Manchester United Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - 2013/14 Mod Warning: Post #7871

LiamoSail

lordgoat wrote: »

David May said that? I doubt it. I think you haven't a clue what you're talking about.

Had a look there and the video is on the sky sports website

Q. Who was the least intelligent?

DM. Butty or Giggsy. Between them two, not the cleverest

So doubt all you fcuking well want, and accuse me of not having a clue, but the video is there

J. Marston

No

kryogen wrote: »

Moyes could piss off and focus on defense and let Rene focus on attack

I agree.

Backstreet Moyes

keane2097 wrote: »

This staff thing still rumbling along makes me lol.

Does nobody remember how **** to watch United were since 09?

Do you think if Moyes brought in staff with more experience at the highest level he would do better? He needs a strong tactical coach or assistant brought in to help him for starters.

bucketybuck

No

lordgoat wrote: »

Phil Neville always comes across very well in interview imo, and is one of the more articulate on twitter.

Well, that changes everything. Now I'm surprised Madrid or Barca didn't try to get him as a coach!

Backstreet Moyes

DM-ICE wrote: »

I don't want Barkley for that price personally which is why I referenced Witsel. But what elite, or as you had world class, player are going to be got for 25 to 30 million? With the way transfers have gone I would be expecting 40plus. Unless there is a contract issue which reduces the fee.

Without champions league I think a younger player might need to be signed, a player who wouldn't mind missing out on champions league. Vidal for example is at an age where his any move would be with the intention of winning the big prize that appears out of reach at Juve.

Their are plenty of players i am sure that you could get for the same money as Barkley who would improve the starting 11. For example Witsel would cost a similar amount and Gundogan and Banega. Maybe Lars Bender and i don't know how Munian has got on the last few seasons. Even if someone like Vidal was available for 40+ then signing Barkley would make it less more likely we could sign somebody like Vidal.

I am sure people here could give a list of dozens of midfielders we could get for 25-30 million that would be a massive improvement on the midfield. People who would know far more than me about players from foreign leagues.

Headshot

No

I wish the end of the PL season would come already and we'll finally see whats going to happen with the club.

jaykay74

No

bucketybuck wrote: »

Well, that changes everything. Now I'm surprised Madrid or Barca didn't try to get him as a coach!

Yes that is certainly the implication of saying that he comes across well in interviews and twitter

Timmyctc

No

LiamoSail wrote: »

Had a look there and the video is on the sky sports website



So doubt all you fcuking well want, and accuse me of not having a clue, but the video is there

So ignoring the fact Giggs has been coaching the past number of years because the mighty David May said he things Giggs or Butt were the dumbest players he's played with Giggs is then a poor coach. And because you THINK Neville isn't bright, he's a bad coach. I mean.. I don't really mean any offence but this whole point is dumber than the dialogue in a porno.

Timmyctc

No

LiamoSail wrote: »

My point is general however I believe is still valid. Having two such inexperienced coaches in what is a small coaching team is risky, particularly as both would be seen by the players as peers. I'm not claiming it to be the cause of United's poor season, just observing that perhaps Moyes would have been better served had he opted for greater experience in at least one of the role's

Also on this point, if you watched Class of 92, it would give you an idea on how the hierarchy in the dressing room works, as even players like Nev, Scholes and Butt saw Giggs as a "Senior player" and I'm sure at this stage where no player even comes near Giggs' tenure at the club that point is more valid.

LiamoSail

Timmyctc wrote: »

So ignoring the fact Giggs has been coaching the past number of years because the mighty David May said he things Giggs or Butt were the dumbest players he's played with Giggs is then a poor coach. And because you THINK Neville isn't bright, he's a bad coach. I mean.. I don't really mean any offence but this whole point is dumber than the dialogue in a porno.

In the post above the one you quoted, I addressed those points.

I never said either Neville or Giggs were poor coaches, and if you read the post you can see that you have interpreted my point wrongly.

adox

No

Rooney isn't the brightest but is an extremely intelligent footballer.

The inference that you need a high IQ to be a good coach is bollix tbh. You can "not be the brightest" and still be an excellent coach if you know what you are doing.


Also the flimsy reasoning given for both Neville and Giggs "not being the brightest" is laughable.

Paul Tergat

adox wrote: »

Rooney isn't the brightest but is an extremely intelligent footballer.

The inference that you need a high IQ to be a good coach is bollix tbh. You can "not be the brightest" and still be an excellent coach if you know what you are doing.


Also the flimsy reasoning given for both Neville and Giggs "not being the brightest" is laughable.

Football intelligence is all that matters. Based on their careers I'd say, and of course can't say for sure, that those a know a thing or two.

DM_7

Nuts102 wrote: »

Their are plenty of players i am sure that you could get for the same money as Barkley who would improve the starting 11. For example Witsel would cost a similar amount and Gundogan and Banega. Maybe Lars Bender and i don't know how Munian has got on the last few seasons. Even if someone like Vidal was available for 40+ then signing Barkley would make it less more likely we could sign somebody like Vidal.

I am sure people here could give a list of dozens of midfielders we could get for 25-30 million that would be a massive improvement on the midfield. People who would know far more than me about players from foreign leagues.

I agree we could get plenty of really good players for that kind of money or less. It was my point from the start. But if spending such a fee as per original post (25 to 30) it's best to go for a young player with potential to be a 40 or 50 plus million player.

The established world class, elite player will cost more than 25 to 30 million unless there is a contract issue.

SherlockWatson

LiamoSail wrote: »

So doubt all you fcuking well want, and accuse me of not having a clue, but the video is there

Ha, man makes stupid statement, man flips out when people question him.

Funny.

LiamoSail

adox wrote: »

Rooney isn't the brightest but is an extremely intelligent footballer.

The inference that you need a high IQ to be a good coach is bollix tbh. You can "not be the brightest" and still be an excellent coach if you know what you are doing.


Also the flimsy reasoning given for both Neville and Giggs "not being the brightest" is laughable.

The reasoning is flimsy on the basis that it's the extent of the evidence there is to go on.

Without knowing either, nobody here can say for definite whether they are bright or otherwise.

In my initial point, I mentioned neither being perceived as being all that bright as a factor, not a cause. Irrespective of how accurate the portrayal is, the point I was making still stands. In any management team, having two people so inexperienced (have no idea how qualified either are) is risky, that perhaps Moyes would have been better served replacing the old guard with people of greater experience.

keane2097

No

Nuts102 wrote: »

Do you think if Moyes brought in staff with more experience at the highest level he would do better? He needs a strong tactical coach or assistant brought in to help him for starters.

I think "experience at the highest level" is an utter nonsense. Like, literally no merit to the notion whatsoever.

I have no idea if the people involved at the moment are any good or not. I don't think anyone posting on boards has the slightest notion whether they are any good or not either.

If you want to ask whether having better coaches would be a good thing then of course it's true, but it's true of any club. Doesn't mean there's anything wrong with the staff that are there, possibly is, possibly isn't.

It's definitely interesting how yesmanshortsmaneverybodyhatesman Mike Phelan and the guy Fulham just sacked are all of a sudden some sort of coaching dream ticket when they had United playing turgid dross for 5 years. More tbh but they had Ronaldo to make them look less awful and stifle a few yawns.

LiamoSail

SherlockWatson wrote: »

Ha, man makes stupid statement, man flips out when people question him.

Funny.

The statement was correct. May did say what I stated

bucketybuck

No

keane2097 wrote: »

It's definitely interesting how yesmanshortsmaneverybodyhatesman Mike Phelan and the guy Fulham just sacked are all of a sudden some sort of coaching dream ticket when they had United playing turgid dross for 5 years. More tbh but they had Ronaldo to make them look less awful and stifle a few yawns.

We are allowed to think both though.

I don't miss Phelan or Rene in the slightest because as you say, United have been poor to watch for a few years now and they must be held accountable for that. I don't want them back.

But I also think that the current coaching set up is clearly lacking in tactical nous also, and that one of the biggest clubs in the world should have better coaches than two lads who only got the jobs because they are ex-players of the club.

Paul Tergat

bucketybuck wrote: »

We are allowed to think both though.

I don't miss Phelan or Rene in the slightest because as you say, United have been poor to watch for a few years now and they must be held accountable for that. I don't want them back.

But I also think that the current coaching set up is clearly lacking in tactical nous also, and that one of the biggest clubs in the world should have better coaches than two lads who only got the jobs because they are ex-players of the club.

this is bs

bucketybuck

No

Paul Tergat wrote: »

this is bs

No it isn't.

Paul Tergat

bucketybuck wrote: »

No it isn't.

It certainly is. Shows up to be honest as well

SherlockWatson

LiamoSail wrote: »

The statement was correct. May did say what I stated

I didn't say it was incorrect, I said it was stupid.

keane2097

No

bucketybuck wrote: »

We are allowed to think both though.

I don't miss Phelan or Rene in the slightest because as you say, United have been poor to watch for a few years now and they must be held accountable for that. I don't want them back.

Yeah obv you're allowed to think that. You know from reading here that a lot of people are saying something entirely different though.

bucketybuck wrote: »

But I also think that the current coaching set up is clearly lacking in tactical nous also, and that one of the biggest clubs in the world should have better coaches than two lads who only got the jobs because they are ex-players of the club.

I think the tactics have been lacking for sure whoever is responsible for it. As to whether Neville and Giggs are any good or why they got the job sure realistically you're just having a guess really.

bucketybuck

No

Paul Tergat wrote: »

It certainly is. Shows up to be honest as well

If you want to believe that Phil Neville was hired as a coach based entirely on his coaching credentials then more power to you.

shadowcomplex

No

What are the chances this will be our starting first 11 next season

---

Dea gea

---

New left back--Jones/evans-New Centre Back-New Left back

---

2 New Central Midfielders

---

---

New winger---Mata

---

Januzai

---

Rooney

---

My picks would be

---

Dea Gea

---

Coleman

---

Jones/evans--Hummels

---

Shaw

---

Vidal----Strootman

---

---

Reus

---

Mata

---

Januzai

---

Rooney

---

Realistically its going to be this

---

Dea Gea

---

Rafael

---

Jones/evans-New Centre Back-New left back

---

Carrick----New central Midfielder----

---

Mata

---

Rooney

---

Januzai

---

---

RVP

---

I can't shake the feeling RVP will be sold though

Kylo Ren

Until we get a LB who is competent not only in going forward, but also defensively and one or two central midfielders, we cannot play 4-2-3-1 effectively.

Even if that happens, Moyes' style may not lend itself to it.

bryangiggsy

No

I think Moyes will be in job till at least October. Champions league is as good as gone with 11 pt defecit with 12 games left. Board will give him summer to rebuild and if no better by oct... Exit doors. Wud love to see him gone tomorrow myself as he has shown nothing with the team he has.

SherlockWatson

bucketybuck wrote: »

If you want to believe that Phil Neville was hired as a coach based entirely on his coaching credentials then more power to you.

You don't think he would have been a coach at everton had Moyes not left?

Paul Tergat

bucketybuck wrote: »

If you want to believe that Phil Neville was hired as a coach based entirely on his coaching credentials then more power to you.

Now you are making a different point. You said its only cause they are ex-players. So yeah, you were talking, as usual, complete shít.

IamtheWalrus

If Utd splash the cash this Summer on Moyes' recommendations and Utd aren't comfortably top 4 this time next season, I think the Glazers will sack him. But not before.

Lord TSC

No

bryangiggsy wrote: »

I think Moyes will be in job till at least October. Champions league is as good as gone with 11 pt defecit with 12 games left. Board will give him summer to rebuild and if no better by oct... Exit doors. Wud love to see him gone tomorrow myself as he has shown nothing with the team he has.

As much as I want him gone, there'd be zero point giving him the summer and then sacking him in October. If he survives the summer, he'll stay till at least January.

Any new manager coming in should get a transfer window, hence why I'd like to see him sacked sooner rather than later, and let the new manager have the whole summer to build the project. Moyes has had two windows now, has spent 60m and has us in 7th. I honestly don't see why we'd trust him with the long term project that will cost about that again.

Chucky the tree

shadowcomplex wrote: »

What are the chances this will be our starting first 11 next season

---

Dea gea

---

New left back--Jones/evans-New Centre Back-New Left back

---

2 New Central Midfielders

---

---

New winger---Mata

---

Januzai

---

Rooney

---

My picks would be

---

Dea Gea

---

Coleman

---

Jones/evans--Hummels

---

Shaw

---

Vidal----Strootman

---

---

Reus

---

Mata

---

Januzai

---

Rooney

---

Realistically its going to be this

---

Dea Gea

---

Rafael

---

Jones/evans-New Centre Back-New left back

---

Carrick----New central Midfielder----

---

Mata

---

Rooney

---

Januzai

---

---

RVP

---

I can't shake the feeling RVP will be sold though

Think you'll be hard pushed attracting those players when you'll have no CL to offer.

Felexicon

shadowcomplex wrote: »

What are the chances this will be our starting first 11 next season

---

Dea gea

---

New left back--Jones/evans-New Centre Back-New Left back

---

2 New Central Midfielders

---

---

New winger---Mata

---

Januzai

---

Rooney

---

My picks would be

---

Dea Gea

---

Coleman

---

Jones/evans--Hummels

---

Shaw

---

Vidal----Strootman

---

---

Reus

---

Mata

---

Januzai

---

Rooney

---

Realistically its going to be this

---

Dea Gea

---

Rafael

---

Jones/evans-New Centre Back-New left back

---

Carrick----New central Midfielder----

---

Mata

---

Rooney

---

Januzai

---

---

RVP

---

I can't shake the feeling RVP will be sold though

You know the season is fooked when the fantasy line ups start in February

bucketybuck

No

SherlockWatson wrote: »

You don't think he would have been a coach at everton had Moyes not left?

I know he wouldn't be a coach at Manchester United if Moyes was still at Everton.

Paul Tergat wrote: »

Now you are making a different point. You said its only cause they are ex-players. So yeah, you were talking, as usual, complete shít.

The only reason Phil Neville is a coach at United is because he was an ex-player who also happens to have worked with David Moyes. As usual, you struggle with the obvious.

The_Kew_Tour

No

Hummels and Shaw and Vidal

aaand Strootman along with this Reus chap.

Good luck with that.

SherlockWatson

bucketybuck wrote: »

I know he wouldn't be a coach at Manchester United if Moyes was still at Everton.



The only reason Phil Neville is a coach at United is because he was an ex-player who also happens to have worked with David Moyes. As usual, you struggle with the obvious.

You really struggle to answer questions that are asked don't you.

bucketybuck

No

SherlockWatson wrote: »

You really struggle to answer questions that are asked don't you.

I did answer your question.

Felexicon

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

Hummels and Shaw and Vidal

aaand Strootman along with this Reus chap.

Good luck with that.

Eh it would be easy for United to sign all of those players in one summer.

Have you never played Football Manager, you just need to give the board an ultimatum to release more money for transfers, make each one a key player and give them whatever wages they want.

Be grand

The_Kew_Tour

No

Felexicon wrote: »

Eh it would be easy for United to sign all of those players in one summer.

Have you never played Football Manager, you just need to give the board an ultimatum to release more money for transfers, make each one a key player and give them whatever wages they want.

Be grand

That's when I normally get the sack:P

Paul Tergat

bucketybuck wrote: »

The only reason Phil Neville is a coach at United is because he was an ex-player who also happens to have worked with David Moyes. As usual, you struggle with the obvious.

Now you are getting somewhere. Well done!

It's not only cause hes ex-United then is it?

Felexicon

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

That's when I normally get the sack:P

And watch David O'Leary win the treble with United

bucketybuck

No

Felexicon wrote: »

Eh it would be easy for United to sign all of those players in one summer.

This is an issue that will upset people over the summer I think.

Most would agree that the squad needs some serious work, and in a perfect world 6/7/8 players should be moved out and replaced.

But has a top club ever been able to transform their squad to that extent in one transfer window? I wonder if there are any examples of a top club overhauling their squad so dramatically in a short space of time? Whats makes people so confident that United will be able to do it?

A LB, at least two midfielders, defensive cover, fresh attacking options, we need all these things but I don't think we will be able to get them, not all in the summer, and that means difficult times next season as well.

bucketybuck

No

Paul Tergat wrote: »

It's not only cause hes ex-United then is it?

The only reason Phil Neville is a coach at United is because he is ex-United. If he was not ex-United, he would not currently be a coach at United.

Its strange how difficult this is for you.

The_Kew_Tour

No

Oh make no mistake about it, if Moyes is still in charge with same 1960's tactics it does not matter jack who we get we wont be getting CL football for few years.

shadowcomplex

No

Chucky the tree wrote: »

Think you'll be hard pushed attracting those players when you'll have no CL to offer.

City got aguero silva and toure without it

Backstreet Moyes

Felexicon wrote: »

Eh it would be easy for United to sign all of those players in one summer.

Have you never played Football Manager, you just need to give the board an ultimatum to release more money for transfers, make each one a key player and give them whatever wages they want.

Be grand

Even in Football Manager it's not possible. You do half wonder what planet people do be on with these suggested line ups.

shadowcomplex

No

bucketybuck wrote: »

This is an issue that will upset people over the summer I think.

Most would agree that the squad needs some serious work, and in a perfect world 6/7/8 players should be moved out and replaced.

But has a top club ever been able to transform their squad to that extent in one transfer window? I wonder if there are any examples of a top club overhauling their squad so dramatically in a short space of time? Whats makes people so confident that United will be able to do it?

A LB, at least two midfielders, defensive cover, fresh attacking options, we need all these things but I don't think we will be able to get them, not all in the summer, and that means difficult times next season as well.

Real Madrid were very bad a few years ago and they splashed the cash and sorted themselves out very fast

SherlockWatson

bucketybuck wrote: »

I did answer your question.

No you didn't, I asked about Everton and you answered about United, shifting goalposts, have a nice day.

Backstreet Moyes

Lallana, Matudi, Contrao, Gundogan, Garay and Santon. These type of players are far more likely what we will attract.

Vinz Mesrine

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

Hummels and Shaw and Vidal

aaand Strootman along with this Reus chap.

Good luck with that.

150m at least.