Enterprise refurbishment comes closer?

GM228 · 19-11-2014 10:36am

SpaceTime wrote: »

Bring 29000 and 2700 into service on the Cork-Dublin route?
Would that not be commercial suicide?

No, the 2700s would replace ICRs currently in some Commuter workings freeing up more ICRs for the Cork line!

I didn't mean put 2700s on the Cork line, indeed that would be commercial suicide!

GM228

L1011 · 19-11-2014 2:15pm

I'd be delighted to have a 2x2700 - actual commuter stock built for standees, no vestibules and double leaf doors - over the 22k sets on the M3 line

csd · 19-11-2014 2:28pm

GM228 wrote: »

The extra MkIV was brought into service to release a 29000 to a special project and also for an ICR to Belfast, another MkIV will be back soon apparently to release an ICR for the project.

Ok I'll bite! What special project? Any hints?

/csd

LXFlyer · 19-11-2014 2:40pm

Renewal of the CAWS system.

end of the road · 19-11-2014 3:00pm

SpaceTime wrote: »

Bring 29000 and 2700 into service on the Cork-Dublin route?
Would that not be commercial suicide?

they would put the 2700s probably on limerick local services, the 2800s would come back to dublin and be probably banished to the rosslare line in turn freeing up ICRS for the cork line and the 2900s for all commuter workings. shur tis been that way for 10 years now so why change.

end of the road · 19-11-2014 3:01pm

L1011 wrote: »

I'd be delighted to have a 2x2700 - actual commuter stock built for standees, no vestibules and double leaf doors - over the 22k sets on the M3 line

they would certainly be suited to that line as 2 cars would be enough?

L1011 · 19-11-2014 3:03pm

end of the road wrote: »

they would certainly be suited to that line as 2 cars would be enough?

2 permanently coupled would be fine. I know the auto-couplers are useless on them

Captain Chaos · 19-11-2014 3:09pm

L1011 wrote: »

2 permanently coupled would be fine. I know the auto-couplers are useless on them

They have that issue sorted out now. The 2700s just need more regular maintenance than the 26 or 2800s. A 3 car set would be fine for the line, use one of the bubble units coupled to a set.

But bringing back the 270ss creates more problems than it solves. Driver training, maintenance training and stocking different spare parts as that have nothing in common with the 26/2800s.

GM228 · 19-11-2014 3:24pm

csd wrote: »

Ok I'll bite! What special project? Any hints?

/csd

The CAWS upgrade project!

GM228

end of the road · 19-11-2014 3:33pm

Captain Chaos wrote: »

They have that issue sorted out now. The 2700s just need more regular maintenance than the 26 or 2800s. A 3 car set would be fine for the line, use one of the bubble units coupled to a set.

But bringing back the 270ss creates more problems than it solves. Driver training, maintenance training and stocking different spare parts as that have nothing in common with the 26/2800s.

i agree, but we could do with them back eventually though. all though it won't happen as the 26 and 2800s won't have their gangways put back probably as it can't be done. typical waste

GM228 · 19-11-2014 3:38pm

end of the road wrote: »

i agree, but we could do with them back eventually though. all though it won't happen as the 26 and 2800s won't have their gangways put back probably as it can't be done. typical waste

All the 2600s still retain gangways, a lack of gangways won't stop any potential return!

GM228

end of the road · 19-11-2014 4:10pm

GM228 wrote: »

All the 2600s still retain gangways, a lack of gangways won't stop any potential return!

GM228

no but neither the 27 or 28 could operate as anything more then 2 cars. unless they gangways could be put back which is hardly likely?

L1011 · 19-11-2014 4:12pm

end of the road wrote: »

no but neither the 27 or 28 could operate as anything more then 2 cars. unless they gangways could be put back which is hardly likely?

There is no requirement for gangways, the 22s operate without often - any 7 car (and I think 8 is also an option now) is missing a gangway between sets

end of the road · 19-11-2014 4:42pm

L1011 wrote: »

There is no requirement for gangways, the 22s operate without often - any 7 car (and I think 8 is also an option now) is missing a gangway between sets

which stops movement between sets. not a good idea IMO

GM228 · 19-11-2014 4:54pm

end of the road wrote: »

which stops movement between sets. not a good idea IMO

Same issue with the DARTs! The 2800s still operate from time to time as 4 cars as did the 2700s before retirement!

GM228

L1011 · 19-11-2014 6:14pm

end of the road wrote: »

which stops movement between sets. not a good idea IMO

Without catering, the need to change sets is minimal

end of the road · 19-11-2014 6:28pm

L1011 wrote: »

Without catering, the need to change sets is minimal

i don't agree. i've often found the need to change sets if 1 carrige is to full or the heating hasn't worked on 1 set. they were bought with them so they should have been left.

SpaceTime · 19-11-2014 6:35pm

Why would they remove gangways?!

end of the road · 19-11-2014 6:47pm

SpaceTime wrote: »

Why would they remove gangways?!

i honestly don't know, i think it was absolutely a stupid thing to do. i understand the 2700 gangways being locked out because of the coupling problem but ridiculous removing them when they could have been permanently coupled in sets of 2 and 3 instead of remaining as 2 car. but its all irrelevant anyway as they most likely won't return to traffic and the 28s to dublin

L1011 · 19-11-2014 7:10pm

end of the road wrote: »

i don't agree. i've often found the need to change sets if 1 carrige is to full or the heating hasn't worked on 1 set. they were bought with them so they should have been left.

Neither of those are pressing concerns that can't be done at a station.

end of the road · 19-11-2014 7:24pm

L1011 wrote: »

Neither of those are pressing concerns that can't be done at a station.

wrong. both of those can be easily solved by a way of moving between sets while the train is moving rather then waiting for a station getting off one unit and on another unit and hoping you can get a seat. their removal was an idiotic decisian. i won't be convinced otherwise and won't be changing this stance.

L1011 · 19-11-2014 7:26pm

But it's zero impediment to use, despite your explicit claim to the contrary

end of the road · 19-11-2014 7:54pm

L1011 wrote: »

But it's zero impediment to use, despite your explicit claim to the contrary

i claimed nothing of the sort. i effectively said they were bought with gangways for a reason and they should have been left alone. i then gave reasons why i have used them in the past just as an add on.

L1011 · 19-11-2014 8:55pm

end of the road wrote: »

i claimed nothing of the sort. i effectively said they were bought with gangways for a reason and they should have been left alone. i then gave reasons why i have used them in the past just as an add on.

???

end of the road wrote: »

all though it won't happen as the 26 and 2800s won't have their gangways put back

end of the road · 19-11-2014 8:58pm

L1011 wrote: »

???

still not what you claimed i claimed

L1011 · 19-11-2014 9:00pm

end of the road wrote: »

still not what you claimed i claimed

Yes, it is. You claimed that the lack of gangways would prevent them being returned to service which this is patently untrue

If you didn't mean that, perhaps you should have phrased it differently - very differently!

end of the road · 19-11-2014 9:18pm

L1011 wrote: »

Yes, it is. You claimed that the lack of gangways would prevent them being returned to service which this is patently untrue

i claimed no such thing.

L1011 wrote: »

If you didn't mean that

re-reading it carefully will help you understand

L1011 wrote: »

perhaps you should have phrased it differently - very differently!

rubbish, i phrased it all perfectly.

L1011 · 19-11-2014 9:30pm

end of the road wrote: »

i claimed no such thing.

Yes, you did.

end of the road wrote: »

rubbish, i phrased it all perfectly.

If you did, you're now trying to get away from what you wrote.

There really is nothing further to be gained arguing this - its obvious for anyone else to see also. I'm not going to dignify your back-pedalling with another response.

GM228 · 19-11-2014 11:03pm

end of the road wrote: »

i agree, but we could do with them back eventually though. all though it won't happen as the 26 and 2800s won't have their gangways put back probably as it can't be done. typical waste

In fairness you did say it WON'T happen!

GM228

end of the road · 20-11-2014 2:54pm

GM228 wrote: »

In fairness you did say it WON'T happen!

GM228

yeah, that the 2700s won't return to traffic and the 2800s to dublin so the gangway issue is irrelevant.

GM228 · 20-11-2014 3:11pm

end of the road wrote: »

yeah, that the 2700s won't return to traffic and the 2800s to dublin so the gangway issue is irrelevant.

You never mentioned 2800s to Dublin, you specifically said "i agree, but we could do with them back eventually though. all though it won't happen as the 26 and 2800s won't have their gangways put back probably as it can't be done. typical waste".

Therefore it is clear that you stated a lack of gangways on 2600s (obviously incorrect) and 2800s means "it won't happen" in reference to a return of the 2700s!

GM228

LXFlyer · 20-11-2014 3:16pm

All of gangways is not an issue for multiple operation as can be seen across the country with ICRs operating in multiple, 29000s operating in multiple and 4 car 2800s operating on the WRC.

Suggesting otherwise is nonsense.

GM228 · 20-11-2014 3:21pm

lxflyer wrote: »

All of gangways is not an issue for multiple operation as can be seen across the country with ICRs operating in multiple, 29000s operating in multiple and 4 car 2800s operating on the WRC.

Suggesting otherwise is nonsense.

And the DARTs!

GM229

end of the road · 20-11-2014 3:25pm

lxflyer wrote: »

All of gangways is not an issue for multiple operation as can be seen across the country with ICRs operating in multiple, 29000s operating in multiple and 4 car 2800s operating on the WRC.

Suggesting otherwise is nonsense.

the 2800s were bought with gangways for a reason obviously. to facilitate moving from unit to unit. the WRC has so few passengers to make this an issue. whether they should have been bought with them or not i don't know, maybe not but they were and should have been left. thats my stance on the issue and i will not be budging.

GM228 · 20-11-2014 3:32pm

end of the road wrote: »

the 2800s were bought with gangways for a reason obviously. to facilitate moving from unit to unit. the WRC has so few passengers to make this an issue. whether they should have been bought with them or not i don't know, maybe not but they were and should have been left. thats my stance on the issue and i will not be budging.

The WRC may have very few passengers to make it an issue but what about the DART which may have 1000s of passengers spread over four 2-car sets so passenger numbers don't come into play! The 2700s and 2800s only had gangways as IE requested them in the first place, if they feel fit to remove them that's their choice!

The DMUs have spent a greater number of years with the gangways not used than used!

GM228

L1011 · 20-11-2014 3:42pm

end of the road wrote: »

the 2800s were bought with gangways for a reason obviously. to facilitate moving from unit to unit. the WRC has so few passengers to make this an issue. whether they should have been bought with them or not i don't know, maybe not but they were and should have been left. thats my stance on the issue and i will not be budging.

You appear to be confusing opinion with fact

end of the road · 20-11-2014 3:49pm

L1011 wrote: »

You appear to be confusing opinion with fact

i'm not.

Rashers72 · 03-12-2014 10:29pm

That 5 carriage ICR seems under serious pressure on the 19.00 Dublin to Belfast service. Sitting ride beside an 8 carriage suburban service to Dundalk, with capacity (i.e. 90% seats gone).

Captain Chaos · 27-12-2014 4:03am

An update showing the final Enterprise livery along with the unfinished livery on 209.

Thanks to Chris Playfair for his photos showing the second coach to be painted along with the new logo. Looks very Deutsch Bahn ICE to me. Can't wait to see a 201 fully finished out with the red stripes.

http://chrisplayfair.smugmug.com/Travel/2014-Photos/Ireland-December-2014/46120607_wj52Vt#!i=3783740550&k=bGMRgTM

metrovick001 · 27-12-2014 11:59am

Looks very well.

Captain Chaos wrote: »

An update showing the final Enterprise livery along with the unfinished livery on 209.

Thanks to Chris Playfair for his photos showing the second coach to be painted along with the new logo. Looks very Deutsch Bahn ICE to me. Can't wait to see a 201 fully finished out with the red stripes.

http://chrisplayfair.smugmug.com/Travel/2014-Photos/Ireland-December-2014/46120607_wj52Vt#!i=3783740550&k=bGMRgTM

SpaceTime · 27-12-2014 12:10pm

Looks a little like the new TGV colours too.

http://tgvrhinrhone.files.wordpress.com/2011/09/dsc01565.jpg

GM228 · 27-12-2014 3:37pm

Captain Chaos wrote: »

An update showing the final Enterprise livery along with the unfinished livery on 209.

Thanks to Chris Playfair for his photos showing the second coach to be painted along with the new logo. Looks very Deutsch Bahn ICE to me. Can't wait to see a 201 fully finished out with the red stripes.

http://chrisplayfair.smugmug.com/Travel/2014-Photos/Ireland-December-2014/46120607_wj52Vt#!i=3783740550&k=bGMRgTM

Looks well! Has the carriage actually been refurbished already or just painted first?

GM228

Captain Chaos · 27-12-2014 5:34pm

GM228 wrote: »

Looks well! Has the carriage actually been refurbished already or just painted first?

GM228

It's just been painted, it's just a shell inside, no seats or anything. You can see they installed new buttons for opening the doors. It's the second coach to be painted so far.

I was under the impression they were to be shipped off to France for the refit so I'm a bit surprised to see painted shells rolling around York Road already.

corktina · 27-12-2014 5:34pm

new paint isn't any substitute for first class rolling stock

Captain Chaos · 27-12-2014 5:41pm

corktina wrote: »

new paint isn't any substitute for first class rolling stock

As in point being....

The De Detrich rolling stock is the finest rolling stock in the country for comfort as it currently stands. This new refurb is only going to raise the bar.

Irish rail should have ordered 8 sets of these with DVGTs in the formations for the Cork line instead of going to CAF with the Mk4s.

end of the road · 27-12-2014 6:07pm

Captain Chaos wrote: »

It's just been painted, it's just a shell inside, no seats or anything. You can see they installed new buttons for opening the doors. It's the second coach to be painted so far.

I was under the impression they were to be shipped off to France for the refit so I'm a bit surprised to see painted shells rolling around York Road already.

i think they are being refurbished in scotland with some work at york road? couldn't tell you for definite though but its what i'm lead to believe.

SpaceTime · 27-12-2014 6:08pm

They'd be Alstom now as De Dietrich sold off its rail division before the MK4 was built.

CAF is one of the companies doing the Enterprise refurbishment btw...

GM228 · 27-12-2014 11:39pm

end of the road wrote: »

i think they are being refurbished in scotland with some work at york road? couldn't tell you for definite though but its what i'm lead to believe.

As far as I know all work is being done at York Road, the Belmond Mk3s are going to Scotland for refurb-perhaps that's what your thinking?

GM228

end of the road · 27-12-2014 11:59pm

GM228 wrote: »

As far as I know all work is being done at York Road, the Belmond Mk3s are going to Scotland for refurb-perhaps that's what your thinking?

GM228

ah yeah i know the mark 3s are off to scotland. for some reason i believed the de-deitricks were going over as well but to a different place. but it could have been something lost in translation all right.

LXFlyer · 19-05-2015 9:07pm

A second Enterprise set will be removed from service from 25 May.

The following departures will now be operated by a 6 coach NIR CAF set, without 1st Class or full catering:

Monday-Saturdays:
Ex-Belfast: 06:50, 12:35, 18:05
Ex-Connolly: 09:35, 15:20, 20:50

Sundays:
Ex-Belfast: 11:05
Ex-Connolly: 14:00

Also, from Monday 1st June, there will be some Enterprise timetable changes:

19:00 Dublin-Belfast will be accelerated by 10 minutes, arriving at Belfast Central at 21:05

21:35 Belfast-Dublin will be advanced to 21:15 arriving at Connolly at 23:12

Enterprise refurbishment comes closer?

Comments