Irish Adventure Racing

Peterx

Just taking a quote from the Killarney thread to start and not drag that thread off topic;
from Enduro;
"And just to follow up, try googling for Adventure Racing and looking at what you see from outside Ireland. Even the wikipedia entry should give an insight into what AR actually is.

The Killarney race is just a small multi-sports race. All these messy races are just trying to follow the commercial success of Gael Force, which was the original in this country. But funnily enough Geal Force was originally two races, GF6 and GF12. Gael Force 12 was a proper adventure race. Gael force 6 was.... well to quote the organisers...

" ‘Gaelforce 6’ will be for the novice racer or ‘armchair adventurer’ and will be completed over a six-hour course involving mountain biking, trekking and kayaking."

(You can see the original press article here. GF6 became hugely popular, presumably because it was so easy to do in comparison the the GF12 adventure race, to the extent that it took over the name."

GF12 wasn't even a proper AR in that it consisted of four 12 hour stages, enabling competitors to get mandatory rest/sleep periods. The organisers actually expected the first finishers in GF6 to take 6 hours, GF12 was the big Daddy in terms of energy and thought in the first two years but still failed to attract entrants.
The marketing failure and subsequent overall failure of GF12 in the Irish market/context is a salutary lesson that has been well learned by the organisers of most Irish races.
Greg Clarke's race in Fermanagh also brought the requirements for a good one day race into sharp focus. It was simply too hard.

(1)
The successful races (WAR, GF, ROAR and so on) have shown that people want their adventure in manageable chunks and appreciate being able to go back to their accommodation for a shower and a few pints afterwards.
(2)
Irish people want the freedom of racing on their own, teams of four are hard to organise. Teams of four with a woman are very hard to organise.
(3)
Actual hardship is not attracting people.
(4)
People don't want to swim or navigate.

You need one of two things to have a successful AR event in Ireland;

(1) Proximity to Dublin. ie: Wicklow
(2) Iconic West coast location with Local tourism support

Oryx

Do you think its fair that they carry the title Adventure Race?

Peterx

Oryx wrote: »

Do you think its fair that they carry the title Adventure Race?

Yes.

It's a free country and they have successfully managed to promote themselves as Irish Adventure Racing. All capital letters..

It is the fault of the longer adventure races that they did not ringfence their brandname or manage to be associated with the term adventure racing, as Ironman have managed to do with their version of their sport.

But really for me I just don't see the point in the constant struggle to belittle the one day races, probably as I do enjoy them so much in fairness.

I have sympathy for Enduro's crusade to promote his version of adventure racing. I have no sympathy for his regular hijacking of one day adventure race threads in order to belittle them.

People vote with their wallet and their feet.

stevire

Oryx wrote: »

Do you think its fair that they carry the title Adventure Race?

I think it's unfair to strip them of that title, plenty of races in NZ are carrying the Adventure Race title for the same solo events we have here.

Here's one as an example:
http://www.stjamesmountainsports.co.nz/

From Wikipedia:

Adventure racing (also called expedition racing) is a combination of two or more endurance disciplines, including orienteering (if an orienteering map is used) and/or navigation (when non-orienteering maps are used), cross-country running, mountain biking, paddling and climbing and related rope skills. An expedition event can span ten days or more while sprints can be completed in a matter of hours

Going by the above definition, "two or more endurance disciplines" and "can be completed in a matter of hours" it's fair to say that Adventure Race is a perfectly acceptable title.

I don't get why people on this forum have an elitist attitude towards AR in Ireland. The majority of them are popular, well organised and challenging races. Why not embrace the fact that there is a demand for them in this country, sign of better health in our nation and we have the facilities and countryside to host such events.

Oryx

I come at this as someone who also enjoys Irish Adventure Racing. They are good races, they can be more challenging in ways than tri.

The issues people have with these races, as I see it, are the very same issues they have with every other type of race: that 'box tickers' do a mini 'marathon', a try-a-tri, or 'Irish Adventure Racing' without understanding that doing a short race slowly is NOT the same as a longer race or doing the same race 30% faster.

I hold my hand up and say I am as guilty as anyone of grinding my teeth in fury when someone says 'Oh a marathon, I did one of those, the womens one.... I walked it with my mammy.....'

Should we care and get irked about box tickers? Well, yes, tbh. Not because I'm against inclusivity. People don't always start off fast, racing at the top of the pack, and everyone needs to start somewhere. (God knows I did). Why we should care is because of the dumbing down of these events. Mud runs and fun runs are getting shorter and easier to appeal to a mass audience. And people are going away with their medal, dead chuffed at their achievement, without having been really challenged at all. We should care because its too easy.

stevire

Oryx wrote: »

I hold my hand up and say I am as guilty as anyone of grinding my teeth in fury when someone says 'Oh a marathon, I did one of those, the womens one.... I walked it with my mammy.....'

Oryx wrote: »

And people are going away with their medal, dead chuffed at their achievement, without having been really challenged at all. We should care because its too easy.

Why can't you be happy for them? I have friends, parents, relations that you have boxed into the above category, I'm sure we all do. Not for one second do I say to them that was a mickey mouse race you should try this one that I did last year. What's easy for one person is not easy for the next, if it becomes easy then it sounds like you are competitor that consitently finishes at the top of the field in such races. In which case the only person you need to look at is yourself for a better challenge.

Oryx

stevire wrote: »

Why can't you be happy for them? I have friends, parents, relations that you have boxed into the above category, I'm sure we all do. Not for one second do I say to them that was a mickey mouse race you should try this one that I did last year. What's easy for one person is not easy for the next, if it becomes easy then it sounds like you are competitor that consitently finishes at the top of the field in such races. In which case the only person you need to look at is yourself for a better challenge.

I was happy when I finished my first IAR race (6th from last) and I am happy for anyone who does their best. But thats the thing, and the point Im trying to make, instead of competitors stepping up to the mark, the mark is being lowered to cater to those who don't really see training for something as part of the procedure, but theyre a great cash cow!

Fianna Fowl

5 a side soccer is not soccer, tag rugby bears no relation to rugby......does Paul O'Connell or Robbie Keane loose sleep over this.....eh no

MrCreosote

It's splitting hairs really what they're called. The best term would be "multisport race" I suppose, but does it really matter?

woody1

what their called obviously matters to the organisers from a promotional point of view..doesnt matter to the participants at all.. i couldnt care less what you called them.. i enjoy them,
whilst enduro is promoting his type of racing..( and i have serious admiration for the guys that do the multi day events , and i have an interest in the races and try to watch them when their shown on the net or tv) the multi day big event is not practical for me ( and i assume a lot of people ) , i get it hard enough to get a half a day or a day free to do the local tri or small adventure race without trying to get 2 or 3 days free to do a multi day event, added to that most are abroad ( excepting one or two i think ), which again makes them impractical for many ..

i just dont think theres the level of interest in muti day racing in this country for it to be successful at the same level as the smaller races are,

and i dont think theres a need to run down one type of race to promote another..

MrCreosote

It's ridiculous as well to suggest the organisers are tricking people into entering an event they weren't expecting.

Are we seriously to believe people will organise a team of 4, all the gear and plan for a 4-5 day race, only to be shocked when they rock up and realise it's "only" a one day multisport race? Daft.

People know what they're entering, regardless of what it's called.

Oryx

I'm not running down these races. The full versions of any of them are challenging! Those who do compete in the 'proper' ARs most likely do get irritated that these shorter versions carry the same name, and kudos, in the eyes of lay people. Much the same as I get irritated by anyone who equates a mini marathon with 26.2 miles Its not the end of the world, but a niggle all the same.

The bigger point that I see here is that these races (with even shorter cut down versions within the main race) are getting ever easier. Same as the try-a-tris, mini marathons and now even 1 mile fun races. And that is the crux of the matter for me, and what makes me take sides on this. (This is a purely personal viewpoint and Im not trying to insult anyones relatives here!) People are soft. They seem to be getting softer, moving from couch to desk and back again. To do a little short tri or 3 stage AR is a massive achievement for many, and to be fair, is a big leap from a sedentary lifestyle. Except it shouldnt be a massive achievement. It should be, at most, the first step in moving on to even better things. But because of how these things are seen, too many people are happy to do the minimum to get around, chalk it up to experience, and go back to flubber again. It irritates me because people are capable of so much more, but they wont reach for it.

I have a relative who went from very unfit to try a tri in a short space of time as a personal challenge and to improve their health because of a health scare. They overcame their limits and fears and did the race, and god was I proud of them. Except that was it. They haven't trained since, not even once. That I think is terrible. I wonder had they been encouraged to train for a longer race, if the lifestyle change might have had more impact and stuck with them. Now, maybe they wouldn't have taken it on at all, but honestly, looking at that one situation, I think what they did was too achievable, and didn't change them enough to make a difference. It was the crash diet version of racing, and it didn't work.

Im not elitist, partly because I am not part of the elite, I just hate seeing people sell themselves short, I suppose.

nerraw1111

Language changes. Bit like the Ironman in Australia. Except everyone now associates Ironman with a rich hedge fund company.

For the vast majority of people in Ireland, adventure racing means Gaelforce, Roar, WAR etc.

It’s fantastic that a small niche sport, Irish adventure racing, has taken off in Ireland, showcasing the country’s wonderful landscape. I don’t care what they’re called but it’s a decent description.

The mark is not “being lowered to cater to those who don't really see training for something as part of the procedure.”

It’s simply a case of putting on a single day event rather than a multi-day event. That’s it. Same way some people have
no desire to run a marathon/Ironman but are happy to compete in 10km and Olympic distances.

“It should be, at most, the first step in moving on to even better things.” This is the marathon/Ironman argument in reverse. If you can’t go fast go long etc. Why must it be the first step?

It's not dumbing down events, they're just different. Same way an Olmypic tri isn't the dumb down version of an Ironman.

Here we have superb well organised races, taking in the best of what Ireland has to offer, and we’re caught up on how they are described. It’s mad Ted.

Separately, I don't understand why people are bothered by box tickers. Who cares?

dapope

Boom, Enduro drops the AR bomb again.

PeterX's list and woody1 have outlined many of the problems with Adventure Races. These problems and the challenges faced when entering the sport of Adventure Racing highlight some of the major differences between Multi Sport Races (WAR, GF, ROAR etc.) and Adventure Races (Beat of Ballyhoura, The Cooley Raid, CCAR etc).

Both forms of racing have a large cross over in terms of discipline. Beyond this I don't think you can compare the two forms of racing. Each has its own rewards. Adventure Racing has significantly more barriers to entry. If you find you like Adventure Races it can take a long time to overcome these barriers but its a pretty rewarding and fun process if that's your thing. Sacrifices will be made along the way for sure. It is what it is and I wouldn't like to see changes made to the Adventure Race format or the skills required simply to attract a larger audience. As a result I think we're a long way from seeing a commercially successful Adventure Race. I think the larger Adventure Races have been successful indirectly attracting tourism. It is common to see these races backed by a country or regional tourism body... unfortunately an epic fail of ours in the past.

Multi Sport events carrying the title "Adventure Race" has probably had a negative impact on Adventure Racing in so far that it has generated a lot of confusion. This may or may not have been the intention of the event organiser. The confusion is a source of frustration for many who are passionate about their sport be it Multi Sport Racing or Adventure Racing.

If someone said they were doing GF to their buddy and that person was to turn around and ask "Is that like a mud run or an obstacle race?"
How would a person serious about Multi Sport Racing feel about that? Its very easy to be branded elitest when responding to this type of situation especially considering the broad spectrum of abilities and the range of events we have these days.

The introduction of GPS tracking and the use of Social Media has meant a massive leap forward in the awareness and understanding of Adventure Racing. I have seen this first hand within my friends, family and the people I work. The people outside of this group can think whatever they like, I'm not bothered.