Manchester United Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - 2013/14 Mod Warning: Post #7871

irishfeen

Panthro wrote: »

Petition to ban Cleverley from England side doing the rounds apparently.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2570211/Petition-ban-Tom-Cleverley-England-squad-clocks-3-000-signatures-day.html

Whatever anyone thinks about Tom Cleverley and his talent/performaces that petition thing is disgusting.

GSPfan

No

Valmont wrote: »

I'd rather the board forced half the team to resign tbh. They are forgetting another one of Ferguson's dictums: nobody is bigger than the club. He leaves and half of them stop bothering to put any effort in like little spoiled children. It is a good job they are paying Rooney £300,000 a week because he is doing the work of three players out there at the moment.

Cleverley couldn't even sweep the dressing room floor. He'd just sweep all the dirt sideways and backwards.

The suggestion that they aren't trying annoys me. I don't see that. I think they are all being forced to play a rubbish system which has them running around like fools.

Lord TSC

No

Valmont wrote: »

They are forgetting another one of Ferguson's dictums: nobody is bigger than the club. .

Except for Moyes, apparently, who can take the club back massive strides and we should still all back him regardless? :pac:

I fully agree no one man is bigger than the club. That's why I don't get this loyalty to Moyes over the whole team, who have brought us success in the past.

bucketybuck

No

GSPfan wrote: »

The suggestion that they aren't trying annoys me. I don't see that. I think they are all being forced to play a rubbish system which has them running around like fools.

Rooney and Van Persie are averaging around one pass to each other per game. Either people believe that Wayne Rooney isn't working hard enough or they believe there is a serious problem with the tactical setup of the side. I know which I believe.

Valmont

GSPfan wrote: »

The suggestion that they aren't trying annoys me. I don't see that. I think they are all being forced to play a rubbish system which has them running around like fools.

Well they're not running very fast, that's for sure. But I have wondered about some of his selections in recent weeks although we don't get to see who's doing what in training. I would love to know what happened to Fellaini though, he played great at Everton under the same manager but now he looks hopeless? Maybe the dressing room atmosphere has infected him?

tallaghtmick

No

Valmont wrote: »

You're all forgetting what Ferguson told us just before he retired. It's important that we stick by our new manager. Do you think he would have said this if he thought everything was going to be rosy straight away? If Moyes is sacked then we are just like Chelsea or City one of these other clubs who have no sense of building and preserving a culture of success but just want to pay a premium for winning right now.

Just remember you are like the people holding the banners up for Ferguson to be sacked shortly after he became manager. Give it until Christmas next season and then we will know with certainty what needs to be done.

I'm with the chosen one!

So much wrong with this post....but ill point out the worst bit...... The chosen one lol

Cantona's Collars

bucketybuck wrote: »

Rooney and Van Persie are averaging around one pass to each other per game. Either people believe that Wayne Rooney isn't working hard enough or they believe there is a serious problem with the tactical setup of the side. I know which I believe.

When Rooney spends most of his time filling in for our non-existent midfield it's hard to link up with his strike partner.:(

The_Kew_Tour

No

Much worse happened to Andy Cole and he only won extra 5 pl medals, CL medal and 2 fa cup medals.

Tom is big boy on 70k a week.

I would not lose sleep over it

thelad95

No

If Fergie went to the Glazers/the board and admitted he'd made a mistake in appointing Moyes do you think he would be sacked?

Valmont

David Moyes was chosen by Sir Alex Ferguson, was he not?

yabadabado

Valmont wrote: »

You're all forgetting what Ferguson told us just before he retired. It's important that we stick by our new manager. Do you think he would have said this if he thought everything was going to be rosy straight away?

I don't think even the biggest doommonger could have foreseen just how poor United would be this season.
I'm sure SAF thought it would be tough and Moyes would have some hiccups but it has been so ****e its nearly unbelievable .
I like many didn't expect United to win the league but fully expected top 4 and still be competing for the league until the business end of the season.
What has happened is shocking with no sign of improvement or any sign of a plan.

Timmyctc

No

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

Much worse happened to Andy Cole and he only won extra 5 pl medals, CL medal and 2 fa cup medals.

Tom is big boy on 70k a week.

I would not lose sleep over it

Regardless of how much money one earns you should never disregard the fragility of the mind, young one. Right enough though. Doesn't matter how much money you're earning. Having half a ****ing country tell you you're **** at your job can't be great for the mental health.

user2011

No

Valmont wrote: »

David Moyes was chosen by Sir Alex Ferguson, was he not?

Sir Alex Ferguson chose to buy Djemba Djemba, Klerberson

He is a great but he can also get sh!t wrong ffs.

The_Kew_Tour

No

Timmyctc wrote: »

Regardless of how much money one earns you should never disregard the fragility of the mind young one. Right enough though. Doesn't matter how much money you're earning. Having half a ****ing country tell you you're **** at your job can't be great for the mental health.

Well here is a chance to prove few right then?

if I was Cleverley this should be a motivation not a hinderance

case885

No

Timmyctc wrote: »

Regardless of how much money one earns you should never disregard the fragility of the mind, young one. Right enough though. Doesn't matter how much money you're earning. Having half a ****ing country tell you you're **** at your job can't be great for the mental health.

Half the country? 4000 people is a dot in england's population. Would you not think 80,000 fans in a stadium booing every time you touch the ball would be worse as that happens alot. Hopefully its the kick up the ass he needs.

KH25

No

Cleverley is not good enough. He can't impose himself on games. Community Shield v City aside, he has never looked great for United. I had hopes for him after that game but he has failed to kick on since then.

Lord TSC

No

Valmont wrote: »

David Moyes was chosen by Sir Alex Ferguson, was he not?

So were all the players. So why side with the one man over the team? Afterall, as you said, no one man is bigger than the club.

Valmont

KH25 wrote: »

Cleverley is not good enough. He can't impose himself on games. Community Shield v City aside, he has never looked great for United. I had hopes for him after that game but he has failed to kick on since then.

He has kicked on, sideways and backwards, sideways and backwards...

Personally, I've been more 'against' him since he gave that interviewing saying he was the scapegoat, it seemed like he was just making excuses for his poor performances. Just like RVP trying blame his missing a 12 yard sitter on his team-mates being in his 'areas'.

Danger781

No

Hey guys - Haven't been keeping up with this thread at all so my apologies if any of these have been posted already.

Was just speaking to a friend of mine and he informed me of a number of things going on at the United camp that he believes are 100% true. I am not saying they are. He wouldn't reveal his source or where he heard the news but if so, Moyes needs to be gone sooner than later.

1. The relationship between David and Giggs is quite strained as he seemingly never takes Giggs' opinion into consideration at games or with tactics.

2. Ferdinand and Moyes aren't getting along as Moyes keeps comparing what he does with Jagielka. At training David continuously says "this is how Jagielka would do it", which understandably would piss off Rio.

3. Rafael is on the transfer list following a disagreement with Moyes.

Macca07

Valmont wrote: »

You're all forgetting what Ferguson told us just before he retired. It's important that we stick by our new manager. Do you think he would have said this if he thought everything was going to be rosy straight away? If Moyes is sacked then we are just like Chelsea or City one of these other clubs who have no sense of building and preserving a culture of success but just want to pay a premium for winning right now.

Just remember you are like the people holding the banners up for Ferguson to be sacked shortly after he became manager. Give it until Christmas next season and then we will know with certainty what needs to be done.

I'm with the chosen one!

This is your opinion, that's fair enough, but I don't agree with it. Just because SAF said to stick with the manager, doesn't mean we have to. SAF has made many mistakes during his time with United, but the endless amount of trophies have made up for it. I think the appointment of Moyes was another mistake, and unfortunately, SAF isn't in a position to get us a trophy now.

The problem I have with giving him until Xmas next season is that he could quite possibly have £150 million to spend this summer. If it doesn't go right, and he gets sacked, do you think the Glaziers will give the next manager another £150 million to spend on players? Of course not, and then we could really have a revolving door of managers.

Moyes has had his season, and has done nothing with it. He had 4 competitions to make his mark on the club, failed miserably in 2 (PL and FA cup), got knocked out against a poor team in the Carling cup semis, and looks like we could get knocked out against another poor team in the CL.

He has had plenty time to make his mark on United, but the only thing he'll be remembered for is ruining a PL winning side.

tallaghtmick

No

Danger781 wrote: »

Hey guys - Haven't been keeping up with this thread at all so my apologies if any of these have been posted already.

Was just speaking to a friend of mine and he informed me of a number of things going on at the United camp that he believes are 100% true. I am not saying they are. He wouldn't reveal his source or where he heard the news but if so, Moyes needs to be gone sooner than later.

1. The relationship between David and Giggs is quite strained as he seemingly never takes Giggs' opinion into consideration at games or with tactics.

2. Ferdinand and Moyes aren't getting along as Moyes keeps comparing what he does with Jagielka. At training David continuously says "this is how Jagielka would do it", which understandably would piss off Rio.

3. Rafael is on the transfer list following a disagreement with Moyes.

Keep em coming, ffs the Rafael one would piss me off if true.

Red Crow

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

This is been said for 1000th time here

Ferguson took over a club that was in 21st place, a pub team, full of alcos.

He took over a team in crisis. He brought a team outside the The Old Firm to European final and beat a team called Real Madrid.

Comparing Ferguson's start to Moyes' is as stupid as wanting Moyes sacked in less than 12 months.

J. Marston

No

I don't believe the Jagielka one, sounds fake.

The others sound believable.

Macca07

Panthro wrote: »

Petition to ban Cleverley from England side doing the rounds apparently.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2570211/Petition-ban-Tom-Cleverley-England-squad-clocks-3-000-signatures-day.html

If I was Cleverly I would actually take a break from international duty for a while. I don't think he is good enough for the Ireland team, never mind the England team. He was very talented as a youth, and had some good games for United early in his career, but he is going backwards, both with his passing and skill.

He needs to get his head right, something is obviously wrong. I know it's a WC year, and he is still in with a shout of going to Brazil, but can you imagine if he has a couple of bad games for England there, he'll be treated worse than Beckham was when he comes back, and I don't think he has the mental strength for that.

He needs to sort out his United future first.

Vertigo100

No

Danger781 wrote: »

Hey guys - Haven't been keeping up with this thread at all so my apologies if any of these have been posted already.

Was just speaking to a friend of mine and he informed me of a number of things going on at the United camp that he believes are 100% true. I am not saying they are. He wouldn't reveal his source or where he heard the news but if so, Moyes needs to be gone sooner than later.

1. The relationship between David and Giggs is quite strained as he seemingly never takes Giggs' opinion into consideration at games or with tactics.

2. Ferdinand and Moyes aren't getting along as Moyes keeps comparing what he does with Jagielka. At training David continuously says "this is how Jagielka would do it", which understandably would piss off Rio.

3. Rafael is on the transfer list following a disagreement with Moyes.

With regards to the Rafael bit I heard something a bit similar. I heard the had a stand up row face to face with moyes screaming at each other on the training ground during the week in front of everyone.

Bannerman7

No

Valmont wrote: »

You're all forgetting what Ferguson told us just before he retired. It's important that we stick by our new manager. Do you think he would have said this if he thought everything was going to be rosy straight away? If Moyes is sacked then we are just like Chelsea or City one of these other clubs who have no sense of building and preserving a culture of success but just want to pay a premium for winning right now.

Just remember you are like the people holding the banners up for Ferguson to be sacked shortly after he became manager. Give it until Christmas next season and then we will know with certainty what needs to be done.

I'm with the chosen one!

Who said no one person is bigger than the club ?
That's right Ferguson said so and when Moyes goes Ferguson should have little say who the next manager will be.
Most people think Moyes will be sacked at the end of this season so I bet Ferguson will keep a lower profile when it happens.

adox

No

Valmont wrote: »

You're all forgetting what Ferguson told us just before he retired. It's important that we stick by our new manager. Do you think he would have said this if he thought everything was going to be rosy straight away? If Moyes is sacked then we are just like Chelsea or City one of these other clubs who have no sense of building and preserving a culture of success but just want to pay a premium for winning right now.

Just remember you are like the people holding the banners up for Ferguson to be sacked shortly after he became manager. Give it until Christmas next season and then we will know with certainty what needs to be done.

I'm with the chosen one!

You're funny.

I'm sure you think you are doing what's right for the club by blindly following this mantra but it is the exact thing that is decimating the club.

It's not working. It's been a disaster. I will rejoice when Moyes is gone. I will be over the moon.

All your other points about Chelsea blah blah blah have been done to death already on this thread.

keith16

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

and beat a team called Real Madrid.

Never heard of them.

Red Crow

Danger781 wrote: »

Hey guys - Haven't been keeping up with this thread at all so my apologies if any of these have been posted already.

Was just speaking to a friend of mine and he informed me of a number of things going on at the United camp that he believes are 100% true. I am not saying they are. He wouldn't reveal his source or where he heard the news but if so, Moyes needs to be gone sooner than later.

1. The relationship between David and Giggs is quite strained as he seemingly never takes Giggs' opinion into consideration at games or with tactics.

2. Ferdinand and Moyes aren't getting along as Moyes keeps comparing what he does with Jagielka. At training David continuously says "this is how Jagielka would do it", which understandably would piss off Rio.

3. Rafael is on the transfer list following a disagreement with Moyes.

Why should David Moyes listen to Ryan Giggs' tactics who has no experience as a manager?

Macca07

Danger781 wrote: »

Hey guys - Haven't been keeping up with this thread at all so my apologies if any of these have been posted already.

Was just speaking to a friend of mine and he informed me of a number of things going on at the United camp that he believes are 100% true. I am not saying they are. He wouldn't reveal his source or where he heard the news but if so, Moyes needs to be gone sooner than later.

1. The relationship between David and Giggs is quite strained as he seemingly never takes Giggs' opinion into consideration at games or with tactics.

2. Ferdinand and Moyes aren't getting along as Moyes keeps comparing what he does with Jagielka. At training David continuously says "this is how Jagielka would do it", which understandably would piss off Rio.

3. Rafael is on the transfer list following a disagreement with Moyes.

If any of the above was true, it would be in the papers by now. The media have a habit of spouting sh!te, but they do get stories.

The_Kew_Tour

No

Red Crow wrote: »

Comparing Ferguson's start to Moyes' is as stupid as wanting Moyes sacked in less than 12 months.

Its stupid because Fergie was a proven manager both domestically and in Europe when he took over.

adox

No

Red Crow wrote: »

Comparing Ferguson's start to Moyes' is as stupid as wanting Moyes sacked in less than 12 months.

It's not. It's really not.

Timmyctc

No

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

Well here is a chance to prove few right then?

if I was Cleverley this should be a motivation not a hinderance

Yeah well if I was Kate Upton I'd sit inside all day and masturbate. I'm sure it affects different people differently my point is just that getting booed on a pitch is grand you'll have to learn to accept that, in the sport the pitch is like a pantomime. People could boo you for 70 mins. You could score two beauts and the next thing you're the best in the world. People trying to hound you out of the sport is another thing altogether. The pathetic witch hunts put in place by people who, were half the same ire be directed towards them in their lives, would probably implode and become a hermit serve no purpose than genuinely try to cripple a player's mentality.

case885 wrote: »

Half the country? 4000 people is a dot in england's population. Would you not think 80,000 fans in a stadium booing every time you touch the ball would be worse as that happens alot. Hopefully its the kick up the ass he needs.

I actually haven't read the petition I've seen it shared about on the internet alright and while I was obviously using hyperbole for the sake of hyperbole I know many more than 4k people would share this opinion. If you think an actual petition to get the lad to never return to his job should be considered motivation then more power to ye. Criticism within reason is all fine imo. But as I've stated petitions liek the above. Or them pathetic "Open letter" ****es serve two purposes usually. To genuinely remove a person's livelihood and to get tonnes of 'likes' or thumbs up or +1s on the internet so people can call you "OPEN LETTER LAD" or "PETITIONLAD" etc

Danger781

No

Vertigo100 wrote: »

With regards to the Rafael bit I heard something a bit similar. I heard the had a stand up row face to face with moyes screaming at each other on the training ground during the week in front of everyone.

As far as I remember he told me it was after the Fulham game Moyes bitched at him for not overlapping with Mata on the right hand side, and Rafaels response was something along the lines of, sure he's new what the fck does he matter.

Really really don't believe that part.

Son Of A Vidic

GSPfan wrote: »

The suggestion that they aren't trying annoys me. I don't see that. I think they are all being forced to play a rubbish system which has them running around like fools.

Forced to play? Seriously we are talking here about grossly overpaid professionals, nobody's forcing them to do anything. It's their job to implement the manager's plan on the field, no matter who that manager may be. As employees of Manchester United they are contractually obligated to do their job. No matter what the tactics or strategy implemented by any manager maybe. We all expect to see 100% from each player on the field and I didn't see much effort on the field in Greece the other night.

Valmont

adox wrote: »

You're funny.

I'm sure you think you are doing what's right for the club by blindly following this mantra but it is the exact thing that is decimating the club.

One bad season doesn't equal decimation!

adox wrote:

It's not working. It's been a disaster. I will rejoice when Moyes is gone. I will be over the moon.

I agree, it has been a disaster but I wonder whether it's Moyes or the players who think they know more than he does!

adox wrote:

All your other points about Chelsea blah blah blah have been done to death already on this thread.

If blah blah blah is the noise you have to make to hide from yourself the fact you want Man Utd to be the next Chelsea type club then so be it!

Red Crow

adox wrote: »

It's not. It's really not.

It is. Support the fcuking manager. Ferguson isn't going to build the club to let some amateur ruin it on his watch. We were on the cusp of rebuilding for a few seasons and Moyes gets thrown under a bus.

adox

No

Valmont wrote: »

One bad season doesn't equal decimation!


I agree, it has been a disaster but I wonder whether it's Moyes or the players who think they know more than he does!

If blah blah blah is the noise you have to make to hide from yourself the fact you want Man Utd to be the next Chelsea type club then so be it!

What's your obsession with Chelsea? Is that your motivation for keeping Moyes in charge? So Utd are a prim and proper club? Not changing managers after a short time like Chelsea? I think you are letting it blind you to the fact that Moyes has made a complete bollix of the role he was charged with.

You will come around. You are just being stubborn for the sake of it.

The_Kew_Tour

No

Red Crow wrote: »

It is. Support the fcuking manager. Ferguson isn't going to build the club to let some amateur ruin it on his watch. We were on the cusp of rebuilding for a few seasons and Moyes gets thrown under a bus.

So if we get relegated we still should support the manager???

That type of **** post sickens my hole

tallaghtmick

No

Red Crow wrote: »

It is. Support the fcuking manager. Ferguson isn't going to build the club to let some amateur ruin it on his watch. We were on the cusp of rebuilding for a few seasons and Moyes gets thrown under a bus.

Why is ok to blast players but not the manager?

adox

No

Red Crow wrote: »

It is. Support the fcuking manager. Ferguson isn't going to build the club to let some amateur ruin it on his watch. We were on the cusp of rebuilding for a few seasons and Moyes gets thrown under a bus.

Short answer - no. I won't support the manager. I want him sacked as soon as possible.

I admire your tenacity but you will see the light eventually. Your stance is the stance that is ultimately doing damage to the club IMO. I want the best for the club and that is Moyes gone as soon as possible before he does even more damage.

Red Crow

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

So if we get relegated we still should support the manager???

That type of **** post sickens my hole

Are we getting relegated? It's one poor season. Cop on to yourself.

Your Airbag

Lets just say it is true, its not that much of a problem

Giggs, Rio and Raf all dislike Moyes.

Giggs and Rio are done at UTD come seasons end. Giggs maybe worth keeping around as a coach.

Raf is not irreplaceable. In fact he still has a lot to prove at UTD. I wouldn't mind us going for a RB in the summer.

Blatter

No

You know the saying 'It was always going to be very difficult for the guy coming in to replace Fergie'?

Couldn't a very similar concept be applied to Everton seeing as Moyes was there for 10 years and all the people at the club didn't know anything different to the way Moyes handles things?

user2011

No

Red Crow wrote: »

It is. Support the fcuking manager. Ferguson isn't going to build the club to let some amateur ruin it on his watch. We were on the cusp of rebuilding for a few seasons and Moyes gets thrown under a bus.

:cool:

The_Kew_Tour

No

Red Crow wrote: »

Are we getting relegated? It's one poor season. Cop on to yourself.

Are we where we should be??

Acceptable to be out of both cups and embarrassed in Europe?

Happy with the puck football?

Your Airbag

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

So if we get relegated we still should support the manager???

That type of **** post sickens my hole

Bit of a jump there Kew. Huge difference between the two scenarios.

The_Kew_Tour

No

Your Airbag wrote: »

Bit of a jump there Kew. Huge difference between the two scenarios.

The question still stands though

Hococop

No

Red Crow wrote: »

Why should David Moyes listen to Ryan Giggs' tactics who has no experience as a manager?

Oh yeah cause Moyes tactics are clearly working

Al Capwned

I can see Moyes getting the summer window, and at least the early period (10/12 games perhaps) of next season at the very least.

It's getting harder and harder to support him. But I still do.
You may call that blind faith, delusion, stubbornness or whatever.

I do not do this because Ferguson asked the fans to get behind him, I do it because I think it's the right thing to do. It is entirely possible that I'm wrong, and I'm sure the majority of people reading this believe that I am wrong.
Some posters will surely ask why, and tbh I can't give an answer that would adequately answer that. Especially when presented with the constant stream of perfectly valid arguments as to why a lot of you want to see him out!

Up to around Christmas, I would have said that I wouldn't change my mind on this. Right now though, I would have to say that I am on the cusp of it.