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Can developers do this?!!

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245

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    #32
    CONM
    Registered Users Posts: 166 ✭✭CONM


    helimachoptor wrote: »
    Surely after what has happened the last number of years and that the Government is now the majority stakeholder in the banks it is my business, and yours and everyone elses.

    Sorry i do realise we are going of topic, but if he is going back to the banks to arrange deals, I feel that in order to minimise risk to the tax payer developers should be fronting up a lot more cash than they previously would in the boom and given the fact they are now refunding deposits so they can maximise their profits surely they are in a position to commit more of their own cash to any future deals (imo which the banks should be insisting on to minimise their and tax payer exposure)

    Agree on the above, it is a very emotive topic..

    On your part ive highlighted in bold, the Priory Hall developed has been awarded the contract for the new kids hospital so people are still making idiotic decisions
    This is completely untrue. You are aware that your source ,which I presume to be this: http://waterfordwhispersnews.com/2014/01/29/priory-hall-developer-lands-national-childrens-hospital-contract/ , is a satire.


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    #33
    helimachoptor
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 21,658 Mod ✭✭✭✭helimachoptor


    CONM wrote: »
    This is completely untrue. You are aware that your source ,which I presume to be this: http://waterfordwhispersnews.com/2014/01/29/priory-hall-developer-lands-national-childrens-hospital-contract/ , is a satire.

    Apologies.. Egg on my face.. however it still wouldnt surprise me if he did..


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    #34
    jetfiremuck
    Registered Users Posts: 3,467 ✭✭✭jetfiremuck


    The whole issue with booking deposits, downpayments etc for houses needs to be clarified legally or at least updated to ensure that a booking deposit or downpayment for purchase is made fully binding on all parties without prejudice. A standardised legal form thats registered upon deposit would protect all concerned.


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    #35
    Santa Cruz
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,126 ✭✭✭Santa Cruz


    punisher5112 wrote: »
    You have to agree though the fake bubble has started again.

    No I don't. Thats just a lazy assessment by people who don't understand shortgage and the laws of supply and emand


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    #36
    The_Morrigan
    Registered Users Posts: 9,368 ✭✭✭The_Morrigan


    Johnnyhpipe wrote: »
    As an update - received deposit back today. Solicitor noted that this is unfortunately entirely legal and there's nothing we can do. The developer is simply a greedy <snip> and has renaged on the deals.

    OP I realise you are frustrated but please watch your language.

    Thanks

    Morri


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    #37
    davo10
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,926 ✭✭✭davo10


    jetfiremuck wrote: »
    The whole issue with booking deposits, downpayments etc for houses needs to be clarified legally or at least updated to ensure that a booking deposit or downpayment for purchase is made fully binding on all parties without prejudice. A standardised legal form thats registered upon deposit would protect all concerned.

    Most people put down deposits subject to survey and mortgage approval, do you think a buyer should lose their €5k if the bank decides not to approve?


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    #38
    sham58107
    Registered Users Posts: 213 ✭✭sham58107


    Jeez, did we not LEARN ANYTHING in last 6 yrs,and then when everything falls apart again we the taxpayer pays and then we blame the politicians.!!!!


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    #39
    davo10
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,926 ✭✭✭davo10


    sham58107 wrote: »
    Jeez, did we not LEARN ANYTHING in last 6 yrs,and then when everything falls apart again we the taxpayer pays and then we blame the politicians.!!!!

    Jeez, there isn't hundreds of estates being built in bogs, this time the price rises in Dublin are due to the opposite, low availability and high demand. Remember, for the last 6 years prices have fallen, probably to below their proper value, now prices are going up and people are bleating that it's a bubble.

    Sham, house values rise in countries which never had a bubble, it's the economics of a well functioning market place.


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    #40
    sham58107
    Registered Users Posts: 213 ✭✭sham58107


    davo10 wrote: »
    Jeez, there isn't hundreds of estates being built in bogs, this time the price rises in Dublin are due to the opposite, low availability and high demand. Remember, for the last 6 years prices have fallen, probably to below their proper value, now prices are going up and people are bleating that it's a bubble.

    Sham, house values rise in countries which never had a bubble, it's the economics of a well functioning market place.

    Did not say anything about prices, the builders pulling out and upping cost so they can get more was what I was referring to, this happened before and I am not too far from Dublin.
    I know of estate in Longford where this happened in 2007 and 2 people took developer to court to get at original price and guess what they did,but now are in ghost estate with 2 others in 60+ houses,and builder is in NAMA,
    Everybody is not back on again urging people to buy,buy, where are builders getting money?,are the same professionals still handling sales? you bet they are and laughing all the way to the bank,like a no lose bet they will never lose,like all the young tradesmen who are now all over the world.


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    #41
    handlemaster
    Registered Users Posts: 6,003 ✭✭✭handlemaster


    how much has the property gone up ?


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    #42
    Johnnyhpipe
    Closed Accounts Posts: 748 ✭✭✭Johnnyhpipe


    handlemaster wrote: »
    how much has the property gone up ?

    €50k...which is absolute madness anyway. It's not worth that money, but someone's always willing to pay!


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    #43
    handlemaster
    Registered Users Posts: 6,003 ✭✭✭handlemaster


    Johnnyhpipe wrote: »
    €50k...which is absolute madness anyway. It's not worth that money, but someone's always willing to pay!


    yep Dublins gone crazy alright.


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    #44
    DebDynamite
    Registered Users Posts: 2,667 ✭✭✭DebDynamite


    What's the name of the developement / developer OP? Name and shame.

    I feel so bad for you. You paid your deposit in good faith knowing you had to wait almost a year before the house was even build. Poor form on the developer's part.


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    #45
    davo10
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,926 ✭✭✭davo10


    Johnnyhpipe wrote: »
    €50k...which is absolute madness anyway. It's not worth that money, but someone's always willing to pay!

    I think you are missing the wood for the trees here, you are seeing this house in terms of what you are willing to pay for it rather than what it is worth on the market. If the market can bare an extra €50k today, then that is what it is worth today, it might be worth more or less in a year but it is being sold today.

    Also, €50k is a big difference particularly as we are talking about multiple properties.


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    #46
    Johnnyhpipe
    Closed Accounts Posts: 748 ✭✭✭Johnnyhpipe


    DebDynamite wrote: »
    What's the name of the developement / developer OP? Name and shame.

    I feel so bad for you. You paid your deposit in good faith knowing you had to wait almost a year before the house was even build. Poor form on the developer's part.

    Won't name any names yet, but a thread was deleted last week here because the person named the developer and the development..... And I've already heard from another guy on here who has been burned by the same developer on this particular site the same time as me. So that's 3 of us in this situation already, and no doubt there are others.

    I'm meeting my solicitor on Wednesday and will be naming/shaming/taking this further thereafter.


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    #47
    davo10
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,926 ✭✭✭davo10


    Johnnyhpipe wrote: »
    Won't name any names yet, but a thread was deleted last week here because the person named the developer and the development..... And I've already heard from another guy on here who has been burned by the same developer on this particular site the same time as me. So that's 3 of us in this situation already, and no doubt there are others.

    I'm meeting my solicitor on Wednesday and will be naming/shaming/taking this further thereafter.

    There is a good chance you might need that solicitor if you wrongly accuse the developer of acting illegally on a public forum. If your solicitor has already told you that nothing illegal has occurred, why are you bothering meeting him on Wednesday?


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    #48
    The_Morrigan
    Registered Users Posts: 9,368 ✭✭✭The_Morrigan


    Johnnyhpipe wrote: »
    Won't name any names yet, but a thread was deleted last week here because the person named the developer and the development..... And I've already heard from another guy on here who has been burned by the same developer on this particular site the same time as me. So that's 3 of us in this situation already, and no doubt there are others.

    I'm meeting my solicitor on Wednesday and will be naming/shaming/taking this further thereafter.

    The threads were deleted because of the potential for a legal action against Boards.ie.
    If you want to name and shame please do so on a blog that you are responsible for, if you attempt to make any posts that could result in libel actions then they will be deleted and you will be banned from the forum.

    Morri


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    #49
    Eoin247
    Registered Users Posts: 826 ✭✭✭Eoin247


    Johnnyhpipe wrote: »
    €50k...which is absolute madness anyway. It's not worth that money, but someone's always willing to pay!

    Considering how much prices have fallen in the last few years, a 50k increase is probably closer to what would be considered correct for this property than the previous price.

    In any case things are worth what people are willing to pay for them. There's no such thing in reality as a fixed price that each thing should be valued at.


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    #50
    shelle8726
    Registered Users Posts: 12 ✭shelle8726


    Im in the same situation and just to point out we ARE the demand, if it wasnt for us buyers in the first place the houses wouldn't be going up in value ... where does it end??? The next round of buyers cause demand and what will they just put prices up again!??? Its sickening that they can do this to people, ruining peoples lives!! They've cost us thousands as they held are deposit for 7 months leading us to believe we were waiting on our house & now just changing there mind while house prices have plumeted again, we could have a bought a house last year thats now 50k more expensive... 😠


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    #51
    shelle8726
    Registered Users Posts: 12 ✭shelle8726


    Roy_Keane16 wrote: »
    @johnnyhpipe - I have been burned by the same developer. Loan offer ready to go & everything to proceed from our end. Booking deposit paid since June for a house that was to be built by spring 2014. We have been waiting on them to proceed but now the greedy developer has returned a list of deposits to all the affected purchasers solicitors. I think this issue will have to be spread to the wider public re the developer so that future buyers are aware. I have already seen a post removed that warned ppl of this developer 6 days ago. Make contact with me johnnyhpipe

    Hi that was my post removed. I'm in same situation. Ive spoken to johnnypipe. <SNIP>


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    #52
    The_Morrigan
    Registered Users Posts: 9,368 ✭✭✭The_Morrigan


    Shelle8726 you have already had your threads deleted because of the potential for libelous claims. Do not mount a campaign against this developer here.


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    #53
    sawdoubters
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,288 ✭✭✭sawdoubters


    http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/housing/owning_a_home/buying_a_home/steps_involved_buying_a_home.html

    did they take the deposit,that looks like a contract,if its in the bank

    http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/consumer_affairs/consumer_protection/consumer_rights/consumers_and_the_law_in_ireland.html


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    #54
    The_Morrigan
    Registered Users Posts: 9,368 ✭✭✭The_Morrigan


    sawdoubters wrote: »
    http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/housing/owning_a_home/buying_a_home/steps_involved_buying_a_home.html

    did they take the deposit,that looks like a contract,if its in the bank

    http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/consumer_affairs/consumer_protection/consumer_rights/consumers_and_the_law_in_ireland.html

    No it doesn't look like a contract - the first link you have given even says that the deposit is refundable if contracts have not been signed.

    I should also point out that the purchase of a house falls outside the remit of the sale of goods and services acts and consumer law, hence the need for the engagement of solicitors to complete the contracts and the purchase.


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    #55
    metroburgers
    Registered Users Posts: 456 ✭✭metroburgers


    Where are these houses in question, e.g. general area?


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    #56
    Johnnyhpipe
    Closed Accounts Posts: 748 ✭✭✭Johnnyhpipe


    metroburgers wrote: »
    Where are these houses in question, e.g. general area?

    Mod - can i answer this question?


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    #57
    The_Morrigan
    Registered Users Posts: 9,368 ✭✭✭The_Morrigan


    Johnnyhpipe wrote: »
    Mod - can i answer this question?

    Yes.


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    #58
    Johnnyhpipe
    Closed Accounts Posts: 748 ✭✭✭Johnnyhpipe


    It's in Rathcoole.


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    #59
    davo10
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,926 ✭✭✭davo10


    shelle8726 wrote: »
    Im in the same situation and just to point out we ARE the demand, if it wasnt for us buyers in the first place the houses wouldn't be going up in value ... where does it end??? The next round of buyers cause demand and what will they just put prices up again!??? Its sickening that they can do this to people, ruining peoples lives!! They've cost us thousands as they held are deposit for 7 months leading us to believe we were waiting on our house & now just changing there mind while house prices have plumeted again, we could have a bought a house last year thats now 50k more expensive... 😠

    No, you are just one person of the group, others are willing to pay more than you. Shelle, no one disagrees with you that it was morally a terrible thing for the developer to do, but the title of the thread is "can developers do this" and unfortunately in your case, in the absence of a signed contract the answer is also yes.

    A question for you and the OP, deposits were returned to those who had not signed the contracts so presumably those who did sign them have their houses at the advertised price, why, if you paid your deposit 8 months ago, had you not signed?. OP said he tried to get info about queries as you probably did, but the ones who signed would also have needed that info, perhaps they didn't delay and you did?


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    #60
    shelle8726
    Registered Users Posts: 12 ✭shelle8726


    davo10 wrote: »
    No, you are just one person of the group, others are willing to pay more than you. Shelle, no one disagrees with you that it was morally a terrible thing for the developer to do, but the title of the thread is "can developers do this" and unfortunately in your case, in the absence of a signed contract the answer is also yes.

    A question for you and the OP, deposits were returned to those who had not signed the contracts so presumably those who did sign them have their houses at the advertised price, why, if you paid your deposit 8 months ago, had you not signed?. OP said he tried to get info about queries as you probably did, but the ones who signed would also have needed that info, perhaps they didn't delay and you did?
    Davo 10 Yes I know they CAN do this, the same way I could have walked away however I wanted to buy the house I was sticking to my end of the original verbal contract that was made in June, yes nearly 8 months ago but I chased these for my contracts fo nearly 6 months I eventually received them end Nov & naturally my solr raised some general queries & might I ad the very next day, so I would say no we didnt cause the delay. Its alot of money to be handing over & a pretty serious contract to be getting into without being clear & understanding what the terms & conditions were!
    Another thing, you say im one of a group of buyers of which others are willing to pay more, why then was I never given the option to pay more? I was never offered the house at another price.


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    #61
    davo10
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,926 ✭✭✭davo10


    shelle8726 wrote: »
    Davo 10 Yes I know they CAN do this, the same way I could have walked away however I wanted to buy the house I was sticking to my end of the original verbal contract that was made in June, yes nearly 8 months ago but I chased these for my contracts fo nearly 6 months I eventually received them end Nov & naturally my solr raised some general queries & might I ad the very next day, so I would say no we didnt cause the delay. Its alot of money to be handing over & a pretty serious contract to be getting into without being clear & understanding what the terms & conditions were!
    Another thing, you say im one of a group of buyers of which others are willing to pay more, why then was I never given the option to pay more? I was never offered the house at another price.

    There isn't a verbal contract, there was a verbal agreement subject to contract.

    I understand what you are saying, but also I understand that others may have signed contracts and gotten houses at original price. Have you been prevented from buying the house at the higher price or have they all been sold already?


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