SIRO - ESB/Vodafone Fibre To The Home

dbit

cunnijo wrote: »

If this proves to happen it will really put pressure on ESB/Vodafone to speed up their rollout plan, as some of the initial 50 towns on their map are listed in the report (including Naas). However I would still prefer ESB to Eircom any day

Agreed if Eircom site is anything to go by for /ournetwork fiber map , its been blitzed with DF exchanges in build ( Dont know if it can be trusted , only if it was a mistake it would be rectified by now)

The most recent post put up this AM by Lucernarian shows the lads in eircom are now blowing fiber into 16 towns Cavan being one of them . ( With pics)

ITs weird all fo a sudden intermittent bursts are now coming from both FTTH houses .

Nollog

dbit wrote: »

ITs weird all fo a sudden intermittent bursts are now coming from both FTTH houses .

Competition is nice.

KOR101

cunnijo wrote: »

If this proves to happen it will really put pressure on ESB/Vodafone to speed up their rollout plan, as some of the initial 50 towns on their map are listed in the report (including Naas). However I would still prefer ESB to Eircom any day

The pressure is all on Eircom, not the ESB, hence the speed they're moving at. For the ESB, it's just another product, but for Eircom it's a question of survival as the dominant Telecom/BB provider.

dbit

Here is a thought , with the amount of malware infected PC's in this country , once on 1GB up and down does anyone think that we, as a nation will become more of a malware target as per fatter pipes and more powerful bot bandwidths ? Stronger DDOS capabilities from all the irish owned and not maintained pc's ? Will isp's now be on-boarding some heavy measures to slow users connections flagged as malware infected homes ? Will isp's become more proactive in telling customers there is an issue ?

mass_debater

dbit wrote: »

Here is a thought , with the amount of malware infected PC's in this country , once on 1GB up and down does anyone think that we, as a nation will become more of a malware target as per fatter pipes and more powerful bot bandwidths ? Stronger DDOS capabilities from all the irish owned and not maintained pc's ? Will isp's now be on-boarding some heavy measures to slow users connections flagged as malware infected homes ? Will isp's become more proactive in telling customers there is an issue ?

Why would it be any different than it already is? They don't really care and the IPs are dynamic

ED E

Botnets are like dragnetting, its opertunistic not targeted.

MajesticDonkey

dbit wrote: »

Here is a thought , with the amount of malware infected PC's in this country

Why would there be more malware on PCs in this country than in other countries?

Nollog

hopefully they don't rush a bill like that through.

it's bad enough isps are liable for what customers download.

Villain

dbit wrote: »

Here is a thought , with the amount of malware infected PC's in this country , once on 1GB up and down does anyone think that we, as a nation will become more of a malware target as per fatter pipes and more powerful bot bandwidths ? Stronger DDOS capabilities from all the irish owned and not maintained pc's ? Will isp's now be on-boarding some heavy measures to slow users connections flagged as malware infected homes ? Will isp's become more proactive in telling customers there is an issue ?

ISPs will need to add filters for that sort of crap which is pretty easy. I'm more worried about the so called web developers who can't keep WordPress installs updated on hosting servers.

Johnboy1951

dbit wrote: »

Here is a thought , with the amount of malware infected PC's in this country , once on 1GB up and down does anyone think that we, as a nation will become more of a malware target as per fatter pipes and more powerful bot bandwidths ? Stronger DDOS capabilities from all the irish owned and not maintained pc's ? Will isp's now be on-boarding some heavy measures to slow users connections flagged as malware infected homes ? Will isp's become more proactive in telling customers there is an issue ?

Maybe the ISPs will give huge discounts to people who use MAC and Linux and not Windows.

lucernarian

Johnboy1951 wrote: »

Maybe the ISPs will give huge discounts to people who use MAC and Linux and not Windows.

With China Telecom offering 200 Mbit connections across most of Shanghai, I'm sure the hordes of Windows XP and IE6 machines will attract even more botnets than they do already!!!:o

dbit

Well in reality i suppose, an ISP, once it sees port 25 doing the light fandango they dont take long hitching you onto spamhouse lists and blocking your ports . I just envisage a lot of work on behalf of the ISP once 1 GB upload is mainstream and with drive bye infections and that old time favorite guy in India telling people they have been infected by ninja like virus's and that CrashnBurn, Trinity and Morpheus are all up in they're sh1t ...........

Just wondering if anyone thought that infection of nations with 1GB uploads would not be more attractive than those on lower speeds as being on this tier implies more powerful platforms for attack.

dbit

May i add that in recent probes of hardware that more noticeably huawei routers seem to have general vulnerability wide open for broadcom chip-sets, Ralink chip-sets and wps can be powned in less than three mins, Eircoms current routers as well as sky and vodafone seem to be safe enough in that the auto-pixie attacks fail. Our lovely Chinese hardware nose dives on this . ( Tested in my area for vuln stations only a few tp-links , linksys and huawei came back hole open.)

I am a little worried about the selection of the ex-Cisco underdog that started this company . Also worried as the gear seems to be attracting a lot of attention to itself . Deeeeeeerp!

Nollog

What do you folks think about the bundling situation?

Do you think they'll do a massive 5-way bundle type deal?
Get a certain percent discount on your electricity, vodafone mobile plan, internet, iptv(?), and home phone.

Would it even be possible?

dbit

/\/ollog wrote: »

What do you folks think about the bundling situation?

Do you think they'll do a massive 5-way bundle type deal?
Get a certain percent discount on your electricity, vodafone mobile plan, internet, iptv(?), and home phone.

Would it even be possible?

Heaven knows they would clean up for all utilities in one place , I would hazard a guess that its only around the corner. Something we could do with in IRL with utility companies thinking we all have Beverly Hills addresses.

dam099

/\/ollog wrote: »

What do you folks think about the bundling situation?

Do you think they'll do a massive 5-way bundle type deal?
Get a certain percent discount on your electricity, vodafone mobile plan, internet, iptv(?), and home phone.

Would it even be possible?

Isn't it ESB Networks doing this with Vodafone, I doubt that Electric Ireland who retail the electricity are involved so unless Vodafone went into the electricity business themselves I'm not sure this would happen?

dbit

dam099 wrote: »

Isn't it ESB Networks doing this with Vodafone, I doubt that Electric Ireland who retail the electricity are involved so unless Vodafone went into the electricity business themselves I'm not sure this would happen?

Vodafone will be the front end reseller for ESB FTTH , makes sense that to draw in extra customers they would put together 4/5 in 1 offers , TV, BB, Phone, Power /and maybe Gas ?

KOR101

An interesting question is whether the ESB will have permanently lower costs than Eircom because they can piggyback on their electricity infrastructure. Where does that leave Eircom?

ukoda

dbit wrote: »

Vodafone will be the front end reseller for ESB FTTH , makes sense that to draw in extra customers they would put together 4/5 in 1 offers , TV, BB, Phone, Power /and maybe Gas ?

And theres nothing to stop Electic Ireland or any supplier going into the broadband market

dbit

KOR101 wrote: »

An interesting question is whether the ESB will have permanently lower costs than Eircom because they can piggyback on their electricity infrastructure. Where does that leave Eircom?

Ed e and the lads wil tell you that Eircom have way more Fiber infrastructure then the other houses as it is now , currently they are closer to homes with last mile of copper to tie up from vdsl cabs . Each vdsl cab has a 24 core fiber lying with at least 20 fibers dormant intended for the last mile run from cabs to homes. So capacity for 640 homes for FTTH on each cab they can further split that out with more gear in cabs.

http://www.eircomwholesale.ie/news/FTTH_Pricing/

dbit

ukoda wrote: »

And theres nothing to stop Electic Ireland or any supplier going into the broadband market

they would have to go through comreg for regiustration and so on but in that they will resell and already certified platform , no nothing stopping them.

ukoda

dbit wrote: »

they would have to go through comreg for regiustration and so on but in that they will resell and already certified platform , no nothing stopping them.

yes they'd need to go through all that, a more likely scenario maybe is VF and EI teaming up in an affinity deal of some sort, i.e. get BB from VF and Electricity/Gas from EI and save X% with both companies

bk

KOR101 wrote: »

An interesting question is whether the ESB will have permanently lower costs than Eircom because they can piggyback on their electricity infrastructure. Where does that leave Eircom?

As dbit says Eircom has a lot more fiber and a lot closer to customers, so they have a price advantage there. Also Eircom has a pre-existing relationship with the customers, it is easier to hold onto people then to win them over.

On the other hand ESB would have a lot lower operating costs as they only have to maintain one network, while Eircom have to operate both their new FTTH network and their existing old copper ADSL/VDSL network for the foreseeable future.

The other consideration is Eircoms massive debt that it needs to continue to service, which also makes it a lot more expensive to raise capital to build the new FTTH network. The ESB on the other hand are almost completely debt free and profitable and can easily raise capital much more cheaply then Eircom. And similarly Vodafone is debt free and has a massive 100 billion war chest after it sold it's share in Verizon.

So it is hard to say, but on the balance I'd expect the ESB/Vodafone to be able to do it a lot cheaper then Eircom.

Anyway, the ESB will have to be cheaper if they want to win customers away from Eircom. Just like UPC did in their areas of operation.

dbit wrote: »

Vodafone will be the front end reseller for ESB FTTH , makes sense that to draw in extra customers they would put together 4/5 in 1 offers , TV, BB, Phone, Power /and maybe Gas ?

Actually it seems to be a lot more complicated then that. It is actually a 50:50 joint venture between ESB and Vodafone. That means both companies are investing an equal amount of money in the venture.

It would also seem that ESB are bringing their electric network to the table to be used, while Vodafone are brining their teleco and network management expertise (and I expect international backhaul) to the table.

ESB/Vodafone will thus actually be the network managers and wholesalers, similar to Eircom Wholesale.

Of course it makes sense that Vodafone Retail when buy this wholesale service and sell it to customers, but other companies (e.g. Sky, Magnet and maybe even UPC, Eircom) can also buy the wholesale service from ESB/Vodafone wholesale.

I hadn't thought of it, but yes, it would also make a lot of sense for Electric Ireland to also retail this service and create combined Electric + Gas + Broadband + TV + Phone bundles.

As you say EI could also partner with Vodafone Retail to also include mobile in the bundle.

It would make a lot of sense, EI has an existing relationship with almost every home in Ireland, so makes sense to try and leverage that to upsell them on Broadband/TV/phone, much in the same way UPC used it's relationship with it's TV customers to pull them in and upsell them to phone + broadband.

This could create all sorts of interesting scenarios, where Bord Gais, Airtricity, etc. all are also forced to enter the broadband market!!

It kind of makes a sort of perverted sense. If Airtricty are sending it's sales people door to door selling gas + electricity, it takes little extra effort to also have those sales people try and upsell you on broadband + TV + phone.

Purely speculation on my part.

Johnboy1951

bk wrote: »

Purely speculation on my part.

It does though highlight the benefits of an open distribution system which allows a great deal of competition in services to the consumer.

bk

Just came across this interesting Job opening at Vodafone:

http://www.irishjobs.ie/Jobs/FTTH-Retail-Proposition-Manager-7546347.aspx

So it looks like the ESB/Vodafone FTTH rollout is still going ahead, but seems further behind then initially planned.

A bit OT, but I also just came across this interesting presentation about the trade off of going FTTH, versus DOCSIS 3.1 for cable operators here:

http://cablecongress.com/wp-content/uploads/cablecongress/2014/03/Geary-Neil.pdf

dbit

bk wrote: »

Just came across this interesting Job opening at Vodafone:

http://www.irishjobs.ie/Jobs/FTTH-Retail-Proposition-Manager-7546347.aspx

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for that it looks like prepping sales Dept which is inline for Aug/Sept push on sales for first 16 towns ?

Nollog

"Define and execute the FTTH retail proposition including end to end customer experience, proposition build, process mapping, pricing strategy, roll out strategy and go to market plan - liaising with relevant areas to ensure alignment and timely delivery"

Maybe we'll start seeing ads in the next 6 months.

ED E

*Cue eircom NGA planning going into overdrive *

Johnboy1951

bk wrote: »

A bit OT, but I also just came across this interesting presentation about the trade off of going FTTH, versus DOCSIS 3.1 for cable operators here:

http://cablecongress.com/wp-content/uploads/cablecongress/2014/03/Geary-Neil.pdf

ESTIMATE the variability of forecasts in key parameters that drive “responses”:
(Top Tier and usage CAGRs, Competitor actions, Risk of a new FTTH-only player)

UPC might consider themselves forced to go FTTH sooner rather than later .....

dbit

Johnboy1951 wrote: »

UPC might consider themselves forced to go FTTH sooner rather than later .....

Naa they wont do **** as per :-
DOCSIS 3.1
Released October 2013, plans support capacities of at least 10 Gbit/s downstream and 1 Gbit/s upstream using 4096 QAM. The new specs will do away with 6 MHz and 8 MHz wide channel spacing and instead use smaller (20 kHz to 50 kHz wide) orthogonal frequency-division multiplexing (OFDM) subcarriers; these can be bonded inside a block spectrum that could end up being about 200 MHz wide.[5]


Freq shifts and new gear is all that is needed current 3.0 modems should be able to support 3.1 with firmware flash .

Found on :-
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DOCSIS