The Links Thread

FixdePitchmark

pay full rate ?

slave1

Nope, I'm on the Golf Digest Top 100 Assessors panel so was complimentary.
Generally I play and assess about 50/50, e.g. assess Rosapenna and pay for Portsalon as I'm close by.
Out at 8, they only allow singles/two players at that time and the lad out with me was a no-show and had pre-paid, played the 27, the 4th on the yellow course is a super risk/reward driveable hole...my favourites were that and the par 3 12th on the blue nine, super hole with amazing bunkering and runoffs from every angle, took a photo of it from a nearby dune and stepped on a Pro V1, lovely

Rumple Stillson

slave1 wrote: »

Nope, I'm on the Golf Digest Top 100 Assessors panel so was complimentary.
Generally I play and assess about 50/50, e.g. assess Rosapenna and pay for Portsalon as I'm close by.
Out at 8, they only allow singles/two players at that time and the lad out with me was a no-show and had pre-paid, played the 27, the 4th on the yellow course is a super risk/reward driveable hole...my favourites were that and the par 3 12th on the blue nine, super hole with amazing bunkering and runoffs from every angle, took a photo of it from a nearby dune and stepped on a Pro V1, lovely

I'd love to know a but more about how you got involved with Golf Digest's assessors panel?

Often wondered if the agronomic condition of the course is part of the criteria, I'm from a greenkeeping background myself.

slave1

They have an ad in the magazine every year IIRC, I'm doing it a few years now, think that's how I got in, just filled in some form and sent it off, or it could have been on their website.

Rumple Stillson

slave1 wrote: »

They have an ad in the magazine every year IIRC, I'm doing it a few years now, think that's how I got in, just filled in some form and sent it off, or it could have been on their website.

Was there a criteria to join?

In terms of how you assess course, could you give a very broad overview perhaps?

In a previous role I used to visit courses and assess the condition of playing surfaces etc, coming at it from a turf management point of view. Not sure this forms any part of golf digests assessment but at the same time not suggesting it should.

slave1

I don't want to drag this thread off topic, but the two links below sum it up very well...

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=102186346&postcount=10

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=102199519&postcount=31

Rumple Stillson

slave1 wrote: »

I don't want to drag this thread off topic, but the two links below sum it up very well...

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=102186346&postcount=10

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=102199519&postcount=31

Great, appreciate that. Apologies for going off topic.

frink

My old man won tickets to the Darren Clarke Invitational in Portrush in a few weeks. Thinking of getting a game in Portstewart the day before, anyone recommend any other courses, links preferably, up that way?

Cody OHare

frink wrote: »

My old man won tickets to the Darren Clarke Invitational in Portrush in a few weeks. Thinking of getting a game in Portstewart the day before, anyone recommend any other courses, links preferably, up that way?

Depends what you mean by up that way.... Ballyliffen, Portstewart & Rosapenna all top quality.

mighty magpie

From memory I think ballyliffin might have open comps on some saturdays throughout the winter.

do any other courses in donegal do this and when do they usually start? Me and a playing partner fancy getting away from lift clean and place this weekend.

slave1

frink wrote: »

My old man won tickets to the Darren Clarke Invitational in Portrush in a few weeks. Thinking of getting a game in Portstewart the day before, anyone recommend any other courses, links preferably, up that way?

Portsalon have tee times at €25, one in the morning and one in the afternoon, usually on their own website.
Wouln't go to Castlerock as they are renovating 8/9 greens so lots of holes closed.
Why not try the Portrush Valley course?

Hooks Golf Handicap

I see The European Club have put their summer rates up to €225.
http://www.theeuropeanclub.com/guestfees.html

I've played it twice, both as gifts, great track but that rate is nonsense.
Does Ruddy not want business or is there a shifty 50 way of getting out ?

Favourite hole, the 11th btw, last hole before the sea.

benny79

Jesus the winter rate is €120 :eek: that must be for the tourists, As anytime I played it in winter it always has been €50.. As long as you dont turn up with a American accent! his words not mine

Jawgap

Hooks Golf Handicap wrote: »

I see The European Club have put their summer rates up to €225.
http://www.theeuropeanclub.com/guestfees.html

I've played it twice, both as gifts, great track but that rate is nonsense.
Does Ruddy not want business or is there a shifty 50 way of getting out ?

Favourite hole, the 11th btw, last hole before the sea.

The boom is back!

Ridiculous price and anyone paying it needs their head examined.

Always thought it was a pretty good, but overrated, course. Now it's both overrated and hilariously over-priced.

mike12

Jawgap wrote: »

The boom is back!

Ridiculous price and anyone paying it needs their head examined.

Always thought it was a pretty good, but overrated, course. Now it's both overrated and hilariously over-priced.

They have a gui, rate think it is 60 they also run weekly opens and the March plays which are super value.
So loads of ways to play it at a decent rate.

Ronney

Jawgap wrote: »

The boom is back!

Ridiculous price and anyone paying it needs their head examined.

Always thought it was a pretty good, but overrated, course. Now it's both overrated and hilariously over-priced.

In fairness that is a price aimed to attract a certain level of tourist $$.

The European club run a number of weekly open comps where anyone with a GUI can play for 1/4 of that price.

It is by far the most accessible of our top links courses to play

Jawgap

mike12 wrote: »

They have a gui, rate think it is 60 they also run weekly opens and the March plays which are super value.
So loads of ways to play it at a decent rate.

To be honest, I'd say it's still over-priced at €60.

But fair play to them - they are better than most clubs in that price bracket at running opens.

Jawgap

Ronney wrote: »

In fairness that is a price aimed to attract a certain level of tourist $$.

The European club run a number of weekly open comps where anyone with a GUI can play for 1/4 of that price.

It is by far the most accessible of our top links courses to play

i think perhaps that's where our opinions diverge.....I think it's a good course, but I wouldn't rate it as a "top" links. Plenty do, so they'll continue to thrive, and good luck to them.

mike12

Jawgap wrote: »

i think perhaps that's where our opinions diverge.....I think it's a good course, but I wouldn't rate it as a "top" links. Plenty do, so they'll continue to thrive, and good luck to them.

It will always be personal opinions but it is rated very highly by most. It u look at the US and see how much it is to play any course rated in the top 100 in the US.
Those that u could actually play would be 500 plus dollars for most.
That's why clubs here can get away with charging a tourist rate.
20 green fees at 265 a week Is a lot of cash a year.
You would be looking at 88 green fees paying 60 quid for the same money.

Jawgap

mike12 wrote: »

It will always be personal opinions but it is rated very highly by most. It u look at the US and see how much it is to play any course rated in the top 100 in the US.
Those that u could actually play would be 500 plus dollars for most.
That's why clubs here can get away with charging a tourist rate.
20 green fees at 265 a week Is a lot of cash a year.
You would be looking at 88 green fees paying 60 quid for the same money.

I'm not doubting it, but my own experience of playing golf in the US and paying those kind of prices is that you get a better course and a much better service.

I'd agree it comes down to personal preference, but a course like the European charging that kind of money, even if it is to tourists, just emphasises what value is available on less well marketed.

Btw, paying that kind of money is making it more like an "occasion" which means, to my mind, repeat business is less likely - so yes, you get the €265 once, instead of someone paying €60 but playing the course more often.

mike12

Jawgap wrote: »

I'm not doubting it, but my own experience of playing golf in the US and paying those kind of prices is that you get a better course and a much better service.

I'd agree it comes down to personal preference, but a course like the European charging that kind of money, even if it is to tourists, just emphasises what value is available on less well marketed.
But most of the tourists are coming for their one big trip to Ireland.


Btw, paying that kind of money is making it more like an "occasion" which means, to my mind, repeat business is less likely - so yes, you get the €265 once, instead of someone paying €60 but playing the course more often.

But most of the tourists are coming for their one big trip to Ireland.
It's the same with all the links courses they all have green fees that the average Irish punter won't pay.
If the American's see a cheap green fee they think the course isn't worth playing, if you have a sub 100 green free they just won't come.

Jawgap

mike12 wrote: »

But most of the tourists are coming for their one big trip to Ireland.
It's the same with all the links courses they all have green fees that the average Irish punter won't pay.
If the American's see a cheap green fee they think the course isn't worth playing, if you have a sub 100 green free they just won't come.

Hey, it's their business and yes I acknowledge the "Kerrygold" effect - people use price to judge quality. More fool them, and well done to any business who can separate those fools from their money.

And as a matter of personal opinion I think the course, while enjoyable to play, has always been overrated. Bit like Apple, the product is fine, but the genius is in the marketing.

I dare say there are courses I love playing that others would regard as overrated

Miley Byrne

Jawgap wrote: »

i think perhaps that's where our opinions diverge.....I think it's a good course, but I wouldn't rate it as a "top" links. Plenty do, so they'll continue to thrive, and good luck to them.

Yes these things are subjective but I defy anyone who is into golf (especially links golf) to name 5 or 6 better links courses in the country. Ergo it's a "top" links course. It is an absolute beast and one of the few links courses that wouldn't be taken apart on a calm day.

It's also probably one of the more accessible links courses too. Open singles a couple of times a week (Thursday & Sunday last time I checked). I would prefer to spend €60 to play there than play a lot of places twice for €30 x 2.

ThunderCat

Miley Byrne wrote: »

Yes these things are subjective but I defy anyone who is into golf (especially links golf) to name 5 or 6 better links courses in the country. Ergo it's a "top" links course. It is an absolute beast and one of the few links courses that wouldn't be taken apart on a calm day.

It's also probably one of the more accessible links courses too. Open singles a couple of times a week (Thursday & Sunday last time I checked). I would prefer to spend €60 to play there than play a lot of places twice for €30 x 2.

Even on the east coast alone I'd put The Island, Portmarnock, Baltray and Royal County Down ahead of it. Subjective of course but it barely scrapes the top 10 in my opinion if that.

Ronney

Jawgap wrote: »

i think perhaps that's where our opinions diverge.....I think it's a good course, but I wouldn't rate it as a "top" links. Plenty do, so they'll continue to thrive, and good luck to them.

I know opinions differ and but most people would agree its close to a top 10 links,

That said I would say there are few Links in the Top 20 in the country that one can get out for €50/60 a few days a week all year round.

The NW is probably the best value and only place you will watch that but the courses there tend to be remote.

European is bout an Hours drive from the center of Dublin

Jawgap

Miley Byrne wrote: »

Yes these things are subjective but I defy anyone who is into golf (especially links golf) to name 5 or 6 better links courses in the country. Ergo it's a "top" links course. It is an absolute beast and one of the few links courses that wouldn't be taken apart on a calm day.

It's also probably one of the more accessible links courses too. Open singles a couple of times a week (Thursday & Sunday last time I checked). I would prefer to spend €60 to play there than play a lot of places twice for €30 x 2.

Well I'd like to think I'm into my golf and especially my links golf, and to be honest of the courses I've played I think it's quite easy to name 5/6 better links courses on the East Coast (Baltray, The Island, Portmarnock, RCD, Rosslare and Portmarnock Hotel).....it's now 50% again more expensive than the Island.

.....maybe that's the issue - it is a beast, but to my mind that means it rewards golfing brawn rather than golfing brains......and as someone who lacks the former, but likes to think he possesses the latter, thats probably why I don't rate it enough to think the price offers anything approaching reasonable value.

....and I'm not denying its accessible - and as I mentioned it's one of the few decent links courses in that price bracket that do run opens on a regular basis - but is accessibility a hallmark of a top links? - if so, Corballis, should go straight to the top of the list

Miley Byrne

Jawgap wrote: »

Well I'd like to think I'm into my golf and especially my links golf, and to be honest of the courses I've played I think it's quite easy to name 5/6 better links courses on the East Coast (Baltray, The Island, Portmarnock, RCD, Rosslare and Portmarnock Hotel).....it's now 50% again more expensive than the Island.

.....maybe that's the issue - it is a beast, but to my mind that means it rewards golfing brawn rather than golfing brains......and as someone who lacks the former, but likes to think he possesses the latter, thats probably why I don't rate it enough to think the price offers anything approaching reasonable value.

....and I'm not denying its accessible - and as I mentioned it's one of the few decent links courses in that price bracket that do run opens on a regular basis - but is accessibility a hallmark of a top links? - if so, Corballis, should go straight to the top of the list

No matter what criteria you use, on no level is Portmarnock Links a better course than The European. Haven't played Rosslaare or Baltray so can't comment on them.

Jawgap

Miley Byrne wrote: »

No matter what criteria you use, on no level is Portmarnock Links a better course than The European. Haven't played Rosslaare or Baltray so can't comment on them.

Ah well, that's sport for you - each of us can have our own opinion, none of us are necessarily correct beyond our own subjective notions.

And maybe the European is better than Portmarnock Links, but is it really almost twice as good, as the walk-up price differential suggests?

mike12

Think power is not needed in the European, almost every hole tightens up at the 250 mark off the middle tees.
I live the links but no way I would pay even Tue open comp price of 50 now to play it.
Lots of holes up and down which I don't like in a links.
The European u can hardly see another hole bar the one u are playing.

The Island is my favorite links on the east coast, but I still think that RCD and the European are better golf courses.

Any way off next week to play Portrush, Portstewart and Ballyliffin.
Another 3 super courses.

Jawgap

mike12 wrote: »

Think power is not needed in the European, almost every hole tightens up at the 250 mark off the middle tees.
I live the links but no way I would pay even Tue open comp price of 50 now to play it.
Lots of holes up and down which I don't like in a links.
The European u can hardly see another hole bar the one u are playing.

The Island is my favorite links on the east coast, but I still think that RCD and the European are better golf courses.

Any way off next week to play Portrush, Portstewart and Ballyliffin.
Another 3 super courses.

Again not necessarily a hallmark of a quality course......I've played a few links in Scotland - incl St Andrew's - with double greens where you don't just see the other hole, you can effectively be playing it if you're on the green it shares with its reciprocal.

.....and I'm not a fan of "loops" on links courses - I much prefer the traditional "9 out 9 back" configuration.

I'm glad you rate the European ahead of others, I don't - but, as I said, that's sport. Given a choice between the European and the Island, I'd take the Island every day and twice on Sunday (and spend the money I'd save on new kit ).

Enjoy the golf, they are 3 top courses.