Oz opportunities ?

danish pasterys

Im 24 and recently went back to college to keep me busy in this recession however iv no passion in what im doing and cant see myself sticking at it for 4 years to probably be back on the dole cue after it..

So im thinking of going to oz with hope of getting a half decent job which to me is just enough to pay the bills and do some things on weekends..

Im wondering if anyone knows if someone with no college education or trade, just years experience at operative jobs, can pick up a half decent job in oz and if theres just better oppurtunities?

I have two brothers over their at the moment, working in construction but I have no real construction skills so I want to know what other kind of jobs could I possibly land or is it strictly just a skilled shortage down under and odds are ill be struggling ?

Any advice appreciated

Mellor

danish pasterys wrote: »

Im wondering if anyone knows if someone with no college education or trade, just years experience at operative jobs, can pick up a half decent job in oz and if theres just better oppurtunities?

What do you mean by operative job, just to make sure we are on the same page.
There's are unskilled jobs in construction, banking, administration, etc. Every company has everyday roles that need filled, it doesn't really matter where the person who fills it comes from

lg123

don't know how long you intend to spend here but without holding some qualifications and/or having skills which are in demand, you will really struggle for visa options after your two years on the whv.

you didn't mention how much of the course you have done and how far off you are from getting some qualification, but having a cert or diploma in the back pocket is no cross to bare even if you have no intention of going near that industry.

rightyabe

Good advice from lg123.

I'm currently working and sponsored in a role in construction. Having a degree meant it was pi55 easy for my employer to sponsor me.

It's not easy over here, take all those Instagram pics and Facebook posts with a massive punch of salt!! Work 6am - 5pm Monday till Friday..most Saturdays...eat...shower..sleep...it's a much of a muchness apart for the sunshine. Take into account the almost unbearable heat in summer..

pete4130

It is a better quality of life in terms of being able to spend time outdoors more. The heat can be intense at times.

It is still hard work, harder than back home in some respects because everything is more expensive. Working an average 9-5 job here you'll get by easily enough and be able to save some money each week.

I work Fly in/Fly out doing 3 weeks on, 1 week off for good money. I work 84 hours a week though for 21 days straight to make good money. It's tough because I'm away from home, give up a lot of my social life, family, friends and my 1 week off goes by far too quickly.

Breaking my salary down equates to a slightly above average wage after tax per week if it were a 38 hour week. So in that respect I don't earn all that much per hour, mores I just do a lot of hours per week.

rightyabe

Yeah @pete4130

I work in perth, start at 6 and most days finish at 4, could be as late as 7 or even early as 11. All depends of the job and client. As I work in concrete its either full on or nothing.

Working fifo gives you a chance to work guaranteed long hours every day..spend next to zero on food and booze, you may need to rent in a city to secure a address and a place to keep your stuff for your week off.

Living and working in a city day to day can be costly but with a bit if discipline you will learn to save and the benifits of if not being stuck on a remote site/mite can/should/could out weight the earnings of fifo. Living within your means is a must.

danish pasterys

lg123 wrote: »

don't know how long you intend to spend here but without holding some qualifications and/or having skills which are in demand, you will really struggle for visa options after your two years on the whv.

you didn't mention how much of the course you have done and how far off you are from getting some qualification, but having a cert or diploma in the back pocket is no cross to bare even if you have no intention of going near that industry.

Well So far I have a higher cert in IT, im two years off a degree but no experience in that area, and my job exp is basically warehouse op for best part of it. Im just really fed up here and like the taught of working and having the weather and money to go outside the weekend and do things

DoozerT6

As far as I remember from perusing visa options for myself, even if you had a degree, you'd need at least 2-3 years of full-time experience in your field before Immigration would even consider an application for (for example) a migrant visa.

TBH as a warehouse operative, I don't see you managing to get another visa after your two-year max. stay on the WHV. It's nothing an employer couldn't hire an Aussie for.

My advice (from someone who is frustrated at not qualifying for ANY Aussie visa!! ) : Make a five-year plan. Get your degree, try to get a job in your field for a couple of years, even if you have to go to London to do so, and even then, you'll still be young enough to get a WHV, and who knows, maybe sponsorship from there.....

tomwaterford

hate to butt in:o!!!!!!

what would be the best trade to have going to oz on a WHV??or are they all starting to go quiet:(

top madra

tomwaterford wrote: »

hate to butt in:o!!!!!!

what would be the best trade to have going to oz on a WHV??or are they all starting to go quiet:(

That's hard to say because they can change what they are looking for at their will, just because you have a trade doesn't mean you can just stay anymore.

You can get sponsored but you're very restricted because you are at your employers will and if he lets you go/or you get sick of him you only have a few weeks to get sponsored again or out you go.

Your trade might be on the list this year and it may not be next year so best off to pick a trade YOU like and worry about Aus later. At the end of the day do you really want to be doing something you don't enjoy because you think it might help you get in.

But it answer your question apart from the normal construction jobs I always see Panel Beaters/Spray Painters being looked for!

@Op life here is different, it's nice to be able do things and not worry about being rained off, I find work here much easier than home.

I work in construction 7 - 3.30 and get a full paid day off every 19 days worked because we work 40hrs a week instead of 38.

It all depends on who you get a job with much like back home, the guy I got a job with is a sound Aussie, a guy I kinda know over here works for a Irish guy and he works the bollix off them (a old guy I used to work with told me never to work for a Irish guy abroad, dunno maybe he was right)

So much like every country in the world it's whether you get lucky or not.

tomwaterford

Thanks for the reply,..i have my trade done and all like.just trying to suss out whether it's worth my while hoping to get a job in it over there..when i get there
my trade is heavy plant/agri mechanic..im not in a huge rush to go or anything.it's just years could slip by and the chance would pass on me

rightyabe

tomwaterford wrote: »

Thanks for the reply,..i have my trade done and all like.just trying to suss out whether it's worth my while hoping to get a job in it over there..when i get there
my trade is heavy plant/agri mechanic..im not in a huge rush to go or anything.it's just years could slip by and the chance would pass on me

Good demand for that trade as far as im aware. If I knew what I know now I think I would of went on for that kind of trade when I finished school.

Look on seek.com.au to try and guage your job prospects.

lg123

danish pasterys wrote: »

Well So far I have a higher cert in IT, im two years off a degree but no experience in that area, and my job exp is basically warehouse op for best part of it. Im just really fed up here and like the taught of working and having the weather and money to go outside the weekend and do things

realistically, with your current CV, you would be very very lucky to have any visa options in oz after the WHV. you could pop over to NZ and use up your whv there and come home after.

depends on what you want from life, if your happy enough with a career in warehouse ops, then book a flight. i cant encourage you enough to bottom out that degree. it might be 1.5 years of pain but it will pay huge dividends in the future.

the boys here in the fifo jobs, i would really doubt if they are in non-skilled positions.

Slideways

I work FIFO 2:1 as a plant fitter here.

It's definitely different and the money is great but it's not all roses. The health and safety will drive you around the twist. Add in dust, flies, mozzies (we're infested with the bastards after the rain we had), heat (48c a few weeks ago) and politics of not calling an arsehole am arsehole (it's frowned upon apparently)

jackbhoy

pete4130 wrote: »

Breaking my salary down equates to a slightly above average wage after tax per week if it were a 38 hour week. So in that respect I don't earn all that much per hour, mores I just do a lot of hours per week.

It's refreshing to hear a FIFO worker call it like it is and not make out it's like winning the lotto!.

I was at a wedding in Qld last year and few guys from home there doing FIFO spent whole reception going around telling everyone how much they make, was cringe worthy stuff. Also, heard it from mates back home so they are spreading word there too.

When I actually talked to couple of them and looked at hourly rate I was quite shocked. They were working an average of almost twice my hours and for only really about 10-15% more pay. Plus, like other posters have mentioned it was in sweltering conditions in ass end of nowhere etc.

I think FIFO is a great short term option to generate some cash but I think anyone with a family should look to move beyond it in long term.

Mellor

pete4130 wrote: »

Breaking my salary down equates to a slightly above average wage after tax per week if it were a 38 hour week. So in that respect I don't earn all that much per hour, mores I just do a lot of hours per week.

Thats true about the hourly rate. But at the same time, its can be a blessing to have the possibility of hours. I'm stuck on 37.5 with no overtime.

I have a mate on FIFO, he says he gets the same money into his account as the previous job, more or less, but his accomm and bills being covered means he has much more disposable income.

tomwaterford

Thanks rightyabe.i might look into it.
Might email a few and tease out how realistic the chances of work at it would be on a WHV would be as i wouldnt have any real labouring experience

mandrake04

top madra wrote: »

It all depends on who you get a job with much like back home, the guy I got a job with is a sound Aussie, a guy I kinda know over here works for a Irish guy and he works the bollix off them (a old guy I used to work with told me never to work for a Irish guy abroad, dunno maybe he was right)

Irish construction bosses here can be ruthless enough, but they hold a great hand of cards and they know it.

they know Irish like to stick with their own.

a) so there is always a constant supply of bodies arriving looking work

b) String a gang of lads along with the promise of sponsorship (but really only have intention of sponsoring 1 or 2 ...if any)

mandrake04

jackbhoy wrote: »

It's refreshing to hear a FIFO worker call it like it is and not make out it's like winning the lotto!.

I was at a wedding in Qld last year and few guys from home there doing FIFO spent whole reception going around telling everyone how much they make, was cringe worthy stuff. Also, heard it from mates back home so they are spreading word there too.

When I actually talked to couple of them and looked at hourly rate I was quite shocked. They were working an average of almost twice my hours and for only really about 10-15% more pay. Plus, like other posters have mentioned it was in sweltering conditions in ass end of nowhere etc.

I think FIFO is a great short term option to generate some cash but I think anyone with a family should look to move beyond it in long term.

Very true Jackbhoy

This guy is very informative.... and also confirms it.

http://www.pomsinoz.com/forum/jobs-careers/144287-you-trying-get-into-mining-resources-industry-wa-4.html#post1935843401

http://www.pomsinoz.com/forum/jobs-careers/191012-fifo-who-else-does-what-do-you-do-6.html#post1936277967

http://www.pomsinoz.com/forum/jobs-careers/149606-what-jobs-there-mining.html#post1935818052


I agree if you have family you will still have the same overheads so not much saving by living in a camp 3 weeks of the month.

If you own a car you will be paying car/rego/insurance for it to sit doing nothing 3 weeks out of the month.

If you are free & single doing FIFO and flying to Bali or Thailand on your week off and having no overheads you will probably save.... that is if you can get into it.

pete4130

I've done FIFO about 2.5 years out of the last 3 years. You do give up a lot its true.

The fact is you do FIFO to make money, not to make friends or for the love of the job. Some people relocate with their families so they are local or DIDO workers. This can make sense for them.

With FIFO work you don't have to be particularly smart to make good money. You have to be smart to know to save it. For the most part I do it as a short term option to make some money so I can have opportunities opened up to me that otherwise wouldn't be there.

Sometimes it can be pretty sh!t being away for 3 weeks at a time. Most of the time its actually pretty good. It can be social with the people you work with, get to see things most people won't see, great experience in your profession if you have one. It's a different way of life.

I've worked with guys who just follow the work, have 2 divorces behind them and a 3rd wife and can't understand why the pattern keeps repeating itself even though they provide a good home, cars, furniture, lifestyle for their families. It's obvious to me….they are never at home and thats the root cause. These guys are institutionalised. Some to the point that their whole social outlet is being in work, drinking beers in the evening and talking sh1t the whole time. Their week home is long enough for them to be desperate to get away from real life.

Young guys come out and get addicted to the money. It's hard to go back to a regular paying job in the city and be happy with it. I've tried 2-3 times to work back in Sydney and feel like I'm being ripped off working a 40 hour week for an above average wage. It's a double edged sword that you can't really understand until you work FIFO.

As regards to money….I'll agree I don't earn, per hour a huge amount more than someone working a 9-5 job. What makes the difference is the guaranteed long hours you work, overtime and penalty rates. These compensate you for basically selling your life.

A lot of the guys, mainly Aussies that work FIFO get more caught up than the likes of the Irish guys in regards to how easy the money is. Lots of the Aussie guys have big mortgages, V8 utes, maybe a boat, 2nd car, investment property, ex wife, kids etc and a lot of their money is spent on the cheap credit they were able to get.

Lots of the Irish guys I work with see a De Ja Vu of the Irish situation from a few years ago where credit was easy to get, money was cheap and there was no end in sight of the good times. It's these guys, like me, who work hard while we can and are saving what we earn for the future. It won't be around forever.

I could save $250K in 2 years if I work hard and save lots. Opportunities like that don't come around very often so while they are here it makes sense to commit to giving up a normal life so that in 2-3 years you can be secure and relax, find a job and lifestyle that agrees with you, be almost 100% debt free and have a brighter future.

The downside, it isn't secure work. There is always someone who will do your job if you aren't willing. My company let about 300 people go in November/December as the main client wanted to wind down for the wet season. The rains didn't come this year and they were caught with their pants down with being understaffed and work ramping up. I was one of the lucky ones that was kept on.
The other downside is that most companies in the city are reluctant to take you on, as they know you are used to working for lots of cash that they can't match and know you are probably using them as a stop gap until the FIFO work picks up again and will leave them high and dry. It's a double edged sword in that respect.

Hot, remote conditions are part and parcel of the work. You get used to it so it's not really that big of a deal.

@Mellor

Your friend who is getting the same per week as his old job is being grossly underpaid. He's probably on a flat rate per hour, no penalties and is more than likely the lowest paid on his job. You work FIFO for the guaranteed long hours and higher hourly rate to have the bigger pay check at the end of the week. If he is staying in a camp, he should be getting a camp allowance, site allowance or uplift to reflect living and working away from home. It all depends on contracts.

Some companies know they can underpay UK/Irish/foreign workers and they are willing to take it. For example, I work with a guy that had an interview for a previous company I worked for in Sydney (for my old job after I quit because they were paying me crap money). Because they offered me a 457 visa I was on $65K a year gross. As he was Aussie, for the same job, role, responsibility his salary was going to be $80K a year.

Also if you break down the time off per year, it's not so different. I work 3 on, 1 off and 26 days leave. So I am in work for 7.75 months of the year, meaning I get over 4 months off a year (approx 120 days). Working a 9-5 you get weekends (104 days) and your 28 days leave? Thats about 132 days off per year, so roughly 10% more time off per year but only earning about 1/3 of what FIFO workers do.

It depends on how you want to look at it, what you want to get from it and what is right for you to do.

There are opportunities to make good money if your willing to give up your time to earn it. There are also opportunities to have a great standard of living if you are willing to give up earning a higher salary.

I type this as I sit on my bed in my en suite room in a prefab building on the outskirts of a small rural town in Central QLD while sipping on a beer, connected to the internet through my wifi hotspot on my phone on my 3rd and final week of this shift.

jackbhoy

Great post Pete. Well written and very interesting account!

Noo

Thank you Pete. Youve just described a very dear friend of mine who at 27, is stressed to the max with his FIFO job, can work a month straight and be lucky to get a day off! No overtime even though he'll do 18 hour days and get paid for 8 hours. He has saved 75, 000 in 18 months, aiming to have 100, 000 by the end of the year, fancy cars, a boat, gonna buy a house etc. He hates his job, his work days and hours are illegal! The their clients make him fly back to the city for time off for safety reasons...a month straight of 18hr days no time off is not healthy, but his job make him work in the office during any time he is suppose to have off. He complains so much but I am sick of telling hin to quit for a better employer (tons of people have been leaving his company for better jobs) but he has his money goals in sight, as you said young guy addicted to the money, so he is staying for the money. Yet he is so depressed because he is so lonely, he has a lot of love to give and gets so down that he can't find anyone, was seeing someone but didnt work out because of his work. I have asked him many times is it worth it for the money to be that lonely and depressed and he tells me that he's doing it for the money while he can...no mortgage (for now), no partner, kids etc but its a catch 22, he doesn't have these things because of his job!

I know it's not much to do with the thread but your post really hit home.

pete4130

Noo wrote: »

Thank you Pete. Youve just described a very dear friend of mine who at 27, is stressed to the max with his FIFO job, can work a month straight and be lucky to get a day off! No overtime even though he'll do 18 hour days and get paid for 8 hours. He has saved 75, 000 in 18 months, aiming to have 100, 000 by the end of the year, fancy cars, a boat, gonna buy a house etc. He hates his job, his work days and hours are illegal! The their clients make him fly back to the city for time off for safety reasons...a month straight of 18hr days no time off is not healthy, but his job make him work in the office during any time he is suppose to have off. He complains so much but I am sick of telling hin to quit for a better employer (tons of people have been leaving his company for better jobs) but he has his money goals in sight, as you said young guy addicted to the money, so he is staying for the money. Yet he is so depressed because he is so lonely, he has a lot of love to give and gets so down that he can't find anyone, was seeing someone but didnt work out because of his work. I have asked him many times is it worth it for the money to be that lonely and depressed and he tells me that he's doing it for the money while he can...no mortgage (for now), no partner, kids etc but its a catch 22, he doesn't have these things because of his job!

I know it's not much to do with the thread but your post really hit home.

First up….18 hour days are illegal. He needs to start a diary and note/document his start and end times. Any decent company will NOT let you work thought hours due to fatigue management. They can be legally liable for anything that happens with those hours from a work accident to a car accident to/from work. If you work a 14 hour day you legally need a 10 hour break before your next shift starts. Working 18 hour days is highly illegal. He needs to get in touch with Work Cover and sort that out. That job is not worth it. Most big companies won't let you work more than two 14 hour days in a row because of fatigue management.

I understand if he is on salary for whatever hours he works he'll only be paid for the 8 hours. It's still illegal. The job also doesn't seem to be worth the money with this hours. $75K in 18 months isn't that great considering the hours put in. He really needs to keep a diary, get in touch wit Work Cover and get a healthy normal life sorted out.

His time off/RnR is HIS time off. He is being taken advantage of for sure. He 100% needs to speak to someone regarding industrial relations and work conditions. Is he on a 457 visa at all and feels obligated to do all these hours or else lose his job? What is he working at?

I've told jobs to get stuffed when they wanted me to work 10 hour days Mon-Fri and be paid for a 38 hour week. In fact I walked out on a company sponsoring me that told me I had to work for free, in my own time, to correct an error that wasn't my responsibility.

The least you can do is bring your version to an IR solicitor to relay the information to your friend, then all you can do is let him decide what he wants to do.

comfortseeker

i am i the same boat op. I dont have a degree only a FETAc cert in bus admin and i have been working in accounts since I left college. I want to take the plunge and go for a while anything up to a year but it is my intention to come back to Ireland and go to uni as a mature student and do nursing. but i am terrified of going and ending up with nothing!

Does anyone have similar experience and have gotten a job in an office with no degree?

Noo

pete4130 wrote: »

First up….18 hour days are illegal. He needs to start a diary and note/document his start and end times. Any decent company will NOT let you work thought hours due to fatigue management. They can be legally liable for anything that happens with those hours from a work accident to a car accident to/from work. If you work a 14 hour day you legally need a 10 hour break before your next shift starts. Working 18 hour days is highly illegal. He needs to get in touch with Work Cover and sort that out. That job is not worth it. Most big companies won't let you work more than two 14 hour days in a row because of fatigue management.

I understand if he is on salary for whatever hours he works he'll only be paid for the 8 hours. It's still illegal. The job also doesn't seem to be worth the money with this hours. $75K in 18 months isn't that great considering the hours put in. He really needs to keep a diary, get in touch wit Work Cover and get a healthy normal life sorted out.

His time off/RnR is HIS time off. He is being taken advantage of for sure. He 100% needs to speak to someone regarding industrial relations and work conditions. Is he on a 457 visa at all and feels obligated to do all these hours or else lose his job? What is he working at?

I've told jobs to get stuffed when they wanted me to work 10 hour days Mon-Fri and be paid for a 38 hour week. In fact I walked out on a company sponsoring me that told me I had to work for free, in my own time, to correct an error that wasn't my responsibility.

The least you can do is bring your version to an IR solicitor to relay the information to your friend, then all you can do is let him decide what he wants to do.

Thanks for the reply. Oh believe me I am well aware of all this! I have sent him countless links about how it's illegal and who to contact etc. Yes he is on a 457 but in the process of his expression of interest for PR. He says once he get PR he is gonna leave, but only if he can get a FIFO with similar money. He doesnt put up with it because he feels obliged on his 457 he does it because everyone else in his company does and no one complains...it drives me up the wall!!! The fatigue management is ridiculous, they have a massive client, not naming any massive utilies supplier in particular, who send him back to the city for time off as its in their fatigue management plan...if it was up to his compnay he'd work straight through, so as I said they bring him into the office then, unknown to the client. Its at the stage where I wont listen to him complain anymore, I just tell him what do you expect when you let them walk all over you. Hes a site manager.

Noo

pete4130 wrote: »

First up….18 hour days are illegal. He needs to start a diary and note/document his start and end times. Any decent company will NOT let you work thought hours due to fatigue management. They can be legally liable for anything that happens with those hours from a work accident to a car accident to/from work. If you work a 14 hour day you legally need a 10 hour break before your next shift starts. Working 18 hour days is highly illegal. He needs to get in touch with Work Cover and sort that out. That job is not worth it. Most big companies won't let you work more than two 14 hour days in a row because of fatigue management.

I understand if he is on salary for whatever hours he works he'll only be paid for the 8 hours. It's still illegal. The job also doesn't seem to be worth the money with this hours. $75K in 18 months isn't that great considering the hours put in. He really needs to keep a diary, get in touch wit Work Cover and get a healthy normal life sorted out.

His time off/RnR is HIS time off. He is being taken advantage of for sure. He 100% needs to speak to someone regarding industrial relations and work conditions. Is he on a 457 visa at all and feels obligated to do all these hours or else lose his job? What is he working at?

I've told jobs to get stuffed when they wanted me to work 10 hour days Mon-Fri and be paid for a 38 hour week. In fact I walked out on a company sponsoring me that told me I had to work for free, in my own time, to correct an error that wasn't my responsibility.

The least you can do is bring your version to an IR solicitor to relay the information to your friend, then all you can do is let him decide what he wants to do.

Thanks for the reply. Oh believe me I am well aware of all this! I have sent him countless links about how it's illegal and who to contact etc. Yes he is on a 457 but in the process of his expression of interest for PR. He says once he get PR he is gonna leave, but only if he can get a FIFO with similar money. He doesnt put up with it because he feels obliged on his 457 he does it because everyone else in his company does and no one complains...it drives me up the wall!!! The fatigue management is ridiculous, they have a massive client, not naming any massive utilies supplier in particular, who send him back to the city for time off as its in their fatigue management plan...if it was up to his compnay he'd work straight through, so as I said they bring him into the office then, unknown to the client. Its at the stage where I wont listen to him complain anymore, I just tell him what do you expect when you let them walk all over you. Hes a site manager.

Mellor

pete4130 wrote: »

@Mellor

Your friend who is getting the same per week as his old job is being grossly underpaid. He's probably on a flat rate per hour,

Sorry prob wasn't phrased well. He's getting the same per hour after tax as he was self employed. He obv works lot of hours FIFO, and if managed the same when SE, living/business expenses verses camp/allowances (not 100% how they work tbh) make a world of difference.

hedgehog2

danish pasterys wrote: »

Im 24 and recently went back to college to keep me busy in this recession however iv no passion in what im doing and cant see myself sticking at it for 4 years to probably be back on the dole cue after it..

So im thinking of going to oz with hope of getting a half decent job which to me is just enough to pay the bills and do some things on weekends..

Im wondering if anyone knows if someone with no college education or trade, just years experience at operative jobs, can pick up a half decent job in oz and if theres just better oppurtunities?

I have two brothers over their at the moment, working in construction but I have no real construction skills so I want to know what other kind of jobs could I possibly land or is it strictly just a skilled shortage down under and odds are ill be struggling ?

Any advice appreciated

Stick with your degree then head over.

danish pasterys

hedgehog2 wrote: »

Stick with your degree then head over.

Im gonna stick with it thinking of the long run, would an ordinary degree give me any leverage in getting longer then two years their? and would it be worthy to employers I ask incase I dont wanna stay on another year in college for the honors

Mellor

Staying longer than the WHV is dependent more so on immigrations requirements than the employers.

hedgehog2

danish pasterys wrote: »

Im gonna stick with it thinking of the long run, would an ordinary degree give me any leverage in getting longer then two years their? and would it be worthy to employers I ask incase I dont wanna stay on another year in college for the honors

Its a lot harder to go back and finish the your degree once your older and an honours degree is worth something a pass degree is just not good enough now.
It all depends on the job you land in Oz,see if you like the place first.
You may not think its the place for you after a while in Oz so try not to focus too far ahead.
Goid luck with your choice