Manchester United Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - 2013/14 Mod Warning: Post #7871

UnitedIrishman

No

Moyes is so far out of his depth at United it's embarrassing.

I've no doubt he works hard, and gives it everything. But when you're tactics involve basically punting ball after ball towards the head of one the most technically gifted strikers in the world whilst he's being marked by two players who are 6'5 and 6'7 - you've just proven yourself to be tactically inept.

Needs to go before we delve further into the mire.

CSF

No

Dicky Pride wrote: »

Could it be that David Moyes just doesn't suit a team like Man Utd? A team that is expected to win almost every time they play? Could his tactics, and mindset be more suitable to a team whose season highlight is when they beat a man utd or a chelsea?

He hasn't inspired confidence at any turn this season, and that's the very first thing you should look for in a manager of a top club. Well, after experience of course.

His next club will be one like Newcastle or Villa IMO. I don't think there's a space for him at a top 4 competitor based on this. Chelsea, City and Arsenal wouldn't consider him. Liverpool are a given, and I don't think he'd get the Spurs job either but that could be the one I'm wrong on.

Cantona's Collars

Asbury Park wrote: »

Where are people getting this idea that Michael Laudrup is any kind of solution? After his last game in charge, the 2-0 home defeat to West Ham, he gave the players 2 days off and took himself off to Paris. This is the same guy who left Getafe to find a team that “matched his level” and left Mallorca saying he'd been thinking about doing so for “some time”. Is that the type of committment that a club like Utd require? Is it f..k. Like a lot of people on here, I'm losing patience with Moyes but let's not turn a crisis into a calamity by turning to the likes of Laudrup.

There was a journo on Newstalk the other night,he couldn't come out & say exactly what he wanted as players he spoke to retracted what they told him but basically Laudrup didn't take training & pretty much left it up to the players who kept to the principles instilled by Rogers,when things weren't going well they had nobody in charge to turn to.

tallaghtmick

No

portcrap wrote: »

what else do you call it? fans that idolise the manager when everything is going well and turn when things are going badly, surely he deserves a proper shot to get it right

We want to see the team play well not dross like that but yeh we're fake.

Frankie Lee

No

Zeman is available, no team of Zeman would have 82 crosses in a game.

billyhead

Dicky Pride wrote: »

Could it be that David Moyes just doesn't suit a team like Man Utd? A team that is expected to win almost every time they play? Could his tactics, and mindset be more suitable to a team whose season highlight is when they beat a man utd or a chelsea?

He hasn't inspired confidence at any turn this season, and that's the very first thing you should look for in a manager of a top club. Well, after experience of course.

You only realised this now:p

Pyjamarama

portcrap wrote: »

The same reasons that fergie felt he was the right choice stands:

he is a steady stabilising factor for club, really important fopr a club in transition like we are

he can get the best of mediocre players

he believes in youth and can blend them into the team

he can drive players to work hard, track back etc.

All of these aspects are still true regardless of the results. If we finish 7th at the end of the season (which we wont) it doesn't change the fact that the club are in transition. Change has to be managed very carefully, knee jerk reactions lead to barren runs of not winning anything. I, like I suspect most fans do, want to see a manager at the helm for at least 8-10 years and not go through the sh1te that liverpool have had for the last 20 odd years.

Do you really think that Southampton will catch Utd?

Cantona's Collars

Maybe Moyes was using today as a warm up to play Fellaini up front against Arsenal.

NoviGlitzko

MisterAnarchy wrote: »

I'm beginning to think Moyes has to go .

I didnt agree with his appointment as he is a very conservative manager and the standard of football he produced for the majority of his time at Everton was primitive route one stuff.

How he is persisting with widemen like Valencia and Young who are bang out of form and are not Man Utd standard on their best days is incomprehensible.

Ferguson left alot of problems behind him when he left the club but I dont think Moyes is either the right man to manage the club or rebuild it .
Dark days ahead I fear.

Young was one of our best players today. Still he should have went with Adnan but you can't knock Young because of it. Takes too much flack on this site.

This result was down to 2 things; Fulham literally parking the bus and incompetence in defense. You could possibly blame Moyes for the latter talking about a positional sense but the rest is down to the team and missing their chances. Bad result of course but blaming Moyes solely because of it is stupid IMO.

portcrap

portcrap wrote: »

The same reasons that fergie felt he was the right choice stands:

he is a steady stabilising factor for club, really important fopr a club in transition like we are

he can get the best of mediocre players

he believes in youth and can blend them into the team

he can drive players to work hard, track back etc.

All of these aspects are still true regardless of the results. If we finish 7th at the end of the season (which we wont) it doesn't change the fact that the club are in transition. Change has to be managed very carefully, knee jerk reactions lead to barren runs of not winning anything. I, like I suspect most fans do, want to see a manager at the helm for at least 8-10 years and not go through the sh1te that liverpool have had for the last 20 odd years.

Quite a bit of that doesn't make sense. Couple of things I have to ask though, where do you think United will finish season? And I don't see how you can link manager turnover to Liverpool's problems, it was bad managers that was the issue.

portcrap

tallaghtmick wrote: »

We want to see the team play well not dross like that but yeh we're fake.

Despite the results the team hasnt actually being playing that badly...it is playing pretty much the same tactics that won us the championship last season.

The difference comes down to the huge change in management from fergie to moyes. the management which includes a completely new backroom staff, a new approach to training, a new approach to match day preparation and a huge uncertainty with regard to the new manager's character, personality etc.

Performances will improve once stability has been achieved.

Headshot

No

zerks wrote: »

Maybe Moyes was using today as a warm up to play Fellaini up front against Arsenal.

I would of put money on Moyes putting Fell up front against Fulham

Schwiiing

portcrap wrote: »

Despite the results the team hasnt actually being playing that badly...it is playing pretty much the same tactics that won us the championship last season.

The difference comes down to the huge change in management from fergie to moyes. the management which includes a completely new backroom staff, a new approach to training, a new approach to match day preparation and a huge uncertainty with regard to the new manager's character, personality etc.

Performances will improve once stability has been achieved.

Wow.

portcrap

Deleted User wrote: »

Quite a bit of that doesn't make sense. Couple of things I have to ask though, where do you think United will finish season? And I don't see how you can link manager turnover to Liverpool's problems, it was bad managers that was the issue.

nice of you to say it doesnt make sense, notice you dont actually say what parts. I can back up every one of those statements

mitosis

jaykay74 wrote: »

The season review DVD will be a hard one to market :eek:

Get Harry Hill to do the voiceover and you'll be laughing

keane2097

No

What did people think of Januzaj when he came on?

Winston Payne

Frankie Lee wrote: »

Zeman is available, no team of Zeman would have 82 crosses in a game.

Probably still be seventh though. Albeit a much more entertaining ride down the table.

Dicky Pride

No

keane2097 wrote: »

What did people think of Januzaj when he came on?

Not much tbh.

tallaghtmick

No

portcrap wrote: »

Despite the results the team hasnt actually being playing that badly...it is playing pretty much the same tactics that won us the championship last season.

The difference comes down to the huge change in management from fergie to moyes. the management which includes a completely new backroom staff, a new approach to training, a new approach to match day preparation and a huge uncertainty with regard to the new manager's character, personality etc.

Performances will improve once stability has been achieved.

Feck off with that! Awful tactics nothing but cross after cross, hes out of his depth big time!

Also change the first r to s in your username with comments like that.

Pro. F

No

Asbury Park wrote: »

Where are people getting this idea that Michael Laudrup is any kind of solution? After his last game in charge, the 2-0 home defeat to West Ham, he gave the players 2 days off and took himself off to Paris. This is the same guy who left Getafe to find a team that “matched his level” and left Mallorca saying he'd been thinking about doing so for “some time”. Is that the type of committment that a club like Utd require? Is it f..k. Like a lot of people on here, I'm losing patience with Moyes but let's not turn a crisis into a calamity by turning to the likes of Laudrup.

Aside from all the stories coming out, from looking at the football played I think he mostly took Swansea backwards since replacing Rodgers. When you consider the money spent and the quality brought in, one mickey mouse cup, poor performances and a drop down the table is not good enough.

Ulysses Gaze

Deleted User wrote: »

Quite a bit of that doesn't make sense. Couple of things I have to ask though, where do you think United will finish season? And I don't see how you can link manager turnover to Liverpool's problems, it was bad managers that was the issue.

Agree.

Liverpool's mistake was replacing Souness, who was a disaster, with Roy Evans who is a nice guy but not a manager - he was second in command.

They needed a stronger manager at the time.

portcrap

Schwiiing wrote: »

Wow.

ya "wow", must be a wee revelation to you... the fact you can have 75% possession and still play badly. work that out.....

TheDoc

Would be rubbish to sack the manager now. No decent replacements available. Players already had to deal with a collosul change a second in a season would be no point.

If the manager has to go...let it be when someone of quality is lined up. And to be fair there isn't many available that are of high calibre.

If the manager has to go...I'd like for Klopp to be approached and in place. He can't mount serious challenges every year with his team constantly dismantled and has no budgets to work with.

I'd trust him to take the club reigns and move it progressively forward. At the same time I believe Moyes will get it right if given the time and resources.

Look I knew this would be an odd season but I never expected this. We are sitting ducks for everyone that comes to OT. But Ive a lot of sympathy for Moyes. While I'm worried with the current implementation of Mata...and Kagawa before him...I think that's down to personal rather then choice.

At the end of it all...when you look at our midfield...you really need to question how you expect the team to play..so void of ability in there.

Another game we dominated...assaulted the opposition penalty area...and get ****ed over by note Evra slackness and another defensive error.

If I was Moyes...I'd be dropping Evra. Regardless of Buttners ability. He isn't instilled into these players he isn't to be taken for a ride. Drop Evra. High profile player...sends out a message.

Maximus Alexander

Laudrup? Lads you've jumped the shark. Frying pan into the fire.

tallaghtmick

No

portcrap wrote: »

ya "wow", must be a wee revelation to you... the fact you can have 75% possession and still play badly. work that out.....

Cross cross cross cross cross cross.

Pro. F

No

keane2097 wrote: »

What did people think of Januzaj when he came on?

He was able to put in more threatening crosses and he showed some flashes imo. But the team set up was still a mess and he looked confused and frustrated like the rest of the lads.

The_Kew_Tour

No

keane2097 wrote: »

What did people think of Januzaj when he came on?

Not much, but that was down to what Moyes told him. Why you ask dude?

portcrap

Ulysses Gaze wrote: »

Agree.

Liverpool's mistake was replacing Souness, who was a disaster, with Roy Evans who is a nice guy but not a manager - he was second in command.

They needed a stronger manager at the time.

you cannot compare souness appointment with Moyes... souness an unproven manager (apart from the mess he left rangers in) thats equivalent to us appointing Keane as manager.... cannot compare the two at all.

Blatter

No

The Glazers aren't stupid, Ferguson isn't stupid.

There comes a point where you have to hold your hand up and admit that it's not a right fit and I think we're fast approaching that point.

I have no doubt that the Glazers will have had the ''is Moyes good enough?'' conversation more than once. They will be getting advice and seeking the opinions of various football people, not just Ferguson, and I can imagine that the majority of them will be telling them the same thing - Moyes isn't up to it.

I'd be actually shocked if Ferguson wasn't thinking the same thing, he'll be at least coming around to the idea that a mistake has been made. There's no way somebody could have been as successful in management as he was if he was incapable of recognising when something just isn't going to work out.

Schwiiing

portcrap wrote: »

ya "wow", must be a wee revelation to you... the fact you can have 75% possession and still play badly. work that out.....

75% possession against the worst team in the league. 2 goals scored from 80+ crosses, 2 goals conceded from 4 attacks all game all down to defensive ineptitude. Fulham set out to defend and defend only and still left OT with a point. If it was Barca, Bayern etc with 75% possession here today it would have been a demolition.

The_Kew_Tour

No

Is there any hope Moyes will be gone in next 7 days do you think? Are we gonna have to wait till season is over first or what?

tallaghtmick

No

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

Is there any hope Moyes will be gone in next 7 days do you think? Are we gonna have to wait till season is over first or what?

End of season unless Fergie agrees to take over.....which wont happen.

Schwiiing

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

Is there any hope Moyes will be gone in next 7 days do you think? Are we gonna have to wait till season is over first or what?

We'll have to wait 'til next season is over.

billyhead

Blatter wrote: »

The Glazers aren't stupid, Ferguson isn't stupid.

There comes a point where you have to hold your hand up and admit that it's not a right fit and I think we're fast approaching that point.

I have no doubt that the Glazers will have had the ''is Moyes good enough?'' conversation more than once. They will be getting advice and seeking the opinions of various football people, not just Ferguson, and I can imagine that the majority of them will be telling them the same thing - Moyes isn't up to it.

I'd be actually shocked if Ferguson wasn't thinking the same thing, he'll be at least coming around to the idea that a mistake has been made. There's no way somebody could have been as successful in management as he was if he was incapable of recognising when something just isn't going to work out.

And Fergie will need to hold his hands up now and admit that. I feel he may have been standing by Moyes when consulted about our predicament since results went arseways

KombuchaMshroom

No

Pro. F wrote: »

Aside from all the stories coming out, from looking at the football played I think he mostly took Swansea backwards since replacing Rodgers. When you consider the money spent and the quality brought in, one mickey mouse cup, poor performances and a drop down the table is not good enough.

I am in no way in favour of bringing in Laudrup, but if you took out the one redeeming factor of actually winning a trophy, people might get confused as to whether you are referring to him or Moyes, because everyone of those complaints could be made of his season so far.

UnitedIrishman

No

portcrap wrote: »

ya "wow", must be a wee revelation to you... the fact you can have 75% possession and still play badly. work that out.....

Yeah because just like 'how many times a team reaches the byline', possession is a great indicator of how well a team played. :rolleyes:

Every man, woman and child on earth knows how we're getting to set ourselves up every ****ing week. It's pathetic.

bucketybuck

No

portcrap wrote: »

he can get the best of mediocre players

Yeah, he's really doing that isn't he. :rolleyes:

n32

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

Is there any hope Moyes will be gone in next 7 days do you think? Are we gonna have to wait till season is over first or what?

I was all for giving him a good run before judging him but i ve come to the conclusion that he should be shown the door now, and let a new manager get to grips with the job for the last few weeks of the season instead of having another summer of upheaval and uncertainty.

portcrap

tallaghtmick wrote: »

Cross cross cross cross cross cross.

Yes I agree, but I thought the same about the tactics last year too. You cant keep playing that way and not expect the opposition to work out how to nullify that approach.

Sure Moyes should shake it up with central attacks, he has the players to do it mata and rooney etc. but maybe he feels its not the time to be introducing new tactics when the current team cant play to the usual ones.

bmcc10

Why would some people like Ferguson back in and get rid of Moyes that's just stupid.

Lord TSC

No

KombuchaMshroom wrote: »

I am in no way in favour of bringing in Laudrup, but if you took out the one redeeming factor of actually winning a trophy, people might get confused as to whether you are referring to him or Moyes, because everyone of those complaints could be made of his season so far.

Honestly, read the blooded part and presumed it was discussing Moyes at first...

portcrap

portcrap wrote: »

nice of you to say it doesnt make sense, notice you dont actually say what parts. I can back up every one of those statements

OK:

portcrap wrote: »

he is a steady stabilising factor for club, really important fopr a club in transition like we are

That doesn't make sense or at least doesn't match the evidence.

he can get the best of mediocre players

If you're implying United have a lot of mediocre players then how has he got them to win 21 fewer points at the same stage last season. He obviously can't get the best out of them.

he believes in youth and can blend them into the team

Januzaj, anyone else?

he can drive players to work hard, track back etc.

Rooney was the only one who did a decent job of tracking back today and I've never got the impression that's down to a manager, it depends on what kind of mood Rooney is in.

All of these aspects are still true regardless of the results.

So no matter how much United lose they're still stabilising?

If we finish 7th at the end of the season (which we wont) it doesn't change the fact that the club are in transition.

Where will yous finish?

Change has to be managed very carefully, knee jerk reactions lead to barren runs of not winning anything. I, like I suspect most fans do, want to see a manager at the helm for at least 8-10 years and not go through the sh1te that liverpool have had for the last 20 odd years.

As above, sacking managers too soon wasn't Liverpool's problem (Rafa perhaps) for the last 20 years.

jaykay74

No

portcrap wrote: »

Despite the results the team hasnt actually being playing that badly...

Oh. hmm. Right. Good luck.

Richard Hillman

No

I would give Moyes time if he was trying to drastically change the style of play like Brendan Rodgers did. But he isnt doing that. It just looks like he is trying to be a poor version of Alex Ferguson. It seems like he went into the dressing room over the summer and said "Whatever you's are doing, keep on doing that" and that was his masterplan.

What exactly is he trying to do with this team? What is he going to say to the Glaziers when they ask him about his plan for next season?

Gamb!t

No

Blatter wrote: »

The Glazers aren't stupid, Ferguson isn't stupid.

There comes a point where you have to hold your hand up and admit that it's not a right fit and I think we're fast approaching that point.

I have no doubt that the Glazers will have had the ''is Moyes good enough?'' conversation more than once. They will be getting advice and seeking the opinions of various football people, not just Ferguson, and I can imagine that the majority of them will be telling them the same thing - Moyes isn't up to it.

I'd be actually shocked if Ferguson wasn't thinking the same thing, he'll be at least coming around to the idea that a mistake has been made. There's no way somebody could have been as successful in management as he was if he was incapable of recognising when something just isn't going to work out.

Ferguson said something last year along the lines of I would like to remind you, this club stood by me in bad times, the players and the staff .

" Your job now is to stand by the new manager."

While your post makes sense I dont think Moyes is going anywhere soon.

Schwiiing

portcrap wrote: »

Yes I agree, but I thought the same about the tactics last year too. You cant keep playing that way and not expect the opposition to work out how to nullify that approach.

Sure Moyes should shake it up with central attacks, he has the players to do it mata and rooney etc. but maybe he feels its not the time to be introducing new tactics when the current team cant play to the usual ones.

If this is how he really feels and I reckon he does then it's proof he has to go. He couldnt work out that it was the wrong approach by half time today ffs.

Cantona's Collars

Kylo Ren

How much would Moyes' compensation be if let go? Couldn't he refuse it and take the pay for the next 5+ years?

Chazz Michael Michaels

portcrap wrote: »

Yes I agree, but I thought the same about the tactics last year too. You cant keep playing that way and not expect the opposition to work out how to nullify that approach.

Sure Moyes should shake it up with central attacks, he has the players to do it mata and rooney etc. but maybe he feels its not the time to be introducing new tactics when the current team cant play to the usual ones.

Usual = Sh1t

The_Kew_Tour

No

3 lads now on my twitter who were at the game seem to be in the impression that if United lose to Arsenal Moyes is gone.

Seems to be doing the round in Manchester. Might be just wishful thinking

Father was at the game. He said he never seen it as bad and he went to games when United were in Old Division 2.