Shannon Airport Thread [Mod Warning in First Post]

Balf

marno21 wrote: »

The best example I can think of is Cardiff which has service with Qatar Airways on a 787-8. Shannon and Cardiff have comparable passenger numbers.

Interesting comparison - and a little background on the Cardiff service here

https://www.cardiff-airport.com/news/2017/04/24/qatar-airways-chooses-cardiff-airport/

More than 1 million passengers per year from our region are travelling to destinations that are on the Qatar Airways network. Over 90% of these passengers are currently travelling via London and this new service will give them the opportunity to fly more conveniently from Cardiff, their local airport.

“It has been a long journey to get to this stage, with discussions spanning a number of years.

According to wikipedia, the service saw 55,500 passengers in 2018. The service started in May.

The service doesn't seem to be proven yet.

https://www.businesstraveller.com/business-travel/2019/05/09/cardiff-airport-says-qatar-airways-services-have-been-transformational/

Five flights a week are currently running between Cardiff and Doha, which will rise to daily from May 31 for the summer season, all operated by a B787 Dreamliner.

The Welsh government is also paying Qatar Airways £1 million over a two year period to market Wales as a destination.

https://www.businesstraveller.com/business-travel/2018/10/02/qatar-airways-improving-passenger-numbers-at-cardiff/

The projected first year’s traffic is 90,000 against a seat capacity of 150,000. It’s too early to say whether the route is profitable.

I suppose its also fair to say that Cardiff is a larger city than Limerick; but still one to watch.

Brennans Row

Second medical diversion to Shannon in 18 hours (Clare Herald)

American Airlines flight AA-52 was travelling from Philadelphia in U.S. to Prague in the Czech Republic when the crew declared a medical emergency shortly after 5.00am.

The crew reported they had a woman in her 50s who had suffered a fall and a possible seizure.

Brennans Row

Icelandair Ferries Boeing 737 MAXs To Spain (Simple Flying)

Icelandair’s 737 MAX 8s have taken to the skies again, on a ferry flight bound for Northern Spain.

Two MAX 8s so far have left Iceland. As they are flying low and slow with flaps out, they need to stop off in Shannon (SNN) Ireland for refueling. Only the airline’s five MAX 8s are cleared for flights.

Two 737 MAX 8s have left Iceland bound for northern Spain to escape the cold, damp conditions of Iceland in the winter.

The reason for this is that both aircraft must be flown with flaps out. This will prevent the MCAS software from kicking in, thought to have been the cause of the two previous fatal accidents.

The aircraft left Shannon and it looks to be taking a wide route away from UK and French airspace.

JamesBond2010

Brennans Row wrote: »

Second medical diversion to Shannon in 18 hours (Clare Herald)

American Airlines flight AA-52 was travelling from Philadelphia in U.S. to Prague in the Czech Republic when the crew declared a medical emergency shortly after 5.00am.

The crew reported they had a woman in her 50s who had suffered a fall and a possible seizure.

Lads you would make a fortune if u built a hospital nearby in industrial Eastae:P:P:D:D:D

Tiernster7

Balf wrote: »

Interesting comparison - and a little background on the Cardiff service hereAccording to wikipedia, the service saw 55,500 passengers in 2018. The service started in May.

The service doesn't seem to be proven yet.I suppose its also fair to say that Cardiff is a larger city than Limerick; but still one to watch.

Sounds like the kind of bribe money being talked about in budget.

easypazz

Cardiff also has bristol and swansea to tap into.

JCX BXC

The demographics of the UK is what makes this route viable. We simply don't have the same dispora of Asians and Africans that the UK has, making these routes viable.

Tiernster7

easypazz wrote: »

Cardiff also has bristol and swansea to tap into.

On this for a route like this Shannon would have Cork and Galway and quite a number of other areas that aren't in catchment area for European and UK destinations

Cosmo Kramer

Cookiemunster wrote: »

Shannon wouldn't be completing with Knock. Kerry or Cork for Mid West traffic to the UK or Europe.

Depends on your definition of mid west. If the mid west includes all of County Limerick I'd imagine there are parts of the mid west where Shannon is very much competing with Cork and Kerry airports. There is also a geographical area within which it competes with Knock but it wouldn't be in the mid west region.

RE: middle east flights from a regional airport - a long shot but not necessarily impossible. A Turkish 737 four or five times a week might be the most likely way it could be done.

I believe that Cardiff route to Doha is heavily subsidised.

Brennans Row

Shannon Airport Widebody Paint Hangar & Taxiway Construction Project

Work-in-progress from 30.10.2018 to 04.09.2019

Brennans Row

'Do hard work yourself,' Walsh tells Shannon Airport(Irish Independent)

Shannon Airport has a viable future as a seasonal transatlantic gateway and should stop "demanding that everyone else does the hard work for them", Willie Walsh says.

"They need to get on and manage it," the IAG CEO said. "They need to do it themselves."
Mr Walsh - whose group owns Aer Lingus, British Airways, Iberia, Vueling and Level - is optimistic that transatlantic services at the west of Ireland airport can grow.

But Shannon will never be a hub. That, he said, "is never going to happen".
"There's always demand for transatlantic services into the west of Ireland," he said. "The demand is very seasonal, but it's always been very seasonal."

In 2012 Shannon Airport split from DAA, which operates the Dublin and Cork airports. Shannon had pressed the government for the split, arguing it would have a stronger future as an independent entity, and set a target of handling 2.5 million passengers a year.

It has fallen far short of that aim, as 1.86 million used Shannon last year chiefly for UK and European routes and summer links to US cities including Boston and New York.

Shannon complained last month that a €9.7m mandatory upgrade of its baggage screening systems to adhere to international standards would impose "a material financial burden" on the airport. Unlike privately owned airports such as Knock, it argued, Shannon had not received confirmation of any Government financial support for the cost.

Mr Walsh said Shannon shouldn't expect "someone else to pay the bills to do the basics for them. They just need to focus on making what they have as effective as possible".

A Limerick Chamber-commissioned report by Copenhagen Economics this month found that Dublin's dominance made it tough for other airports to maintain current route and passenger levels.
But Shannon could get help from Budget 2020, which included a €2.5m competitive route development fund.

Limerick Chamber president Eoin Ryan welcomed the fund as "a very important moment for balanced regional development" and said it was "now up to Shannon and other airports to make a compelling case".

I'm surprised that Willie Walsh needs to comment on this issue.

Baggage screening systems are very expensive and Shannon's Transatlantic services can never be a soft touch for terrorism.

His own airlines benefit from this investment.

Has he made similar comments regarding Airbus or Boeing state supports?

I hope he is not play politics by throwing his weight on Shane Ross's side or is it his dissatisfaction that Shannon is trying to develop a Lufthansa route to Frankfurt's hub?

Cookiemunster

Brennans Row wrote: »

I'm surprised that Willie Walsh needs to comment on this issue.

Baggage screening systems are very expensive and Shannon's Transatlantic services can never be a soft touch for terrorism.

His own airlines benefit from this investment.

Has he made similar comments regarding Airbus or Boeing state supports?

I hope he is not play politics by throwing his weight on Shane Ross's side or is it his dissatisfaction that Shannon is trying to develop a Lufthansa route to Frankfurt's hub?

He's saying it as it is. Shannon isn't a regional airport, so doesn't qualify for regional funding. They wanted to be independent and are now part of a group including Shannon Heritage, Shannon Properties and IASC. The group made a profit in 2018 and have hundreds of millions in assets and are spending millions on offices and hangers. They're not short of money.

Management need to stop complaining about Dublin and actually sort out their own issues and get some new routes in.

Brennans Row

Cookiemunster wrote: »

He's saying it as it is. Shannon isn't a regional airport, so doesn't qualify for regional funding. They wanted to be independent and are now part of a group including Shannon Heritage, Shannon Properties and IASC. The group made a profit in 2018 and have hundreds of millions in assets and are spending millions on offices and hangers. They're not short of money.

Management need to stop complaining about Dublin and actually sort out their own issues and get some new routes in.

Shannon Group is investing in upgrading a large stock of derelict industrial buildings, building new offices or a new hangar by borrowing from the European Investment Bank.

The value of the properties that the Shannon Group manage are not comparable with those in Dublin, by a long shot!

They make their case for funding in a professional manner, see commissioned report and they are just stating a fact that this mandatory baggage screening investment will be a material financial burden, thus curtailing the airport in developing new routes, which in my book is not complaining.

Cookiemunster wrote: »

Try reading the article properly and find anyone from other than a FF TD looking for votes in Limerick saying that. The article finishes Shannon Airport has been contacted for comment. So, you know, nobody form Shannon actually did say it.

He is correct about the poor management in Shannon though.

Brennans Row wrote: »

Where exactly were they poor and what measures do you think they need to make that would make good management.

By the I was hoping you would respond to that previous reply of mine.

Cookiemunster

Brennans Row wrote: »

Shannon Group is investing in upgrading a large stock of derelict industrial buildings, building new offices or a new hangar by borrowing from the European Investment Bank.

The value of the properties that the Shannon Group manage are not comparable with those in Dublin, by a long shot!

They make their case for funding in a professional manner, see commissioned report and they are just stating a fact that this mandatory baggage screening investment will be a material financial burden, thus curtailing the airport in developing new routes, which in my book is not complaining.

And they could also borrow for the new security equipment. It's another investment. And I never claimed that Shannon Groups property value was comparable to the DAA. Please don't make things up. The value of Shannon Groups holdings however is hundreds of millions and can easily be borrowed against.

Brennans Row wrote: »

By the I was hoping you would respond to that previous reply of mine.

You seriously can't see why the management of the only airport in the country losing passengers (they would be down even without the MAX issue) are poor? Really?

Brennans Row

Cookiemunster wrote: »

And they could also borrow for the new security equipment. It's another investment. And I never claimed that Shannon Groups property value was comparable to the DAA. Please don't make things up.

But property prices are way higher in Dublin than in the Mid-West.

I was only implying that you were exaggerating the property value of the Shannon Group especially when a lot of investment is needed to make old empty building stock attractive again for new clients.

I never mentioned the DAA.

Cookiemunster wrote: »

The value of Shannon Groups holdings however is hundreds of millions and can easily be borrowed against.

We probably need someone with good accounting skills to interpret the real value of the group from the balance sheet along with the groups liquidity and borrowing risks.

Cookiemunster wrote: »

You seriously can't see why the management of the only airport in the country losing passengers (they would be down even without the MAX issue) are poor? Really?

Can you not elaborate on what poor management led to a drop in passenger numbers for 2019 and what good management would have prevented it?

Balf

Brennans Row wrote: »

Can you not elaborate on what poor management led to a drop in passenger numbers for 2019 and what good management would have prevented it?

I suspect the underlying issue is political, and one that benefits from not allowing ourselves to forget recent history. Who said 2.5 million passengers was a reasonable target, and if it isn't a reasonable target what is?

https://www.oireachtas.ie/en/debates/debate/dail/2012-12-11/2/

Dáil Éireann debate - Tuesday, 11 Dec 2012

Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport (Deputy Leo Varadkar): ... the Government is confident that Shannon not only is ready to stand on its own but will perform far better on its own, free of constraint and control by the DAA.

In this regard, it has been suggested the passenger projections for Shannon Airport seem fanciful. While the business plan is confidential, in the next five years the Shannon plan projects passenger numbers to grow from approximately 1.5 million this year to 2.3 million in 2017 and 2.5 million in 2021. ... the alternative of accepting that passenger numbers at Shannon cannot be improved is much worse because that would spell the continued decline of the airport. In that eventuality we would soon be seeking to downgrade or even wind down the structures at Shannon.

Deputy Mick Wallace: ... The projected passenger figures, moving from 1.5 million to 2.5 million in the coming years, are very optimistic. ...

Deputy Kieran O'Donnell: Shannon Airport has the longest runway in Europe. ... Passenger numbers are critical and we must remain focused on the fact that we are seeking to reach passenger numbers of 2.5 million. This plan is realistic and what is required is strong management and adequate resources to ensure Shannon Airport will continue to contribute to the region. ...

Of course, Kieran O'Donnell was simply wrong when he said Shannon has the longest runway in Europe.

Was he just as wrong when he said strong management was needed?

What is a realistic plan for Shannon? There's far too much guff around the place.

Brennans Row

High flying French aviation companies avail of unique business networking opportunity with Shannon IASC (ILoveLimerick)

On Monday, October 14 2019 the Shannon Group welcomed 13 aerospace and aviation companies from France as they met with members of the Shannon International Aviation Services Centre (IASC) cluster at a special networking event hosted at Shannon Airport.

IASC who joined the elite European Aerospace Cluster Partnership (EACP) in 2018, along with fellow EACP member, Aerospace Valley Toulouse, collaborated with the French Embassy and Business France Ireland, to organise the prestigious business networking event.

IASC was accepted as a member of EACP last year and became the first Irish member to achieve this status. The membership acknowledges Shannon IASC as not only the largest aerospace cluster in Ireland but a cluster of pan-European significance. The recognition elevated the international status of the Shannon cluster and created the opportunity for Shannon’s aviation cluster firms to co-operate on a European level to identify new projects and development opportunities.

John Drysdale, Business Development Manager of Shannon Group’s International Aviation Services Centre said, “It is a wonderful opportunity for our IASC cluster members to present to, and network with, top French aviation companies and explore business opportunities. The basis of the event was to create partnership and collaboration opportunities across the EACP network and to showcase Shannon’s growing aerospace cluster, which now has over 80 companies employing over 3,000.”

The programme included presentations from IASC and also two IASC aviation cluster companies GECAS and Emerald Aero cluster company, Takumi Precision Engineering. The event concluded with delegates being taken on a site visit to view Shannon Group’s €60 million property investments at Shannon Free Zone and also Shannon Airport where a new aircraft hangar is currently under construction.

Brennans Row

Shannon - Commercial Movements (IAA)

|Jan|Feb|Mar|Apr|May|Jun|Jul|Aug|Sept|Oct|Nov|Dec|Total
2015|1,253|1,026|1,277|1,454|1,725|2,169|2,058|1,728|1,780|1,645|1,283|1,312|18,710
2016|1,222|1,128|1,390|1,488|1,807|2,031|2,032|1,834|1,839|1,698|1,353|1,327|19,149
2017|1,291|1,215|1,429|1,446|1,776|1,975|1,949|1,885|1,778|1,796|1,440|1,316|19,296
2018|1,301|1,200|1,368|1,575|1,829|2,098|2,104|1,949|2,066|1,858|1,385|1,369|20,102
2019|1,246|1,087|1,320|1,444|1,836|1,951|1,976|1,843|1,974||||
Change|-4.2%|-9.4%|-3.5%|-8.3%|+0.4%|-7.0%|-6.1%|-5.4%|-5.8%||||

shanec1928

Brennans Row wrote: »

Shannon - Commercial Movements (IAA)

|Jan|Feb|Mar|Apr|May|Jun|Jul|Aug|Sept|Oct|Nov|Dec|Total
2015|1,253|1,026|1,277|1,454|1,725|2,169|2,058|1,728|1,780|1,645|1,283|1,312|18,710
2016|1,222|1,128|1,390|1,488|1,807|2,031|2,032|1,834|1,839|1,698|1,353|1,327|19,149
2017|1,291|1,215|1,429|1,446|1,776|1,975|1,949|1,885|1,778|1,796|1,440|1,316|19,296
2018|1,301|1,200|1,368|1,575|1,829|2,098|2,104|1,949|2,066|1,858|1,385|1,369|20,102
2019|1,246|1,087|1,320|1,444|1,836|1,951|1,976|1,843|1,974||||
Change|-4.2%|-9.4%|-3.5%|-8.3%|+0.4%|-7.0%|-6.1%|-5.4%|-5.8%||||

Some big declines there.

Cosmo Kramer

Does anyone know what the anticipated passenger numbers are for Shannon this year - obviously they will drop but is it looking like a smaller drop back to about 2017 levels (1.75 million) or more of a crash back towards 1.5 million again?

Shn99

Cosmo Kramer wrote: »

Does anyone know what the anticipated passenger numbers are for Shannon this year - obviously they will drop but is it looking like a smaller drop back to about 2017 levels (1.75 million) or more of a crash back towards 1.5 million again?

Cork seems to know! 1.71m according to them

JamesBond2010

Shn99 wrote: »

Cork seems to know! 1.71m according to them

that biggest load of bull **** i saw on the planet. they only rteason they are surviving is cause the DAA are giving flights & have arrangements with some of the airlines to provide cork with some routes, they would be nothing otherwise. If they were that good norwegian wouldnt have left u even got subsidised parking when you flew with them from cork.

JamesBond2010

JamesBond2010 wrote: »

that biggest load of bull **** i saw on the planet. they only rteason they are surviving is cause the DAA are giving flights & have arrangements with some of the airlines to provide cork with some routes, they would be nothing otherwise. If they were that good norwegian wouldnt have left u even got subsidised parking when you flew with them from cork.

Were the DAA not been blamed here for the demise of Shannon. That there would be an aviation utopia once they were gone.

So now its because the DAA are still in Cork supplying so many routes ??

SleetAndSnow

JamesBond2010 wrote: »

that biggest load of bull **** i saw on the planet. they only rteason they are surviving is cause the DAA are giving flights & have arrangements with some of the airlines to provide cork with some routes, they would be nothing otherwise. If they were that good norwegian wouldnt have left u even got subsidised parking when you flew with them from cork.

"Cork is failing because of the DAA! Remove them and they will succeed!"

Has changed to

"Stupid DAA, They are the only reason Cork is more successful then us"

Which is it? Are they failing Cork or helping them?

JamesBond2010

SleetAndSnow wrote: »

"Cork is failing because of the DAA! Remove them and they will succeed!"

Has changed to

"Stupid DAA, They are the only reason Cork is more successful then us"

Which is it? Are they failing Cork or helping them?

Helping them enough so they so can barely survive but not enough that they can start to get bigger. DAA were always like that, Other 2 airports losses were always covered by dublin profits then. They only give you business which would not impact or have a negative effect on them.

GlenCurtis

Brennans Row wrote: »

Rare treat for plane spotters at Shannon ()

Aircraft and aviation enthusiasts enjoyed a very rare treat this week with the arrival of a 73-year-old Douglas DC-3 at Shannon Airport.

The twin turboprop plane flew almost 8 hours across the Atlantic from St John’s in Newfoundland, Canada and made an overnight stop at Shannon on Wednesday.

The official aircraft viewing area on the north side of Shannon’s main runway was thronged with plane buffs and other curious onlookers.

A line of step ladders could be seen along the security fence with every possible vantage taken to ensure photographers got their shot of a piece of aviation history.

************************************************************

I believe it started in Akron-Canton Ohio with its destination as Kenya, stops in St. Johns Canada, Shannon and Malta. Just like old times.

What will be the price though?

JamesBond2010

Deleted User wrote: »

Were the DAA not been blamed here for the demise of Shannon. That there would be an aviation utopia once they were gone.

So now its because the DAA are still in Cork supplying so many routes ??

50/50 Everyone thought it was a good idea @ the time. But in reality it turned out to be a disaster.


Deals 101 They agree to run some flights out of cork when they agree flights for dublin.

JCX BXC

The DAA element is not really anything to the argument. You can't switch from "The DAA is holding cork/Shannon back" to "The DAA is making cork better"

Really, it just proves their effect was minimal.

JamesBond2010

Unless u can break the Monopoly of the DAA. Its always going to be like this

highlydebased

DAA can easily give Cork a leg up as much as they want to - they have the relationships that clearly deliver. Start a route from Cork and X deal on fees at Dublin. It's also a known fact they will do certain details at Dublin if the airline stays away from other airports in the state.