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Future of terrestrial broadcasting in the UHF band?

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Comments

  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    The Cush wrote: »
    I'd take the WEDDIP maps to be the actual plan over the UKfree TV website speculation.

    According to the maps the post 700MHz clearance plan for Divis is - 21, 23, 24, 26, 27, 30 (current plan 21, 23, 24, 26, 27, 29), the only change being ArqB's move to UHF 30 with the local mux being moved elsewhere.

    With one of Divis's frequencys shifting to 30, will this not cause alot of CCI with Three Rock? I'm in Dundalk and regularly lose 23 & 26 from Divis due to Mt Leinster interference which a good bit further south.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,596 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    With one of Divis's frequencys shifting to 30, will this not cause alot of CCI with Three Rock? I'm in Dundalk and regularly lose 23 & 26 from Divis due to Mt Leinster interference which a good bit further south.

    A lot more transmitter direction restrictions to avoid CCI in order to squeeze the same number of muxes into a smaller space.

    Posted previously
    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=97325299#post97325299
    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=99373162#post99373162

    Replanning to clear TV from the channels 49-60 is currently underway in conjunction with the UK. It is expected that TV services will clear the channels 49-60 by about 2021, creating a second digital dividend. Associated with that will be much tighter reuse of frequency channels. In these circumstances reception of TV services outside their core service area cannot be guaranteed. Thus people may find that where they are or have been receiving UK TV signals from Northern Ireland or Wales they may not longer be able to do so as the frequencies may be used by neighbouring area Irish TV transmissions.

    http://www.dcenr.gov.ie/communications/en-ie/spectrum/Pages/DTT-Spectrum.aspx#


  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    The Cush wrote: »
    A lot more transmitter direction restrictions to avoid CCI in order to squeeze the same number of muxes into a smaller space.

    Posted previously
    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=97325299#post97325299
    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=99373162#post99373162

    Hopefully no restrictions on Divis ch 24 (theres nothing on a similar frequency down here to cause it to be restricted it seems). It's nice at long last to have all the main UK terrestrial channels in HD!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,596 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    The Cush wrote: »
    Ofcom has published a call for input on the clearance of the 700MHz band and a summary of progress to date.

    The UK government is considering public funding for DTT and PMSE users who must clear the band and has tasked Ofcom to provide advice on this. Ofcom are seeking feedback from DTT viewers, consumer groups, wireless microphones owners as well as interested industry bodies.

    On the progress front the document says the revised frequency plan for the main transmitters has been agreed (this would include Ireland) and work is now starting on the plan for the smaller transmitters.

    Network infrastructure modifications are due to start later this year with retuning expected to start in 2018.

    http://stakeholders.ofcom.org.uk/consultations/700-clearance-cfi/

    Consultation closed a few days ago, NImux submission attached


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,596 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    Even with over 40% of TV spectrum lost to Digital Dividends in a short number of years the mobile industry is still pushing for access to the remaining UHF band long before the next review of the band is due to take place at WRC2023, this quote from a report on the ETNO-MLex conference in Brussels yesterday
    Harmonisation of spectrum policy will also be a "very important" part of the regulatory framework review, said Kamila Kloc, deputy head of cabinet for Commission Vice-President Andrus Ansip, in a panel discussion. The Commission is intent on sticking to its proposal to free up the 700 MHz band for mobile services by 2020, despite calls from some member states to delay the deadline, she said. Viola noted that this is the third attempt in recent years at spectrum policy reform, and if Europe fails this time, it will miss out on the opportunities offered by the Internet of Things, something the EU cannot afford.

    According to Phillip Malloch, Head of Group Public Affairs at Telia, Europe also needs to move faster on opening up sub-700 MHz frequencies, as high-band spectrum will not be enough to realise the full benefits of 5G. The decision at last year's World Radiocommunication Conference only to consider opening up these bands at the next WRC in 2023 is a "lacklustre" approach, given that operators like Telia already plan to start 5G in 2018 and full commercial roll-outs will begin in 2020, he said.

    http://www.telecompaper.com/news/ec-says-on-track-to-deliver-telecom-reform-proposal-in-sept--1145069

    Back in Feburary the Commission published it proposals for a Decision on EU harmonisation of the 700 MHz band for mobile broadband use. The proposal is making its way through the EU Parliament and Council co-decision legislative route. To date amendments to Commission proposals have been tabled which include delaying the mandatory release of the band by 2-2½ years if required by a member state to mid/end 2022, maintaining the remaining UHF exclusively for broadcasting, guaranteeing broadcasting use of the band until at least the end of 2030.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,596 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    The EU Telecom Ministers at their Council meeting today agreed their position on the future of the 470-790 MHz band. As per the co-decision procedure this agreed position and the Parliaments future agreed position will be the basis for negotiations on an agreed final text before the Decision becomes law.

    http://www.consilium.europa.eu/en/meetings/tte/2016/05/26/

    - Repurposing the 700 MHz band under harmonised technical conditions by June 2020 with 2 year delay if required
    - Safeguarding conventional television services in the sub-700 MHz (470-694 MHz) band for digital television and wireless microphones at least until 2030


  • Registered Users Posts: 792 ✭✭✭Mickey Mike


    Yes it will happen, this 700 mhz band will go from terrestrial Tv. Its very important the remainder of the UHF band is kept or they ll be nothing left of it for Television.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,596 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    Yes it will happen, this 700 mhz band will go from terrestrial Tv. Its very important the remainder of the UHF band is kept or they ll be nothing left of it for Television.

    The band officially went from terrestrial broadcasting last Nov at the ITU's WRC-2015, having been delayed from WRC-2012. The current EU legislative process is about putting the regulations in place for the release to mobile services.

    The 700MHz band auctions have already happened in Germany and France, with the Swedish auction lined up for later this year but the consensus across Europe is that the remainder of the UHF band will be primarily allocated to broadcasting until at least the end of 2030 and will most likely be included in the final EU Decision. In Germany this is the date locked in by statute, in doing so it allowed the commercial broadcasters to continue broadcasting terrestrially.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 295 ✭✭Stasi 2.0


    Anybody guess what the new frequencies for say, Clermont Carn, will be?

    If Clermont shifts a lot of aerial installs (aerials, diplexers and amplifiers) could be rendered useless. Diplexing Clermont and Divis could be fun.

    The chunk they've taken out of band 4 is even more puzzling though. Rather than snipping off the end of the band they've taken a big chunk out of the MIDDLE. Has a need for these frequencies for non-broadcast use even been proven ?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,596 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    Stasi 2.0 wrote: »
    If Clermont shifts a lot of aerial installs (aerials, diplexers and amplifiers) could be rendered useless. Diplexing Clermont and Divis could be fun.

    Clermont Carn's frequencies have to move, that portion of the band will be sold off to the MNOs. Same applies to the other main transmitters Truskmore, Kippure, Dungarvan and partially to Maghera and Spur Hill.

    Clermont Carn's new allocation appears to be 33, 36, 39, 42, 45, 48 so no conflict with Divis's allocation. No indication which two actual UHF channels will be allocated to Saorview Mux 1 & 2 under the new plan though.
    Stasi 2.0 wrote: »
    The chunk they've taken out of band 4 is even more puzzling though. Rather than snipping off the end of the band they've taken a big chunk out of the MIDDLE. Has a need for these frequencies for non-broadcast use even been proven ?

    Which chunk are you referring to?


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 295 ✭✭Stasi 2.0


    The Cush wrote: »
    Which chunk are you referring to?

    I'm referring to the proposed 600MHz band (channels 31-37) which the UK authorities have suggested will be reallocated to unspecified "broadband" services -I'm assuming this is still on the cards ?


    Assuming there is even a demand/need for spectrum in this area wouldn't it have made more sense to reallocate channels from the bottom rather than the middle of the band ?

    Divis is currently using channels in the range 21-34 duplexing this with Clermont's 33-48 (assuming the latter ever use the full set allocated to it) will be fun and at the very least creates massive (and in many cases expensive) obsolescence issues with a lot of existing installs.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,596 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    Stasi 2.0 wrote: »
    I'm referring to the proposed 600MHz band (channels 31-37) which the UK authorities have suggested will be reallocated to unspecified "broadband" services -I'm assuming this is still on the cards ?

    No, that plan was effectively suspended back in 2009 when Ofcom decided to align the release of the UK's 800MHz band (channels 63-68) with what the rest of Europe were planning (channels 61-69). It was proposed at that time 2 DTT muxes would be created in the 600MHz band.

    Since then the second digital dividend has been developed for the 700MHz band (channels 49-60) and the remaining UHF band (channels 21-48), including the 600MHz band, have been replanned for 6 DTT layers/multiplexes.
    Stasi 2.0 wrote: »
    Divis is currently using channels in the range 21-34 duplexing this with Clermont's 33-48 (assuming the latter ever use the full set allocated to it) will be fun and at the very least creates massive (and in many cases expensive) obsolescence issues with a lot of existing installs.

    Only 6 muxes are now planned for Divis instead of the current 8 (see my post 121 above). Muxes 7 & 8 (UHF 33/34) will be switched off under the clearance plan.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,596 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    Comreg published its Radio Spectrum Management Strategy 2016 - 2018 yesterday.

    http://www.comreg.ie/publications/radio_spectrum_management_strategy_2016_-_2018.583.105139.p.html

    In the section on the future use of the 700 MHz band Comreg expects bilateral technical frequency and transition planning to be completed with the UK by July 2017.

    At the end of April a multilateral agreement was signed by countries in the WEDDIP region who agreed a DTT plan for the main transmitter sites. This is the basis for bilateral technical and transition DTT planning between individual countries which must be completed by mid 2018 under proposed EU regulations.

    Comreg expects Ireland to clear the 700 MHz band about 2019/20.
    1. On 29 April 2016, the administrations of Belgium, France, Germany, Ireland, Luxembourg, the Netherlands and the United Kingdom entered into a multilateral agreement relating to the DTT plan for the 470-694 MHz band, as facilitated by the Western European Digital Dividend Implementation Platform (WEDDIP) group
    2. Significant preparations have been also completed by ComReg, in collaboration with 2RN and the BAI, on a technical frequency plan to relocate DTT below the 700 MHz band and the international coordination of same with the UK and France. In relation to the latter:

       in April 2016 a DTT co-ordination agreement was signed with France; and
       in relation to the UK it is ComReg’s intention that:
      o the frequency plan for DTT below the 700 MHz band will be finalised and co-ordinated by July 2017; and
      o the frequency plan to enable the transition of DTT to below the 700 MHz band will be finalised and co-ordinated by Q4 2016.
    3. The DTT frequency plan below the 700 MHz band allows relevant stakeholders to make practical arrangements (e.g. equipment procurement) for the repurposing of the 700 MHz band including the identification of a repurposing date. While Ireland has not yet finalised these considerations, it is ComReg’s understanding that Ireland’s 700 MHz migration activities are indicatively planned for the time period 2019/2020 (i.e. a period of 3-4 years from now)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,596 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    Ofcom today published a statement on the 700 MHz band which sets out 2 decisions in relation to the clearance of the band

    - the band will be released in Q2 2020, ahead of the European Commission's proposed deadline of June 30th, 2020
    - 20 MHz of the centre duplex gap to be used for LTE SDL (or similar technology)

    https://www.ofcom.org.uk/consultations-and-statements/category-1/maximising-benefits-700mhz-clearance

    The 600 MHz interim Freeview HD multiplexes 7 & 8 will be moved to the duplex gap (UHF Chs. 56/56) during the clearance and remain until at least 1 May 2020, or until mobile downlink services in this spectrum are deployed.

    The current 700MHz clearance plan sees NI clearing the band in about 3 years, Q3/Q4 2019. Presumably this will happen across the whole island on the same day in line with what happened at ASO/DSO on Oct 24th, 2012.
    Ofcom will work with ComReg and the relevant UK and Irish government departments to co-ordinate the clearance programme in Northern Ireland and the Republic of Ireland, and to help manage the effect on DTT viewers in both jurisdictions. In this regard we have the benefit of the experience of the successful all-island co-ordination of Digital Switchover in 2012.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,596 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    The auction there concluded today, the first of the smaller European countries to auction this band after Germany and France. Considering its similar population size to Ireland it's interesting to see what the market value of this band is in a smaller market

    The 3 existing mobile operators Elisa, DNA and Sonera each acquired 2x10 MHz blocks between them at the reserve price of €11m per block for a total price of €66.33m for a 17 year licence starting next Feb. The fee is to be paid over a 5 year period ([url] http://valtioneuvosto.fi/en/article/-/asset_publisher/700-alueen-taajuudet-kolmelle-toimijalle)[/url].

    The same quantity of 800 MHz band spectrum was auctioned here in 2012, as part of a larger Multi Band Spectrum Auction, for an estimated €285m.


  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,450 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    Denis Naughten was on about the 700MHz clearout yesterday in the Dail when asked a quesiton about Mobile Phone Coverage by Cork South West TD Michael Collins
    In my Department's Estimates for 2017 I have secured €8 million for RTE to allow it to free up the 700 MHz spectrum band. ComReg will, in turn, make plans to allocate this spectrum to provide for significantly enhanced mobile coverage. The 700 MHz band is particularly suited to rural environments where the signal can travel long distances. These initiatives should assist in enhancing the quality of mobile phone and data services across Ireland, particularly in rural Ireland. In parallel, the national broadband plan aims to deliver high speed services to every city, town, village and individual premises in Ireland through private investment and a State intervention in areas a where commercial investment has not been fully demonstrated.

    Full debate: https://www.kildarestreet.com/debates/?id=2016-12-06a.228


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,596 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    The €8m clearance funding for RTÉ gets a mention whenever the issue of rural broadband is raised in the Dáil since the budget

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057658022


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,557 ✭✭✭Gerry Wicklow


    They also expect nationwide 5G by 2019. It would be nice to get nationwide 3G. They really are living in la la land up in the Dáil. No doubt the telcos will claim back the 700MHz fees in tax allowances or am I really getting too cynical in my old age?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,596 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    The Dept of Communications recently published the migration plan for the 700 MHz band

    - 4th September 2019 is the agreed and fixed Ireland/UK coordinated start date for clearance of the band
    - In the UK all broadcasting in the band will cease within a number of weeks
    - In Ireland this will be the start of the simulcast phase which will allow affected Saorview users time to make the necessary aerial upgrades. The simulcast phase ends 4th March 2020
    - Ireland and the UK will sign the new agreed DTT bandplan in March 2017.
    - Estimated transition/simulcasting costs to RTÉ/2rn is €8.6m. Compensation for the cost of transition will be provided and €8m was allocated at the last budget

    In related news, in mid December the European Parliament and Council of Ministers, as part of the legislative co-decision procedure, reached informal agreement of the proposed Decision on the UHF band up to 2030. It now goes to the Ministers and Parliament for formal approval.

    Main points
    - 700 MHz band to be released by the end of Jun 2020, a 2 year extension is available if required
    - broadcasting guaranteed in the remainder of the band until at least 2030

    The 700 MHz band auction here will take place in either late 2019 or early 2020, but the Minister isn't really sure as we see from this newspaper interview
    Naughten has allocated €8 million to RTÉ to decommission the digital terrestrial television infrastructure that currently uses the 700Mhz spectrum and “retune” it. This is two summers’ work, meaning the 5G auction will “take place in 2019, hopefully . . . 2019-2020 . . . 2019, probably”.

    http://www.irishtimes.com/business/media-and-marketing/interview-denis-naughten-has-his-work-cut-out-with-tricky-portfolio-1.2887796


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,596 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    Provisionally Agreed or Requested changes to the DTT plan, 700 MHz clearance coordinated with the UK
    [B][U]TX id[/U]	[U]TX[/U]			[U]On Air[/U]		 [U][U]Replan[/U][/U][/B]
    
    19000	Kippure	        	[B]54, 58[/B]		 22, 25, 28, 32, 34, 35, 48
    19013	Wicklow				         22, 25, 28, 29, 31, 37
    
    19100	Mt Leinster		[B]23, 26[/B]		 [B]23, 26,[/B] 29, 30, 31, 37
    19101	Suir Valley		[B]52, 56[/B]		 33, 36, 39, 42, 45, 48
    19103	Wexford				         32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 48
    19111	Waterford		[B]22, 25[/B]		 21, [B]22,[/B] 24, [B]25,[/B] 27, 28
    19126	Gorey			[B]55, 59[/B]		 32, 34, 35, 41, 44, 47
    19131	Arklow		        [B]21, 24[/B]		 [B]21[/B], 22, [B]24[/B], 25, 27, 28
    
    19200	Mullaghanish		[B]21, 24[/B]		 [B]21[/B], 22, [B]24,[/B] 25, 27, 28
    19201	Spur Hill		[B]45, 49[/B]		 30, 31, 37, 39, 42, [B]45[/B]
    19202	Crosshaven		[B]46, 56[/B]		 33, 36, 41, 44, 47, 48
    19203	Dungarvan		[B]55, 59[/B]		 32, 34, 35, 41, 44, 47
    19206	Castletownbere	        [B]55, 59[/B]		 32, 34, 35, 40, 43, 46
    19214	Mt Gabriel		[B]31, 37[/B]		 30, [B]31, 37[/B]
    19216	Drimoleague		[B]39, 42[/B]		 23, 26, 30, 32, 34, 35,
    
    19300	Maghera		        [B]48, 55[/B]		 32, 34, 35, 40, 43, 46
    19304	Woodcock Hill	        44, 47		 39, 41, 42, [B]44,[/B] 45, [B]47[/B]
    19306	Castlebar		[B]22, 25[/B]		 [B]22,[/B] 23, [B]25,[/B] 26, 28, 30
    
    19400	Truskmore		[B]53, 57[/B]		 33, 36, 39, 42, 45, 48
    19401	Achill			[B]44, 47[/B]		 33, 36, 41, [B]44, 47,[/B] 48
    19402	Fanad			[B]55, 59[/B]		 40, 41, 43, 44, 46, 47
    19403	Moville		        [B]42, 45[/B]		 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 48
    19404	Letterkenny		[B]53, 57[/B]		 33, 36, 39, 42, 45, 48
    19406	Aranmore		[B]44, 47[/B]		 32, 34, 35, 40, 43, 46
    19412	Holywell Hill		[B]30, 33[/B]		 22, 23, 25, 26, 28, [B]30[/B]
    19414	Malin			[B]26, 28[/B]		 21, 23, 24, [B]26,[/B] 27, 30
    19415	Magheraroarty		[B]22, 27[/B]		 [B]22,[/B] 23, 25, 26, 28, 30
    19420	Dooncarton		[B]27, 32[/B]		 21, 24, [B]27, 32,[/B] 34, 35
    
    19500	Cairn Hill		[B]44, 47[/B]		 22, 25, 28, 41, [B]44, 47[/B]
    19502	Monaghan		[B]55, 59[/B]		 32, 34, 35, 40, 43, 46
    
    19600	Clermont Carn		[B]52, 56[/B]		 33, 36, 39, 42, 45, 48
    19601	Drogheda				 22, 25, 28, 29, 31, 37
    
    19700	Three Rock		[B]30, 33[/B]		 23, 26, [B]30, 33,[/B] 36, 48
    19705	Greystones		[B]52, 56[/B]		 33, 36, 39, 42, 45, 48
    
    19800	Kilduff			[B]52, 56[/B]		 30, 31, 33, 36, 37, 48
    

    Two additional new sites, Wicklow and Drogheda, are budgeted for under the transition plan. These are required to counter increased interference from the UK and reduced coverage from existing transmitters in those areas.

    New antenna for Kippure, 10-tier, 18m higher than existing antenna, estimated cost €550,000. Required to improve clearance and create line of sight transmission to some areas which are currently shielded by nearby hills.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,138 ✭✭✭snaps


    Just to note, Here in Poland we have recently seen muxes start up in VHF (Channel 7) Vertical. Only people living close to the transmitters are able to receive the channels with their WB UHF horizontal aerials. Barely any information released about this here.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 295 ✭✭Stasi 2.0


    What are the prospect of all Irelands DTT multiplexes ever being used ?
    snaps wrote: »
    Just to note, Here in Poland we have recently seen muxes start up in VHF (Channel 7) Vertical. Only people living close to the transmitters are able to receive the channels with their WB UHF horizontal aerials. Barely any information released about this here.

    One problem with allowing DTT on Band 3 is that it opens up the debate over how much spectrum should be for DTT v's how much for DAB+

    If Band 3 was ever used for TV in Ireland again would it make more sense to use 7 or 8 MHZ channel spacing ?


  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Our allocation is for 7 Mhz spacing rather than 8 as was used with analogue.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,596 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    Stasi 2.0 wrote: »
    What are the prospect of all Irelands DTT multiplexes ever being used ?

    One problem with allowing DTT on Band 3 is that it opens up the debate over how much spectrum should be for DTT v's how much for DAB+

    If Band 3 was ever used for TV in Ireland again would it make more sense to use 7 or 8 MHZ channel spacing ?

    Since the ITU's RRC-06 all VHF DTT in Europe, Middle East and Africa has a channel spacing of 7 Mhz. At the conference any country that required a VHF TV layer were allocated one within the frequency plan, Ireland has 1 VHF DTT layer (the UK has none). At the same conference the previously allocated DAB layers were reconfirmed within the new plan.

    There is no reason for further debate re: DAB vs. VHF DTT spectrum as it was all agreed back in 2006. Within the plan countries can convert VHF DTT allocations to DAB if required and vice versa. On average each country was allocated 3 national DAB layer and 1 VHF DTT layer but some countries chose to go with VHF DTT instead of DAB, Finland for example has 3 national VHF DTT layers, Italy has a number of DTT layer combined with DAB, Sweden has 1 VHF DTT layer in use and Poland has activated their allocation as we see from the post above.

    As regards Ireland it's unlikely there'll ever be DTT in the VHF band, not a viable option according to RTÉ - http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=96102686#post96102686


  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,450 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    The Cush wrote: »
    Since the ITU's RRC-06 all VHF DTT in Europe, Middle East and Africa has a channel spacing of 7 Mhz. At the conference any country that required a VHF TV layer were allocated one within the frequency plan, Ireland has 1 VHF DTT layer (the UK has none). At the same conference the previously allocated DAB layers were reconfirmed within the new plan.

    There is no reason for further debate re: DAB vs. VHF DTT spectrum as it was all agreed back in 2006. Within the plan countries can convert VHF DTT allocations to DAB if required and vice versa. On average each country was allocated 3 national DAB layer and 1 VHF DTT layer but some countries chose to go with VHF DTT instead of DAB, Finland for example has 3 national VHF DTT layers, Italy has a number of DTT layer combined with DAB, Sweden has 1 VHF DTT layer in use and Poland has activated their allocation as we see from the post above.

    As regards Ireland it's unlikely there'll ever be DTT in the VHF band, not a viable option according to RTÉ - http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=96102686#post96102686
    It's a pity it wasn't considered BEFORE the digital switchover. Would've been a lot more beneficial with the current band clearances especially considering the massive increase in mobile spectrum was known before Irish switchover. 2 VHF PSB muxes supplemented with UHF relays and if needed, commercial muxes on UHF would've been very handy and negated the need for Saorsat in parts of the country.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,596 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    marno21 wrote: »
    It's a pity it wasn't considered BEFORE the digital switchover. Would've been a lot more beneficial with the current band clearances especially considering the massive increase in mobile spectrum was known before Irish switchover. 2 VHF PSB muxes supplemented with UHF relays and if needed, commercial muxes on UHF would've been very handy and negated the need for Saorsat in parts of the country.

    The problem is as RTÉ has stated in my link above, they would have to maintain 2 separate networks with less available capacity for the same mux parameters on the VHF network for less than 2% of the population, the increased capacity available with DVB-T2 wasn't an option at the time. Saorsat was probably the cheaper option.

    As regards the demand for mobile spectrum, at the time the network was being planned only the DD1 spectrum was being planned for release but the same year we ASO'd, at WRC-12, co-allocation of the 700MHz band was surprisingly added to the agenda at the request of Arab and African countries without any prior notification and this was opposed by all members of CEPT (Europe).

    A compromise was eventually agreed, the band would be released but not until the end of WRC-15. This gave European countries time to put the necessary technical and regulatory standards in place.

    This is a reason some European countries are using their VHF DTT allocation to increase capacity with the loss of UHF spectrum.


  • Registered Users Posts: 792 ✭✭✭Mickey Mike


    :D
    Stasi 2.0 wrote: »
    What are the prospect of all Irelands DTT multiplexes ever being used ?

    I can't any more multiplexes been used apart from the two we have, hope they could at least upgrade the picture quality on the two Muxes that's there and forget about the rest.:D

    One problem with allowing DTT on Band 3 is that it opens up the debate over how much spectrum should be for DTT v's how much for DAB+

    If Band 3 was ever used for TV in Ireland again would it make more sense to use 7 or 8 MHZ channel spacing ?


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 19,829 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    Stasi 2.0 wrote: »
    If Band 3 was ever used for TV in Ireland again would it make more sense to use 7 or 8 MHZ channel spacing ?

    If band 3 is used, then the spacing is 7 mhz. It would be the third mux, so that would be no problem. There is plenty of space in 7 Mhz for quite a few test cards, and static information channels giving guidance on how to tune in Saorview (but of course you would have to know how to tune it in to see the picture).

    We will see, as band 3 has much greater coverage than UHF, particularly the 700 mhz band.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,596 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    We will see, as band 3 has much greater coverage than UHF, particularly the 700 mhz band.

    VHF isn't part of the transition plan, the major work items include 2 new UHF sites and new antennas and increased height for Kippure.

    The new antennas on the Kippure mast will be 18m higher and increase coverage in line with analogue transmission. The existing antennas are to remain as emergency back-up. Kippure is the only main transmitter where work of this scale is to be carried out.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 787 ✭✭✭ArKl0w


    I use a saorview/freeview UK terrestrial combination currently of the Arklow tx and preseli in Wales

    It's currently impossible to receive saorview here from Clermont carn so I'd be hoping no interference from them if they choose preseli channels in 2019
    They have the option not to.


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