Feminism and the emasculation of men

lufties

Muise... wrote: »

Are you confusing "Feminists" with some aul harpy that burnt you one time? Or maybe you had a bad dream?

]
Not at all, it's not an anti-woman thread, I love women. But I must admit I'm into feminine women.

kunst nugget

FTA69 wrote: »

It shouldn't be though, and that's the point. Maternity is a necessary thing in society and there should be maternity pay and strict job protection for women who are pregnant. Likewise women of a certain age shouldn't be denied promotion in the workplace because their boss is afraid she might get up the duff at some stage.

On the other side of the fence, paternity leave should be given a radical overhaul and men should have protection to take time off if they choose to as well.

Muise...

FTA69 wrote: »

It shouldn't be though, and that's the point. Maternity is a necessary thing in society and there should be maternity pay and strict job protection for women who are pregnant. Likewise women of a certain age shouldn't be denied promotion in the workplace because their boss is afraid she might get up the duff at some stage.

Agreed, depending on the type of job.

Czarcasm

DannieHasABrazilian wrote: »

Some examples would be manbags, mancara or the need to be cleanshaven and must require the most sensative after skin protection for when you shave for the 20th time today.

That Brazilian must be getting right itchy!

Menas

lufties wrote: »

Feminists want equality without accountability.

Can you explain this please?

lufties wrote: »

Other things are they want to be paid equal but refuse to work as such.

Say what? When have women as a whole refused to work as hard as men?

lufties wrote: »

men also get manipulated by women sexually. .

Yup, the porn industry and sex slaves are all poor men been exploited.

lufties wrote: »

On tv men are portrayed as idiots while the woman is the dominant figure.

TV is not real life. Females are badly represented in some tv shows too. Indeed, all humans are portrayed badly in lots of tv shows. Bloody aliens running our media.

lufties wrote: »

Men are also expected to just nod along at whatever women say and hence becoming emasculated.

No they are not. Men and women are expected to treat each other with respect regardless of their sex.

lufties

Bannasidhe wrote: »

'Equal pay for Equal work' as I recall was what was asked for...

Female immorality - care to spell out exactly what you mean by that?

Ya - I can't believe the number of TV shows where men are raped and brutally murdered...oh...hang on....

You seem to have some issues...

Thanks for that diagnosis doctor..or was it an insult by any chance?

If that's your opinion then mine shouldn't bother you.

Czarcasm

lufties wrote: »

These are just some of my thoughts I felt worthy of discussion.

lufties wrote: »

If that's your opinion then mine shouldn't bother you.

lufties you shouldn't bother starting threads if you're not prepared to enter discussion on the issues. If you're not prepared to take other people's opinions seriously, then why would you feel that anyone should take your opinion seriously?

If you're prepared to be so dismissive of other people's opinions that don't agree with you when you're arguing from a minority, then you don't deserve to be heard.

Clandestine

FTA69 wrote: »

What percentage of the parliament are women?

Why do women on average earn less than men for similar work?

Why are women under-represented for promotion in the professions?

Why is maternity constantly seen as a barrier for a woman's career?

Why is domestic violence still prevalent?

1.What percentage of women have an interest in government jobs?
2. http://www.forbes.com/sites/realspin/2012/04/16/its-time-that-we-end-the-equal-pay-myth/
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/christina-hoff-sommers/wage-gap_b_2073804.html
http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2013/05/the-biggest-myth-about-the-gender-wage-gap/276367/
3.Source?
4.Because it costs business's money to support someone who isn't working?
5.Domestic violence cases are nearly 50/50 in terms of gender

lufties

Czarcasm wrote: »

lufties you shouldn't bother starting threads if you're not prepared to enter discussion on the issues. If you're not prepared to take other people's opinions seriously, then why would you feel that anyone should take your opinion seriously?

If you're prepared to be so dismissive of other people's opinions that don't agree with you when you're arguing from a minority, then you don't deserve to be heard.

First of all, I have entered the debate and made my thoughts and feelings known, I wanted this thread to be objective. Secondly, the poster insulted me, referring to mental health.

Thirdly, who the f**k do you think you are to talk to me like that? Sounds like a typical bullying tactic in fact.

lufties

lufties wrote: »

First of all, I have entered the debate and made my thoughts and feelings known, I wanted this thread to be objective. Secondly, the poster insulted me, referring to mental health.

Thirdly, who the f**k do you think you are to talk to me like that? Sounds like a typical bullying tactic in fact.

Lufties, you started a sh*tstorm of a thread, a whole can of worms has been opened by you and you have said absolutely nothing to back it up. Now you're having a freak attack and accusing people who disagree with you of bullying. You are the one who is looking unreasonable here - not "feminists".

Bannasidhe

lufties wrote: »

Thanks for that diagnosis doctor..or was it an insult by any chance?

If that's your opinion then mine shouldn't bother you.

You post here complaining that women demand equal pay but are not prepared to actually do the same work and now you are taking umbridge because I said you appear to have some issues?

WOW.

kunst nugget

lufties wrote: »

First of all, I have entered the debate and made my thoughts and feelings known, I wanted this thread to be objective. Secondly, the poster insulted me, referring to mental health.

Thirdly, who the f**k do you think you are to talk to me like that? Sounds like a typical bullying tactic in fact.

Oh noes, you're a victim because people don't agree with you! You're not John Waters or Breda O’Brien by any chance?

pablo128

Bannasidhe wrote: »

You post here complaining that women demand equal pay but are not prepared to actually do the same work and now you are taking umbridge because I said you appear to have some issues?

WOW.

Ok, well back yourself up then. What issues do you think the OP has?

lufties

Deleted User wrote: »

Lufties, you started a sh*tstorm of a thread, a whole can of worms has been opened by you and you have said absolutely nothing to back it up. Now you're having a freak attack and accusing people who disagree with you of bullying. You are the one who is looking unreasonable here - not "feminists".

Lets not get too dramatic now shall we...deep breaths now.

I have backed up what I said, but obviously there has been little objectivity from posters. I was just sharing my thoughts and experiences, rightly or wrongly, but have been insulted in doing so.

SamAK

I was reprimanded the other day by a girl i'm seeing...


My crime? Paying for her lunch along with mine and then opening the door for her as we left a cafe :rolleyes: She has a bit of a feminist streak, which I have no issue with, but I don't expect to be frowned at when i'm simply being nice.

Chivalry is alive and well

Czarcasm

lufties wrote: »

First of all, I have entered the debate and made my thoughts and feelings known, I wanted this thread to be objective. Secondly, the poster insulted me, referring to mental health.

Bannsidhe made no reference whatsoever to your mental health? Clearly you're falling well short of the mark in your attempts to be objective, and it's clear from your ill informed posts that you actually do have issues with women despite your assertions to the contrary.

Thirdly, who the f**k do you think you are to talk to me like that? Sounds like a typical bullying tactic in fact.

I'm not bullying you at all, I'm merely disagreeing with your ill informed core assertion that feminism has emasculated men. It hasn't. The concept of feminism is to empower women, it is not to take power away from men. I don't particularly have much time for any of these 'movements', but I'm secure enough in my manhood that I don't perceive feminism as a threat to my masculinity. Women can have at it for all I care, they're not taking my power away from me, they are encouraging women to assert their power.

lufties

lufties wrote: »

Lets not get too dramatic now shall we...deep breaths now.

I have backed up what I said, but obviously there has been little objectivity from posters. I was just sharing my thoughts and experiences, rightly or wrongly, but have been insulted in doing so.

Yes, you're right, you should stop being so dramatic. You claimed an insult against your mental health was made - it wasn't.

This was your post, dramatic and aggressive:

Thirdly, who the f**k do you think you are to talk to me like that? Sounds like a typical bullying tactic in fact.

You have not back up anything you said. You have yourself insulted others, but I guess you think that's ok,

tigger123

lufties wrote: »

]
Not at all, it's not an anti-woman thread, I love women. But I must admit I'm into feminine women.

Is a woman either a feminist or feminine? Can they not be both?

Wibbs

FTA69 wrote: »

What percentage of the parliament are women?

How many put themselves forward in the first place though?

Then you have the voters themselves http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/our-gender-ourselves/201301/why-aren-t-women-voting-women

"many reports still show that female voters remain reluctant to vote for a woman. In an AP analysis of data from the 2006 American National Election Study Pilot Test, researchers found that when it came to selecting a candidate for president, gender matters more for women than for men. And that while women are more likely to vote for a candidate because she is female, they are also more likely to dismiss her for that very same reason."

Now that's in the US, but I'd not be too surprised to find similar elsewhere.

Why do women on average earn less than men for similar work?

That's more than a bit of a fallacy. It is certainly less cut and dried than often promoted as fact.

Why is domestic violence still prevalent?

All sorts of reasons, but gender ain't one of them. http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2011/jun/07/feminism-domestic-violence-men And given that men are less likely to report it in the first place. Even if it was only 20 per cent, why would men report it? What support structures do they have in place? How many mens shelters, how many mens hotlines? Eh that would be none.

Like I said not nearly so cut and dried as is imagined or promoted.

Wibbs

SamAK wrote: »

I was reprimanded the other day by a girl i'm seeing...


My crime? Paying for her lunch along with mine and then opening the door for her as we left a cafe :rolleyes: She has a bit of a feminist streak, which I have no issue with, but I don't expect to be frowned at when i'm simply being nice.

Sam, that's not a feminist thing, she just sounds like a twat, no "ism" required. Apologies, but that's what it sounds like. TBH if I got a sniff of that kind of childish twattery she'd not be asked for another lunch. The world is full of women(and men) who are sound human beings, so I cant understand taking crap from a partner just because you wanna get squishy with them. Imagine that kind of guff down the line? Jeeeesus.

strobe

Honestly I've never once felt emasculated in my entire life by women, feminism, society, the media or anything else that I can think of. Think this 'feeling emasculated' malarky must be akin to the whole 'being offended' thing you also hear about. Something you do to yourself and project the cause onto outward agents or some such I suspect.

tigger123

Agreeing with another poster, as a guy I've never once felt emasculated. The stuff I read over in The Gentlemens Club makes me cringe sometimes. So many many guys with a chip on their shoulder, blaming feminism and wimmins for everything that's wrong with their lives.

lufties

Deleted User wrote: »

Yes, you're right, you should stop being so dramatic. You claimed an insult against your mental health was made - it wasn't.

This was your post, dramatic and aggressive:



You have not back up anything you said. You have yourself insulted others, but I guess you think that's ok,

Read my OP again and tell me how I have offended anyone. If I said you have 'issues', how would you react.

tigger123

tigger123 wrote: »

Agreeing with another poster, as a guy I've never once felt emasculated. The stuff I read over in The Gentlemens Club makes me cringe sometimes. So many many guys with a chip on their shoulder, blaming feminism and wimmins for everything that's wrong with their lives.

And there are women who seem to like to blame men for everything that's wrong in society too. Thankfully most men, and most women, do not feel that way.

If we stopped putting up these barriers between genders, we'd get a whole lot more done.

Bannasidhe

lufties wrote: »

I'm all for gender equality, but as a man I'm honestly getting a bit confused about a man's role in western society. back in the old dark ages, a fella looked after his lady and children and had a more dominant role in society. It's great to see women are more independent, but sometimes I can't help wondering have men become more emasculated and submissive. In my experience when a man is sexualised it is a big laugh generally with an undertone of 'you go girl', when it's the opposite the man is a pathetic sleaze. Also, when a woman is being rude or aggressive, men are expected to be sensitive to this. Sometimes it feels we're being shamed for simply just being male.
These are just some of my thoughts I felt worthy of discussion.
Also to add, this is not a anti-women thread, as I personally cherish and appreciate women with the upmost respect.

His lady - like his dog/bike/house/chiponhisshoulder?

Independent women != emasculated men - unless one believes that in order to be masculine men need women to be dependent.

Shamed just for being male smells a bit like a persecution complex

lufties wrote: »

Of course it is possible, but honestly, men are expected to pander to every whim and take any ****e that women throw at them.If not, they're labelled a chauvanist. Perhaps that's more true to life in the likes of the U.S though in fairness. I find sometimes in day to day life, It is not really accepted for a man to correct a woman for being rude, but god help you if it's the other way around.

No. They are not. Saying they are does not make it so.

lufties wrote: »

There is actually a conspiracy that feminism was spearheaded by zionists so that women could be taxed in society rather than for something more noble.

Not sure what the hell that is about.

lufties wrote: »

Ok i never lashed out firstly :rolleyes:,
I'm just speaking from experience. I suppose perhaps in some sense 'getting the girl', is not as easy these days, as women don't need/rely on men as much anymore. As a previous poster pointed out feninism and women's equality has all happened so quickly, there is no support structures for men and their new roles. Also, back in the dark ages women were considered more feminine. I can't imagine they were down the pub lewing pints in the pub or pissing in the streets(I say that light-heartedly )

'getting the girl' - seriously??? One does not 'get' another human being.

Yes, equality for women did happen quickly after centuries of being the possession of father/husband.
What exactly has changed for men? They no longer can control women's lives by putting a ring on their finger.

Women were considered 'more' feminine - oh dear, are women wearing trousers now and talking back?

lufties wrote: »

honestly I'm not really sure,Perhaps less crap from feminists and more respect and less disdain for men in society.

Crap like women are equal to men?

lufties wrote: »

Domestic violence happens to men too in case you didn't know. Women in parliament? Mary harney, hanafin and coughlan..enough said.

Three women all retired.

lufties wrote: »

Feminists want equality without accountability. Other things are they want to be paid equal but refuse to work as such. Male sexuality is shamed but female immorality is excused. men also get manipulated by women sexually. On tv men are portrayed as idiots while the woman is the dominant figure. Men are also expected to just nod along at whatever women say and hence becoming emasculated.

Lazy women wanting money for nothing....female immorality (still hasn't explained what exactly that means)... all women on TV are apparently super smart while all men are thundering eejits...

lufties wrote: »

Did you ever hear of the term 'mangina'?

You should google it for the craic

Drag Queens usually do this so there is no bulge in their frock. No idea what it has to do with feminism....

lufties wrote: »

]
Not at all, it's not an anti-woman thread, I love women. But I must admit I'm into feminine women.

Loves women...as long as they look like 'proper' feminine women...

pablo128 wrote: »

Ok, well back yourself up then. What issues do you think the OP has?

I think the OP hankers for a by gone age when men were men and women were submissive and feminine and quiet and not taking men's jobs. His issues appear to be that he is living in the wrong place at the wrong time period and would perhaps prefer somewhere like Saudi Arabia...

Edit to add - I made no reference to the OP's mental health. Everyone has issues about different things. Saying someone has issues is not commenting on their mental health, it is saying there are things that irk them (i.e. things they take issue with)

crockholm

biko wrote: »

Iceland had a openly gay female prime minister.
In 2010, her government banned strip clubs, paying for nudity in restaurants, and other means of employers profiting from employees' nudity - the first such ban in a Western democratic country. Jóhanna commented; "The Nordic countries are leading the way on women's equality, recognizing women as equal citizens rather than commodities for sale.

And you would imagine that the good ms sigurdardottir would have fancied a good spot near the greasy pole, anyway-Cheers for feminism,jeers for unemployed strippers.
Alas,with a bitta Nordic know-how,I'm sure they'll transform those gals into feminist brain surgeons with a few courses

tigger123

Deleted User wrote: »

And there are women who seem to like to blame men for everything that's wrong in society too. Thankfully most men, and most women, do not feel that way.

If we stopped putting up these barriers between genders, we'd get a whole lot more done.

I couldn't agree with ya more, absolutely, it exists on both sides. The stuff in TGC kinda hits home a bit more because I'm a guy I suppose. In some ways I kinda pity them (and I don't mean that in a patronizing way) as it's a pretty skewed view of the world, and one that ultimately achieves nothing.

Wibbs

tigger123 wrote: »

Agreeing with another poster, as a guy I've never once felt emasculated. The stuff I read over in The Gentlemens Club makes me cringe sometimes. So many many guys with a chip on their shoulder, blaming feminism and wimmins for everything that's wrong with their lives.

Oh I agree T, however that doesn't mean that this explanation should be used as a gagging order to quell all discussion on many aspects of US college campus "feminism", much of it easily debatable and some of it pure and simple BS.

kunst nugget

tigger123 wrote: »

Agreeing with another poster, as a guy I've never once felt emasculated. The stuff I read over in The Gentlemens Club makes me cringe sometimes. So many many guys with a chip on their shoulder, blaming feminism and wimmins for everything that's wrong with their lives.

I do believe that young men and boys need decent role models and we need to have positive and constructive discussion about masculinity and what being a man means today. But nearly all of that MRA stuff is fúcking terrible and disheartening to read as a man.

Semele

lufties wrote: »

Feminists want equality without accountability. Other things are they want to be paid equal but refuse to work as such. Male sexuality is shamed but female immorality is excused. men also get manipulated by women sexually. On tv men are portrayed as idiots while the woman is the dominant figure. Men are also expected to just nod along at whatever women say and hence becoming emasculated.

I love that, in a post intended to argue that male and female roles/behaviours are seen in an unequal way (to the detriment of the men, of course), your counterpart to "male sexuality" is "female immorality"! Says an awful lot about how much you allegedly "love" and "respect" women:rolleyes: