Breeding ewe lambs (hill)

Conmaicne Mara

Mulling over this idea for next year. I kept ten replacements this year and left them at home on the basis that there are chaser rams out on the hill and I'd end up with surprise lambs in June or such other nonsense.

So I'm in the position that the ten replacements are at home with the ewes that don't go to the hill and the couple that aren't fit to go. This puts a bit of pressure on that space.

So I have been considering letting replacements in lamb next year, seeing as they'll be under my hand. I am however not convinced it's altogether a good idea yet.

Reasons would be lambing difficulty, possible losses, loss of future growth, uncertain mothers, small/poor dooer lambs, cost?

Thoughts, experiences?

Conmaicne Mara

No bites hah?

Found this online

http://www.eblex.org.uk/wp/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/breeding_ewe_lambs150512.pdf

rancher

Conmaicne Mara wrote: »

No bites hah?

Found this online

http://www.eblex.org.uk/wp/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/breeding_ewe_lambs150512.pdf

Interesting where they say that hill ewes only have to be 33kg, we like to have our ewe lambs weighing 60% of their mature weight so 45kgs for a mature weight of 75kg, obviously the same rule applies for hill ewes.
Ewe lambs work well here but the right level of feeding is important and so is scanning. Its a disaster to overfeed a single or underfeed a double

Conmaicne Mara

rancher wrote: »

Interesting where they say that hill ewes only have to be 33kg, we like to have our ewe lambs weighing 60% of their mature weight so 45kgs for a mature weight of 75kg, obviously the same rule applies for hill ewes.
Ewe lambs work well here but the right level of feeding is important and so is scanning. Its a disaster to overfeed a single or underfeed a double

I weighed my ewes at some point last year, in the Summer I think. The lightest would have been 45kg, since sold. Now, when it'd come to lamb breeding weights I would personally want to base it on 65-70% mature weight of a 55kg ewe, just to push it for myself to give a bit of growing room. Which would work out at 35-38kg (roughly) for the ewe lamb. The heaviest ewe I weighed in my flock was a 58kg blackie/cheviot cross. I didn't weigh the lambs in October/November so I am guessing they'll make those weights.

I can see the importance of scanning and the relationship with feeding. A big lamb inside a small ewe, disaster. Not nearly as economical to get a vet out as for cattle or pedigree sheep either. I thought the Eblex document had a rather humourous balancing act between feeding the lamb after weaning but not flushing them before tipping, that will be interesting.

In the past I never had anything tipped before 2 years old. There are a fair number of hill farmers that won't tip a ewe before 3 as well. But, different hills, holdings and systems.

rancher

Conmaicne Mara wrote: »

I weighed my ewes at some point last year, in the Summer I think. The lightest would have been 45kg, since sold. Now, when it'd come to lamb breeding weights I would personally want to base it on 65-70% mature weight of a 55kg ewe, just to push it for myself to give a bit of growing room. Which would work out at 35-38kg (roughly) for the ewe lamb. The heaviest ewe I weighed in my flock was a 58kg blackie/cheviot cross. I didn't weigh the lambs in October/November so I am guessing they'll make those weights.

I can see the importance of scanning and the relationship with feeding. A big lamb inside a small ewe, disaster. Not nearly as economical to get a vet out as for cattle or pedigree sheep either. I thought the Eblex document had a rather humourous balancing act between feeding the lamb after weaning but not flushing them before tipping, that will be interesting.

In the past I never had anything tipped before 2 years old. There are a fair number of hill farmers that won't tip a ewe before 3 as well. But, different hills, holdings and systems.

Found that out the hard way myself...you don't flush ewe lambs

Username John

Hi Con,

I wouldn't know much about hill sheep, but I'll tell you my experience with some ewe lambs I put in young last year.

Like you, I had a few lambs and I let them run with the ram, they lambed last spring. I put 8 with the ram, 6 went in young.

These ewe lambs were born Feb 2012, and lambed down in March 2013. They were 50kg+ when they went to the ram, which would be around 60% of their mature weight, which I think is what they recommend as a minimum.

A few weeks after tipping, I separated them from the ewes, so I could feed them a small amount of ration. They were out on good grass, and got some ration as well daily from maybe 8 or 10 weeks before lambing.
5 of the 6 had singles, one had twins. I left the twins on the ewe lamb, which was a mistake. (the ewe lambs lambed later than the ewes, and I didn't have a ewe to foster the lamb onto and I didn't want a pet, so was laziness on my part really)

Overall, their lambs did ok, with one of the lambs being one of the first sold.
But... The ewe lambs themselves were shook after rearing the lambs, and took a long while to recover.

For me - I thought it was more hassle than it was worth, due to having to an extra group to manage, have grass / paddock for, feed for longer and then manage again the next summer to bring into good condition for the next season.
If you had the numbers to make it worthwhile, I can see how it would be good.

But for me, It's easier to leave the lambs run on for their first winter.

That's my two cents. Please note Con, this is based on me doing it only once. :P
There are lads on here doing it every year, with good results.

monseiur

Conmaicne Mara wrote: »

Mulling over this idea for next year. I kept ten replacements this year and left them at home on the basis that there are chaser rams out on the hill and I'd end up with surprise lambs in June or such other nonsense.

So I'm in the position that the ten replacements are at home with the ewes that don't go to the hill and the couple that aren't fit to go. This puts a bit of pressure on that space.

So I have been considering letting replacements in lamb next year, seeing as they'll be under my hand. I am however not convinced it's altogether a good idea yet.

Reasons would be lambing difficulty, possible losses, loss of future growth, uncertain mothers, small/poor dooer lambs, cost?

Thoughts, experiences?

Hill sheep/ hoggets should be lambing for the first time on their second birthday any sooner will stunt growth as the hill lamb is a much slower developer that the lowland. They have genetically evolved this way due the poor quality of the grazing, it lacks minerals like calcium etc. which promotes bone growth and strength. It would help to feed ewe lambs you plan to keep for breeding over their first winter, this has two advantages, the obvious nutritional gain and the ewe is trained for life if she had to be fed later.
M.

Conmaicne Mara

So, I sprung it on the ould fella today and he had a surprise in store for me, he's all for it once the lambs are up to weight. He's farming since 1962 so he's seen and done a fair bit by now.

rancher wrote: »

Found that out the hard way myself...you don't flush ewe lambs

I suppose they could be fed early and let them idle away on grass maybe six weeks before tipping.How do you manage not to flush them rancher? I sure don't want more twins that I have to deal with in terms of ewe lambs.

Username John wrote: »

A few weeks after tipping, I separated them from the ewes, so I could feed them a small amount of ration. They were out on good grass, and got some ration as well daily from maybe 8 or 10 weeks before lambing.
5 of the 6 had singles, one had twins. I left the twins on the ewe lamb, which was a mistake. (the ewe lambs lambed later than the ewes, and I didn't have a ewe to foster the lamb onto and I didn't want a pet, so was laziness on my part really)

Overall, their lambs did ok, with one of the lambs being one of the first sold.
But... The ewe lambs themselves were shook after rearing the lambs, and took a long while to recover.

For me - I thought it was more hassle than it was worth, due to having to an extra group to manage, have grass / paddock for, feed for longer and then manage again the next summer to bring into good condition for the next season.
If you had the numbers to make it worthwhile, I can see how it would be good.

My plan is to have the ewe lambs dropping (not figuratively I hope ) at the same time as the mature ewes, might not work out so easy but I will try to do that. Reason being I would prefer not to have pets so would have mature ewes to foster lambs onto (hopefully, small flock).

Were they on good grass and were you feeding them up to tipping time? Just wondering how you managed not to flush them doing that. Sheep Ireland fella told me last year bringing in the ewes from the hill to grass three weeks before tipping would be enough to flush the mature ewes.

I recognise the hassle of separate groups, more fencing divisions, more places to go look at etc. Also I did take heed of the after effect of raising a lamb on the lambs/hoggets and that is something else I will have to give thought to.

I don't have numbers, not allowed blah blah blah everyones heard that story, what I do have is sheep under me feet and am exploring one option of using them differently.

monseiur wrote: »

Hill sheep/ hoggets should be lambing for the first time on their second birthday any sooner will stunt growth as the hill lamb is a much slower developer that the lowland. They have genetically evolved this way due the poor quality of the grazing, it lacks minerals like calcium etc. which promotes bone growth and strength. It would help to feed ewe lambs you plan to keep for breeding over their first winter, this has two advantages, the obvious nutritional gain and the ewe is trained for life if she had to be fed later.
M.

Dad and I would always have done it that way, in that a '13 lamb would not be let to the ram until October/November 14. Some flocks would go a year further and have that same '13 lamb not tipped before November 15.

What I would be proposing to do would likely see what will be a '14 lamb sent to the hill with it's mother for hefting in Summer '14. Weaned and brought home, then prepared for the ram in October/November '14. She will hopefully lamb herself in March/April 15, and would very likely not see the hill again until December '15 or even possibly into '16 depending on condition and whether I am happy with development etc. They would need some level of extra feeding compared to an empty replacement I fully agree. I would feed before lambing as a rule each year anyway, I always leave lots of trough space so lambs never really have an issue eating for me at any stage.

I can only really speculate and listen to advice at the moment as I've never done this before. It's a bit of an experiment.

Username John

Conmaicne Mara wrote: »

Were they on good grass and were you feeding them up to tipping time? Just wondering how you managed not to flush them doing that. Sheep Ireland fella told me last year bringing in the ewes from the hill to grass three weeks before tipping would be enough to flush the mature ewes.

I flushed the ewes. As I understand it, flushing means putting them on lower then higher nutrition level. The ewe lambs were on the same level of nutrition all the time. They were running in a separate group, and were on good enough grass continuously.
The ewe lambs had acess to some creep when they were young, but weren't being fed into the summer.

Conmaicne Mara wrote: »

I can only really speculate and listen to advice at the moment as I've never done this before. It's a bit of an experiment.

Ah yeah, sure you have to try new things. It's nice to have experiments like this, that was the reason I did it as well, just to see how twould work for me...
Best of luck with it,anyways.

rancher

Conmaicne Mara wrote: »

So, I sprung it on the ould fella today and he had a surprise in store for me, he's all for it once the lambs are up to weight. He's farming since 1962 so he's seen and done a fair bit by now.



I suppose they could be fed early and let them idle away on grass maybe six weeks before tipping.How do you manage not to flush them rancher? I sure don't want more twins that I have to deal with in terms of ewe lambs.



My plan is to have the ewe lambs dropping (not figuratively I hope ) at the same time as the mature ewes, might not work out so easy but I will try to do that. Reason being I would prefer not to have pets so would have mature ewes to foster lambs onto (hopefully, small flock).

Were they on good grass and were you feeding them up to tipping time? Just wondering how you managed not to flush them doing that. Sheep Ireland fella told me last year bringing in the ewes from the hill to grass three weeks before tipping would be enough to flush the mature ewes.

I recognise the hassle of separate groups, more fencing divisions, more places to go look at etc. Also I did take heed of the after effect of raising a lamb on the lambs/hoggets and that is something else I will have to give thought to.

I don't have numbers, not allowed blah blah blah everyones heard that story, what I do have is sheep under me feet and am exploring one option of using them differently.



Dad and I would always have done it that way, in that a '13 lamb would not be let to the ram until October/November 14. Some flocks would go a year further and have that same '13 lamb not tipped before November 15.

What I would be proposing to do would likely see what will be a '14 lamb sent to the hill with it's mother for hefting in Summer '14. Weaned and brought home, then prepared for the ram in October/November '14. She will hopefully lamb herself in March/April 15, and would very likely not see the hill again until December '15 or even possibly into '16 depending on condition and whether I am happy with development etc. They would need some level of extra feeding compared to an empty replacement I fully agree. I would feed before lambing as a rule each year anyway, I always leave lots of trough space so lambs never really have an issue eating for me at any stage.

I can only really speculate and listen to advice at the moment as I've never done this before. It's a bit of an experiment.

Ewe lambs are put with the ram here in November, I only give them grass before that and October grass is really only water standing up. If you were flushing them, you'd give them meal....I did it one year and got 1.6lambs/ewe but it was too hard to keep up the ewes, they physically can't eat enough at a year old to feed two lambs.
I think I will feed the ewe lambs meal this year in aug/ sept just to have them a bit bigger going to the ram, I'm also considering taking one from each of the doubles and hand rearing

Conmaicne Mara

Username John wrote: »

I flushed the ewes. As I understand it, flushing means putting them on lower then higher nutrition level. The ewe lambs were on the same level of nutrition all the time. They were running in a separate group, and were on good enough grass continuously.
The ewe lambs had acess to some creep when they were young, but weren't being fed into the summer.

Ah yeah, sure you have to try new things. It's nice to have experiments like this, that was the reason I did it as well, just to see how twould work for me...
Best of luck with it,anyways.

rancher wrote: »

Ewe lambs are put with the ram here in November, I only give them grass before that and October grass is really only water standing up. If you were flushing them, you'd give them meal....I did it one year and got 1.6lambs/ewe but it was too hard to keep up the ewes, they physically can't eat enough at a year old to feed two lambs.
I think I will feed the ewe lambs meal this year in aug/ sept just to have them a bit bigger going to the ram, I'm also considering taking one from each of the doubles and hand rearing

Now another question, how do ye find them for mastitis?

My "grass" would not be nearly the same as ye're grass It's all old pasture, never seeded. I have intentions to reseed at some point but the farm budget is being pulled every which way to accommodate a few projects.

I think growing them on, then backing well off well before tipping might be the thing to do. Could be ramped up again after tipping but not to the point of getting a big lamb.

Would definitely break up twins, no question about it.

Have been advised against this experiment for cost reasons lately, could be merit to that too.

Username John

Conmaicne Mara wrote: »

Now another question, how do ye find them for mastitis?

My "grass" would not be nearly the same as ye're grass It's all old pasture, never seeded. I have intentions to reseed at some point but the farm budget is being pulled every which way to accommodate a few projects.

I think growing them on, then backing well off well before tipping might be the thing to do. Could be ramped up again after tipping but not to the point of getting a big lamb.

Would definitely break up twins, no question about it.

Have been advised against this experiment for cost reasons lately, could be merit to that too.

I didnt see any issues with mastitis.

Not sure about backing them off. I'd keep growing them, but consistently. But that's just me...

Also, I think I should bow out of the chat now... I don't think I am any way qualified to be answering questions really...
as like I said - only did it once, and only with 6 lambs.

Lano Lynn

tbh I wouldn't let them in lamb what you gain at one end of their lives they loose at the other with lower adult weight/bone mass etc thus draft value reduced.
used to lamb ewe lambs Its ok but they require a lot of extra feed to keep them right.your top genetics throws out twins and wrecks herself rearing them delaying her going in lamb the next year with a single.

I met an old shepherd with cheviots who firmly believed that lambing before 3yr old destroyed good sheep,mind you he was talking about 1930s & 40s when wool was more than paying the rent!!!!!!!!! they would tie squares of cloth over the hoggets rump to prevent them getting in lamb know as a breek.check out tarset.co.uk shepherds blog 17.12.09.

AnFeirmeoir

Lowland here
Have 20 ewe lambs in lamb this year. I got a beltex ram specially for the job cause I heard they have fine boned lambs that are easy lambed .ill know in march if it's true. It's difficult to know are you getting the feeding right at this time of the year. Some recommend not feeding ewe lambs as much as they might have a big single. At the same time you're reminded they need extra nutrition as they are growing themselves !?!?

Did it a few years ago and to be honest I found it hard going and shyed away from it for the past 2 years. Had a few difficult lambings.

Found ewe lambs brilliant mothers. They are much more protective of lambs than they are as 2 year olds

razor8

Some of my lowland ewe lambs in for the next 6 weeks or so. These ones all have twins so will need lots of tlc through out the year. I here other people mention lambing them stunts there growth but I don't see it an issue, the genetics are still there just as long as you don't let them get too under pressure ime

Lano Lynn

fine looking lambs what are the mules out of?

Username John

razor8 wrote: »

Some of my lowland ewe lambs in for the next 6 weeks or so. These ones all have twins so will need lots of tlc through out the year. I here other people mention lambing them stunts there growth but I don't see it an issue, the genetics are still there just as long as you don't let them get too under pressure ime

Fine big looking lambs - were they shorn?

razor8

Lano Lynn wrote: »

fine looking lambs what are the mules out of?

breed from lanark and perth hornys, mixture of my own breeding and some i bought this year.

razor8

Username John wrote: »

Fine big looking lambs - were they shorn?

yes uj, shorn end of september i think it was, happy enough with them

supersean1999

Conmaicne Mara wrote: »

Mulling over this idea for next year. I kept ten replacements this year and left them at home on the basis that there are chaser rams out on the hill and I'd end up with surprise lambs in June or such other nonsense.

So I'm in the position that the ten replacements are at home with the ewes that don't go to the hill and the couple that aren't fit to go. This puts a bit of pressure on that space.

So I have been considering letting replacements in lamb next year, seeing as they'll be under my hand. I am however not convinced it's altogether a good idea yet.

Reasons would be lambing difficulty, possible losses, loss of future growth, uncertain mothers, small/poor dooer lambs, cost?

Thoughts, experiences?

IMO not worth your while for the numbers involved, I reckon you would be better not sell any ewe lambs and have a few hoggets for selling every year,

Conmaicne Mara

supersean1999 wrote: »

IMO not worth your while for the numbers involved, I reckon you would be better not sell any ewe lambs and have a few hoggets for selling every year,

Can't do that, AEOS restricts me to 40 sheep.

supersean1999

Conmaicne Mara wrote: »

Can't do that, AEOS restricts me to 40 sheep.

40 ewes :eek: . What clown Done that plan up.

supersean1999

Con. Is The 40 ewes based on min max numbers. For commanage . Is The lowland seperate or it it altogether. Its very low.

Conmaicne Mara

supersean1999 wrote: »

40 ewes :eek: . What clown Done that plan up.

supersean1999 wrote: »

Con. Is The 40 ewes based on min max numbers. For commanage . Is The lowland seperate or it it altogether. Its very low.

Teagasc done up the plan, in REPS it was 25! They told me they approached the Department and they wouldn't budge over 40. I am not sure I believe that based on other things the same advisor told me regarding jumping between Reps 3 & 4.

I don't know exactly what it's based on. I presume CFP. My figures on Max/min would be 116 or 85 I think, there or there abouts. It is, unfortunately, an all farm plan.

I am, ah, maddened by a few things. Neighbours, who I have nothing against, are allowed run multiples of the number of sheep I have on the same commonage, yet I am restricted. Other farmers with 10 times my number of sheep have no number restrictions on their AEOS2 plans, I am in AEOS 1. Any Teagasc or IFA meeting advocate increasing income by carrying more stock, changing breeds, of production, production, production - all of which I am excluded from. The Dept say they are worried about land abandonment and undergrazing yet won't allow AEOS1 plans to be adjusted.

Not very fair at all.

So I try to improve my lot by various ideas, increasing store lamb weight, breeding ewe lambs?, lengthening the service life of my ewes?. But none of those measures amount to a hill of beans really when you say 40 sheep.

Lano Lynn

Conmaicne Mara wrote: »

Not very fair at all.

So I try to improve my lot by various ideas, increasing store lamb weight, breeding ewe lambs?, lengthening the service life of my ewes?. But none of those measures amount to a hill of beans really when you say 40 sheep.

not fair at all and stupid too.but they won't keep a good man down.


why not 40 of these:rolleyes:

11-10-13 scottish blackface sale (lawrie & symington)
Elmscleugh’s offering has kicked off at £68,000 for a son of £11,000 Aitkenhead. He sold to Nunnerie, Dalchirla, Blackcraig, Loughash, Gass and Midlock.
Their next, a son of £9000 Elmscleugh sold for £6000 to Holylee and Silloans.
Then making £12,000 was a son of £11,000 Aitkenhead, he was purchased by Aitkenhead and Graystone Knowe.
A son of £24,000 Dalchirla sold for £18,000 to Netherwood and Greenside.
Another by the £24,000 Dalchirla has just made £14,000 and was purchased by Glen Gatehouse.
This pen averaged £16,992.85 for seven lambs sold.


and a wee seat on a bord to top up your pension:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Conmaicne Mara

Lano Lynn wrote: »

not fair at all and stupid too.but they won't keep a good man down.


why not 40 of these:rolleyes:

11-10-13 scottish blackface sale (lawrie & symington)
Elmscleugh’s offering has kicked off at £68,000 for a son of £11,000 Aitkenhead. He sold to Nunnerie, Dalchirla, Blackcraig, Loughash, Gass and Midlock.
Their next, a son of £9000 Elmscleugh sold for £6000 to Holylee and Silloans.
Then making £12,000 was a son of £11,000 Aitkenhead, he was purchased by Aitkenhead and Graystone Knowe.
A son of £24,000 Dalchirla sold for £18,000 to Netherwood and Greenside.
Another by the £24,000 Dalchirla has just made £14,000 and was purchased by Glen Gatehouse.
This pen averaged £16,992.85 for seven lambs sold.


and a wee seat on a bord to top up your pension:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Only my opinion but I reckon anyone buying into that type of arrangement won't spot the sucker in the room, because it's him/her.

Conmaicne Mara

Another question.

How to get ewe lambs dropping lambs at the same time, or possibly slightly before, the mature ewes? I am of course thinking of twins and fostering onto single bearing mature ewes rather than bottling pets, if possible.

razor8

Conmaicne Mara wrote: »

Another question.

How to get ewe lambs dropping lambs at the same time, or possibly slightly before, the mature ewes? I am of course thinking of twins and fostering onto single bearing mature ewes rather than bottling pets, if possible.

A teaser would be all con, got one done this year but he got an infection so couldn't use him,
If no teaser then I find it's the second cycle before the tipping really gets going. So you need to let them out a fortnight before main ewes, haven't done this yet myself tho.

Lano Lynn

Conmaicne Mara wrote: »

Only my opinion but I reckon anyone buying into that type of arrangement won't spot the sucker in the room, because it's him/her.

its not just your opinion.its bonkers ...guess that leaves the board room

supersean1999

You should really bypass Teagasc and get straight on to a td to get that changed, your allowed go with Cfp and new min ,max, as far as I know. It's plain stupid , the dep of ag, makes my blood boil re commanages

dave747

razor8 wrote: »

A teaser would be all con, got one done this year but he got an infection so couldn't use him,
If no teaser then I find it's the second cycle before the tipping really gets going. So you need to let them out a fortnight before main ewes, haven't done this yet myself tho.

Dont use teaser here but let ram into paddock beside lambs for a week and take away for 2 weeks and introduce to the lambs same time as ewes and take out same time 6 wks usually . 16 out of 20 in lamb this year with 11 in the first 3 weeks. size and age of lamb important though

Conmaicne Mara

supersean1999 wrote: »

You should really bypass Teagasc and get straight on to a td to get that changed, your allowed go with Cfp and new min ,max, as far as I know. It's plain stupid , the dep of ag, makes my blood boil re commanages

Yes, I'm still pursuing options. Think I have run into a dead end with IFA, have talked to two heavy hitters there and got zilch back.

Liam Fahey, one of the head inspectors with the department said in Tuam last year that AEOS plans couldn't be amended so......... Options narrowing batman

To be fair to my local TD of choice he has been more than helpful in the past with issues I've brought to him. Could well be time to give him a crack at another easy problem

Will keep at it.




Just on Teagasc, I think next time out with whatever plan I may leave them behind. I've had fairly suspect guidance from them previously and why do we as farmers need advisors if it isn't for correct and timely advice? To be fair, I do get on well with my current advisor who does seem better clued in compared to the previous one.

supersean1999

Conmaicne Mara wrote: »

Yes, I'm still pursuing options. Think I have run into a dead end with IFA, have talked to two heavy hitters there and got zilch back.

Liam Fahey, one of the head inspectors with the department said in Tuam last year that AEOS plans couldn't be amended so......... Options narrowing batman

To be fair to my local TD of choice he has been more than helpful in the past with issues I've brought to him. Could well be time to give him a crack at another easy problem

Will keep at it.




Just on Teagasc, I think next time out with whatever plan I may leave them behind. I've had fairly suspect guidance from them previously and why do we as farmers need advisors if it isn't for correct and timely advice? To be fair, I do get on well with my current advisor who does seem better clued in compared to the previous one.

I agree and there not the cheapest, I'll be getting quotes for new scheme, any con I better check the weather I'm gathering tomorrow to scan Tuesday, scanned 35 ewes at home a few weeks ago,all in lamb but very low on twins,

Sheep breeder

con for the number of sheep you have to stock for AEOS surely is determined by the commonage share you have.

Conmaicne Mara

Sheep breeder wrote: »

con for the number of sheep you have to stock for AEOS surely is determined by the commonage share you have.

You would think so wouldn't you? If you were to go by my commonage shares and the Max/min figures I would be between 85 and 116 sheep or there abouts.

The issue I have with the dept is how neighbours with the same shares as me have between 5 and 15 times the number of sheep I have.

MayoAreMagic

Con, I have all mayo ewes and have had a few lambs get tipped by accident in the past. I have to say it is a lot of work getting them over the line. They need good grass, and meal, and even then you have to keep an eye on them in particular over the rest. Plus, they are more susepctible to things like worms, so you have to be watching them all the time. I had to keep them moving around what grass I had right up until they were ready to be sold. That is a lot of care and special attention, and I couldnt help but feel had I been able to put that time in elsewhere I might have saved a few that died and had a couple less stragglers at the end. If I was you, knowing the type of area you farm as my own is similar, I wouldnt do it. But if you feel you have that type of time to offer then maybe try the strongest 3-4 of them and see how it goes.

If you want to go the other way, I know of a guy who puts bags on the backsides of his ewe lambs. I know you might be thinking that will look daft, but he can let them off to the hill with the ewes every year and they dont get tipped. A few years later and a few more were doing the same...