Arsenal Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2013/14 mod warning post #5144

Mickeroo

Oranage2 wrote: »

I'd love to see it, he was great at city. Though I doubt wenger would sign a player with such a questionable character

He bid 40,000,001 for one in the summer so you never know.

12gauge dave

Ya he has improved since his move to milan and is still very young and is capable of anything at anytime on the pitch.
In my opinion potential to be one of the top top strikers in the world in a few years.

If he can keep focused and out of media attention he could be perfect for us.

Worth 40mill(the supposed ac milan valuation) not sure but if take a gamble if at 25mill if puma are paying the other 15.

Fuzzy_Dunlop

12gauge dave wrote: »

See when ozil was at madrid he had ronaldo benzema and great players around him and against much weaker opposition

At arsenal he has only giroud infornt of him who isnt very mobile so he cant be effective as he could be. Walcott upfront when he comes back should he an option considered.

Podolski is a big let down in my eyes this is a man who has scored how many goals for a top class german international side injuries aside he should be stepping up to the plate now and start banging them in and communicating well with ozil.

We really need players to step up to the plate now as we enter crunch time in the league ozil and podolski are two that could really make a difference if they step it up a gear imo

I don't know where you get the idea that podolski doesn't score goals for Arsenal

12gauge dave

Fuzzy_Dunlop wrote: »

I don't know where you get the idea that podolski doesn't score goals for Arsenal

I understand he scores goals but he scores them in bunches it seems he might score 4/5 goals in a month then do nothing for another month he hasnt quite found form or even a regular place in the team yet injuries have had held him back to be fair I am being harsh on him I know but I was just expecting more from him when he joined thats all.

ronjo

Fuzzy_Dunlop wrote: »

I don't know where you get the idea that podolski doesn't score goals for Arsenal

He has 5 goals in 5 starts plus 5 sub appearances this season.

Royale with Cheese

I'd take Fabregas back in a heartbeat. I know Ozil has only been here 6 months so he has plenty of time to grow into his role, but I never really get excited or expect anything amazing to happen when he's on the ball like I did when Fabregas had it.

Mickeroo

12gauge dave wrote: »

I understand he scores goals but he scores them in bunches it seems he might score 4/5 goals in a month then do nothing for another month he hasnt quite found form or even a regular place in the team yet injuries have had held him back to be fair I am being harsh on him I know but I was just expecting more from him when he joined thats all.

Tbf the bunches this season have come when he's played and the dry spells have been when he wasn't playing. 5 goals in 10 appearances is pretty good going.

Dolph Starbeam

Can't believe so many would take Balotelli at Arsenal. I wouldn't want him anywhere near the club. His attitude stinks, he did definitely show glimpses of his talent but he's not worth it. Can't be spending that kind of money on someone who will only play well when he's in the mood.

Manzoor14

12gauge dave wrote: »

I understand he scores goals but he scores them in bunches it seems he might score 4/5 goals in a month then do nothing for another month

Found this interesting as I though he was fairly consistent whenever he plays. Always likely to grab a goal every few games.

Went through every month since he signed. The most he's scored in a calendar month is 2 (I thought it would be higher!).

And the only months he hasn't scored since he signed are August and October 2012, March 2013 (he played 27 mins all month), Sept, Oct and Nov 2013 (he was injured for all 3 months) and February 2014.

However the stats might be slightly off as I noticed that beside Stephen's Day the last time he scored only 1 goal in a game was April 2013! :eek:

So it seems he pops up once a month, bangs in 2 goals in one game, then chills out until the next month! :P

Still, I love the guy! :pac:

Soups123

My feel with Pod is that he doesnt score often but often scores to pull us out of a whole. He is a squad player.

Players like him and Mert have changed the mentality in the team over the past 2 years

Spanish Johnny

Sorry all for clogging up the thread but I enjoyed this from Arseblog today. I sometimes get a bit baffled when we take offence to pundit and media criticism. In my opinion the majority of them make fair points in that we definitely have the hardest run in and thus write us off. Also we have failed to win a big game in the League this year bar maybe Liverpool at home so as I said before unless we win the League all these guys will be vindicated.




"The first thing to say is that it is possible to praise another team and still appreciate the merits of another. It’s not a necessity to qualify every positive thing you might say so as not to offend other people. The second thing is that we have been quietly chugging along, the little engine that could-style, winning games by a couple of goals and, let’s be honest, in a far less spectacular way than a team that’s been smashing in 5 or 6 goals a game on a semi-regular basis.




The third, and to my mind, the most crucial, thing is this: who gives a ****? The single most important thing is what the team does, not what the media thinks of what the team does. It shouldn’t be a personal affront if one journalist thinks City are more exciting, or Chelsea have the relentlessness to take them to the title. Much as you might disagree with it, or feel aggrieved about it, aren’t they entitled to hold that opinion?
There was, for some time, outrage every time Match of the Day was on this season because – to a man – none of them thought Arsenal could win the title. I get that. We’ve hardly challenged for 5 or 6 seasons, we’ve been brittle, despite some obvious qualities unconvincing over the course of whole seasons, and although we bought Mesut Ozil and brought in Mathieu Flamini, there was (and still is to a certain extent), a belief that we’d botched our attempts to bring in a top class striker.




So if Shearer or Hansen or Lawrenson or any of them had misgivings about us being able to last the pace, it was hardly at odds with the opinion of many fans who thought similar. If you’d asked me at the start of the season if I thought we could win it, or if I thought we’d be top now, I’d have said no. Obviously, I would want it to happen, but realistically speaking I didn’t think we’d be doing as well as we are.




So it’s not exactly an outrageous thing for people to say at the start of the season. Or a third of the way through it. Or even halfway through it. It’s worth remembering too that opinion is fluid and changes due to circumstances. Taking a fixed position on something, whichever end of the spectrum you’re at, and never budging regardless of what happens, is not healthy for your mind. So Arsenal doing well might make people think we can win the title, or it might not. It’s up to us to convince them, I suppose.




My opinion has changed from the start of the season. I think we can win it. It’ll be tremendously difficult, a massive challenge for this group of players, but based on what we’ve seen from this team this season my opinion is that it’s possible, if not probable. We’re still underdogs (but then I quite like that anyway).




The other thing to bear in mind is that there’s little or no goodwill towards most of these pundits. They’re an ex-Liverpool this, or a former Sp*rs that, so why is their validation so important? Why do people get so hung up on the opinions of people they can’t stand in the first place? Do you really need Robbie Savage or Michael Owen to perform a public about face, apologise for being a cretin and seek forgiveness? You really shouldn’t.
A journalist being critical of something Arsenal, Arsene, or the team do, doesn’t necessarily mean that journalist is anti-Arsenal. I’m sure that’s true in a few cases, those with loyalties to other clubs have been well known to stick the knife in from time to time, but you see, with monotonous regularity, writers with generally balanced and intelligent views being set upon as if they were Ashley Cole doing a poo on the bust of Herbert Chapman simply because they’ve dared to question something we’ve done or how we’ve done it. It’s bizarre.


The basic point is this: Arsenal are enjoying a great season so far. It promises much, there are trophies to fight for, big games to be played, and so far we’ve acqiutted ourselves brilliantly. We’re competing – properly competing at that – we’re defensively mean, offensively keen, and as efficient as we’ve been in what seems like an age.


But if your enjoyment of all of this is predicated on the need for journalists and rent-a-gob pundits to wax lyrical over Arsenal, might I respectfully suggest you’re doing yourself a disservice. If pissing in the wind is your thing, be my guest, but I’m quite content for us to keep chugging along.
What happens on the pitch is far more important than what ends up in print or on the airwaves.

cathalio11

I think there is a big difference between Balotelli and Suarez in terms of character.

Suarez does stupid things on the pitch that gives him a bad reputation, but Balotelli has been a poison behind the scenes for managers and players.

There is a close knit group at Arsenal and I'd hate to see Balotelli ruin that.
Suarez appears to be a player who is loved by his team-mates so that wouldn't be a problem.

Though if Wenger could keep a leash on Balotelli, I'd actually be more inclined to have him at the club.

cathalio11

Martin Tyler wrote: »

And now it's Walcott. And the road-runner is on his way.
Alonso - The last man back.
Releases it, Arshavin
FFFOOOOOOUUUUUUURRRRRRR

.

UnknownSpecies

Apparently Szczesny tried to convince Lewandowski to come to us.

ronjo

I saw an article that had the top 10 most important players in the run in.
Suarez was at number one. Is that not extremely odd??

There are 3 teams involved in an incredibly close title race.
10 or 11 teams can get relegated but its a player in a team whos aim is 4th most likely is the most important player. (yes I know that was very often us)

FWIW Giroud was 3rd on the list and Hazard 2nd.

gosplan

ronjo wrote: »

I saw an article that had the top 10 most important players in the run in.
Suarez was at number one. Is that not extremely odd??

There are 3 teams involved in an incredibly close title race.
10 or 11 teams can get relegated but its a player in a team whos aim is 4th most likely is the most important player. (yes I know that was very often us)

FWIW Giroud was 3rd on the list and Hazard 2nd.

I think the point was that he will single handedly dictate where Liverpool will finish.

Hazard, say, may have more of an impact on the title but Chelsea would be close enough without him too.

Without Suarez, Liverpool would struggle for Europa league places.

ronjo

gosplan wrote: »

I think the point was that he will single handedly dictate where Liverpool will finish.

Hazard, say, may have more of an impact on the title but Chelsea would be close enough without him too.

Without Suarez, Liverpool would struggle for Europa league places.

I know what you mean but they did alright at the start of the season if my memory serves me correct.
Kompany was high on the list too.

ronjo

Maybe I am just condescendingly looking down my nose at teams in a batlle for 4th!!

Childish I know considering our last few seasons

G1032

Royale with Cheese wrote: »

I'd take Fabregas back in a heartbeat. I know Ozil has only been here 6 months so he has plenty of time to grow into his role, but I never really get excited or expect anything amazing to happen when he's on the ball like I did when Fabregas had it.

I don't expect that Ozil will go on strike though to force a move and refuse to line out in a Champions League qualifier.......................

Mickeroo

ronjo

That flick from Giroud really was fantastic.

Nemeses2050

It's great when it comes off, but trying to do that everytime is not gonna work. It's OK against teams like Norwich who stand-off and admire the skill but against quick pressing teams it won't work. That's one thing I don't like about Giroud he tries to flick fecking every thing.

Soups123

Nemeses2050 wrote: »

It's great when it comes off, but trying to do that everytime is not gonna work. It's OK against teams like Norwich who stand-off and admire the skill but against quick pressing teams it won't work. That's one thing I don't like about Giroud he tries to flick fecking every thing.

Never did Denis B any harm. Flicks work in any game if done right

Nemeses2050

Soups123 wrote: »

Never did Denis B any harm. Flicks work in any game if done right

DB10 was a one-off a kind player, there's a day and night's difference between Bergkamp's touch/Vision/technical ability and Giroud's.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n275iW54o68

niallo27

gosplan wrote: »

I think the point was that he will single handedly dictate where Liverpool will finish.

Hazard, say, may have more of an impact on the title but Chelsea would be close enough without him too.

Without Suarez, Liverpool would struggle for Europa league places.

Liverpool also have a striker who has scored the same amount of league goals as arsenals 1st and 3rd highest goal scorers put together even though he missed the whole of December.

dvemail

I don't know about ye but I'm much happier with the goals being spread about the team rather than one player getting almost half the goals. We saw that with RVP and it didn't take him long to think he was bigger than the team.

niallo27

dvemail wrote: »

I don't know about ye but I'm much happier with the goals being spread about the team rather than one player getting almost half the goals. We saw that with RVP and it didn't take him long to think he was bigger than the team.

Ya it's great it is but all championship winning teams always had one stand out striker, van Persie, Rooney, Ronaldo, aguero, Henry. My point about sturridge was that everyone seems to forget about how lethal he is with Suarez around.

ronjo

niallo27 wrote: »

Ya it's great it is but all championship winning teams always had one stand out striker, van Persie, Rooney, Ronaldo, aguero, Henry. My point about sturridge was that everyone seems to forget about how lethal he is with Suarez around.

Which sort of proves my point that its weird that a striker for a team battling most likely for 4th is seen as the most important person in the run in because
a) the battle for 4th is far less important than the battle for title/relegation and
b) Liverpool have Sturridge scoring a goal a game anyway.

niallo27

ronjo wrote: »

Which sort of proves my point that its weird that a striker for a team battling most likely for 4th is seen as the most important person in the run in because
a) the battle for 4th is far less important than the battle for title/relegation and
b) Liverpool have Sturridge scoring a goal a game anyway.

I agree with you. I was more replying to the post saying Suarez with single handily dictate where Liverpool finish.

Mickeroo

niallo27 wrote: »

Ya it's great it is but all championship winning teams always had one stand out striker, van Persie, Rooney, Ronaldo, aguero, Henry. My point about sturridge was that everyone seems to forget about how lethal he is with Suarez around.

When Chelsea did back to back titles they didn't have one (drogba was there but only got 16 and 10 league goals respectively I think). Could be the exception to the rule though.

Soups123

niallo27 wrote: »

Liverpool also have a striker who has scored the same amount of league goals as arsenals 1st and 3rd highest goal scorers put together even though he missed the whole of December.

thats some random selection criteria

Arsenal have a much better spread of goals, the way they are currently and with the talent across the goals we are less reliant on any one person which is great.

But I do agree with the point championship winning teams usually have a stand out striker goals wise and we are missing that

ronjo

niallo27 wrote: »

I agree with you. I was more replying to the post saying Suarez with single handily dictate where Liverpool finish.

Suarez is easily the top scorer in the league and Sturridge is 3rd and only one goal behind 2nd.
Has it every happened before that a team has two players score so many and not really challenge for the title? (dont want to fully write Pool off but I think most people will agree that they wont challenge).

Soups123

niallo27 wrote: »

I agree with you. I was more replying to the post saying Suarez with single handily dictate where Liverpool finish.

Take Suarez out and you remove a large % of Sturridges goals, he really is huge for Liverpool and covers a lot of deficencies.

I think he is the most important player to any one club in the league, if Liverpool invest more around him they could really go places

niallo27

Soups123 wrote: »

Take Suarez out and you remove a large % of Sturridges goals, he really is huge for Liverpool and covers a lot of deficencies.

I think he is the most important player to any one club in the league, if Liverpool invest more around him they could really go places

Depends who you replace him with. I think sturidge would score goals in any team. Not knocking Suarez though he has been unreal. Enough talk about liverpool in here I think anyway. On arsenals point of view I think it would be some achievement to win a league with a top scorer of maybe 14 15 goals which giroud would finish on if he kept going the way he is.

Bobby Baccala

Fuzzy_Dunlop wrote: »

I don't know where you get the idea that podolski doesn't score goals for Arsenal

I'm with you there, 16 goals in his first season in the BPL isn't too shabby..

ronjo

niallo27 wrote: »

Depends who you replace him with. I think sturidge would score goals in any team. Not knocking Suarez though he has been unreal. Enough talk about liverpool in here I think anyway. On arsenals point of view I think it would be some achievement to win a league with a top scorer of maybe 14 15 goals which giroud would finish on if he kept going the way he is.

In the 5 seasons that Arsenal won the title that I remember the top league scorer has been

1989 Smith 23
1991 Smith 21
1998 Bergkamp 16
2002 Henry 24
2004 Henry 30

I guess goals were split in 98 as Wrighty was at the end of his career and Anelka was starting.
It would be unusual though as you say.

dinorebel

Saw this on Twitter.

Giving Juan Mata to David Moyes is like giving your Grandad a smartphone.

Gus99

ronjo wrote: »

I saw an article that had the top 10 most important players in the run in.
Suarez was at number one. Is that not extremely odd??

There are 3 teams involved in an incredibly close title race.
10 or 11 teams can get relegated but its a player in a team whos aim is 4th most likely is the most important player. (yes I know that was very often us)

FWIW Giroud was 3rd on the list and Hazard 2nd.

As Liverpool also have to play the Top 3, Suarez will also have an influence in that sense.

cathalio11

I agree with Suarez being first. Definitely deserves top 3.

If Arsenal didn't have Van Persie two seasons ago, chances are that it would have been warfare at the club for a while. He was easily the most important player in the league that season even if we weren't in the title race.

If Suarez guides Liverpool to 4th, he is less likely to leave and it will mark the return of Liverpool as a force.

Godge

niallo27 wrote: »

Ya it's great it is but all championship winning teams always had one stand out striker, van Persie, Rooney, Ronaldo, aguero, Henry. My point about sturridge was that everyone seems to forget about how lethal he is with Suarez around.

Is that really true? do you have statistics to back this up?

Mickeroo wrote: »

When Chelsea did back to back titles they didn't have one (drogba was there but only got 16 and 10 league goals respectively I think). Could be the exception to the rule though.

Don't think it is the exception.

ronjo wrote: »

In the 5 seasons that Arsenal won the title that I remember the top league scorer has been

1989 Smith 23
1991 Smith 21
1998 Bergkamp 16
2002 Henry 24
2004 Henry 30

I guess goals were split in 98 as Wrighty was at the end of his career and Anelka was starting.
It would be unusual though as you say.

Would it really be that unusual? We now have Chelsea's two wins with Drogba at 16 and 10 and Arsenal in 1998 with Bergkamp on 16. A quick look at a few of Utd.'s title wins shows:

In 1999, Yorke had 18 league goals and Cole 17 for Utd.
In 2000, Yorke managed to get up to 20 league goals with the rest spead round again.
In 2001, Teddy Sheringham had 15.
In 2007, Ronaldo had 17.

Hardly domination by one striker in those four years.

So without looking too hard, we now have at least seven of the last 15 years where the goals were shared around in the title-winning team (does someone else want to check the rest?) which kind of makes the assertion that every title-winning team has one stand-out striker look a bit silly. Many of them actually share the goals around in the same way that the current team do.

In fact, if you are to look at Arsenal's recent history, it is the seasons where Van Persie or Henry scored lots of goals and the rest of the squad contributed little that were least successful.

To me, it would seem that scoring goals is a necessary component of a title-winning team but as Utd. in particular have shown over the years, having those goals coming from a variety of sources (and therefore making you more difficult to defend against even by the better teams) is the surest way to title success. Liverpool have come unstuck a number of times this season when good defences have kept out Suarez and they have failed to conjure up a goal from somewhere else.

In an Arsenal context, think of the games over the last few seasons where Van Perise or previously Adebayor and Henry had an off-day and we couldn't find a goal from anywhere else.

Godge

Nemeses2050 wrote: »

It's great when it comes off, but trying to do that everytime is not gonna work. It's OK against teams like Norwich who stand-off and admire the skill but against quick pressing teams it won't work. That's one thing I don't like about Giroud he tries to flick fecking every thing.

The pass to the Ox for the second goal on Sunday wouldn't be classed as a flick. He got the ball, used his physical prowess to protect it and made sure the return pass of the 1-2 was into exactly the one place where it needed to be.

tayto lover

dinorebel wrote: »

Saw this on Twitter.

Giving Juan Mata to David Moyes is like giving your Grandad a smartphone.

Aw feck off. I'm a grandad. :mad::mad:














What's a Smartphone?

Maire2009

tayto lover wrote: »

Aw feck off. I'm a grandad. :mad::mad:




What's a Smartphone?

:P:P:P:P:P

ronjo

Godge wrote: »

Is that really true? do you have statistics to back this up?



Don't think it is the exception.



Would it really be that unusual? We now have Chelsea's two wins with Drogba at 16 and 10 and Arsenal in 1998 with Bergkamp on 16. A quick look at a few of Utd.'s title wins shows:

In 1999, Yorke had 18 league goals and Cole 17 for Utd.
In 2000, Yorke managed to get up to 20 league goals with the rest spead round again.
In 2001, Teddy Sheringham had 15.
In 2007, Ronaldo had 17.

Hardly domination by one striker in those four years.

So without looking too hard, we now have at least seven of the last 15 years where the goals were shared around in the title-winning team (does someone else want to check the rest?) which kind of makes the assertion that every title-winning team has one stand-out striker look a bit silly. Many of them actually share the goals around in the same way that the current team do.

In fact, if you are to look at Arsenal's recent history, it is the seasons where Van Persie or Henry scored lots of goals and the rest of the squad contributed little that were least successful.

To me, it would seem that scoring goals is a necessary component of a title-winning team but as Utd. in particular have shown over the years, having those goals coming from a variety of sources (and therefore making you more difficult to defend against even by the better teams) is the surest way to title success. Liverpool have come unstuck a number of times this season when good defences have kept out Suarez and they have failed to conjure up a goal from somewhere else.

In an Arsenal context, think of the games over the last few seasons where Van Perise or previously Adebayor and Henry had an off-day and we couldn't find a goal from anywhere else.

Hands up fair point.

My original question though was that Liverpool have two of top three scorers and isn't it unusual that they aren't really challenging in that situation.

shano_88

Ray Parlour was on Off the Ball earlier. Had some great stories about Wengers early years and the drinking culture in English football.

You will be able to listen back on it later on. Definetly worth a listen.

http://www.newstalk.ie/player/listen_back/launch

tayto lover

ronjo wrote: »

Hands up fair point.

My original question though was that Liverpool have two of top three scorers and isn't it unusual that they aren't really challenging in that situation.

Its because their defenders are rubbish.

enfant terrible

tayto lover wrote: »

Its because their defenders are rubbish.

Think that's an easy excuse for fans, keep buying new players until our problems are sorted.

Defending is more than the back four, look at the difference Pulis made to Palace defensively since he took over.

He got them organized and defending as a unit.

tayto lover

enfant terrible wrote: »

Think that's an easy excuse for fans, keep buying new players until our problems are sorted.

Defending is more than the back four, look at the difference Pulis made to Palace defensively since he took over.

He got them organized and defending as a unit.

I hope they play Kolo.

enfant terrible

tayto lover wrote: »

I hope they play Kolo.

He'll probably put in a stormer now.

Royale with Cheese

Hopefully there'll be more of this