Who can see Private Hosted Forums?

PhlegmyMoses

Be nice if the people that are here to tell people that they didn't follow the guidelines told one of their own that they didn't follow the guidelines.

It felt like the admin in particular was looking to be offended. How hard would it have been to PM one of our HMods with a warning saying you'd audited a couple of posts and that some were a bit over the line and needed to be toned down? That the rules were changing a bit?

Instead, we had official posts from an admin and Dav for an offence that will be seen hundreds of times over the next few days on the site that won't even register on that level of user's radar.

I get that the privacy of private forums is not iron clad, but trawling through three week old posts and infracting them seems a bit much.

Quazzie

I gotta admit that the idea that Admins are reading through private forums where people are posting some very private information is a bit off-putting.

With no real definition of what is and isn't "admin duty" they can basically look through it as they please.

Lovely Bloke

Safe to assume then that the Admins read PM's as they please also then, they have denied that they do this previously but as we now know these denials mean very little from this particular group of Admins

Zaph

Baldy Conscience wrote: »

Safe to assume then that the Admins read PM's as they please also then, they have denied that they do this previously but as we now know these denials mean very little from this particular group of Admins

Admins don't, and never have had the ability to read PMs. It is not technically possible with the tools available to us.

Micky Dolenz

Baldy Conscience wrote: »

Safe to assume then that the Admins read PM's as they please also then, they have denied that they do this previously but as we now know these denials mean very little from this particular group of Admins

Ah here. You have no understanding of the framework boards.ie has in place if you thought that,. Don't be scaremongering for the sake of it.

Private messages ain't read unless they are reported (triangle symbol in right bottom of text)
or the tech lads really need too I.E Court order.

Long story short, use email.

Xavi6

Micky Dolenz wrote: »

Ah here. You have no understanding of the framework boards.ie has in place if you thought that,. Don't be scaremongering for the sake of it.

Private messages ain't read unless they are reported (triangle symbol in right bottom of text)
or the tech lads really need too I.E Court order.

Long story short, use email.

Well it's only natural to question everything after something you were told is in fact a lie.

The long and the short of it is, once it stays private, the Admins won't get involved.

Still no word Berutal, must have had very important real life business to attend to all day :rolleyes:

LoLth

Xavi6 wrote: »

Well it's only natural to question everything after something you were told is in fact a lie.

you forgot to read the rest of the relevant bit:

The long and the short of it is, once it stays private, the Admins won't get involved. However, Admins do have access to every forum on the site and occasionally dip in and out of some to make sure no one's doing something they shouldn't.

Quazzie

LoLth wrote: »

you forgot to read the rest of the relevant bit:

What is the role of the HMod so?

event

Still no response to ShiverinEskimos question then, no?

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=88949809&postcount=68
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=88950682&postcount=77

He's asked it twice now, just in case ye missed it

Xavi6

LoLth wrote: »

you forgot to read the rest of the relevant bit:

Nope, I didn't forget. The wording is disingenuous so you should change it going forward so others aren't misled.

Lovely Bloke

LoLth wrote: »

you forgot to read the rest of the relevant bit:

that's typical of the kind of responses from Admins - ignore the bits you don't want to answer like the questions weren't asked.

Look, you got the outcome you all wanted, time to drop the bull.

Dav

Dav wrote: »

Honestly, we've got enough to be looking at without worrying about what people in private forums are talking about unless we're specifically asked to go and look at something.

Quite a U-turn huh Dav in the space of a few weeks? I'd wager that Beruthiel among others helped themselves to the information on that forum quite regularly from the looks of things, even though some of the subject matter was very private which is absolutely pathetic.

There was absolutely nothing going on which went against what the site/site owner told us was ok 5 years ago. The way you all have tried to paint us is nothing short of laughable though I have to say. It's the Thunderdome/Poker forum(I'm sure there has been more) debacle all over again.

Quazzie wrote: »

With no real definition of what is and isn't "admin duty" they can basically look through it as they please.

It has been done quite regularly too from what I can see. The fact they don't see anything wrong with it is even worse. I won't be wasting my time discussing it anymore that's for sure.

LoLth

Xavi6 wrote: »

Nope, I didn't forget. The wording is disingenuous so you should change it going forward so others aren't misled.

so you ignore it? how is it disingenuously worded?

admins do have access to all forums on boards.ie (seeing as its posted in a section dealing with hosted forums its not too much of a leap to assume that hosted forums are covered by that or is "all forums" too vague?)

occasionally dip in and out of some to make sure no one's doing something they shouldn't : occasionally implies irregular and infrequent timings. and the reason for the dipping in and out? to make sure no-one's doing something they shouldn't.


@event: that's not up to me to answer. I have given my thoughts on it already, in a response to Shiverineskimo.

@Quazzie: hmod roles are the same as mod roles, just for private forums. Just like mods you have admin oversight. You just don't have the Cmod tier.

Kold

The statement was that admins don't go into the forums without just cause. This was made 2 weeks ago. Beruthial's actions today go to show that this isn't the case. It's clear that she was having a peek and probably has done many times. Out of nothing more than a dislike of the members, waiting to pounce on something.
Whilst it's always been a possibility, I've posted personal things in that forum under confidence that as long as we behaved within the constraints that were explained to us that this wouldn't be read by strangers. Now I have to review my posting in regards to personal information and I would urge everyone else on this site to do the same.
Some admins seemingly have agendas and they can in fact read your 'private' forums. Not saying they do. Saying one does.

Still not a peep out of Beruthial. Considering the warning was for saying mean things about another user, implying cowardice, I find it hugely ironic that she was gone for the radio silence approach since she caused this mess with her impulsive and emotion driven rash judgement.

There has been an awful lot of circular debate led by the Admins on this also, designed to avoid the very clear and very simple question of why we were given a rule by Dav, and then Beruthial, because she was being sensitive that someone said something mean about her pal, decides that this rule no longer applies, just because. That's a very simple question to answer and yet if I get a reply I expect, given the trends so far, for it to be to my 1st paragraph, with some high and mighty BS about how she's not a coward but a stromg independent woman, or some BS to that effect, with no acknowledgement whatsoever of this very simple question.

Kangaroo court type stuff lads. Beruthial, you should be ashamed of yourself.

MugMugs

Would a lot of this conversation not be better suited to the Hmod forum ?

ShiverinEskimo

MugMugs wrote: »

Would a lot of this conversation not be better suited to the Hmod forum ?

No - since it concerns all users of private forums on Boards I don't think it should be had in a place the vast majority of those users can't view.

ShiverinEskimo

LoLth wrote: »

so you ignore it? how is it disingenuously worded?

admins do have access to all forums on boards.ie (seeing as its posted in a section dealing with hosted forums its not too much of a leap to assume that hosted forums are covered by that or is "all forums" too vague?)

occasionally dip in and out of some to make sure no one's doing something they shouldn't : occasionally implies irregular and infrequent timings. and the reason for the dipping in and out? to make sure no-one's doing something they shouldn't.

This *might* go some way toward explaining what Beruthiel was doing trawling through weeks-old posts looking for an infringement.

It doesn't explain why she decided what I posted was an infringement and why she infracted me in direct contradiction to the guidelines set out by Dav.

LoLth wrote: »

@event: that's not up to me to answer. I have given my thoughts on it already, in a response to Shiverineskimo.

Correct. Only one person can answer it. See my 'deafening silence' comment above though in that regard.

Boggles

Quazzie wrote: »

It really made me wonder are we wrong in assuming that what we post in there is private and how big is the audience.

I assume now you know that the audience could be at least as big as whoever has access to the "private" forum, not just by invite but by pure database privilege.

My advice would be don't say anything in the private forum you are attached to, that you wouldn't be comfortable with everyone else knowing. Kind of makes a mockery out of the title "private" but as we have discovered that's the reality.

Assume there will be a stranger in the wings quite liberally gourging themselves on your personal data, not just nipping in to keep an eye on ye just in case ye are organising a more militant remembrance of 1916, "whoHaw - better things to be doing - guff-ahh!" but trawling through the posts, trying to involve themselves in some sort of weird voyeuristic exercise.

Assume there are people that profoundly sad that has access to your "private" forum, but don't assume they will remain anonymous, assume sooner or later they won't be able to help themselves and will involve themselves.

Also definitely assume it won't change.

Over 24 hours later. Tick tock.

4zn76tysfajdxp

Deleted User wrote: »

Over 24 hours later. Tick tock.

In fairness, this is the kind of post that gives people who would rather not have this topic discussed an excuse to close the thread for going off-topic or descending into lunacy.

Quazzie

LoLth wrote: »

@Quazzie: hmod roles are the same as mod roles, just for private forums. Just like mods you have admin oversight. You just don't have the Cmod tier.

Do you go through all the forums checking up that they are being modded correctly or is it solely done to private forums?

Xavi6

Priscilla Massive Memorandum wrote: »

In fairness, this is the kind of post that gives people who would rather not have this topic discussed an excuse to close the thread for going off-topic or descending into lunacy.

And on the flip side, leaving people stewing for 24 hours is bound to stir the pot more than is necessary.

Why would you create a sh*t storm if you weren't going to be around to deal with the fall out?

I mean, the post in question was three weeks old so another day or two wouldn't have made any difference.

But no, the pin was pulled and the instigator ran and hid. Unsurprising though.

Priscilla Massive Memorandum

Priscilla Massive Memorandum wrote: »

In fairness, this is the kind of post that gives people who would rather not have this topic discussed an excuse to close the thread for going off-topic or descending into lunacy.

Fair enough, but it's no worse than opening up a giant can of worms, and then buggering off to radio silence for over 24 hours. It makes no difference really. They were never going to answer anyway, it's the classic Admin MO these days. So they were always going to close it.

Tbh, this is my last post on boards period. Which is a shame. I have been on this site for years. At one point I was a mod. I have always been a keen contributor. But more and more and more, stupid power trips have taken over from the values that this place once stood for in the 1st place. People in positions of power abusing this power for personal agendas and score settling, being backed up by the Admin Club, so instead of being called on their sh*t, even privately, they are clearly encouraged. And the only retort thus far has been "If you don't like it, get lost".

So it's time to take that one quite literally. I hope for this places sake that things improve, but the downwards trend has been drastic and consistent, and this latest debacle just confirmed it for me.

I truly do hope the Admins take a long hard look at how certain people are abusing their power, but I expect that nothing will change. Anyway, not my problem anymore. So long.

LoLth

Quazzie wrote: »

Do you go through all the forums checking up that they are being modded correctly or is it solely done to private forums?

I go through random forums at fairly random intervals (usually if I'm at a loose end). I do check that modding is being done by the moderators and if I see an incident that has not been addressed I have asked why in the past, as have the other admins. On more than one occasion I have felt the need to action a post without first bringing it to the attention of the mods of that forum or the category moderator.

we're the site admins. its an unfortunate part of our job description. The same question could be asked of mods by users "do you go through all the threads in a forum checking that users are posting correctly" - answer, not all of them, mods respond to the reported posts and do random dipping when time allows. I'm fairly sure that the admins check forums a lot less frequently than a mod checks threads (or at least I hope thats the case!)

I'll echo that Neil. I'm disgusted with this to be honest. Been great getting to know people on this site and I've made real friends out of it but I won't be part of something where you have people in power snooping on stuff you post in "private" amongst friends.

Auf wiedersehen

dr.bollocko

At the core we have a bunch of people speculating in the worst possible terms about how an admin behaved.... In fact being borderline insulting. While, on the other hand, as an observer with no stake, I am not an admin nor am I a member of the forum, I see admin replies and still have to say I see wrongdoing being described on the part of the community.

There is a certain mouthfoaming tinge to this wagon circling which I would wager is doing the forum no favours tbh.

It's unpleasant. It doesn't strike me as a useful start-point to any beneficial discussion.

Xavi6

dr.bollocko wrote: »

At the core we have a bunch of people speculating in the worst possible terms about how an admin behaved.... In fact being borderline insulting. While, on the other hand, as an observer with no stake, I am not an admin nor am I a member of the forum, I see admin replies and still have to say I see wrongdoing being described on the part of the community.

There is a certain mouthfoaming tinge to this wagon circling which I would wager is doing the forum no favours tbh.

It's unpleasant. It doesn't strike me as a useful start-point to any beneficial discussion.

Users wrong, admins right. Thanks for reiterating the party line.

And the forum is finished so nobody wants favours.

LoLth

Can we please stop with the speculation and personal attacks? It serves no purpose other than to shine a very unflattering light on the poster and convince me that that's the exact type of user I really dont want to have to listen to.

jesus guys, its a forum on the internet. Its a section of a bulletin board that you were allowed to use for your own purposes, free of charge and under the agreement that admins had oversight and that boards.ie rules applied. An admin crossed a line and posted a warning in a thread, not an infraction, not a card , not a ban. thats it. Its not the end of the world.

so please, stop the ****e and namecalling and drop the sense of entitlement. The favour that was done for you was not as perfect as you thought it was originally, it doesnt negate the use you got out of the forum for over 5 years.

I get that you feel uneasy that admins can read posts you've made that you feel are very important and personal. You wont believe me but I honestly dont care about your personal lives. My only concern, and I believe I speak for the other admins as well, is the site policies and rules in the interest of having a better forum for everyone. I couldnt be bothered reading your personal posts and I honestly dont think anyone should post ANYTHING online that they don't mind others reading. Either keep your identity separate or keep your posts non-sensitive.

I get that you are upset that the admin didnt respond here herself. Sometimes RL takes precedence, thats a policy we've always upheld and its one that we will never blame and mod , cmod or admin for. Personally, given some of the comments made here, I'm not sure a response is deserved at all.

Discuss the issue in a civilised manner or dont post. any more personal attacks will be dealt with as such.

Mitch Connor

dr.bollocko wrote: »

At the core we have a bunch of people speculating in the worst possible terms about how an admin behaved.... In fact being borderline insulting. While, on the other hand, as an observer with no stake, I am not an admin nor am I a member of the forum, I see admin replies and still have to say I see wrongdoing being described on the part of the community.

There is a certain mouthfoaming tinge to this wagon circling which I would wager is doing the forum no favours tbh.

It's unpleasant. It doesn't strike me as a useful start-point to any beneficial discussion.

What wrong doing on the part of the community though?

Everything in the forum is/was in line with the charter and rules explained to us. including calling anyone we want a knob head as long as it didn't overspill to the main site.

You can have an opinion that what was said wasn't nice, and shouldn't have been said, but that is all it is - an opinion. According the rules we were told to work under, it is allowed. The forum should not be threated with closure simply because you don't like what was said - if it is within the rules laid out, then your opinion doesn't matter.

This sums it up well:


The overall issue is that an Admin threatened to close the forum over a post made 3 weeks ago, with no just cause to be looking at it, which was within the rules.

How anyone can say that is fair or right is beyond me.