Enterprise refurbishment comes closer?

cargo

end of the road wrote: »

there are no new carriges. the current enterprise stock is being overhauled and refurbished. i should imagine they will be tested before re-entering service

Sorry, let me rephrase that. Any sign of the current enterprise stock having been overhauled and refurbished returning to service?

Captain Chaos

Spotted 8208 outside Connolly shed earlier facing the wrong way round from it's testing duties. It's going to have to run light engine back to Belfast to turn it or it may haul the current set with no2 end leading which would be a sight not seen since 1997.

Losty Dublin

Captain Chaos wrote: »

Spotted 8208 outside Connolly shed earlier facing the wrong way round from it's testing duties. It's going to have to run light engine back to Belfast to turn it or it may haul the current set with no2 end leading which would be a sight not seen since 1997.

Could 8208 be turned on either the Connolly or Inchicore turntables?

Captain Chaos

Losty Dublin wrote: »

Could 8208 be turned on either the Connolly or Inchicore turntables?

Nope, not a hope.

When the Mk3 EGVs were being converted for Enterprise work one had to be turned, so it was hauled from Inchicore to Limerick Junction, turned on the triangle and back to Connolly for transfer on to York Road. Don't know why it could not have been down at Belfast but I'm sure there was a reason at the time.

Hungerford

Captain Chaos wrote: »

Spotted 8208 outside Connolly shed earlier facing the wrong way round from it's testing duties. It's going to have to run light engine back to Belfast to turn it

You're telling me that the refurbished Enterprise sets can only be driven from one cab on each loco? This project is starting to sound like a farce.

Hungerford

Captain Chaos wrote: »

Don't know why it could not have been down at Belfast but I'm sure there was a reason at the time.

Lack of a spare loco with NIR safety gear?

Captain Chaos

Hungerford wrote: »

You're telling me that the refurbished Enterprise sets can only be driven from one cab on each loco? This project is starting to sound like a farce.

The 201s were always turned with the no1 end cab leading due to driver comfort as the no2 end cab is very loud in when in HEP mode. Also the change over valve for changing ends to drive from the DVT is only located in the no1 cab, it saves the driver having to go from cab 1 to 2 to the DVT to change ends.

As it is now only the no1 end cab has the new MMI screen fitted and only the no2 end of the loco has the MMI socket connection to connected to the refurb Enterprise stock. Basically if 8208 is turned it means the rufurb set was turned as well during testing.

It's a non issue as all sets have been facing the same way for 18 years, they only get turned for odd situations. Having the loco on the north facing end of the set makes it easier to swap out locos in Connolly and at York Road.

Hungerford wrote: »

Lack of a spare loco with NIR safety gear?

Doubt that was it because on at least two occasions non TPWS locos have transfered EGVs. 221 took all 4 from Inchicore to York Road and another time 082 took two from Inchicore to York Road.

GM228

Captain Chaos wrote: »

The 201s were always turned with the no1 end cab leading due to driver comfort as the no2 end cab is very loud in when in HEP mode. Also the change over valve for changing ends to drive from the DVT is only located in the no1 cab, it saves the driver having to go from cab 1 to 2 to the DVT to change ends.

As it is now only the no1 end cab has the new MMI screen fitted and only the no2 end of the loco has the MMI socket connection to connected to the refurb Enterprise stock. Basically if 8208 is turned it means the rufurb set was turned as well during testing.

It's a non issue as all sets have been facing the same way for 18 years, they only get turned for odd situations. Having the loco on the north facing end of the set makes it easier to swap out locos in Connolly and at York Road.



Doubt that was it because on at least two occasions non TPWS locos have transfered EGVs. 221 took all 4 from Inchicore to York Road and another time 082 took two from Inchicore to York Road.

All the Enterprise sets have been turned prior to refurbishment via GVS and so 8208 was turned to enable testing, they will be re-turned prior to re-entry into service which has been deferred from the 21st until at least October.

The MMI is to be fitted in both cabs of the 201s and there is a possability the MMI cables will also eventually be fitted to both ends and to the DVTs cab fronts to enable a 201 work the train from the DVT if required.

GM228

Captain Chaos

It's odd to see that with the last set removed from service on Sunday evening, 227 is still on standby at Connolly with a dellner coupler. Suppose it has nowhere else to be or go for the time being.

I think 207 is next out of the paint shop as there has been no sign or her for a few weeks now.

GM228

Captain Chaos wrote: »

It's odd to see that with the last set removed from service on Sunday evening, 227 is still on standby at Connolly with a dellner coupler. Suppose it has nowhere else to be or go for the time being.

I think 207 is next out of the paint shop as there has been no sign or her for a few weeks now.

AFAIK a stanby loco is required in Connolly at all times even when there is no Enterprise to cover for any failures on the Connolly side.

207 (and 228) are under overhaul.

228 should return in green/silver but will be interesting to see if it has the new logos removed or a white version like on the 071s.

GM228

cgcsb

A novice question but following this refurbishment and works on the viaduct in Drogheda, will there be any improvement in journey time?

At present I cannot get from Belfast into Dublin before 9am and the journey takes well over 2 hours, that is the problem with the service, the colour of the stripes on the side are of little consequence.

flyingsnail

cgcsb wrote: »

A novice question but following this refurbishment and works on the viaduct in Drogheda, will there be any improvement in journey time?

At present I cannot get from Belfast into Dublin before 9am and the journey takes well over 2 hours, that is the problem with the service, the colour of the stripes on the side are of little consequence.

I doubt there would be change to the speed once the works are finished but even if there was it would have no impact on the current timetable given the curvature of Drogheda station and the fact that most trains stop there means they are always going to be going slow through that area.

GM228

cgcsb wrote: »

A novice question but following this refurbishment and works on the viaduct in Drogheda, will there be any improvement in journey time?

At present I cannot get from Belfast into Dublin before 9am and the journey takes well over 2 hours, that is the problem with the service, the colour of the stripes on the side are of little consequence.

No there is no time improvements associated with the works or refurbishment programme.

GM228

GM228

Losty Dublin wrote: »

Could 8208 be turned on either the Connolly or Inchicore turntables?

Inchicore turntable can and has turned 201s in the past.

GM228

cgcsb

Seems like a waste of time/money if there's no tangible benefits for passengers.

flyingsnail

cgcsb wrote: »

Seems like a waste of time/money if there's no tangible benefits for passengers.

If you are talking about the viaduct then the tangible benefit is to passengers is that there is no further reduction in the speed limit and it is not left fall into disrepair where closure or replacement are your options.


If you are talking about the carriage overhauls then the tangible benefit to the passenger is that they keep working. The enterprise stock will be 20 years old next year and the refurbishment is not just a cosmetic refit but also includes a major mechanical overhaul along with some new improvements like a new passenger information system, electronic passenger reservation and new CCTV.

Captain Chaos

GM228 wrote: »

228 should return in green/silver but will be interesting to see if it has the new logos removed or a white version like on the 071s.

GM228

Most likely the same logo as 215 got I'd have thought.

GM228

Captain Chaos wrote: »

Most likely the same logo as 215 got I'd have thought.

215 got the standard tri-colour logo, however this logo is not permitted on cross-border fitted stock so either no logo (like on cross border 22000s) or a white or black logo will be required.

GM228

L1011

GM228 wrote: »

215 got the standard tri-colour logo, however this logo is not permitted on cross-border fitted stock so either no logo (like on cross border 22000s) or a white or black logo will be required.

GM228

Not permitted? I'd love to see whatever pathetic reasoning is given there. Never a problem with Are Lingus carrying tricolours - actual, not hinted - on their livery to Belfast when state owned

cgcsb

flyingsnail wrote: »

If you are talking about the viaduct then the tangible benefit is to passengers is that there is no further reduction in the speed limit and it is not left fall into disrepair where closure or replacement are your options.


If you are talking about the carriage overhauls then the tangible benefit to the passenger is that they keep working. The enterprise stock will be 20 years old next year and the refurbishment is not just a cosmetic refit but also includes a major mechanical overhaul along with some new improvements like a new passenger information system, electronic passenger reservation and new CCTV.

I see, a maintenance exercise rather than an improvement, still disappointing that nothing is being done to improve the service, especially considering the amount of money going into more roads.

Captain Chaos

cgcsb wrote: »

I see, a maintenance exercise rather than an improvement, still disappointing that nothing is being done to improve the service, especially considering the amount of money going into more roads.

He said in the post it's not just cosmetic or mechanical. There are comfort improvements for passengers. Better online booking systems, new seats being fitted to the standing bar area of the buffet coaches, better PA system, new carpets and seat fabrics.

The comfort and ride quality of the Enterprise stock is already better than anything else as it is. The only thing possible that can improve the service is to build a dedicated double track line with 100mph running the whole way to Belfast out over Dublin bay and up the coast by Drogheda and that's not going to happen ever. And before someone says the Enterprise stock is 90mph limited they were tested up to 100mph on the Cork line and the northern line was only ever upgraded for 90mph running in certain parts.

cgcsb

Captain Chaos wrote: »

He said in the post it's not just cosmetic or mechanical. There are comfort improvements for passengers. Better online booking systems, new seats being fitted to the standing bar area of the buffet coaches, better PA system, new carpets and seat fabrics.

Fur coat and no nickers if you ask me. The speed needs to be improved, especially the northern half, the train crawls along past Dundalk.

I'd rather serious money be spent on improving/realigning the track.

Jamie2k9

L1011 wrote: »

Not permitted? I'd love to see whatever pathetic reasoning is given there. Never a problem with Are Lingus carrying tricolours - actual, not hinted - on their livery to Belfast when state owned

Very different from a security prospective all the same

GM228

L1011 wrote: »

Not permitted? I'd love to see whatever pathetic reasoning is given there. Never a problem with Are Lingus carrying tricolours - actual, not hinted - on their livery to Belfast when state owned

Planes carry a flag from their country from where the carrier is based which is fine, however a logo is a didferent story!

Basically because the new tri-colour logo is similar to the tri-colour flag it is not permitted under the Good Friday Agreement and also more specifically in another agreement (can't think of it off-hand) which require the use of public logos, symbols and emblems to have a neutral look and no similarities to any of the various flags which have caused divisions in the North, that is why the new tri-colour logo is removed on the 22000s.

The Enterprise is also exempt from the Official Languages Act which requires Irish announcements when in the South for similar reasons.

GM228

StonyIron

Planes also don't trundle through loyalist areas or get stones thrown at them. They operate from one highly secure airport to another highly secure airport.

Trains are far more exposed and the Enterprise has been hijacked and attacked before.

There are political sensitives up north that are very irrational but, it makes more sense to be politically neutral in branding.

In general, for cross border brands you're better off to avoid all politics and just stick to something neutral.

I don't want to get into a political debate but I think we should be keeping the crossborder train services beyond anything politically charged.

It's pathetic that we still have people who behave like that but, it's a common sense measure really.

end of the road

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

Very different from a security prospective all the same

not when a 29 is sent up to belfast it isn't. its as obvious as the day is long to anyone who may be wanting to do something that these trains belong to the south and not the north

Jamie2k9

end of the road wrote: »

not when a 29 is sent up to belfast it isn't. its as obvious as the day is long to anyone who may be wanting to do something that these trains belong to the south and not the north

No flag displayed on 29000 that have been sent up North, would expect a set or two will get plain white logo also.

Captain Chaos

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

No flag displayed on 29000 that have been sent up North, would expect a set or two will get plain white logo also.

Some 29s have a mix of white only and tri colour logos as it is. I personally don't like the logo with the tri colour on it, it looks St Patrick's Day style tacky imo.

GM228

Captain Chaos wrote: »

Some 29s have a mix of white only and tri colour logos as it is. I personally don't like the logo with the tri colour on it, it looks St Patrick's Day style tacky imo.

The 29000s with the white logos are ones which have had graffiti removed from the bodysides, the graffiti removal chemicals strip the colours off the vinyls leaving them white!

The repainted sets are not permitted to cross the border now and a standard set is supposed to be used but I'm sure some will slip through the net! There won't be unpainted ones forever!

GM228

end of the road

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

No flag displayed on 29000 that have been sent up North, would expect a set or two will get plain white logo also.

i know, but the fact its green is a give away