Your reasons for emigrating

ArnieSilvia

I admit that I might be biased because I like to go to places and see how people lived in certain era, not just empty walls.

My comment regarding castles etc was due to visiting a number of sites that were not only left to their own (happens everywhere due to lack of funds) but, despite being a part of this country's heritage, are in hands of people who don't understand its value, letting for example cattle to roam around and damage the site (nevermind the shoite on/around it - it's an Abbey after all?). An example here would be Athassel Abbey, Golden, County Tipperary.

Of course, Bunraty castle, nostalgic old Irish village beside it, Iron age related reconstructions (liked them much) and many others prove otherwise.


In my eyes, despite the historical scars, history should be maintained, not destroyed, it is part of national heritage, be it English or Germans living there. A good example from my home town - German Prince palace with adjacent park, a gem, maintained to highest standard despite of what Germans did in Auschwitz and how many people they killed during WW2. Oh, and despite how they protected German SS predators after war against international justice tribunals.

I think this thread is very related to what I feel about the whole issue:
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=80180505

I want to build planes for a living.

No one building planes in Ireland.

Trading, serving, servicing, flying, buying, selling, but no making.

I'm outta here.

maninasia

DoozerT6 wrote: »

I know this is only a small point from your very informative post, but I just thought I'd address it.

Personally I think ruined or unrestored castles SHOWS a great respect for the past. Why upgrade or restore everything to the hilt? We have plenty of heritage sites that ARE restored, been upgraded, have visitor centres and tours - people actually do come here to see unrestored buildings, to see what it was like to live in a place with bare stone walls, tiny windows with no glass, to see what a place might have looked like in it's raw state, before The Gubbermint, or Bord Failte, or whoever, decided that a historic site needed a makeover.

It's the ruined buildings and castles that are part of our heritage. They are part of our history and our landscape. THAT'S what's real about this country, which is not found in many countries outside of Europe. It's why tourists come here.

Anyway, I haven't had any coffee yet. Maybe I better go get some.

In China it's odds on that if you visit an 'historical site' that it is actually more a modern reconstruction than the original building or structure. Most tourists aren't aware of this, many may not care, but to me it takes away from the authenticity and my feelings towards those sites.

The authentic and the real and the unique is a rare and valuable thing in the modern world.

As for the abbey in Tipp, yes, Ireland does have some amazing sites that are left as is, and maybe could be looked after better (protection from thieves and vandals), but at the same time they are very charming as they return back to nature over the centuries and you can visit them without the tourist throngs. It's good to remember that many have been ruins for most of their existence.

jank

maninasia wrote: »

Australia is a severely over regulated place with high costs and fees for everything, the last thing I would say about it is 'it's liberal'. The people are not particularly 'liberal' either.

I would tend to agree with the regulation here. There seems to be rules and red tape for everything and costs attached. However, I think it steems from the fact that they want to preseve certain freedoms rather than banning things outright. E.g. 24 hours drinking, you can drink all day if you want but you will have to adhere to lots of rules especially if you are a pub. Same goes for the sex industry.

I would not agree with your last statement either, soundbites asside.

maninasia

Ask the average Aussie on their views on the black fellas or refugees, listen to the answers. Ask the average Queenslander anything and listen to the answers.

Nelson Muntz

maninasia wrote: »

Ask the average Aussie on their views on the black fellas or refugees, listen to the answers. Ask the average Queenslander anything and listen to the answers.

Total garbage. The QLD nominee for Australian of the year is Asian and the assistant teacher in my daughters prep class is Aboriginal & nobody there even batted an eyelid.

The Aussie

maninasia wrote: »

Ask the average Aussie on their views on the black fellas or refugees.

Or you could ask your average Paddy their views on the old Eastern European and Nigeria.


LOl.......

Nelson Muntz

Nelson Muntz wrote: »

Total garbage. The QLD nominee for Australian of the year is Asian and the assistant teacher in my daughters prep class is Aboriginal & nobody there even batted an eyelid.

What kind of Asian? I like that you had to mention the Aborigine.

The Aussie wrote: »

Or you could ask your average Paddy their views on the old Eastern European and Nigeria.


LOl.......

Other than taxi-drivers and 3rd-generations never-employed it's a very good response.

Nelson Muntz

Deleted User wrote: »

What kind of Asian? I like that you had to mention the Aborigine.



Other than taxi-drivers and 3rd-generations never-employed it's a very good response.

What's your point? I was responding to the assertion that Australians don't like immigrants or Aboriginals. The guy is of Chinese heritage I think but not 100%

Haha, you are either flat out lying or you don't leave the house very often.

Nelson Muntz

Nelson Muntz wrote: »

What's your point? I was responding to the assertion that Australians don't like immigrants or Aboriginals. The guy is of Chinese heritage I think but not 100%

They don't mind the Chinese so much as the rest. If one wants to claim that Australians are no more anti-immigration (racism is maybe a bit too strong a word aside from the Indigenous population) than, say, Europe then they should be working to make their politics reflect that.

Haha, you are either flat out lying or you don't leave the house very often.

The latter applies somewhat while the former doesn't at all. When Ireland has a "right" movement that is capable of even naming itself we can discuss it.

The Aussie

Deleted User wrote: »

Other than taxi-drivers and 3rd-generations never-employed it's a very good response.

I don't get the response sorry.

Did you have a handful of Rowntree's Randoms before replying?

The Aussie

The Aussie wrote: »

I don't get the response sorry.

Did you have a handful of Rowntree's Randoms before replying?

Ireland is in a massive economic disaster. Usually any kind of downturn results in anti-immigration stuff and the rise of a far-right. How much of that has happened in Ireland in the last 6 years?

The Aussie

Deleted User wrote: »

How much of that has happened in Ireland in the last 6 years?

According to the Immigrant Council of Ireland, a hell of a lot more than the previous 6 years :rolleyes:
And still rising...

The Aussie

The Aussie wrote: »

According to the Immigrant Council of Ireland, a hell of a lot more than the previous 6 years :rolleyes:
And still rising...

Any links to demonstrations? TDs suggesting measures? Any parties that have adopted any kind of policies to lower immigration?

The Aussie

Deleted User wrote: »

Any links to demonstrations? TDs suggesting measures? Any parties that have adopted any kind of policies to lower immigration?

Deleted User wrote: »

Usually any kind of downturn results in anti-immigration stuff and the rise of a far-right.

I will just heap Racist Incidents in with the "anti-immigration stuff"

Racist incidents in Ireland up by 85 percent says Immigrant Council

Read more: http://www.irishcentral.com/news/racist-incidents-in-ireland-up-by-85-percent-says-immigrant-council-234952171-237791131.html#ixzz2rfLj5yjF

The Aussie

The Aussie wrote: »

I will just heap Racist Incidents in with the "anti-immigration stuff"

Racist incidents in Ireland up by 85 percent says Immigrant Council

Read more: http://www.irishcentral.com/news/racist-incidents-in-ireland-up-by-85-percent-says-immigrant-council-234952171-237791131.html#ixzz2rfLj5yjF

That'll be a "no" then.

wuffly

Moved to the Middle East three years ago. To get a decent job I had no choice, and at the time i really needed a break from Ireland. Like it, don't love it. Feel like its heading for another stupid bubble... its closer to home than Oz and for 6 months of the year the weather is pretty nice. Saving to give ourselves a good start when we move back.

JimmyCrackCorn

• Fed up of paying higher and higher tax
  
• Fed up of doom and gloom.
  
• Rain I had the absolute ****s of that....
  
• Wanted a change
  
• Sun wanted to see what that was
  
• I got offered a job..
  

The Aussie

Deleted User wrote: »

That'll be a "no" then.

So you don't think anti-immigration happens on the streets then, no wonder there is a prevailing attitude that Ireland is welcoming to foreigners (LOL)

Even I'm on the end of it and at least I can blend in, would hate to be a different complexion.

The Aussie

The Aussie wrote: »

So you don't think anti-immigration happens on the streets then, no wonder there is a prevailing attitude that Ireland is welcoming to foreigners (LOL)

There's not many countires with a great foreign-born population than Ireland aside from Colonial outposts, geographical novelties and countries that import slave labour. Yet there's no movement for limiting immigration and it rarely ever registers on the political agenda. Fairly welcoming I would've said.

Even I'm on the end of it and at least I can blend in, would hate to be a different complexion.

I'm guessing you didn't grow up here then? "**** off home then" is used for someone who lives 2 miles away, I wouldn't take it personally.

Tugboats

Its been a dream of mine to wear a gaa jersey in Perth while urinating in the street singing the fields of athenry

The Aussie

Deleted User wrote: »

Yet there's no movement for limiting immigration and it rarely ever registers on the political agenda. Fairly welcoming I would've said.

If emmigration was not such a national tragedy that is treated as an easy option for handling the unemployment rate by this and the previous Government, immigration would be far higher up the political agenda, that's even if Ireland's new colonial masters would allow it, so maybe not all that welcoming when scrutinised.

jank

maninasia wrote: »

Ask the average Aussie on their views on the black fellas or refugees, listen to the answers. Ask the average Queenslander anything and listen to the answers.

Huge sweeping generalisations tbh considering that Australia is arguably the most multicultural country on earth. There are no race riots here unlike 'liberal' Europe....

The Aussie

The Aussie wrote: »

If emmigration was not such a national tragedy that is treated as an easy option for handling the unemployment rate by this and the previous Government, immigration would be far higher up the political agenda, that's even if Ireland's new colonial masters would allow it, so maybe not all that welcoming when scrutinised.

I'd love some further explanation of this.
Surely high emigration (supposedly due to lack of jobs) while still maintaining quite high immigration would be a recipe for backlash. Yet both those ingredients are present but for some reason the racist Irish just aren't biting?

jank

Deleted User wrote: »

They don't mind the Chinese so much as the rest. If one wants to claim that Australians are no more anti-immigration (racism is maybe a bit too strong a word aside from the Indigenous population) than, say, Europe then they should be working to make their politics reflect that..

Then I suppose there should be huge and massive support for anti-immigration far right politics here, more so than europe. Hmmm, so where is the Australian version of the Greek Golden Dawn, Frances National Front, the Danish Peoples Party, the Austrian Freedom Party or the UK's BNP.
Something of comparison would be One Nation which polled a massive 22,000 (0.2%) votes in the 2013 Federal Election. To put it in perspective the Australian Sex party polled 78,000 votes.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/federal-election-2013/results/party-totals/

Deleted User wrote: »

The latter applies somewhat while the former doesn't at all. When Ireland has a "right" movement that is capable of even naming itself we can discuss it.

And when Australia has a similar 'right' movement that is capable of demonstrating a critical mass of popular support then we can discuss it as well.

The Aussie

Deleted User wrote: »

I'd love some further explanation of this.
Surely high emigration (supposedly due to lack of jobs) while still maintaining quite high immigration would be a recipe for backlash.

But Ireland does not have high immigration, so I fail to see your point.

Deleted User wrote: »

but for some reason the racist Irish just aren't biting?

20 racist incidents have been reported to the Immigrant Council of Ireland in the first 20 days of 2014, according new figures released this morning (Saturday Jan 25th 2014).*





* these are only the ones that get reported.

Lurching

- Lack of work,
- Lack of interest in Ireland on the whole.

The lack of interest in Ireland is dissipating at the moment, but unfortunately the lack of work there isn't helping my return.

Kev_2012

I moved to Canada on the 2 year whv. I like here a lot but I will return to Ireland. I moved here to experience living in a different country. There is a lot of jobs in my field in Ireland but unfortunately not in Limerick right now so I hope to god that changes by the time I wanna return!

ArnieSilvia

Due to globalisation and multinationals moving businesses wherever it suits them I realised very early that there is no such a thing as a lifetime job (apart from certain public service and professional jobs). So at some stage of life a lot of people will have no job.

In the past, if given industry wasn't doing well anymore, you'd re-qualify to another job. End of. The choice of emigration was very limited due to high cost of travelling (no Ryanair), visa requirements and don't forget the biggie - no English spoken worldwide. No SW of any sort either. Globalisation brought movement of goods, movement of manufacturing across countries and movement of labour. These days it seems to be easier to just move to another country rather than to re-qualify. Or live off the state if you don't want to change industry and wait till developers start building houses again.

So get used to it, emigration and immigration will be part of our lives we want it or not. Or we close the borders, live one-nation countries as it was set up after WW2 and live our lives jumping at your national's throats that you have to re-qualify.

I'm quite puzzled looking at people crying over recession 5 years down into it. Enough time to re-qualify, change industry or set up something own. Or move where the job is, countrywide (i.e. seen a lot of Mayo, Donegal, Cork ppl working in Dublin now) or internationally.

Looking at posts in this thread, it's quite obvious a lot of qualified people left Ireland to exploit better opportunities abroad. I don't see a problem with that as long as Irish allow other nations exploit opportunities in Ireland. Simple as that. But don't deny that there are big markets out there, much bigger than Ireland and it helps develop career. If I didn't have kids I'd be now in UK, Canada, US, Germany or (for sake of being different) Switzerland.

In most countries people are complaining about immigration while lots of their own people are emigrating from these countries as well

Balls, imagine people went back to one nation concept and estimated 20 million Irish coming back to Ireland from US or another few million from UK. That'd be fun. Building industry would be booming again, lol.

Saying that, I already mentioned that it's important to expect newcomers to respect local culture and speak local language, therefore allowing in only those who come from similar cultural circle.

lufties

ArnieSilvia wrote: »

Due to globalisation and multinationals moving businesses wherever it suits them I realised very early that there is no such a thing as a lifetime job (apart from certain public service and professional jobs). So at some stage of life a lot of people will have no job.

In the past, if given industry wasn't doing well anymore, you'd re-qualify to another job. End of. The choice of emigration was very limited due to high cost of travelling (no Ryanair), visa requirements and don't forget the biggie - no English spoken worldwide. No SW of any sort either. Globalisation brought movement of goods, movement of manufacturing across countries and movement of labour. These days it seems to be easier to just move to another country rather than to re-qualify. Or live off the state if you don't want to change industry and wait till developers start building houses again.

So get used to it, emigration and immigration will be part of our lives we want it or not. Or we close the borders, live one-nation countries as it was set up after WW2 and live our lives jumping at your national's throats that you have to re-qualify.

I'm quite puzzled looking at people crying over recession 5 years down into it. Enough time to re-qualify, change industry or set up something own. Or move where the job is, countrywide (i.e. seen a lot of Mayo, Donegal, Cork ppl working in Dublin now) or internationally.

Looking at posts in this thread, it's quite obvious a lot of qualified people left Ireland to exploit better opportunities abroad. I don't see a problem with that as long as Irish allow other nations exploit opportunities in Ireland. Simple as that. But don't deny that there are big markets out there, much bigger than Ireland and it helps develop career. If I didn't have kids I'd be now in UK, Canada, US, Germany or (for sake of being different) Switzerland.

In most countries people are complaining about immigration while lots of their own people are emigrating from these countries as well

Balls, imagine people went back to one nation concept and estimated 20 million Irish coming back to Ireland from US or another few million from UK. That'd be fun. Building industry would be booming again, lol.

Saying that, I already mentioned that it's important to expect newcomers to respect local culture and speak local language, therefore allowing in only those who come from similar cultural circle.

I admire your positiveness and you are right, emigration/immigration is the norm nowadays. With regard to Ireland, I wish the government had the foresight to invest in indigenous industry, they seem to just rely on the whims of multinationals coming in and out. This cannot be sustained. For example, we don't even own our fisheries, why is this? we also had a beet industry that is no more.
As much as I dislike FG/Lab/, I can see what they are trying to do with the I.T sector and food/agriculture, which is a good thing. A lot more could be done though and with a change in perspective, Ireland could be a thriving nation.

On a side note, another thing is booze. Not all of us are p1ssheads of course, but a lot of us are without going into statistics. We Irish, including myself need to shake off the 'drunken' stereotype and our destructive relationship with alcohol. In my opinion, this is the root of a lot of our problems.