Manchester United Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - 2013/14

adox

irishfeen wrote: »

You see that could be considered very narrow minded too - how do you know he cant change things around? ... this is not his team but a team with some very average players who are not of the quality to match City, Chelsea, Arsenal not to mention Barca, Madrid, Bayern.

Fcuk sake give Moyes the chance to make signings and create his own team at least until this time next year before calling for his head.

See this is where we fundamentally disagree. No one is saying this squad is good enough to compete with Barca, Madrid and Bayern or even City but it is more than capable of competing with the likes of Chelsea and Arsenal.

I really don't see why Moyes needs to build his own team and think that is the wrong path for the club to go down, no matter who the manager is. Some additions are needed but even as is, before the two signings, this squad is good enough to be at the very least in the top four and challenging for thrid and second place.

I really am perplexed at the opinion of "give him a chance to build his own team". He had a team and a squad to take charg of that was as good as, if not better than 99% of the squads in the premier league.

hufpc8w3adnk65

Any Juan mata chants yet? Also has anyone a source that he'll be number 7 or is it just guesswork?

irishfeen

adox wrote: »

See this is where we fundamentally disagree. No one is saying this squad is good enough to compete with Barca, Madrid and Bayern or even City but it is more than capable of competing with the likes of Chelsea and Arsenal.

I really don't see why Moyes needs to build his own team and think that is the wrong path for the club to go down, no matter who the manager is. Some additions are needed but even as is, before the two signings, this squad is good enough to be at the very least in the top four and challenging for thrid and second place.

I really am perplexed at the opinion of "give him a chance to build his own team". He had a team and a squad to take charg of that was as good as, if not better than 99% of the squads in the premier league.

Honest question - Have you coincidered the sheer brilliance of Sir Alex Ferguson (the greatest club manager) and his ability to get 110% week in week out from average players in assessing that we are "more than capable of competing with the likes of Chelsea and Arsenal" ? - imo no other manager in world football could have won the PL last year with Manchester United.

Pudsy33

Sunday times linking us with Kroos, Mandzukic, Pogba, Vidal, Guarin, Reus and Fernando Rege from Porto.

IamtheWalrus

I'd love a bukkake with 11 Matas, that's how a big a fan I am.

Agueroooo

irishfeen wrote: »

Honest question - Have you coincidered the sheer brilliance of Sir Alex Ferguson (the greatest club manager) and his ability to get 110% week in week out from average players in assessing that we are "more than capable of competing with the likes of Chelsea and Arsenal" ? - imo no other manager in world football could have won the PL last year with Manchester United.

I am not undermining what Ferguson achieved last season, but RVP was in ' once in lifetime form' which was a massive percentage to why it went so well.

I posted an image weeks ago with how critical RVP was last season, and how much of a negative impact his absence is having this season.

Will try dig it out but on phone. Not easy.

markc1184

@DiscoMirror: Man Utd confirm they will officially introduce record signing Juan Mata at a 1.30pm press conference tomorrow #MUFC

beno619

irishfeen wrote: »

You see that could be considered very narrow minded too - how do you know he cant change things around? ... this is not his team but a team with some very average players who are not of the quality to match City, Chelsea, Arsenal not to mention Barca, Madrid, Bayern.

Fcuk sake give Moyes the chance to make signings and create his own team at least until this time next year before calling for his head.

What about Everton, Liverpool and Spurs ?

Cleverley, Valencia, Kagawa & Chicha have all been made to look very poor by the manager imo.

Very few of our performances give me confidence things will turn around. We are all clinging to blind faith or ignoring the past 6 months if you think otherwise.

Will I Amnt

The squad is far from poor but Fergie did manage to defy logic by winning so much despite the midfield issues. We have been crying out for midfielders for years now.
I don't think any other manager could have done what he did without a more solid centre.

I'll give Moyes a chance to sort out what he sees as a good setup and judge him from there, not with another mans team and tactics.

irishfeen

beno619 wrote: »

What about Everton, Liverpool and Spurs ?

Cleverley, Valencia, Kagawa & Chicha have all been made to look very poor by the manager imo.

Very few of our performances give me confidence things will turn around. We are all clinging to blind faith or ignoring the past 6 months if you think otherwise.

Liverpool have some very good players and are not in Europe so most are very fresh , Everton are always there or there abouts and if im not mistaken didn't Spurs spend £100 million+ during the summer... we don't have a right to win the PL every year either.

yabadabado

beno619 wrote: »

What about Everton, Liverpool and Spurs ?

Cleverley, Valencia, Kagawa & Chicha have all been made to look very poor by the manager imo.
.

I don't think there is anyway you can blame Moyes for the performances of Valencia and Cleverly . Valencia has been poor for iver 2 years now and Clev isnt good enough for the first team .Moyes hasn't ruined them .

irishfeen

Will I Amnt wrote: »

The squad is far from poor but Fergie did manage to defy logic by winning so much despite the midfield issues. We have been crying out for midfielders for years now.
I don't think any other manager could have done what he did without a more solid centre.

I'll give Moyes a chance to sort out what he sees as a good setup and judge him from there, not with another mans team and tactics.

This very very much this.

adox

irishfeen wrote: »

Honest question - Have you coincidered the sheer brilliance of Sir Alex Ferguson (the greatest club manager) and his ability to get 110% week in week out from average players in assessing that we are "more than capable of competing with the likes of Chelsea and Arsenal" ? - imo no other manager in world football could have won the PL last year with Manchester United.

Yes I have an no doubt Fergie got that little extra out of the squad, but even Fergie needed the tools to do the job.

Ferguson is/was a legend. But I think you and others overvalue his impact if you think this squad at the moment is at it's true level this season and indeed do Fergie a disservice by implying so.

beno619

irishfeen wrote: »

Honest question - Have you coincidered the sheer brilliance of Sir Alex Ferguson (the greatest club manager) and his ability to get 110% week in week out from average players in assessing that we are "more than capable of competing with the likes of Chelsea and Arsenal" ? - imo no other manager in world football could have won the PL last year with Manchester United.

Our players are not that poor we should be in the top 4.

Honest question - would Mourinho have us challenging for the title with the same squad/players fit ?

Will I Amnt

beno619 wrote: »

Our players are not that poor we should be in the top 4.

Honest question - would Mourinho have us challenging for the title with the same squad/players fit ?

It took Mourinho until the last few weeks to get some sort of form together with Chelsea. That's at a club he knows inside out and no major injury concerns.
They are only starting to look like title contenders now. Last month I'd have said no chance.

irishfeen

adox wrote: »

Yes I have an no doubt Fergie got that little extra out of the squad, but even Fergie needed the tools to do the job.

Ferguson is/was a legend. It I think you and others overvalue his impact if you think this squad at the moment is at it's true level this season and indeed do Fergie a disservice by implying so.

He was a beast who churned out trophy's on an industrial scale - his tool last year was RVP - Moyes does not have the luxuary of RVP or Rooney in his prime.

As I have always said here, if we get RVP and Rooney back then I guarantee you results and performances will/would pick up drastically.

Lord TSC

Is it not a bit of a double standard though to go "Well, Fergie did wonders with them and deserves the credit for good performances" and at the same time go "Well, it's not Moyes' fault they are weaker and he doesn't deserve the blame, the players do"?

Either the blame/credit goes to the manager or it goes to the players, but pick a side and stick with it...

Ed The Equalizer

Will I Amnt wrote: »

The squad is far from poor but Fergie did manage to defy logic by winning so much despite the midfield issues.

He did sh*te when Scholes retired and then well when he came back.

I don't think Fergie would be winning the league with the current squad given the loss of Scholes and injuries to key players.

My big fears were that Moyes wouldn't attract players, Rooney would leave, and the slide would continue. All of those fears are gone now and now it appears we're on track.

Am definitely happy to give Moyes another season now, having wanted him out before Christmas.

Like many have said, CM and LB are the priority, Moyes at least deserves the chance to build that much of a team and then we can judge him better.

irishfeen

beno619 wrote: »

Our players are not that poor we should be in the top 4.

Honest question - would Mourinho have us challenging for the title with the same squad/players fit ?

Honestly with the exact same team/circumstances (Rooney, RVP injured) then I don't think any manager (SAF included) would have us challenging for the title - maybe slightly better in terms of points but challenging for the title is just not possible with our midfield and missing RVP & Rooney.

KH25

Teamshadowclan wrote: »

Is it not a bit of a double standard though to go "Well, Fergie did wonders with them and deserves the credit for good performances" and at the same time go "Well, it's not Moyes' fault they are weaker and he doesn't deserve the blame, the players do"?

Either the blame/credit goes to the manager or it goes to the players, but pick a side and stick with it...

Its a bit of both. Fergie had the ability to squeeze 110% out of players, but he also had the players in good form. Moyes may not have that ability, but he is not being helped by the players either. He hasn't helped himself either in terms of selections and subs though. That said, I am fully prepared to let him build his own team before I judge him completely.

adox

irishfeen wrote: »

He was a beast who churned out trophy's on an industrial scale - his tool last year was RVP - Moyes does not have the luxuary of RVP or Rooney in his prime.

As I have always said here, if we get RVP and Rooney back then I guarantee you results and performances will/would pick up drastically.

But RVP played at the start of the season and the performances were the same?
Rooney is playing way way better this season than he did last season and played for a large part of the season so far?

Injuries always have an effect on a club but I don't buy them being a major factor to Utds predicament this season.

beno619

irishfeen wrote: »

Liverpool have some very good players and are not in Europe so most are very fresh , Everton are always there or there abouts and if im not mistaken didn't Spurs spend £100 million+ during the summer... we don't have a right to win the PL every year either.

We dont have a right. So you think 7th is our level and Moyes could not of had us fighting for the title ?

yabadabado wrote: »

I don't think there is anyway you can blame Moyes for the performances of Valencia and Cleverly . Valencia has been poor for iver 2 years now and Clev isnt good enough for the first team .Moyes hasn't ruined them .

Valancia has reached new levels or poor, not helped by having Smalling behind him.

Cleverley certainly is not good enough and should not have played the amount of games he has this year, while a far superior midfielder sat on the bench. It might take him a while to recover any sort of form.

Kagawa messed about.
Chicha unused for 3 months.

RobertKK

---

de Gea

---

Rafael---Evans---vidic/Jones---Shaw

---

Vidal----Kroos
Mata---Rooney---Januzaj

---

RVP

---

If a magic week was to happen....it won't though.

irishfeen

Teamshadowclan wrote: »

Is it not a bit of a double standard though to go "Well, Fergie did wonders with them and deserves the credit for good performances" and at the same time go "Well, it's not Moyes' fault they are weaker and he doesn't deserve the blame, the players do"?

Either the blame/credit goes to the manager or it goes to the players, but pick a side and stick with it...

There was always going to be a drop in performance from average players when SAF went, the players played for 110% for Sir Alex and the fear factor was also an issue.... even Roy Keane admitted recently that SAF knew exactly when to say/take action at the right time to help the team - that came from experience that no other manager has in their locker.

irishfeen

RobertKK wrote: »

---

de Gea

---

Rafael---Evans---vidic/Jones---Shaw

---

Vidal----Kroos
Mata---Rooney---Januzaj

---

RVP

---

If a magic week was to happen....it won't though.

Now don't take this the wrong way RobertKK but I think that may be ever so slightly optimistic

beno619

Looks like Zaha will get his move.

"Wilfried Zaha & Kenwyne Jones at St George's Park for medicals ahead of moves to Cardiff #SSN"

irishfeen

beno619 wrote: »

We dont have a right. So you think 7th is our level and Moyes could not of had us fighting for the title ?

No not fighting for the title with our midfield situation and RVP & Rooney missing - 7th of course not our level, that's why I think we will still finish 4th and Tuesday night we could knock a few points off the clubs above us.

Red Crow

Duncan Castles is linking us with Glen Johnson today. That is a strange rumour that I find very hard to believe.

Rafael hasn't exactly been fantastic but he's a better player than Johnson and he has far more upside. Johnson will be 30 in August and is always a player that I felt could be exploited defensively.

It makes no sense at all which makes me think that he has either a poor source or is just making up something to print.

In the next 6 months you would imagine that Moyes will want a CM, CB, LB and maybe a striker. I think a back-up RB is way down that list and Johnson isn't suitable for that. Also Marchisio seems to have dried up after he came out and said that he wants to fulfill his contract. That makes me think it's a load of rubbish.

Kerrydude1981

shadowcomplex wrote: »

Is the cardiff game on tv

No,looks like we'l have to get out the canoe Tuesday night.

irishfeen

Independent claiming "[Mata] may only be the first of three arrivals. David Moyes, United’s manager, also wants to bring in a central midfielder and a left-back before Friday’s deadline. One club source stated: “There is a real excitement around Old Trafford.”

LB and CM would be fcuking sweet

KH25

Red Crow wrote: »

Duncan Castles is linking us with Glen Johnson today. That is a strange rumour that I find very hard to believe.

Rafael hasn't exactly been fantastic but he's a better player than Johnson and he has far more upside. Johnson will be 30 in August and is always a player that I felt could be exploited defensively.

It makes no sense at all which makes me think that he has either a poor source or is just making up something to print.

In the next 6 months you would imagine that Moyes will want a CM, CB, LB and maybe a striker. I think a back-up RB is way down that list and Johnson isn't suitable for that. Also Marchisio seems to have dried up after he came out and said that he wants to fulfill his contract. That makes me think it's a load of rubbish.

Johnson is a poor player. How he has done so well for himself at Liverpool is beyond me. I view him as one of their weakest players.

No news of Southampton rejecting our bid for Shaw? I can only assume that means they are considering it.

Red Crow

Red Crow wrote: »

Duncan Castles is linking us with Glen Johnson today. That is a strange rumour that I find very hard to believe.

Rafael hasn't exactly been fantastic but he's a better player than Johnson and he has far more upside. Johnson will be 30 in August and is always a player that I felt could be exploited defensively.

It makes no sense at all which makes me think that he has either a poor source or is just making up something to print.

In the next 6 months you would imagine that Moyes will want a CM, CB, LB and maybe a striker. I think a back-up RB is way down that list and Johnson isn't suitable for that. Also Marchisio seems to have dried up after he came out and said that he wants to fulfill his contract. That makes me think it's a load of rubbish.

You're welcome to him, he's been píss poor this season, particularly the last few months. LFC have said he's out for an "indefinate" period btw so this source is talking through his hole I'd say. Also, Utd and Pool don't deal with each other. Non story.

Will I Amnt

Red Crow wrote: »

Duncan Castles is linking us with Glen Johnson today. That is a strange rumour that I find very hard to believe.

I hope he's still drunk.

Professey Chin

Christ I hate the official website. Can't even click a link without that fcuking pop up looking for email. And it's just a mess anyway

jimjamcos

As good a player as Mata is, unless United sign a CM who can win and keep hold of the ball then it has to go down as another poor transfer window. I'd much rather have seen us offer 37.5m for Pogba or a player of his ilk.

GSPfan

That Official Agent guy on twitter tweeted that Glen Johnson story aswell last night. Got a good laugh out of it.

A week of Shaw and any decent central midfield player (Cabaye or better) would be unreal. Even just Shaw on his own would be great.

Jimmy Iovine

Professey Chin wrote: »

Christ I hate the official website. Can't even click a link without that fcuking pop up looking for email. And it's just a mess anyway

It hasn't changed since I started using the internet regularly about 10 years.

For a club of its size, United are crap at social media. The website is terrible, the Facebook account is appalling and don't get me started on the Twitter account.

A 14 year old would run it better than that.

newballsplease

Wondering what reaction would be IF Zaha goes to Cardiff and runs riot against defences from now till end of season.

Will it be a case of-'Moyes couldnt see this talent?'
'maybe utd wouldnt be in this bad a position if Moyes played Zaha more instead of Valencia'?
Etc etc!

Discodog

KH25 wrote: »

Johnson is a poor player. How he has done so well for himself at Liverpool is beyond me. I view him as one of their weakest players.

No news of Southampton rejecting our bid for Shaw? I can only assume that means they are considering it.

The Sunday Times are saying that, contrary to rumours, we haven't bid for Shaw but that we are monitoring the situation. Southampton want 30m for him.

Dicky Pride

newballsplease wrote: »

Wondering what reaction would be IF Zaha goes to Cardiff and runs riot against defences from now till end of season.

Will it be a case of-'Moyes couldnt see this talent?'
'maybe utd wouldnt be in this bad a position if Moyes played Zaha more instead of Valencia'?
Etc etc!

Well the fans haven't been given much of a chance to decide for themselves so we just have to trust Moyes. Is this a loan deal?

lordgoat

Some Youth Team news for anyone interested.

4 noobs on trial!

http://thepeoplesperson.com/picture-manchester-united-take-four-players-on-trial-including-south-american-trio/

Hangballlouie

Just read Andy Dunn in the mirror saying that in 34 games so far, Moyes has never sent out an unchanged team. Seems crazy to me but it had me wondering if fergies record of chopping and changing was similar. Anybody shed some light on it for me?

tallaghtmick

A lot of this seasons disaster is the drastic decline by Rio, Vidic, and Evra compared to last year.

ShaneU

Fabio joining Cardiff http://www.bbc.com/sport/0/football/25903634

GSPfan

And Cleverly, don't forget Cleverly.

8-10

Why is left back more of a concern to fans than centre back out of interest? I understand CM being a priority but to me CB would be next on the list. But I keep seeing posts about LB instead, is Evra playing that badly ?

newballsplease

hangballlouie wrote: »

Just read Andy Dunn in the mirror saying that in 34 games so far, Moyes has never sent out an unchanged team. Seems crazy to me but it had me wondering if fergies record of chopping and changing was similar. Anybody shed some light on it for me?

Hes hardly had any choice with the injuries in fairness.
Fergie rotated alot more towards the end of career more so than back in 99 when you could predict the lineup of becks,keane,scholes,giggs,cole,yorke

RGDATA!

8-10 wrote: »

Why is left back more of a concern to fans than centre back out of interest? I understand CM being a priority but to me CB would be next on the list. But I keep seeing posts about LB instead, is Evra playing that badly ?

yes Evra is playing poorly and we don't have an adequate stand in. plus we are much better stocked at CB than LB. Vidic's form is a bit of a concern, but we have 3 others in Evans/Jones/Smalling.

KH25

Discodog wrote: »

The Sunday Times are saying that, contrary to rumours, we haven't bid for Shaw but that we are monitoring the situation. Southampton want 30m for him.

Miguel Delaney just this morning said we have indeed bid for Shaw. On twitter he replied to someone saying he assumes Southampton are considering the bid.

lordgoat

8-10 wrote: »

Why is left back more of a concern to fans than centre back out of interest? I understand CM being a priority but to me CB would be next on the list. But I keep seeing posts about LB instead, is Evra playing that badly ?

Moreso that Evra is playing poor and he's gone at the end of the season.

Plus we have Rio Vidic Evans Smalling and Jones for CB, whether you rate them or not we have numbers in this position.