Minister Shatter and Commissioner Callinan should both resign in disgrace

Shady Tady · 09-04-2014 3:42pm

JRant wrote: »

Far from it, I don't have it in for anybody. All I want is for those who are charged with upholding the law to actually do their job and uphold it. Is that to much to ask for.

Why is calling for GSOC to be given more powers "having it in for AGS"?

Horse ****e! You've basically blackened every member of the force and painted them all with the same brush. Some of the finest people you will ever meet are members of AGS and contribute greatly to society both on and off duty. Maybe you would care to give us a percentage of members you feel are doing their job!

sopretty · 09-04-2014 3:44pm

Shady Tady wrote: »

Horse ****e! You've basically blackened every member of the force and painted them all with the same brush. Some of the finest people you will ever meet are members of AGS and contribute greatly to society both on and off duty. Maybe you would care to give us a percentage of members you feel are doing their job!

Well, I have to say, you're not contributing greatly to either society or the perception of AGS. I wonder are they aware that you're acting as spokesperson?

Shady Tady · 09-04-2014 3:50pm

sopretty wrote: »

Well, I have to say, you're not contributing greatly to either society or the perception of AGS. I wonder are they aware that you're acting as spokesperson?

Am I not entitled to an opinion, or is that only confined to critics

sopretty · 09-04-2014 3:53pm

Shady Tady wrote: »

Am I not entitled to an opinion, or is that only confined to critics

Oh, you're quite entitled to an opinion. That said, most of your contributions on here have been rantings, ravings, LOL's, insults and little more.

Shady Tady · 09-04-2014 3:54pm

sopretty wrote: »

Oh, you're quite entitled to an opinion. That said, most of your contributions on here have been rantings, ravings, LOL's, insults and little more.

We'd make a great couple you and me!

sopretty · 09-04-2014 3:55pm

Shady Tady wrote: »

We'd make a great couple you and me!

Add deflection to your tactics. Anything but substantive arguments. :cool:

Shady Tady · 09-04-2014 3:57pm

sopretty wrote: »

Add deflection to your tactics. Anything but substantive arguments. :cool:

sopretty · 09-04-2014 3:58pm

Shady Tady wrote: »

Doesn't work in society and it certainly doesn't wash with a Judge my dear.

tayto lover · 09-04-2014 4:01pm

JRant wrote: »

Far from it, I don't have it in for anybody. All I want is for those who are charged with upholding the law to actually do their job and uphold it. Is that to much to ask for.

Why is calling for GSOC to be given more powers "having it in for AGS"?

We all want fair play, for everybody.
You did generalise a lot I felt.
There's good and bad in all walks of life.

Shady Tady · 09-04-2014 4:08pm

sopretty wrote: »

Doesn't work in society and it certainly doesn't wash with a Judge my dear.

Neither does brandishing a whole police force of 13.000 as corrupt. That's the sort of thing a recently released sex offender might want to do after joining boards.ie and becoming a keyboard warrior venting their anger at being put away and pretending they are a pillar of society. There is corruption but it's no worse that any other police force, not accepting there are good people in the force shows you have little credibility.

sopretty · 09-04-2014 4:09pm

Shady Tady wrote: »

Neither does brandishing a whole police force of 13.000 as corrupt. That's the sort of thing a recently released sex offender might want to do after joining boards.ie and becoming a keyboard warrior venting their anger at being put away and pretending they are a pillar of society. There is corruption but it's no worse that any other police force, not accepting there are good people in the force shows you have little credibility.

Are you somehow suggesting that I'm a released sex offender?

sopretty · 09-04-2014 4:10pm

Shady Tady wrote: »

Neither does brandishing a whole police force of 13.000 as corrupt. That's the sort of thing a recently released sex offender might want to do after joining boards.ie and becoming a keyboard warrior venting their anger at being put away and pretending they are a pillar of society. There is corruption but it's no worse that any other police force, not accepting there are good people in the force shows you have little credibility.

So, finally you accept this?

Shady Tady · 09-04-2014 4:16pm

sopretty wrote: »

Are you somehow suggesting that I'm a released sex offender?

Absolutly not, but you never really know who's online in these forums if you get what I mean!

Shady Tady · 09-04-2014 4:20pm

sopretty wrote: »

So, finally you accept this?

Do you believe there is a force in the world that does not have corruption, it's human nature, gardai are recruited from the general public and society and generally reflect society! The vast majority of gardai are decent like the vast majority of the public

sopretty · 09-04-2014 4:21pm

Shady Tady wrote: »

Absolutly not, but you never really know who's online in these forums if you get what I mean!

Hard to tell the honest cops from the corrupt ones alright.

sopretty · 09-04-2014 4:23pm

Shady Tady wrote: »

Do you believe there is a force in the world that does not have corruption, it's human nature, gardai are recruited from the general public and society and generally reflect society! The vast majority of gardai are decent like the vast majority of the public

Do you accept that there is a disproportionately higher percentage of corruption within AGS than within other public service bodies such as teaching or nursing?

Shady Tady · 09-04-2014 4:27pm

sopretty wrote: »

Hard to tell the honest cops from the corrupt ones alright.

"There is no one so blind are those who choose not to see"

sopretty · 09-04-2014 4:29pm

Shady Tady wrote: »

"There is no one so blind are those who choose not to see"

Oh I saw. I saw. And I heard. I saw and I heard a lying guard LIE in court, completely and utterly LIE in court, in order to implicate my friend. Thankfully, he didn't succeed. The bollix.

Shady Tady · 09-04-2014 4:32pm

sopretty wrote: »

Oh I saw. I saw. And I heard. I saw and I heard a lying guard LIE in court, completely and utterly LIE in court, in order to implicate my friend. Thankfully, he didn't succeed. The bollix.

That's wrong and I don't condone it, but did the other 12,999 get in the box and lie as well?

fr3d12 · 09-04-2014 4:32pm

sopretty wrote: »

Oh I saw. I saw. And I heard. I saw and I heard a lying guard LIE in court, completely and utterly LIE in court, in order to implicate my friend. Thankfully, he didn't succeed. The bollix.

Can I ask if the Garda in question was prosecuted or disciplined for perjury?

sopretty · 09-04-2014 4:34pm

Shady Tady wrote: »

That's wrong and I don't condone it, but did the other 12,999 get in the box and lie as well?

I don't think the other 12,999 would have fitted into the box. Anyway, he wasn't in a box. He was standing in front of the judge.

sopretty · 09-04-2014 4:37pm

fr3d12 wrote: »

Can I ask if the Garda in question was prosecuted or disciplined for perjury?

No, he wasn't. Because neither of us could believe it. If he had the audacity to lie in court, he would have the audacity to lie during an enquiry. We asked the barrister why he had lied, and his advice was to just relax, let it go, and forget about it. His lies got him nowhere anyway! The judge believed my friend.
I know he knew that he lied, because on the day in question, he wrote (or made shapes to be writing) in his black book. What he testified to in court was unbelievable lol. You couldn't actually make it up.

Shady Tady · 09-04-2014 4:38pm

sopretty wrote: »

I don't think the other 12,999 would have fitted into the box. Anyway, he wasn't in a box. He was standing in front of the judge.

Did you witness the incident that was brought to court or did your friend tell you what happened?

sopretty · 09-04-2014 4:42pm

Shady Tady wrote: »

Did you witness the incident that was brought to court or did your friend tell you what happened?

I witnessed both the incident and the conversations with the guard on a couple of occasions afterwards.

Shady Tady · 09-04-2014 4:43pm

sopretty wrote: »

I don't think the other 12,999 would have fitted into the box. Anyway, he wasn't in a box. He was standing in front of the judge.

Normally in court you take the oath and sit in the witness box

sopretty · 09-04-2014 4:45pm

Shady Tady wrote: »

Normally in court you take the oath and sit in the witness box

Not in this one. The guard was presenting evidence. I think he was sworn in on the bible, but stood back in his place in front of the judge. Perhaps he wasn't sworn in. Either way, he lied.

Shady Tady · 09-04-2014 4:45pm

sopretty wrote: »

I witnessed both the incident and the conversations with the guard on a couple of occasions afterwards.

Did you complain to GSOC?

sopretty · 09-04-2014 4:49pm

Shady Tady wrote: »

Did you complain to GSOC?

No. If he could lie in court, he would lie to them.

Shady Tady · 09-04-2014 4:54pm

sopretty wrote: »

No. If he could lie in court, he would lie to them.

Let him lie to them and see how they deal with it, but not complaining is a cop out and you let down both the decent cops and the public down as well as yourselves. Poor decision

sopretty · 09-04-2014 4:58pm

Shady Tady wrote: »

Let him lie to them and see how they deal with it, but not complaining is a cop out and you let down both the decent cops and the public down as well as yourselves. Poor decision

Lol, ok.

mikom · 09-04-2014 5:01pm

Shady Tady wrote: »

Let him lie to them and see how they deal with it, but not complaining is a cop out and you let down both the decent cops and the public down as well as yourselves. Poor decision

Interesting choice of words.........

Shady Tady · 09-04-2014 5:07pm

mikom wrote: »

Interesting choice of words.........

You have great sight, what's your hearing like ex army man?

09-04-2014 5:23pm

sopretty wrote: »

No. If he could lie in court, he would lie to them.

You have been on this thread for weeks now, you have told us all that this one particular guard lied on oath in court.

Then, maybe it wasn't court, maybe he wasn't sworn in.......
You either know what happened or you don't.

If you know that the guard lied on oath, committed perjury, then I say its your duty to report it.

You lack credibility now, in my mind. You complain about gardai being corrupt, the only decent ones are the two whistleblowers, the rest ( you say ) ignored corruption.

A bit like you are doing now then yes?

sopretty · 09-04-2014 5:31pm

bubblypop wrote: »

You have been on this thread for weeks now, you have told us all that this one particular guard lied on oath in court.

Then, maybe it wasn't court, maybe he wasn't sworn in.......
You either know what happened or you don't.

If you know that the guard lied on oath, committed perjury, then I say its your duty to report it.

You lack credibility now, in my mind. You complain about gardai being corrupt, the only decent ones are the two whistleblowers, the rest ( you say ) ignored corruption.

A bit like you are doing now then yes?

Are you taking the piss?
He was sworn in to give evidence (that is my understanding). He did not sit in a box. He stood in his place on a bench in front of a District Court Judge. He LIED. He lied unbelievably. Basically, where we had contacted the gardai to complain about an assault, he said that he never received such a report. The f*cker came down and sat on the windowsill in my sitting room, writing in his black book. He then went to the 'assaulter'. He came back 2 further times, each time, writing in his black book. As my friend was not the assaulter, we didn't want to proceed with making statements. My friend was then accused of being the assaulter! He (the guard) was in our house on 3 occasions.

1. Immediately after the incident.
2. A couple of days later
3. About a week after no. 2 (the day after the Cavan fleadh - we discussed music with him and reiterated to him that we didn't want to press charges as we didn't want any hassle).

Then!!!!

This piece of *something* stood up in court and stated on questioning by our barrister, that the first night he came down, he had responded to a complaint by the other party (it was us who rang the guards) and that we told him to '**** off'.

Now............

WTF do you do with that level of lying??????????????

oscarBravo · 09-04-2014 5:37pm

sopretty wrote: »

WTF do you do with that level of lying??????????????

You could either (a) make a formal complaint to GSOC, or (b) do nothing but bitch about it on an online forum and wonder why nobody is doing anything about dishonest Gardaí.

sopretty · 09-04-2014 5:42pm

oscarBravo wrote: »

You could either (a) make a formal complaint to GSOC, or (b) do nothing but bitch about it on an online forum and wonder why nobody is doing anything about dishonest Gardaí.

I have since reported a different garda to GSOC. She was investigated (by a Garda) and found to have done nothing wrong.

Maybe she hadn't done anything wrong eh?
Maybe the cop in the other incident hadn't done anything wrong?

Or............ maybe you can't prove that a liar is a liar!!!!!!!!!!!!

oscarBravo · 09-04-2014 5:43pm

sopretty wrote: »

I have since reported a different garda to GSOC. She was investigated (by a Garda) and found to have done nothing wrong.

Maybe she hadn't done anything wrong eh?
Maybe the cop in the other incident hadn't done anything wrong?

Or............ maybe you can't prove that a liar is a liar!!!!!!!!!!!!

Impotent bitching it is, so. That oughta sort it.

sopretty · 09-04-2014 5:45pm

oscarBravo wrote: »

Impotent bitching it is, so. That oughta sort it.

In the absence of a more credible avenue.............

Shady Tady · 09-04-2014 5:46pm

sopretty wrote: »

Are you taking the piss?
He was sworn in to give evidence (that is my understanding). He did not sit in a box. He stood in his place on a bench in front of a District Court Judge. He LIED. He lied unbelievably. Basically, where we had contacted the gardai to complain about an assault, he said that he never received such a report. The f*cker came down and sat on the windowsill in my sitting room, writing in his black book. He then went to the 'assaulter'. He came back 2 further times, each time, writing in his black book. As my friend was not the assaulter, we didn't want to proceed with making statements. My friend was then accused of being the assaulter! He (the guard) was in our house on 3 occasions.

1. Immediately after the incident.
2. A couple of days later
3. About a week after no. 2 (the day after the Cavan fleadh - we discussed music with him and reiterated to him that we didn't want to press charges as we didn't want any hassle).

Then!!!!

This piece of *something* stood up in court and stated on questioning by our barrister, that the first night he came down, he had responded to a complaint by the other party (it was us who rang the guards) and that we told him to '**** off'.

Now............

WTF do you do with that level of lying??????????????

You wanted to complain of assault he called 3 times and you say yourself you didn't want to make a statement . How can you complain if you don't make a statement

Shady Tady · 09-04-2014 5:47pm

sopretty wrote: »

I have since reported a different garda to GSOC. She was investigated (by a Garda) and found to have done nothing wrong.

Maybe she hadn't done anything wrong eh?
Maybe the cop in the other incident hadn't done anything wrong?

Or............ maybe you can't prove that a liar is a liar!!!!!!!!!!!!

There's a pattern emerging!

sopretty · 09-04-2014 5:51pm

Shady Tady wrote: »

You wanted to complain of assault he called 3 times and you say yourself you didn't want to make a statement . How can you complain if you don't make a statement

We complained about the assault. He asked us whether we wanted to make statements (this was the evening of the incident). We said we'd think about it. He came back a few days later, again asking if we wanted to make statements. We (knowing the reality of what happened) again declined, as we knew we had done nothing wrong and were in fact the victims.
He came back the last time (the Monday after the Cavan Fleadh) and asked us again. Again, we declined, as we didn't want hassle.

It never occurred to us that the assaulter was in fact accusing my friend!!!!

The guard however, in court, said that, we hadn't called in the complaint, and that in fact, we had told him to F**k off when he arrived at the house on the night.

sopretty · 09-04-2014 5:53pm

Shady Tady wrote: »

There's a pattern emerging!

There's no pattern. I didn't complain about the first guy. I complained about the second one (on third party advice - entirely different situation involved).
She was found to be completely innocent. :cool:

One complaint I have made. No pattern.

Shady Tady · 09-04-2014 5:58pm

sopretty wrote: »

We complained about the assault. He asked us whether we wanted to make statements (this was the evening of the incident). We said we'd think about it. He came back a few days later, again asking if we wanted to make statements. We (knowing the reality of what happened) again declined, as we knew we had done nothing wrong and were in fact the victims.
He came back the last time (the Monday after the Cavan Fleadh) and asked us again. Again, we declined, as we didn't want hassle.

It never occurred to us that the assaulter was in fact accusing my friend!!!!

The guard however, in court, said that, we hadn't called in the complaint, and that in fact, we had told him to F**k off when he arrived at the house on the night.

Why would he call back if you told him you didn't want to make a statement unless he was there on foot of another persons complaint. It's possible the other person complained offically before you did. Maybe you rang in the call but the other party clearly put the offical complain in first as you wouldn't back up your call with a complaint. If you were the victim you 'd have done what the other party done, you owe the garda an apology!

sopretty · 09-04-2014 5:58pm

I have to say though Shady

On the one hand you're recriminating me for NOT reporting the first idiot to GSOC.
On the other hand, when I tell you I reported another idiot to GSOC, you attempt to cast aspersions on my character.

So, what should I be doing?

Reporting, or not?

Shady Tady · 09-04-2014 6:02pm

Anyone want anything from the shop? I'll be back later!

tayto lover · 09-04-2014 6:02pm

This thread has become a bit of a "he says this, i say that" and is losing context.
It has gone off the topic it started on.

Anyway I am glad to see that a Policing Body will be set-up and that the Garda Commissioner and higher officers in the Garda will no longer be political appointments. This is progress.
I also want to see the guilty Garda members being prosecuted but the many good members of the force who do their jobs properly continue to do just that.

We can't paint the entire force with the same brush as the guilty. It is disrespectful to those good men and women.

sopretty · 09-04-2014 6:04pm

Shady Tady wrote: »

Why would he call back if you told him you didn't want to make a statement unless he was there on foot of another persons complaint. It's possible the other person complained offically before you did. Maybe you rang in the call but the other party clearly put the offical complain in first as you wouldn't back up your call with a complaint. If you were the victim you 'd have done what the other party done, you owe the garda an apology!

Honestly, are you taking the actual piss?
We were never ever informed that the other party had put in a complaint.
Suffering from vomiting attacks when I saw the other party, I certainly did not wish to have to go to a court with them. It never occurred to us that they would have put a complaint against us?

Can you imagine if you're assaulted randomly by someone lol, would it enter your head that they might say that you in fact assaulted them?????

I owe the Garda an apology??? The scumbag is lucky to still be in a job. Lucky for him, I don't believe in his corrupt reporting structure. Lucky for him, his lying was so convincing that I have no doubt that he could become even more convincing under investigation himself. Lucky for him, I just about escaped the entire ordeal with my mental health intact.

mikom · 09-04-2014 6:05pm

Shady Tady wrote: »

Let him lie to them and see how they deal with it, but not complaining is a cop out and you let down both the decent cops and the public down as well as yourselves. Poor decision

mikom wrote: »

Interesting choice of words.........

Shady Tady wrote: »

You have great sight, what's your hearing like ex army man?

ex army man?

I think you have me confused with someone else.

sopretty · 09-04-2014 6:06pm

Look, you know. ShadyTady. I know what you are.
I will not further engage with you. It's not worth it for me.
I have said my piece and people can read it.
I am not going to be ridiculed or interrogated by someone on an internet forum.
You take from it what you will, but I will not be replying to any further questions from you in relation to either incident.

09-04-2014 6:37pm

quote="sopretty;89861113"]Are you taking the piss?
He was sworn in to give evidence (that is my understanding). He did not sit in a box. He stood in his place on a bench in front of a District Court Judge. He LIED. He lied unbelievably. Basically, where we had contacted the gardai to complain about an assault, he said that he never received such a report. The f*cker came down and sat on the windowsill in my sitting room, writing in his black book. He then went to the 'assaulter'. He came back 2 further times, each time, writing in his black book. As my friend was not the assaulter, we didn't want to proceed with making statements. My friend was then accused of being the assaulter! He (the guard) was in our house on 3 occasions.

1. Immediately after the incident.
2. A couple of days later
3. About a week after no. 2 (the day after the Cavan fleadh - we discussed music with him and reiterated to him that we didn't want to press charges as we didn't want any hassle).

Then!!!!

This piece of *something* stood up in court and stated on questioning by our barrister, that the first night he came down, he had responded to a complaint by the other party (it was us who rang the guards) and that we told him to '**** off'.

Now............

WTF do you do with that level of lying??????????????[/quote]

You told him you did not wish to press charges.

I'm guessing whoever your friend had the fight with did wish to press charges?
So you and your friend ended up in court?

If you weren't willing to make a statement, that's not the guards fault. Now, I don't know what was said in court but I will say again that if you believe a guard has broken the law then you should report him.

GSOC are there to investigate incidents involving gardai, now if they didn't find in your favour I'd be inclined to believe they know what they are doing.

Do you think people should do what you say but not what you do?
Basically you complain and moan but are not willing to do anything about it.

I won't be taking any of your posts seriously from now on.
You, are a hypocrite.

Minister Shatter and Commissioner Callinan should both resign in disgrace

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