car hire, Hire company charging for scratches

homewardbound11

Hi,
I have a problem and need some thoughts on this.

I had a car hired out at copenhagen this week. The car had identified on the contract one scratch. I checked the car on rental and could not see any other scratches. There was not agent available at the car hire parking location.
On return I returned the car to the same pick up location. There were no scratches on the car during my rental period. Again on the rental return there were no agents available . This was even though it was during normal weekday hours????Only a note that the keys had to be returned to terminal 3. So having checked the car it was fine.

I returned the keys to terminal 3. Last night I checked my contract and it had an additinoal 5000DK addedto the bill. Immeaditely I contacted the terminal and they notified that there were scratches on the car. I said there were no additonal scratches on the car. So I was put through to terminal 3. So phone call after repeat phone call I get the engaged tone. I have repeated this and via e-mail but cant get a responce.
I feel there is a great degree of customer deception here. I rent cars many times during the year but this is the first time that I have had this issue.

Firstly on hire the agent never circled the original scratches. But luckily I read the contract and it was in it as a pre hire scratch in the details.
Then on the hiring the agent never asked me to sign the the contract.
This I only saw the next day as my signature was not on any of the two contract copies.

Lastly on return and this is the first time I have seen that an agent was not available on a week day at returns.
So I have returned a car that was in exactly the same condition as I hired it and I have no proof other than the rental company collecting the car and saying there is now a scratch.
I have asked for photographic proof but have had nothing in reply.
This car is most likely out on hire now so I any pictures are irrellevant. I feel rightly duped here.

Where can I take this ?

cml387

Don't give up. Keep at them, this is a scam perpetrated by all car hire companies if they can get away with it.They will give in if pushed enough.

Have you evidence of the scratch on the original rental agreement? It should have been marked on the "squashed car" diagram.

marozz

You should contact the customer relations department of the rental company by e-mail. Give them your story and demand proof that there was a new scratch on the car. Tell them you want photos and a copy of the signed pre-inspection form. Also threaten legal action if they cannot provide definitive proof that the was car damaged during your rental.

zbluebirdz

Talk to the Irish branch of the European Consumer Centre - they might be able to give you some advice/help:
http://www.eccireland.ie/popular-consumer-topics/car-rental/
http://www.eccireland.ie/faqs/car-rental/

- Not too sure if they have any "powers" in doing something against a company in another country ...

homewardbound11

Thanks bluebirdz,
Got a hold of the desk at terminal 3 Copenhagen.
They said they are going to their inspection dept to see what damage was reported. I have to head back there in 2 weeks but will definitely not be renting . I would prefer at this stage to taxi around. I can't name this company am very dissapointed a multinational would do this.

doublej

You have every right to provide other posters to a consumer board the name of the company that failed to meet with your approval.

I don't believe that all branches of every car hire firm operate in the way that you state has happened in Copenhagen but can see a potential for this type of dispute to become more commonplace.

I am noting a greater number of depots / return points that are not manned at times that could not be considered to be unsocial hours.

There was a post in this thread( not by OP ) that stated "all" of the car hire firms were charging their customers in a similarly dishonest fashion.

As the majority of hirers provide a credit card as security, if the level of abuse cited is widespread then surely the hirer is being put into a potentially expensive situation if there is no one at the depot to receive and check the returned car for marks, etc.?

Murt10

Get onto your credit card company and tell them that you are disputing the charge. They will charge the amount back to the hire company and they will have to prove that the money is due. The CC company is working for you.

I rented a car in Alicante airport last year and succeeded in getting a refund for damage to a wheel. The damage was there before I hired the car. I had, however, got the girl in the office to note the damage on the diagram in the contract. Still didn't stop them trying it on. Avant handled the matter for me.

If they mentioned a scratch without noting where it was on the diagram, I think that they have a weak case.

As I said they tried to charge me for damage that was already there. Chances are that thyey are trying to charge you for the original scratch.


While the amount is in dispute the CC company won't charge you interest on it.

homewardbound11

I will update all on this outcome but fear it will develop slowly.
Just a word of warning to all . Take photos of your car on return if no agent is present.

To think how much a rental company could make per car is unthinkable. 7 to 10 of rentals just like me would nearly cover the car pre vat.

It could be a solicitors letter to resolve this. Their incompetence and lack of staff has resulted in an additional large sun to my bill

dudara

doublej wrote: »

You have every right to provide other posters to a consumer board the name of the company that failed to meet with your approval.

You can leave that to the moderator team to decide.

dudara

dudara

homewardbound11 wrote: »

To think how much a rental company could make per car is unthinkable. 7 to 10 of rentals just like me would nearly cover the car pre vat.

In fairness, there are a lot more overheads and costs involved in running their business than just the cars. Thinking about it that way isn't really fair.

Some of the previous posters have given really good advice here. Look for evidence of the damage.

homewardbound11

dudara wrote: »

In fairness, there are a lot more overheads and costs involved in running their business than just the cars. Thinking about it that way isn't really fair.

Some of the previous posters have given really good advice here. Look for evidence of the damage.

Sorry but where did deception become part of the cost of running a business. No need to reply , I understand your point but is is not relative.

Fred Swanson

This post has been deleted.

doublej

This is unrealistic; if my flight is leaving at 6pm on a Friday but when I arrive at 4pm to the car hire return depot and find it to be unmanned it is suggested that I do NOT EVER leave the keys and car back without a returns inspection being done,
I don't want to spend an extra day or two away from home just because a car hire firm has chosen to rely upon the fact that they have my credit cars details and chosen to close early/ failed to roster to meet customer departure times.
There should be a clear process in place to allow for the protection of car hirers from additional charges when there has not been agreed visual verification by the company and hirer.
Anything less than this is a license to cheat by a small minority.
As payments are made to the company, how does the individual depot benefit?

sawdoubters

in Ireland when I take a car out I check the car 3 times,even a bit of dirt,when I come back they check the car

and tell me its ok and give me the document back,how much was the charge in euros


what company is it so we can see the policy,you can dispute it with the credit card company,did the insurance not cover damage,

how well did you check the car before you took it out

and when you brought it back

shedweller

doublej wrote: »

This is unrealistic; if my flight is leaving at 6pm on a Friday but when I arrive at 4pm to the car hire return depot and find it to be unmanned it is suggested that I do NOT EVER leave the keys and car back without a returns inspection being done,
I don't want to spend an extra day or two away from home just because a car hire firm has chosen to rely upon the fact that they have my credit cars details and chosen to close early/ failed to roster to meet customer departure times.
There should be a clear process in place to allow for the protection of car hirers from additional charges when there has not been agreed visual verification by the company and hirer.
Anything less than this is a license to cheat by a small minority.
As payments are made to the company, how does the individual depot benefit?

But if it is unmanned how is a customer supposed to have an inspection done? This being before check in time there will be little or no time to wait around. Not getting at you just a genuine question!

Gasherbraun

I rent cars abroad a lot and have never experienced an unmanned return but would just add the following.

The pre hire and after hire checks are effectively an inventory check of condition and I cannot see how such an 'inventory' can hold either party liable if not mutually signed off against - I do accept that small print may circumvent this.

Take good hi res photos on collection and return (most smart phone cameras are capable if used correctly) and all the better if the rental agency see you doing this.

I think if I was in a position of a non manned vehicle return then I would then email photos through as soon after return as possible. It just sends a message that the renter is aware.

For the record I have rented through many rental companies and never had a similar issue and would like to think that such problems are rare.

sham58107

Happened to me in France last yr first time ever in over 25 yrs,I had pictures which are a must,car was collected at hotel again after I had left,but hotel had security and cctv in locked underground car park.
Got on to credit card company and they said it was regular for this to happen, many emails to car hire and cc company got everything worked out got my 600 euro back in 3 weeks.
Lesson learned always give car back to company rep and get signed for,which I usually do.

doublej

If car hire companies are introducing a facility for hirers to return cars without those returned cars being inspected and any additional scratches or damage that THEY claim are the responsibility of the hirer then such a policy is inherently unfair. It is only possible because the car hire company have retained your cc details ; there is an imbalance in the burden of proof when the hirer is not in a position to conclusively disprove an assertion that damage has been noted after they have returned home.
Whilst camera phones are useful, I would suggest that the images taken by a hirer may not always be of the highest quality or may be affected by poor lighting or not taken at an angle that would show an absence of a dent or scratch .
As one of the posters suggested, this style of additional damage charges is happening frequently.
I don't believe that the majority of car hire firms do this but there is sufficient evidence that the practice is implemented with unfair consequences for the consumer.

keithclancy

homewardbound11 wrote: »

Firstly on hire the agent never circled the original scratches. But luckily I read the contract and it was in it as a pre hire scratch in the details.
Then on the hiring the agent never asked me to sign the the contract.
This I only saw the next day as my signature was not on any of the two contract copies.

This has happened to me a few times. When I initially go to collect the car I do a full inspection, more carefully so if it night time or the car is just after being washed/rained on.

I just take pictures of any Damage that is not marked on the sheet and then head back to the rental desk where I picked up the keys.

Every time I've gotten them to mark off the damage and never had a problem.

A lot of the time when marking off damage the do a sloppy job of it.

daheff

keithclancy wrote: »

This has happened to me a few times. When I initially go to collect the car I do a full inspection, more carefully so if it night time or the car is just after being washed/rained on.

I just take pictures of any Damage that is not marked on the sheet and then head back to the rental desk where I picked up the keys.

Every time I've gotten them to mark off the damage and never had a problem.

A lot of the time when marking off damage the do a sloppy job of it.

OP if you havent signed any contracts, then you are probably in the clear. If there is no written authorisation they cant charge your card afterwards.


I've had an issue once or twice with rental cars. One co charged me for damage to an alloy wheel when the car had hubcaps. They wouldnt provide evidence of it being an alloy.

If you are renting the best thing to do is buy excess insurance. No need to worry about dodgy charges, just claim it back on your insurance. It costs about 50eur...probably the same as if you bought the extra insurance off the car hire co.


I'd also bet that the people who get these dodgy charges are people who havent bought the extra insurance....so the carhire co is getting their money either way.

homewardbound11

O.k. an update
I got photos of the car .it had scuff marks on the plastic bumper no material dents and they photographed it at the rental returns apparently where I left it. The scuff mark was the length of a finger at the rear bottom and was about the width of 3 fingers. Actually in one photo I could not see it. they had no time or date on the photos.
Their address is appauling. They sent the rental agreement they had and sure my signature was on it so I have signed their copy. Their words were to sign the damage to the car on the rear of the document and return it so they can invoice me for a lower amount when the accessing had been done.
Utterly rediculous.v