not my argument at all...you should probably read what I've said first!!! Give me a fair go!

To boil my argument to a sentence - Sheedy and English are not ruthless to the extent of Cody or Loughane as they have other life interests and goals. I would also say that Cody is more ruthless than Loughnane and I would not relate that to medals. That's to put it very simplistically but lads don't seem to want to read what I have written - no bother! I don't blame ye! At a high level ruthlessness - and no I don't equate Sheedy's job achievements with O'Shea's research. I just don't...it's pretty valuable work for old people and disease suffers in society.

My argument was ruthlessness and obsession are not terms you could apply to figures in Tipperary hurling right now....that's just a fact. You'd have to go to the 60s for ruthlessness in Tipperary Hurling. The Famed Hell's Kitchen - ruthlessness gets results. My brother said to me the beauty of Tipperary is they try to out hurl Kilkenny - that is beauty and Tipp play amazing hurling to watch - but its not a ruthless game plan... - Playing total hurling - creating space rather than going into lock down - shutting up space is the smart and ruthless thing to do. More mistakes and things can go wrong when you trying an elaborate system of play rather than a simplified to the point game-plan - shut down a style of play.

There is a morality in sport - a respect. But, the record books do not record respect or the beauty of play. It records results. What will last from this year...well, I think rather showing KK lift the cup in high light reels they'll be showing Ritchie Hogan, and Seamie Callinan clips as long as hurling is around....

Sean Moran wrote in the Irish Times today -
The disheartening American football precept of “show me a good loser and I’ll show you a loser” appears within Gaelic games to have fostered a corollary: “show me a graceless winner and I’ll show you a winner”.
It’s almost as if winning All-Irelands has become a licence to say what you want. A year ago Dublin football manager Jim Gavin after winning the All-Ireland was highly critical of what he felt was an inexplicable disparity between frees conceded by his team and those awarded to them.

That's unfair on Sheedy etc to say he is not as ruthless because of his life and goals etc elsewhere and is unfair on him and what his role was as coach. While I see the point you are trying to make I disagree completely on saying Sheedy etc is not ruthless to extent of Cody

evolving tipperary

Then why did he leave? Why not try and win back to back?

How is it unfair?

I don't see it as a bad thing - it's a bad thing in terms of being ruthless. Do we want the Tipperary manager to be ruthless?

But, surely there are more important things than sport....

http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/does-brian-cody-have-to-behave-like-this-1.1947086

buggy beag

Alrite lads was just wondering do any of ye get the season ticket every year as was thinking of getting it this year any pro's or con's to having it?

evolving tipperary

Sometimes life gets in the way - and you won't be able to make games you've paid out for - but depends upon the job you have and if you do much travelling...

The Lost Sheep

evolving tipperary wrote: »

Then why did he leave? Why not try and win back to back?

How is it unfair?

I don't see it as a bad thing - it's a bad thing in terms of being ruthless. Do we want the Tipperary manager to be ruthless?

But, surely there are more important things than sport....

http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/does-brian-cody-have-to-behave-like-this-1.1947086

He left due to other commitments but regardless of that decision to leave the position he was and is still a ruthless coach. You are putting Sheedy at level lower because of his professional decisions and that's unfair.
Yes you want the head Tipperary coach/decision maker to be ruthless as if they're not you don't know if they'll make big decisions when they have to

evolving tipperary

I don't think we're operating off the same level of what ruthlessness means...

I don't see ruthlessness as affecting big decisions...i see it as informing either - Cody never walked away - and no matter what the life circumstances are - I'm sure he has his own life matters - but he never walked - he wants more - more - more - more...

I think you have Sheedy on this pedestal because of his fantastic All-Ireland win - which was amazing - particularly the hurling that was played. but he is not beyond criticism....

Nor am I criticizing to a high degree. I just don't view him as operating off a ruthless approach to high level achievement in sport. - I think that's evident in his life choices.

ReacherCreature

To boil my argument to a sentence - Sheedy and English are not ruthless to the extent of Cody or Loughane as they have other life interests and goals.

I think that's wholly unfair. I get that hurling is about commitment but you also need to look after your position outside of the sport. These lads won't be coaching forever and All-Ireland medals won't give you a roof over your head unless you are hugely marketable and can live off endorsements or sponsorships and the like but that's not for everyone. I think in order to make that statement, you'd need to know Sheedy and from common sense, you don't get to be a successful club and county managers without some sort of ruthless streak in you.

buggy beag wrote: »

Alrite lads was just wondering do any of ye get the season ticket every year as was thinking of getting it this year any pro's or con's to having it?

Head over to the GAA forum, there's a thread on it and the price has gone up with some commenting that it isn't worth it or there's a lack of value.

The Lost Sheep

evolving tipperary wrote: »

I don't think we're operating off the same level of what ruthlessness means...

I don't see ruthlessness as affecting big decisions...i see it as informing either - Cody never walked away - and no matter what the life circumstances are - I'm sure he has his own life matters - but he never walked - he wants more - more - more - more...

I think you have Sheedy on this pedestal because of his fantastic All-Ireland win - which was amazing - particularly the hurling that was played. but he is not beyond criticism....

Nor am I criticizing to a high degree. I just don't view him as operating off a ruthless approach to high level achievement in sport. - I think that's evident in his life choices.

EOS taking time away doesn't affect his ruthlessness as a coach. He took time off as the coach as it wasn't possible to combine his personal family life, his professional life and role as coach. Cody having stayed as coach of Kilkenny doesn't make him more ruthless than O Shea, Sheedy or whoever,
I don't have Sheedy on a pedestal in any way. And where did I state that he was beyond criticism?

buggy beag

I knew someone with a child in the school cody is in couldn't fault him nicest man You would meet they said but they also said he's semi retired with years so its probaly easier for him to have the time to dedicate than say for others in jobs that are more demanding