Manchester United Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - 2013/14 Mod Warning: Post #7871

Ugo Monye spacecraft experience

No

Moyes was 15/2 to get the sack next at 9am this morning. He's now 8/11

That's a massive market shift

Cantona's Collars

v3ttel wrote: »

Sorry, but this is absolute bollocks. He is the one member of the midfield we picked last night that is capable of playing CL standard football. What exactly was he slowing down? The rate at which Cleverley gave away the ball? Valencia's predictable and uninspiring wing play? Young's ineffectiveness?

Seriously, if you think that Michael Carrick is this teams biggest concern, you need to have a word with yourself.

I think you picked me up wrong,I mentioned Clev not turning up in my post.The point I'm making is that Carrick is a senior player in a position that is meant to dictate our play,his tempo is slow & languid.Works ok if we have a decent midfielder alongside him,falls to bits otherwise & he reverts to passing the ball backwards or hail mary diagonal balls,he simply isn't the one to grab a game by the scruff of the neck and help drive the team on.It's damning when our striker spend most of the time playing as a midfielder as ours don't do their jobs.

The deficiencies of other players simply magnify Carrick's limitations.I wonder would it help him if we played Fellaini in his position for a while?

tallaghtmick

No

xabi wrote: »

Good news - #MUFC source: David Moyes has not been sacked, he has Alex Ferguson full backing. Review meeting is planned in June with CEO & Ferguson.

Nearly got sick reading that

Cantona's Collars

mike65 wrote: »

Guillem Balague says its horse feathers, something that originated on Wall Street (as shareholders would need to be informed first I think)

Do you not now the Balague rule? Believe the opposite of what he says.

bucketybuck

No

Corvus Maximus wrote: »

That’s the length of time SAF was granted, so Moyes should be extended the same courtesy imo.

This is the second time you have spouted this claptrap.

What the fcuk does courtesy have to do with anything? Courtesy?

If we had appointed Joe Kinnear as manager he should be given 3 years out of fcuking courtesy?

Stop fooling yourself.

mike65

http://www.theguardian.com/football/2014/feb/26/david-moyes-position-manchester-united-manager-secure

CSF

No

Corvus Maximus wrote: »

You obviously missed the 3.5 years bit in my last post. That’s the length of time SAF was granted, so Moyes should be extended the same courtesy imo.



You catch on fast don’t you. Yes that’s part of it, but it’s also myself applying a little bit of cop on and realism based on the barren years we endured in the past.



Apart from yourself who else mentioned that SAF was infallible? Did I not previously mention Lee Martin's goal? and do you know why that was? Well it was to point out that SAF didn't start his reign in glory. He had 3.5 trophyless years and it's quite possible that if we had of lost that FA cup replay. Then our history and destiny may have been very different.


I can but you obviously can’t. The difference being back in 1986 United fans were a patient bunch, with realistic expectations. Today? Well today in 2013, the only difference I see is a bloated spoiled rotten brigade. A brigade who appear to have only known success. A dose of reality will do them no harm imo.


Looks like that went right over your head. I’ll make it clearer for you. Some fans want success right now, they want instant gratification hence my reference to cum shot. The foreplay comments refers to the actual effort you need to put in, in order to obtain the gratification/success.



Don’t be so hard on yourself. Personally I wouldn’t go so far as to call you that, it is only a sport after all.

Seriously, I don't think I've ever seen a post be quite so full of its own important yet so utterly nonsensical.

Fergie got 3.5 years and became great, therefore everyone else must get 3.5 years regardless of the longterm impact those years could have. Nonsense.

Son Of A Vidic

Liam O wrote: »

I've been very disappointed with this season. I think it would have been similarly difficult for anyone coming in and we could be talking about how Jose has walked out after a bust up with someone. If at the start of next season there isn't a clear tactical philosophy from the ground up beginning to be executed at the club then I'll be the first to jump on the anti-Moyes bandwagon. Looking at his previous job he has the mentality to do this and Fellaini and Mata are a step in the right direction. I think his problem is that he refuses to make any changes as a stop gap so wouldn't sign someone for a short period in January. It's all about this Summer, that's when my real judgement will start.

I totally agree with you on all that and yes I also think this summer is key. Moyes starting the job last July with the season beginning in August, made this a non-season for me. Like yourself, this summer is the point I am expecting to see serious rebuilding with Moyes putting his stamp and future direction on the team.

Headshot

No

Just need him to get the dreaded vote of confidence and ill be delighted

Cantona's Collars

1983/'84 season was the last time we overturned a 2 goal deficit in Europe.

Ludo

No

CSF wrote: »

Fergie got 3.5 years and became great, therefore everyone else must get 3.5 years regardless of the longterm impact those years could have. Nonsense.

Exactly. Football is a VERY different game now. In fact it isn't a game...it is a business. Times have changed completely and no way can a business like ManU allow a manager the same time to "settle" as they did with Fergie.
Share price would be ruined and that cannot be allowed to happen.

tossy

Serious/realistic suggestions on who you think should replace him ?

(there is probably only one manager in European football i think is qualified and we actually have a realistic chance of getting,i would love to see it happen but i'm not sure it will)

bangkok

moyes will not be sacked before the season is over.....that's a fact. players will be gone before manager is.

Son Of A Vidic

bucketybuck wrote: »

This is the second time you have spouted this claptrap.

What the fcuk does courtesy have to do with anything? Courtesy?

If we had appointed Joe Kinnear as manager he should be given 3 years out of fcuking courtesy?

Stop fooling yourself.

Jaysus calm yourself down and untwist your knickers. No need to be losing the plot over a difference of opinion.

CSF

No

bangkok wrote: »

moyes will not be sacked before the season is over.....that's a fact. players will be gone before manager is.

Just to clarify, that isn't actually a fact. That is your opinion, whether correct or incorrect.

Do you need a dictionary definition of the word fact because I am a nice enough guy and would happily oblige?

adox

No

Ugo Monye spacecraft experience wrote: »

Moyes was 15/2 to get the sack next at 9am this morning. He's now 8/11

That's a massive market shift

People put money on based on rumours and the odds fall. Nothing to it I would say unfortunately.

adox

No

mike65 wrote: »

Guillem Balague says its horse feathers, something that originated on Wall Street (as shareholders would need to be informed first I think)

Him dismissing the rumours actually gives me a little hope.

Also Wall St doesnt open until 1.30PM.

brinty

tossy wrote: »

Serious/realistic suggestions on who you think should replace him ?

(there is probably only one manager in European football i think is qualified and we actually have a realistic chance of getting,i would love to see it happen but i'm not sure it will)

And who is that???

Van Gaal
Heynckes
heaven forbid....Trapatoni
or maybe the Great....Stan...

bangkok

adox wrote: »

People put money on based on rumours and the odds fall. Nothing to it I would say unfortunately.

yes and Asian betting firms do put big money on moyes for example 50K getting sacked, word spreads like wildfire, people put money on moyes getting sacked, odds drop to 5/6 on.... moyes not to get sacked goes to 6/5....same Asian betting firm put 200k on moyes not getting sacked.....easy money. Has happened loads of times

CSF

No

bangkok wrote: »

yes and Asian betting firms do put big money on moyes for example 50K getting sacked, word spreads like wildfire, people put money on moyes getting sacked, odds drop to 5/6 on.... moyes not to get sacked goes to 6/5....same Asian betting firm put 200k on moyes not getting sacked.....easy money. Has happened loads of times

If the odds on Moyes being sacked are 5/6, the odds on him not being sacked would be about 5/6 too. Anything but easy money.

Ugo Monye spacecraft experience

Ugo Monye spacecraft experience wrote: »

Moyes was 15/2 to get the sack next at 9am this morning. He's now 8/11

That's a massive market shift

Someone must've put a fiver free bet on it.

Son Of A Vidic

Ludo wrote: »

Exactly. Football is a VERY different game now. In fact it isn't a game...it is a business. Times have changed completely and no way can a business like ManU allow a manager the same time to "settle" as they did with Fergie.
Share price would be ruined and that cannot be allowed to happen.

A very good point and I can totally see not only your logic but also the business logic behind it. But I just want the man to be given an adequate amount of time to effect change within the club. But those who think 8 months is an adequate amount of time in a behemoth of a club like United? Well that is just totally nonsensical imo. And I may be wrong, but my gut feeling suspects the Glazers have the good business sense to realise that also.

super_furry

No

All kinds of twitter chat about Moyes leaving seems to have stemmed from this financial blog http://www.forexlive.com/blog/2014/02/26/market-talk-on-the-new-york-stock-exchange-that-moyes-is-to-leave-man-utd-by-mutual-consent/

messinkiapina

Its All Wright wrote: »

Moyes is going no where lads. Speculating about it is a waste of time. Odds can fall through all the floors they want but Moyes is our long term gaffer

I'd be surprised myself if the club didn't want to give him more time. But if (big if) he's lost the dressing room, they might feel they've no choice.

super_furry

No

Ferguson 7/4 on Paddy Power to take charge of Manchester United for one competitive game this season.

CSF

No

Corvus Maximus wrote: »

A very good point and I can totally see not only your logic but also the business logic behind it. But I just want the man to be given an adequate amount of time to effect change within the club. But those who think 8 months is an adequate amount of time in a behemoth of a club like United? Well that is just totally nonsensical imo. And I may be wrong, but my gut feeling suspects the Glazers have the good business sense to realise that also.

You have to earn the right to get to every stage in your project, every unsuccessful implementation of a stage in a footballing project, multiplies the amount of work to be done to fix the damage done when Moyes leaves.

tossy

brinty wrote: »

And who is that???

Van Gaal
Heynckes
heaven forbid....Trapatoni
or maybe the Great....Stan...

You really want a 62 or 68 year old to get the job ? Van Gaal,Heynckes and hiddink etc can get the boat.

I was thinking of Klopp, he's probably one of the few managers (possibly) available and qualified, more qualified than Moyes was. I'm not one of these Moyes out brigade but if he were to go we could end up in just as bad a position with the new manager if we didn't choose wisely. Any potential new manager is still left with the bunch of donkeys we have at the moment that we are using as filler.

LuckyCharms

I dont understand how SAF's initial start at Utd is even being used in the Moyes Debate. The only simiarilities between them is the name of the club they came to manage.

Saf was a European champion and multiple league champion breaking the Old Firm stranglehold which is akin to the Madrid/Barca domination except even worse.He came to manage a club that was a shambles which had a terrible booze culture among other things.He was a hotshot arriving to the big stage when he came to Utd.

How can anyone compare the above to Moyes? Taking over the reigning League champions, spent 60m of players which are rubbish(afrodude) or was bought in to play the exact same role that you just resigned your best player this season to on a massive contract.

Moyes was never good enough, im glad he is bombing so hard that he will get replaced sooner rather than later. Cant stand the type of football he employs or the mentality that the players are showing under him.

People can blame the players all they want but when it comes down to it, these are champions and have turned into chumps under a new regime. One player can turn rubbish ala Torres which is fine.

When your whole team of Champions turns into Sunday League players, then you blame the management team i.e Moyes and the band of misfits he brought from Everton.

Francie Barrett

No

super_furry wrote: »

Ferguson 7/4 on Paddy Power to take charge of Manchester United for one competitive game this season.

Awful odds.

user2011

No

From Matt Dickinson: The Times

"What will it take? £150 million? £200 million? The Glazers can give David Moyes more money than he knows what to do with but, while it can buy better players, you cannot shop for the confidence, desire and defiance that this self-pitying squad so shockingly lack.

It goes back to his media image of the "we hope" "we'll try" "we were unlucky"
Moyes has not portrayed confidence in himself and then went as far to say he had none in the players he had at his disposal. Stupidity, to say he would be happy to go into the new season with no new signings then a few games into it it's ah we need more WC players in the team. No sh!t Moyes could you not of seen the weaknesses in the team you've been opposite for 10 years as Everton manager and looking to exploit our weaknesses when against us?

Also I take back the "I hate the man" comment last night I was reading a few other news sites and the red mist descended and I stopped thinking. I've a lot of annoyances with his management style and what it's manifested too with United. I like zero of it. Please exit the building ASAP.

patmac

No

I'm all for giving managers time but last night was the worst performance in Europe I can remember and I have been following Utd since 1968, it was on a par with the 4-0 drubbing in Barcelona but that team was affected by the foreigner rule. The difference between Moyes and Fergie, is that Fergie had a plan to get rid of the drinking culture and change his team and was proven by having broken the Celtic-Rangers dominance in Scotland, Moyes doesn't fill me or the team with confidence so sadly if he was sacked today I would be delighted.

Giruilla

Your Airbag wrote: »

Fellaini was pushing through the lines and trying to create on Saturday, he was clearly instructed to get high in the opposition half. Moyes has no faith in Clev and Carrick to do this. Why bloody play them and drop Fellaini then?

This I just cannot understand. Thought Fellaini or Fletcher at least would be a shoe in to play this game.

He brought instant freedom to those around him against Palace, and brought united core higher up the pitch allowing the wings to receive the ball higher up rather than, as you said, inside their own half.
Carrick looked a different player beside him as he could solely concentrate on dictating the play and not about covereing positions Cleverley wasn't in. His touch map was very similar to Kroos' v Arsenal in that game - who also had that freedom as he was playing alongside Lahm. It must be frustrating for Carrick. Not to mention RVP who effectively never receives the ball to his feet now unless he drops 25/30 yards deep.

The_Kew_Tour

No

Lot of Money on Moyes getting the chop.

More money today then all this month if my mate who watches all this markets is to be believed.

I still dont think he be gone by summer.

Maybe and hopefully then.

Cantona's Collars

Schmeichel on twitter:

I have no words;-(

The_Kew_Tour

No

zerks wrote: »

Schmeichel on twitter:

Not the only one after last night:pac:

super_furry

No

He's now 8/11 to be next manager sacked.

Nuri Sahin

tossy wrote: »

You really want a 62 or 68 year old to get the job ? Van Gaal,Heynckes and hiddink etc can get the boat.

I was thinking of Klopp, he's probably one of the few managers (possibly) available and qualified, more qualified than Moyes was. I'm not one of these Moyes out brigade but if he were to go we could end up in just as bad a position with the new manager if we didn't choose wisely. Any potential new manager is still left with the bunch of donkeys we have at the moment that we are using as filler.

Not a chance.

edit - I'd be saying the above for any other club btw, not just United.

Coillte_Bhoy

Is this correct? Might be a fake, outrageous if true

lordgoat

No

I hate the fact that the most excited I've been about my team this season is today at the thoughts of Moyes getting the sack.

kstand

No

Hills had a book on the next manager to be sacked and up to last week he was 12/1 or 14/1 on that.
Today they have suspended that book - the b est odds you can get now are 6/4 with Corals or 19/10 with Betfair - all other books are below evens.
I'd be surprised if it was announced that he was sacked before summer - wonder if this is just a Wall St rumour that has got out of hand and the bookies slashing their prices to protect themselves in case.

case885

No

zerks wrote: »

Schmeichel on twitter:

Deep from schmeichel. :pac:

scudzilla

No

Coillte_Bhoy wrote: »

Is this correct? Might be a fake, outrageous if true

Wasn't there a big issue over this whereas all Season Ticket holders HAD to buy tickets for all home Cup games, be it F.A, Carling or CL?

radharc

Lads there is no point quoting what price DM is to get the sack, those markets are notoriously weak with hugely volatile price changes. It proves nothing.

LuckyCharms

Corvus Maximus wrote: »

A very good point and I can totally see not only your logic but also the business logic behind it. But I just want the man to be given an adequate amount of time to effect change within the club. But those who think 8 months is an adequate amount of time in a behemoth of a club like United? Well that is just totally nonsensical imo. And I may be wrong, but my gut feeling suspects the Glazers have the good business sense to realise that also.

I have to ask, why do you want Moyes to effect change within the most successful club of the Premiership era.

The whole point of SAF's succession plan was to keep the club as is for the most part.

We didn't hire Moyes to reshape the club, he was hired to continue what was already built.

You can see it clearly amongst all the top clubs in Europe this summer.

Bayern and Barca both hired new managers, one is a globally sought after manager in Pep who can demand whatever he wants at a club probably and the other came with a big rep from Argentina but unproved in Europe.

What is the mainstay of these two managers with very different reputations and pulling power?

Both brought there own staff and installed them to work alongside the existing staff at either club.

This is how it should have been done at Utd but Moyes thought he knew best and decided to bring in Phil and Giggs as first team coaches, how ridiculous is that, no to mention bringing his staff from Everton to replace the Utd Staff.

What Moyes was thinking when he decided to gut the coaching staff and the scouting network after Gill & Saf leaving the same summer, i'll never know but it was a crazy decision and one that we will pay for some time to come.

The best thing to come out of this i hope is that, in future managers will be brought in to work within the confines of the club ala Bayern or Barca, not to gut the heart of it to enact their own boys club.

brinty

tossy wrote: »

You really want a 62 or 68 year old to get the job ? Van Gaal,Heynckes and hiddink etc can get the boat.

I was thinking of Klopp, he's probably one of the few managers (possibly) available and qualified, more qualified than Moyes was. I'm not one of these Moyes out brigade but if he were to go we could end up in just as bad a position with the new manager if we didn't choose wisely. Any potential new manager is still left with the bunch of donkeys we have at the moment that we are using as filler.

did one forget their sarcasm detector for breakfast

kstand

No

radharc wrote: »

Lads there is no point quoting what price DM is to get the sack, those markets are notoriously weak with hugely volatile price changes. It proves nothing.

True - they are reacting to those rumours of a NYSE announcement at 1.30pm - protecting themselves if nothing else.

The_Kew_Tour

No

lordgoat wrote: »

I hate the fact that the most excited I've been about my team this season is today at the thoughts of Moyes getting the sack.

Sadly im in same boat

Cantona's Collars

It's like a flashback to Ireland under big Jack.

David de Gea completed more passes to Van Persie than all but two of United’s attacking personnel.

The Spanish netminder delivered two balls to his Dutch comrade, and that was one more than Michael Carrick, Ashley Young and Danny Welbeck managed.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2568071/Robin-van-Persie-blasts-United-team-mates-occupying-spaces-firing-blank.html#ixzz2uQn6XmG5

Macca07

Firstly, I'm going to apologize for the long post, but I've just read thru nearly 1000 posts to get the general opinion before posting.

Right, I'm in my late 20s, and that is the worse team performance I've ever seen from a Man Utd team, it was absolutely awful, disgraceful, and everyone needs to take responsibility for it, players and the management team.

There was no gameplan, there was no tactics, not even the standard cross cross cross was being used last night, which I think might have actually worked against that opposition. Rooney had to come to the edge of his own box to get the ball to try and start something. Vidic was playing long balls into RvP, yes, Vidic, kicking the ball 60 yards to our only striker and no one near him. The only thing the team did last night was when position was conceded, every player turned around and ran back towards goal to get every possible man behind the ball. If that is the tactics Moyes is planning on using, then we need to forget about it. With a team consisting of Clev, Young and Valencia, 3 athletic players with speed, we should be trying to close down the opposition down as soon as possible, not leave them get to the edge of the box and try and block the shot. There has been a lot of deflected goals against us this season, and that is the main reason why.

Cleverly shouldn't be playing for United, he isn't good enough, and that was glaringly obvious all season. Smalling at RB is exactly that, he isn't a RB and shouldn't be played there, I'd have preferred to see Val at RB and Kagawa or anyone else starting. I know we have our defensive injuries so can't really complain about back 4, but Smalling is a RB, and playing him there is going to destroy him as a player.

I thought after a good performance against Palace that we could finally get going and start playing well, but this is Sunday league stuff that we played last night. I was one of many ppl saying that Moyes will be given 2-3 seasons before being replaced, but it just can't happen. I expect him to stay until the end of the season, but I couldn't see the fans, the media, and the board willing to except him at the club next season.

I think if a signing is made before the WC, then Moyes will be in charge at the start of next season, but if we wait until after the WC before trying to sign someone, when a few more managers will be available after the WC, then I think Moyes is gone.

I actually wouldn't mind seeing Giggs take the reigns for the remainder of the season and let someone replace him at the summer, but I can't see anything good coming from this Moyes era, no matter how long it lasts.

Son Of A Vidic

CSF wrote: »

You have to earn the right to get to every stage in your project, every unsuccessful implementation of a stage in a footballing project, multiplies the amount of work to be done to fix the damage done when Moyes leaves.

Yes but I don't think he has even started the project yet. As I said earleir, this was always going to be a non-season not only for Moyes, but for any man that took over last July. With a season under the belt, I expect any manager to have a better idea of the weaknesses and driftwood within the team. Taking over 6 weeks before the new season starts is not an adequate amount of time for that process to occur. So I expect the project work you mentioned to really begin this summer.