Manchester United Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - 2013/14

kryogen

kstand wrote: »

I'd have Adam Johnson before either Young or Valencia right now - no question. He has been top drawer for Sunderlland in recent weeks. Unlike the two wingers we had at Chelsea on Sunday.

Played a couple of good games has he?

Thats the bar now is it?

May aswell keep what we have so, they have all played a couple of good games here and there

Do you honestly rate Johnson that highly?

If you tell me you havent particularly watched him over the last 4 years or so Ill respect that, but if you try to tell me he is top drawer after following his career lately (his attitude problems, his fitness problems his massive inconsistency problems) Ill lose all interest in reasoned debate about it.

magnumbud

bullvine wrote: »

United be better to let Rooney go on a free, he'll be nearly 30 by the time his contract runs out.

hey we can say we could be more open to dealing with them in the summer if they sell us him now but then not actually sell to them :pac:

TheDoc

Mitch Connor wrote: »

They improve United, a side that won't win the league from them, a side they don't have to play again, a side that DOES have to play City, Arsenal and Liverpool.

This immediately sprung to mind with me aswell to be fair. Although are football clubs as clever as we are?

Mitch Connor

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

When did Moyes come out and say this?

'IF IT ISN'T QUOTED ON THE OFFICIAL SITE IT DIDN'T HAPPEN LALALALALALALALALALALALALALLALALALA'.

v3ttel

only1stevo wrote: »

Unless Mourinho has designs on getting the United job if Moyes is let go WE AREN't SIGNING MATA!!!!!

Mourinho, possibly letting a player who can't get into his current side, is a sign that he wants the United job if Moyes is sacked?

Ah here. You're not even trying to make sense.

Mitch Connor

TheDoc wrote: »

This immediately sprung to mind with me aswell to be fair. Although are football clubs as clever as we are?

Maybe not with sales - but I would argue it is certainly a consideration when loaning players.

bullvine

magnumbud wrote: »

hey we can say we could be more open to dealing with them in the summer if they sell us him now but then not actually sell to them :pac:

Think about this though, if United dig their heels in and refuse to sell, meaning he has to wait till hes almost 30 to sign for Chelsea. Chelsea may have lost interest in him by then. No way they are gonna wait till then for a striker, I wouldnt be surprised to see them bid for Suarez in the summer instead.

TheDoc

supersean1999 wrote: »

11 days left . Start checking The supermarkets for cheap booze iv a feeling We will need a lot to sleep after listening to Jim white for a Few hours on deadline day. And prob end up With a lb at most .

Most activity comes through January last few days in fairness. So I would have been happily suprised if anything happened faster. Players put their final pushes through, clubs feel the financial strain etc etc etc etc

there is a lot more last minute in January then the summer, where a good pre-season isn't essential, and there is already guys with half a season under their belt.

max life

I would love us to sign Mata but I really cant see Chelsea selling him to us.

Backstreet Moyes

JRant wrote: »

Well we can't use what we already have. If i was Mata i'd steer well clear.

Can you not question an opinion without childish jibes like "I would question anybody who say's that if they are a United fan".

Their is a big difference saying Mata should stay well clear and that as a United fan you don't want him signed.

I think the childish statement here is from a supposed United fan who doesn't want the best players at the club. I don't think my statement is childish i think it's a fact.

Maximus Alexander

Mitch Connor wrote: »

'IF IT ISN'T QUOTED ON THE OFFICIAL SITE IT DIDN'T HAPPEN LALALALALALALALALALALALALALLALALALA'.

I read on twitter that Moyes is afraid to drop Valencia because he threatened to have his daughter killed. Must be true.

Mitch Connor

Find it funny people (mostly on twitter) saying Mata isn't the answer to United's problems.

It is such an irritatingly obvious statement.

No, he isn't the answer to our problems.

So, go oh fantastic ones - find me that combative creative holding attacking central midfield left back winger. We should sign THAT guy.

kstand

kryogen wrote: »

Played a couple of good games has he?

Thats the bar now is it?

May aswell keep what we have so, they have all played a couple of good games here and there

Do you honestly rate Johnson that highly?

If you tell me you havent particularly watched him over the last 4 years or so Ill respect that, but if you try to tell me he is top drawer after following his career lately (his attitude problems, his fitness problems his massive inconsistency problems) Ill lose all interest in reasoned debate about it.

He has spent 3 years at City where he struggled at times to get into the first team, but he has been excellent for Sunderland and has been their best players by a mile recently. There arent many good wingers in England - he went to Sunderland for 10m whereas we got Zaha who was unproven at EPL level for 15m. Now its early days for Zaha I know but who got the better deal there so far?

Mitch Connor

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

I read on twitter that Moyes is afraid to drop Valencia because he threatened to have his daughter killed. Must be true.

Yeah, that is SOOOO the same thing.

kryogen

kstand wrote: »

He has spent 3 years at City where he struggled at times to get into the first team, but he has been excellent for Sunderland and has been their best players by a mile recently. There arent many good wingers in England - he went to Sunderland for 10m whereas we got Zaha who was unproven at EPL level for 15m. Now its early days for Zaha I know but who got the better deal there so far?

No, he has "recently" got back into the Sunderland team, a **** team, standing out in a couple of games in a **** team is nothing to write home about.

United did not pay 15 million up front for Zaha
United are more then likely not paying Zaha as much as Johnson gets paid

He has not been excellent for Sunderland, as I said, if you had just said you didnt really pay attention to him till the game against us I could respect that, you wont so I have no interest in this.

Long story short Adam Johnson is not good enough for this club and never will be.

Could have been at one point but his attitude ended that a long time ago. He is now a 26 year old who is beginning to make his way down the league

JRant

kryogen wrote: »

Played a couple of good games has he?

Thats the bar now is it?

May aswell keep what we have so, they have all played a couple of good games here and there

Do you honestly rate Johnson that highly?

If you tell me you havent particularly watched him over the last 4 years or so Ill respect that, but if you try to tell me he is top drawer after following his career lately (his attitude problems, his fitness problems his massive inconsistency problems) Ill lose all interest in reasoned debate about it.

Johnson made a terrible career move joining City when he did. He had bags of potential but unfortunately for him was sidelined for much of his time there and that really hurt his development.

Giggsy11

Adam Johnson? While we are at it we should tie up deal for Cattermole too and maybe bring back Brown and O'Shea.

Nalz

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

I read on twitter that Moyes is afraid to drop Valencia because he threatened to have his daughter killed. Must be true.

Holy cow I heard this too off a guy I know. Also its been reported we're chasing the signiture of Terry Wogan to work for MUTV

Maximus Alexander

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Yeah, that is SOOOO the same thing.

It's exactly the same thing . Unsubstantiated natter from randomers, equivalent to pub talk, which should never be mistaken for fact.

Maximus Alexander

Trilla wrote: »

Holy cow I heard this too off a guy I know. Also its been reported we're chasing the signiture of Terry Wogan to work for MUTV

Sure they'll both be trending any minute now!

Mitch Connor

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

It's exactly the same thing . Unsubstantiated natter from randomers, equivalent to pub talk, which should never be mistaken for fact.

In your opinion, that is what it is. In my opinion it is natter from journalists, whom I trust.

United and City rejected Ozil.
United negotiated for Ronaldo and Bale.
United had a contract agreed with Fabregas.
Rooney had a contract agreed with Chelsea.

Would bet my life on all being true.

Nalz

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Would bet my life on all being true.

Like fúck you would

JRant

Nuts102 wrote: »

Their is a big difference saying Mata should stay well clear and that as a United fan you don't want him signed.

I think the childish statement here is from a supposed United fan who doesn't want the best players at the club. I don't think my statement is childish i think it's a fact.

My apologies then, I hadn't realised I was dealing with the foremost authority on who is or isn't a Utd fan!

NaiveMelodies

v3ttel wrote: »

Mourinho, possibly letting a player who can't get into his current side, is a sign that he wants the United job if Moyes is sacked?

Ah here. You're not even trying to make sense.

I don't want to make sense, I've lost all reason and hope.

keane2097

If you're arguing from the point of view that any two unproven claims have equal probability of being true you should take yourself aside.

Maximus Alexander

Mitch Connor wrote: »

In your opinion, that is what it is. In my opinion it is natter from journalists, whom I trust.

United and City rejected Ozil.
United negotiated for Ronaldo and Bale.
United had a contract agreed with Fabregas.
Rooney had a contract agreed with Chelsea.

Would bet my life on all being true.

It's a good thing for you then that nobody can prove a negative. I could just as easily be my life on Valencia threatening murder and nobody will ever be able to prove I was wrong. It's a safe bet.

Sure were United not so close to signing someone the other day that Moyes was able to take time out for a bikini wax and a pina colada, so confident he was that the deal was done? What ever happened to that?

kstand

kryogen wrote: »

No, he has "recently" got back into the Sunderland team, a **** team, standing out in a couple of games in a **** team is nothing to write home about.

United did not pay 15 million up front for Zaha
United are more then likely not paying Zaha as much as Johnson gets paid

He has not been excellent for Sunderland, as I said, if you had just said you didnt really pay attention to him till the game against us I could respect that, you wont so I have no interest in this.

Long story short Adam Johnson is not good enough for this club and never will be.

Could have been at one point but his attitude ended that a long time ago. He is now a 26 year old who is beginning to make his way down the league

It seems that under Poyet he has really flourished - a lot of the players under-performed under that lunatic Di Canio. Will admit that I only really took notice of him when he came on against us - and since then. And I always thought he had something over the years but made the wrong decision the day he joined City.

Hank Scorpio

Jose angling for a swap deal with Rooney? Can't see it happening till the summer

Mitch Connor

Trilla wrote: »

Like fúck you would

Yeah, I would.

If you could sit Woodward, Rooney and Fabregas down and get them to be 100% truthful, I am 100% certain they would say that is right.

Mitch Connor

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

Sure were United not so close to signing someone the other day that Moyes was able to take time out for a bikini wax and a pina colada, so confident he was that the deal was done? What ever happened to that?

What in the name of feck are you talking about here?

Nalz

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Yeah, I would.

If you could sit Woodward, Rooney and Fabregas down and get them to be 100% truthful, I am 100% certain they would say that is right.

Bordering on being deluded tbf.

Who are these journalists you trust their word with your life and have they ever got anything wrong or lied?

lordgoat

Giggsy11 wrote: »

http://www.101greatgoals.com/blog/does-a-handshake-mata-chelseas-abramovich-shook-hands-with-fergie-gill-woodward-after-the-man-united-game/


Fergie, Gill and Woodward met Roman after the Chelsea game. So much reading between the lines?

There is nothing in this. They were on the way to Jose's big dinner gala thing is all.

shadowcomplex wrote: »

If we had better players to play the wingback role like Baines and Coleman, our first choice 11 with everyone fit wouldn't be that bad, I don't rate Rafael and Evra is gone past it, also couldnt Mata play centrally in a 3 man midfield

---

Dea Gea

---

Coleman

---

Vidic

---

Jones/evans

---

Baines

---

Carrick

---

---

Mata

---

Fellaini

---

---

Kagawa

---

---

Rooney

---

Rvp

---

Still can't spell players names properly. Players in the wrong position. More FM crap.

keane2097 wrote: »

If you're arguing from the point of view that any two unproven claims have equal probability of being true you should take yourself aside.

+1

Mitch Connor

Trilla wrote: »

Bordering on being deluded tbf.

Who are these journalists you trust their word with your life and have they ever got anything wrong or lied?

So your base is that if the club don't say it, it isn't true. And anything a journo says that the club don't officially back, its a lie.

Fine.

Not going to name the journos, cause it isn't my place to.

I'm not going off some random twitter account, I am going off people I trust.

I simply think it is deluded to take a default position that something didn't happen because the club didn't confirm it.

Would be like saying Rooney didn't want to sign for Chelsea and United were never in for Thiago. at the end of the day there is no direct quote from Rooney and Moyes never said we were in for Thiago, so all the Thiago and Rooney stories must have been lies.

kryogen

kstand wrote: »

It seems that under Poyet he has really flourished - a lot of the players under-performed under that lunatic Di Canio. Will admit that I only really took notice of him when he came on against us - and since then. And I always thought he had something over the years but made the wrong decision the day he joined City.

He did, he had some fantastic potential when he was younger, a combination of bad decisions and poor attitude have stopped him from ever becoming the player I thought he could have been.

He couldnt get a game at City, the reasons were well publicised, he was brought to Sunderland by Martin O Neill, I thought it could be a good move for both parties but he was poor for him too after a good initial spell, poor for Di Canio and until the last couple of weeks has never looked like a player to be relied upon. This could be his good spell under Poyet and he will revert to type soon! I would bet money on that actually. Possibly a worse Stewart Downing?

He isnt much of a goal threat either despite his recent spree

240appearances and less then 40 goals

10 in 54 in the league for Sunderland
11 in 73 for City

He wouldnt add the goals we lack from midfield, he doesnt have the fitness to get up and down the field properly for 90 minutes, he doesnt have the work ethic to put in a good shift defensively.

Look, thankfully he will never now be a realistic target for United so I suppose there is no point going too deep into this either. He is in good form the last couple of games, I expect him to dip again in the extreme near future, if he maintains his good form he could earn himself a seat on the place to Brazil, Hodgson has a thing for average players but tbf, not like England are overlowing with quality wingers

Giggsy11

lordgoat wrote: »

There is nothing in this. They were on the way to Jose's big dinner gala thing is all.

I thought it was a non story, just a slightest of hope as usual in transfer window.

Maximus Alexander

keane2097 wrote: »

If you're arguing from the point of view that any two unproven claims have equal probability of being true you should take yourself aside.

We're not talking about claims like "I saw a green Audi on the way to work this morning" vs "I was abducted by aliens on the way to work this morning". Clearly one of those is more likely to be true than the other.

We are talking about stringing together random claims by people who make a living (or are trying to do so) by drawing clicks to their 'stories', along with hearsay, to produce tripe like:

bullvine wrote: »

So we turned down the chance to sign Ozil

bullvine wrote: »

because hes not what United need

bullvine wrote: »

but we try and sign Mata? Madness..

Three unsubstantiated claims mashed together and presented as fact. If you don't see something wrong with that I'd be quite surprised at you.

Giggsy11

kryogen wrote: »

He did, he had some fantastic potential when he was younger, a combination of bad decisions and poor attitude have stopped him from ever becoming the player I thought he could have been.

I for one wanted him signed from Middlesbrough, always impressed me and I thought he will become one of the best wingers in the league. I wanted him as Giggs' replacement.

Now I'm glad that we didn't sign him but it was risk worth tacking at that time. Just 7 Million.

lordgoat

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

We're not talking about claims like "I saw a green Audi on the way to work this morning" vs "I was abducted by aliens on the way to work this morning". Clearly one of those is more likely to be true than the other.

We are talking about stringing together random claims by people who make a living (or are trying to do so) by drawing clicks to their 'stories', along with hearsay, to produce tripe like:





Three unsubstantiated claims mashed together and presented as fact. If you don't see something wrong with that I'd be quite surprised at you.

I find it hilarious when people don't understand how the press/media work.

Nalz

Mitch Connor wrote: »

So your base is that if the club don't say it, it isn't true. And anything a journo says that the club don't officially back, its a lie.

No, I'm simply saying if its a journalist or a collection of them you're constantly quoting and putting 100% belief in, betting you're life on then well.... quite frankly you shouldn't!

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Not going to name the journos, cause it isn't my place to

Why not? Name names come on Have you the inside track Mitch Connor? If not then at least let us know some sort of connection you have, or as to why you know, trust and believe these people 100%. Give us something!

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Would be like saying Rooney didn't want to sign for Chelsea and United were never in for Thiago. at the end of the day there is no direct quote from Rooney and Moyes never said we were in for Thiago, so all the Thiago and Rooney stories must have been lies.

Again I'm not saying because the club didn't say it it mustn't be true... but why should we take one sources word over the other these days? If the background of your link\knowledge\trust to these people is apparent in here then apologies. I for one don't know it. I see you post a lot, mostly good stuff (except when you said you wouldn't blab on about Moyes and Woowars failings - a few posts later you did ) you put in great effort with that team of the month list and your passion for the club is undeniable,... What I would like to question is why should we believe and\or enter conversation regarding transfer rumours etc safe in the knowledge that what you say is true all the time? It would be great if that was the case!

Maximus Alexander

lordgoat wrote: »

I find it hilarious when people don't understand how the press/media work.

That makes two of us.

bucketybuck

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

I read on twitter that Moyes is afraid to drop Valencia because he threatened to have his daughter killed. Must be true.

Well, it's about the only thing that could explain his guaranteed place in the side...

Pudsy33

As good as Mata is, he plays in the position we are best stocked in. If he came in he'd be out on the wing like Kagawa. He'd be infinitely more effective there then Shinji mind, but still a waste.

Cypher_sounds

Mitch Connor wrote: »

In your opinion, that is what it is. In my opinion it is natter from journalists, whom I trust.

United and City rejected Ozil.
United negotiated for Ronaldo and Bale.
United had a contract agreed with Fabregas.
Rooney had a contract agreed with Chelsea.

Would bet my life on all being true.

Why hasn't the journalist wrote about these in an article? If he has show me the article:)

keane2097

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

We're not talking about claims like "I saw a green Audi on the way to work this morning" vs "I was abducted by aliens on the way to work this morning". Clearly one of those is more likely to be true than the other.

We are talking about stringing together random claims by people who make a living (or are trying to do so) by drawing clicks to their 'stories', along with hearsay, to produce tripe like:

Three unsubstantiated claims mashed together and presented as fact. If you don't see something wrong with that I'd be quite surprised at you.

Going from "United turned down the chance to sign Ozil in the summer" to "Valencia threatened to kill Moyes' daughter" is pretty close to as ridiculous as the Audi/aliens thing. It's a very annoying way to argue the toss on which/whether stories in the press are likely to be true.

It's obvious that stuff that appears in the newspaper is unproven.

If you don't think United had the chance to sign Ozil, then grand, but IMO if you want to argue the toss on the matter, address it and say why. Don't just blather on about Valencia shooting Moyes' daughter, he would probably miss anyway.

Something like the Ozil thing, which appears to be accepted universally, is a pretty safe one to accept as likely, and even if you don't frothing out a stupid fake twitter rumour and carrying on like both things are equally likely is an annoying, unenlightening and intellectually dishonest way of avoiding actually debunking the post you don't agree with.

Rayne Wooney

Imagine Moyes bought Mata and tried to play him as a winger...

Surely signing him would mean a complete change in the philosophy, it would give all the players a massive boost as well.

I wonder if Fergie asking about Cavani means Chelsea will get first refusal of Rooney in the summer?

supersean1999

TheDoc wrote: »

Most activity comes through January last few days in fairness. So I would have been happily suprised if anything happened faster. Players put their final pushes through, clubs feel the financial strain etc etc etc etc

there is a lot more last minute in January then the summer, where a good pre-season isn't essential, and there is already guys with half a season under their belt.

Exactly Why im saying to get the beers Ready. it will be a scramble again

lordgoat

keane2097 wrote: »

Going from "United turned down the chance to sign Ozil in the summer" to "Valencia threatened to kill Moyes' daughter" is pretty close to as ridiculous as the Audi/aliens thing. It's a very annoying way to argue the toss on which/whether stories in the press are likely to be true.

It's obvious that stuff that appears in the newspaper is unproven.

If you don't think United had the chance to sign Ozil, then grand, but IMO if you want to argue the toss on the matter, address it and say why. Don't just blather on about Valencia shooting Moyes' daughter, he would probably miss anyway.

Something like the Ozil thing, which appears to be accepted universally, is a pretty safe one to accept as likely, and even if you don't frothing out a stupid fake twitter rumour and carrying on like both things are equally likely is an annoying, unenlightening and intellectually dishonest way of avoiding actually debunking the post you don't agree with.

This is a cracking post. +1 on all the above i would not have said it as diplomatically.

Kerrydude1981

So with SSN saying that Chelsea are willing to listen to offers for Mata,if thats the case that will surely attract more interest in him.

It will be interesting to see how much Utd offer if they do make a bid for him

Chelsea want 37m so that means Utd will probably offer 27m and then watch on as PSG or some other club gives Chelsea the money they want.

wonderfullife

DeanAustin wrote: »

Not agreeing or disagreeing with your post but is anyone else getting fed up of the game being analysed to within an inch of its life in terms of stats? It's gotten much worse over the last couple of seasons, it really has.

For example:
His passing accuracy in 2012/2013 was excellent 89.7% completion. Then again this wasn't even the highest at the club and Tom Cleverley had a 90.2% completion rate..... enuf said on that....

How is that enuf said? Does that mean Cleverley is a better passer? Lets say Cleverley drops deep and collects the ball and then lays simple passes off to his defenders rather than trying anything. Does that make him a better passer than Kagawa who could be trying more adventurous passes?

Football isn't simply a mathematical equation. There are too many moving parts and while stats like this can be valuable, they do not tell the full story and they rarely prove a point conclusively.

That was my point!!

Whilst it looked like a good pass completion rate, that statistic alone is undermined by the fact Cleverley had a better one. Which shows the pass completion stats alone are useless as all you have to do is pass it sideways and backwards to have a high stat.

The more relevant stat of chance creation was very poor.

Anyway it's like talking to the wall in here when it comes to Kagawa. Never have i seen such misguided love, defence and loyalty when it comes to an underperforming player.

99%* of fans of other clubs all think he's been poor for UNITED. Most agree he was fantastic for Dortmund.

*made up stat.

magnumbud

Pudsy33 wrote: »

As good as Mata is, he plays in the position we are best stocked in. If he came in he'd be out on the wing like Kagawa. He'd be infinitely more effective there then Shinji mind, but still a waste.

mata and waste dont belong in the same sentance