Manchester United Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - 2013/14

bad2dabone

Crazy giving Rooney such power. RVP will ask for the same access no doubt. I can't believe its accurate by the press.

Whatsisname

Busy week ahead maybe?

Mark Ogden &#8207 wrote: »

Man United scouted Filipe Luis in action for Atletico against Rayo Vallecano again tonight. A move is possible the week..

The_Kew_Tour

Im very confident United will sign another player, but they're about 15 on the list.:pac:

Mitch Connor

bad2dabone wrote: »

Crazy giving Rooney such power. RVP will ask for the same access no doubt. I can't believe its accurate by the press.

What power? Really, so he knows we wanted mata and are looking at gundogan, Vidal, shaw etc... So what?

Pro. F

UnitedIrishman wrote: »

Interesting reading - looks like the Equalizer might come out with a bit of credit out of this one -

http://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2014/jan/26/chelsea-manchester-united-juan-mata-transfer

That's fascinating stuff, a genuinely exciting read. But we can't know if it's all true or just made up to sound convincing.

If it turns out Woodward has pulled this off - Mata to United and Rooney not going the other way soon - then the gist of that story will look very believable.

danthefan

GSPfan wrote: »

Not sure about living in the past, just living in a Roy of the Rovers comic strip.

Professional football is a business and players are employees. Would you expect a movie star to agree to a movie without reading the script? It's not that much of an ask to be assured of the ambition of the club before he commits to another 4 years. I'm delighted if it's true. Shows he isn't only after money after all.

Yes, this is my line of thinking. I wouldn't go work for a company who I knew was about to fold or offered very poor work conditions. I know footballers live in a different world but football is Rooney's job and he wants to win trophies clearly.

Have seen the word "disgusting" been used on this issue. There are a lot of things in the world to be disgusted at, this isn't remotely one of them.


As for RVP, he'll be about 32 or 33 when his current contract expires. Past his prime, and won't be in the same position of strength. Plus he hasn't been at the club for 10-ish years.

Headshot

GSPfan wrote: »

Not sure about living in the past, just living in a Roy of the Rovers comic strip.

Professional football is a business and players are employees. Would you expect a movie star to agree to a movie without reading the script? It's not that much of an ask to be assured of the ambition of the club before he commits to another 4 years. I'm delighted if it's true. Shows he isn't only after money after all.

A movie star without a script? Jebus GS what a load of crap that example was. Your very one dimensional in your thoughts about this. Where will the access to utd's business stop? RVP will want to know whats happening, Mata some day may want to know whats happening too. It has open a can of worms and the worse thing about it, its over a player that has cried and cried but gets indulged all the same.

MagicMarker

Rooney has seen no midfielders being bought for the last 4 years, he of all people is well aware of our problems there. I'd also be reluctant to sign a new contract if I thought that was going to continue too.

bucketybuck

UnitedIrishman wrote: »

Interesting reading - looks like the Equalizer might come out with a bit of credit out of this one -

http://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2014/jan/26/chelsea-manchester-united-juan-mata-transfer

I know it might be painted as not wanting to ever give Woodward credit, but still...

Reading that article all I could think was that it appears Chelsea were very, very eager to do a deal with United for Mata. Thats the type of situation in which a shrewd negotiator gets a player at a bargain price. You have to wonder if Woodward had actually sat and talked to Chelsea could he have driven the price down by millions?

danthefan

bucketybuck wrote: »

I know it might be painted as not wanting to ever give Woodward credit, but still...

Reading that article all I could think was that it appears Chelsea were very, very eager to do a deal with United for Mata. Thats the type of situation in which a shrewd negotiator gets a player at a bargain price. You have to wonder if Woodward had actually sat and talked to Chelsea could he have driven the price down by millions?

I think Utd did well enough considering the initial clause apparently said Mata would not be sold to Utd at all.

Blatter

Pro. F wrote: »

That's fascinating stuff, a genuinely exciting read. But we can't know if it's all true or just made up to sound convincing.

If it turns out Woodward has pulled this off - Mata to United and Rooney not going the other way soon - then the gist of that story will look very believable.

Daniel Taylor is almost always on the ball. My favorite football journalist by a mile, he definitely has excellent contacts imo.

Schwiiing

Anyone else think we should be looking at a new striker during the summer maybe? RVP is 31 now and I doubt Hernandez or Welbeck are going to become world class 30-40 a season strikers and Henriquez is only 19.

UnitedIrishman

bucketybuck wrote: »

I know it might be painted as not wanting to ever give Woodward credit, but still...

Reading that article all I could think was that it appears Chelsea were very, very eager to do a deal with United for Mata. Thats the type of situation in which a shrewd negotiator gets a player at a bargain price. You have to wonder if Woodward had actually sat and talked to Chelsea could he have driven the price down by millions?

Without sounding like I don't care about what we pay for players - was it worth taking the chance of them sitting down and the more experience Chelsea reps turning the deal on its head, and then the United reps saying 'no' and it being at a permanent standoff for the rest of the window?

Also I don't get all that caught up in what we pay for players these days. If the moneys there and we're not running up further debt, give the manager what he wants. It's about time.

GSPfan

Headshot wrote: »

A movie star without a script? Jebus GS what a load of crap that example was. Your very one dimensional in your thoughts about this. Where will the access to utd's business stop? RVP will want to know whats happening, Mata some day may want to know whats happening too. It has open a can of worms and the worse thing about it, its over a player that has cried and cried but gets indulged all the same.

Your bitterness to Rooney clouds your judgement on Rooney issues. You believe every negative bit of tat written about Rooney like it's gospel. Accept that you know F all about what goes on inside a football club and no amount of posts on an internet thread or articles in a newspaper should fool you into thinking you know better than the people who work for the club.

bucketybuck

danthefan wrote: »

I think Utd did well enough considering the initial clause apparently said Mata would not be sold to Utd at all.

In isolation I would be more than happy to pay £37million for Mata. But when he was warming the bench all season and it appears Chelsea were actively chasing United to try and sell the player, then I suspect he could have went for less.

Its a moot point anyway, and paying more than we might have had to for Mata is certainly not the same type of foul up as overpaying for Felliani.

Pro. F

Blatter wrote: »

I agree it wouldn't be ideal, but then again City are getting away with Toure and Fernandinho in the middle which is pretty light on the defensive side, especially with Silva and Nasri starting on the flanks so regularly.

Well Fernandinho and Yaya are both strong and brave in the tackle, unlike Cabaye. And even though Yaya can be lazy defensively, Fernandinho's positioning has been good enough any time I've seen him. So that isn't too bad of a balance in the middle.

They're weak defensively on the wings all right. But the whole team have been clicking so well going forward I wouldn't be surprised if defensive flaws are being masked a bit.

DM_7

Blatter wrote: »

Daniel Taylor is almost always on the ball. My favorite football journalist by a mile, he definitely has excellent contacts imo.

I don't like some of the doin he puts on things and his writing on Ravel made me dislike him.

However this story seems to line up with other reports and I would agree he gets good info. The 37.1 fee makes lots more sense now

Lord TSC

bucketybuck wrote: »

In isolation I would be more than happy to pay £37million for Mata. But when he was warming the bench all season and it appears Chelsea were actively chasing United to try and sell the player, then I suspect he could have went for less.

Personally, I think if he'd been playing, and we'd tried getting him, we'd have been talking around 50-60m minimum for him. So for me, 37m IS the knockdown price...

Headshot

GSPfan wrote: »

Your bitterness to Rooney clouds your judgement on Rooney issues. You believe every negative bit of tat written about Rooney like it's gospel. Accept that you know F all about what goes on inside a football club and no amount of posts on an internet thread or articles in a newspaper should fool you into thinking you know better than the people who work for the club.

My bitterness for Rooney is outside the pitch, on the pitch he gives it all. Your getting upset now, I can see that. Ill ask you again where will the pandering to players stop after giving Rooney access to utds business? Do you not see what this could do to the dressing room? Fergie was on the ball about this "My reply was that it was none of his business who we should have gone for. I told him it was his job to play and perform."

bucketybuck

UnitedIrishman wrote: »

was it worth taking the chance of them sitting down and the more experience Chelsea reps turning the deal on its head, and then the United reps saying 'no' and it being at a permanent standoff for the rest of the window?

But this just indicates a lack of faith in Woodward as a negotiator.

Ignoring Chelseas phone calls because he didn't want to talk about Rooney isn't really the way to do things, for all that it has seemed to work out in this case.

TheTownie

danthefan wrote: »

I think Utd did well enough considering the initial clause apparently said Mata would not be sold to Utd at all.

Utd were the only club willing to pay the amount stipulated which forced Chelsea to re-consider their initial "not Utd" stance.

DM_7

bucketybuck wrote: »

In isolation I would be more than happy to pay £37million for Mata. But when he was warming the bench all season and it appears Chelsea were actively chasing United to try and sell the player, then I suspect he could have went for less.

Its a moot point anyway, and paying more than we might have had to for Mata is certainly not the same type of foul up as overpaying for Felliani.

According to the Taylor piece Chelsea were trying to open a Rooney discussion not actively looking to sell Mata to united. United only got him because they paid the fee Abramovich agreed with Mata.

Pro. F

GSPfan wrote: »

Your bitterness to Rooney clouds your judgement on Rooney issues. You believe every negative bit of tat written about Rooney like it's gospel. Accept that you know F all about what goes on inside a football club and no amount of posts on an internet thread or articles in a newspaper should fool you into thinking you know better than the people who work for the club.

If none of us know what is happening inside the football club then you are just as wrong for arguing that it's okay for Rooney to be told about transfers as Headshot is for arguing the opposite side.

You're both arguing the case based on the agreed assumption that the story has at least some truth.

Also, if we were to abide by your "the club knows best" dictum, then there would be no point questioning any decisions that are made by the club ever. This place would have very few posts if that was how we all behaved.

Headshot

Pro. F wrote: »

If none of us know what is happening inside the football club then you are just as wrong for arguing that it's okay for Rooney to be told about transfers as Headshot is for arguing the opposite side.

You're both arguing the case based on the agreed assumption that the story has at least some truth.

Also, if we were to abide by your "the club knows best" dictum, then there is no point questioning any decisions that are made by the club ever. This place would have very few posts if that was how we all behaved.

Pro F the new voice of reason

Maximus Alexander

Schwiiing wrote: »

Anyone else think we should be looking at a new striker during the summer maybe? RVP is 31 now and I doubt Hernandez or Welbeck are going to become world class 30-40 a season strikers and Henriquez is only 19.

He's not even 30 and a half.

Headshot

Can someone who is in the okay to give Rooney and therefor other players transfer details explain to me why your okay with that? Id like to have a proper answer than F this and F that tbh

I might change my mind

GSPfan

Headshot wrote: »

Your getting upset now, I can see that.

Cringe.

That's all you've got.

Maximus Alexander

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

Do you honestly reckon you'd be prepared to waltz into a title winning club and start making changes day one on the basis of scouting reports, before getting to know the squad yourself? I don't think I would.

Check out the big brain of reason on me:

The Guardian wrote:

Özil was offered to United in the first week of the summer transfer window, but Moyes had barely seen Kagawa at that point and wanted to learn more about a player about whom Sir Alex Ferguson had left glowing reports.

Headshot

GSPfan wrote: »

Cringe.

That's all you've got.

If your not going to give me a proper answer, im done with ya tbh. I like to have a proper discussion about it than F this and F that, childish stuff tbh

NTMK

Headshot wrote: »

Can someone who is in the okay to give Rooney and therefor other players transfer details explain to me why your okay with that? Id like to have a proper answer than F this and F that tbh

I might change my mind

Same reason anyone working for any company has to know about the direction the company is taking over the next few years.

I think its perfectly fine for a player to know roughly (key word here) who the club is targeting as since football contracts are difficult to get out of and the fortunes of a club directly effect the player (call-ups, sponsors, etc)

Should the player have a say? NO unless asked

GSPfan

Pro. F wrote: »

If none of us know what is happening inside the football club then you are just as wrong for arguing that it's okay for Rooney to be told about transfers as Headshot is for arguing the opposite side.

You're both arguing the case based on the agreed assumption that the story has at least some truth.

Also, if we were to abide by your "the club knows best" dictum, then there would be no point questioning any decisions that are made by the club ever. This place would have very few posts if that was how we all behaved.

You are dead right but wrong in the facts.
Headshot is taking everything as fact and he is "Disgusted".
Whereas I don't believe the accuracy of these stories and even if they are true it doesn't seem like a big issue to me.

Oh and No the club doesn't know best but they defo know better than us.

UnitedIrishman

Headshot wrote: »

Can someone who is in the okay to give Rooney and therefor other players transfer details explain to me why your okay with that? Id like to have a proper answer than F this and F that tbh

I might change my mind

I don't think it's a case of everything being discussed with every player. In fact, prospective targets might not even be mentioned by name. But I think that it's fine for management to say whilst negotiating a contract with Rooney that they're looking to bring in 2-3 players by the end of the window in these positions if he looks for assurances about improving the squad.

Would you rather he went - 'I don't care who you bring in or how you have to budget it, I want 50k more than what you're offering' or 'are we going to improve the squad? If so I'll sign that contract.'

Lord TSC

I'm fine with Rooney being told "Here's a list of players we are after and what we are doing to get them", especially if we're about to ask him to sign a new contract tying him down, and especially if we're about to hand him the captaincy after he does so.

As captain, he's the go-between for the players and the manager, so if the manager is able to reassure him about the clubs future, he can then go and reassure the players.

Hangballlouie

No wonder Rooneys getting a rise to 300k a week, he deserves it if he's double jobbing and working as DOF also.

keith16

Headshot wrote: »

If your not going to give me a proper answer, im done with ya tbh. I like to have a proper discussion about it than F this and F that, childish stuff tbh

Rooney is probably no different to any of us on here. He is obviously eager that united get the right people playing for the club.

He is a senior squad member and I think it's good that he is displaying this kind of leadership.

No harm that he gets what looks to be reassurances about the direction the club is moving in.

Now go F on that for a while

NoviGlitzko

Teamshadowclan wrote: »

I'm fine with Rooney being told "Here's a list of players we are after and what we are doing to get them", especially if we're about to ask him to sign a new contract tying him down, and especially if we're about to hand him the captaincy after he does so.

As captain, he's the go-between for the players and the manager, so if the manager is able to reassure him about the clubs future, he can then go and reassure the players.

That's wrong in my eyes. It goes along the lines of players being bigger than the club. It might sound cliche but it just simply shouldn't happen.

GSPfan

Headshot wrote: »

If your not going to give me a proper answer, im done with ya tbh. I like to have a proper discussion about it than F this and F that, childish stuff tbh

I didn't even read the post to be honest. I've an over active cringe gland and it was set off by that line.

Lord TSC

NoviGlitzko wrote: »

That's wrong in my eyes. It goes along the lines of players being bigger than the club. It might sound cliche but it just simply shouldn't happen.

Provided it stops at "Here's the list" and doesn't progress into "Nah, this ain't good enough, I demand more!", then I don't think it's a case of being bigger than the club.

As someone said, it's likely Mata was offered similar reassurances. It's also one thing to ask a player to trust Fergie who has the background of winning stuff, but if you want players to trust Moyes, he needs to give them a reason. So asking the unproven manager to show some cards with regards his plans for the future of the club he'll now probably retire at isn't that big an issue for me.

Now the crazy wages, they worry me...

Headshot

UnitedIrishman wrote: »

I don't think it's a case of everything being discussed with every player. In fact, prospective targets might not even be mentioned by name. But I think that it's fine for management to say whilst negotiating a contract with Rooney that they're looking to bring in 2-3 players by the end of the window in these positions if he looks for assurances about improving the squad.

Would you rather he went - 'I don't care who you bring in or how you have to budget it, I want 50k more than what you're offering' or 'are we going to improve the squad? If so I'll sign that contract.'

He is getting 50k or more now thou lol

If you believe Fergie he never gave players a hint of anything they were doing in the background. Why change now? We are one of the biggest clubs in the world of course we are going to go for top players, why give Rooney assurances? I dont mind of a manager says during contract renewal that they hope to strengthen the team but I disagree with how Rooney had such insight into the Mata transfer. Its probably bs about how much insight he has thou

I dont particularly like how utd are shown to be this weak over a player tbh. No doubting he's a fantastic player but to go out of the way to please him, I dont particularly like.

Pro. F

GSPfan wrote: »

You are dead right but wrong in the facts.
Headshot is taking everything as fact and he is "Disgusted".
Whereas I don't believe the accuracy of these stories and even if they are true it doesn't seem like a big issue to me.

If he is taking the story as fact then I think he is wrong to do that.

If he is saying he's disgusted by the idea of pandering to Rooney, then that is perfectly understandable. I'm not bothered by the idea, but it makes sense that some people think that way about the whole Rooney situation. Rooney has done a lot of crazy shít over the last few years.

GSPfan wrote: »

Oh and No the club doesn't know best but they defo know better than us.

If we were to follow that reasoning there would be very little to talk about on here. I think that you are the type to not express too many opinions on what you think the club should do (just going on the impression I get), but the majority of regular posters on here are happy to give their opinions on those topics. So you're in the wrong place to be making that argument.

Lord TSC

Headshot wrote: »

If you believe Fergie he never gave players a hint of anything they were doing in the background. Why change now?

Cause Moyes =/= Fergie, and won't get the same benefit of trust as him.

Headshot

Pro. F wrote: »

If he is taking the story as fact then I think he is wrong to do that.

If he is saying he's disgusted by the idea of pandering to Rooney, then that is perfectly understandable. I'm not bothered by the idea, but it makes sense that some people think that way about the whole Rooney situation. Rooney has done a lot of crazy shít over the last few years.



If we were to follow that reasoning there would be very little to talk about on here. I think that you are the type to not express too many opinions on what you think the club should do (just going on the impression I get), but the majority of regular posters on here are happy to give their opinions on those topics. So you're in the wrong place to be making that argument.

That one.

Teamshadowclan wrote: »

Cause Moyes =/= Fergie, and won't get the same benefit of trust as him.

Do you not think the club over rules that?

Devil08

Andow made debut, few pics

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2546444/Manchester-United-flop-Anderson-makes-Fiorentina-debut-Alberto-Aquilani-nets-hat-trick-thrilling-draw-against-Genoa.html

Blatter

If the reports are correct and Rooney is going to get 300k/week then I think most logical people would agree that he's not worth that.

However if Moyes is absolutely desperate to keep him (which is almost certainly the case) and with the club being in a very strong financial position, if that's the amount they feel is needed to tie him down to the club long term, then it is an understandable decision.

Lord TSC

Headshot wrote: »

Do you not think the club over rules that?

I am not a blind-faith sort of guy, and it's not my career and legacy I man trying to forge. If Moyes is manager, then Rooney needs to trust Moyes and his ability.

GSPfan

Pro. F wrote: »

If he is taking the story as fact then I think he is wrong to do that.

If he is saying he's disgusted by the idea of pandering to Rooney, then that is perfectly understandable. I'm not bothered by the idea, but it makes sense that some people think that way about the whole Rooney situation. Rooney has done a lot of crazy shít over the last few years.



If we were to follow that reasoning there would be very little to talk about on here. I think that you are the type to not express too many opinions on what you think the club should do (just going on the impression I get), but the majority of regular posters on here are happy to give their opinions on those topics. So you're in the wrong place to be making that argument.

Yeah that's fair.
I check this place everyday to read everyones opinions. I love it (for the most part). I just don't get wrapped up in the whole idolisation of players and managers in general. Therefore that aspect goes over my head. I don't get disgusted by the inner workings of a billion dollar company or it's millionaire employees.
To be honest we all call ourselves supporters but we are also in reality customers, and all i really care about is the product I pay for. What's most important for me is to be entertained when I sit down once or twice a week to watch the team I've followed since I was a kid to distract me from work and whatever. I've enough worries in life without adding what Wayne Rooney is doing to the list.

But I don't judge others for being a different way, I just don't understand it.

Headshot

On another topic weren't we fair lucky to miss our on Rodwell. Taken off at HT

GSPfan

Also another topic before I go to bed,

What is Filipe Luis like? Left back for Athletico Madrid and another name that pops up as a target for United.

Headshot

Would be a super buy. Not in a the oh my god Shaw level but a super buy. Only down side his age.

Pro. F

I'd be wary of any player coming from Athletico these days. They look like a team juiced up to the gills.

Headshot wrote: »

On another topic weren't we fair lucky to miss our on Rodwell. Taken off at HT

He looked like a good player to me, but his injuries were always too much. His career was over once he went to City imo.