Cutting off a Clamp

Friend Computer

You forgot to call him one of the sheeple!

Amirani

Fudge You wrote: »

This is so cringey.
We should just fall in line. Never question anything our leaders do.

Where did I say we shouldn't question what the legislature does?

JustAddWater

TireeTerror wrote: »

Elected? Bunch of morons. I dont want anyone representing me, because none of them actually represent me. I dont want to pay to park anywhere. I dont agree with land ownership either. How can someone own land? Its a place on a planet which shouldnt belong to anyone. I hate society too, big bunch of crap. Im away to fill up with green diesel right now in protest at the OPs actions!

Please let us know how you get on with all of that

TireeTerror

JustAddWater wrote: »

Please let us know how you get on with all of that

I get on great doing it, been doing it for years. Never been stopped ever. I couldn't care less, they would have to physically shoot me before I would let them take my property.

There isnt much point in these debates right enough, because the reality is that most people are blind to the truth, they dont even want to see it, you get by, it could be worse. That is the mentality that allows the few to control the many. Its a pathetic weakness in the human race. Like the Jews walking into the gas chambers, thousands of them, shuffling in, knowing their fate. Bred to comply.

As a creature of this earth, I never chose to participate in society, I never chose to be born, Im just here. Why should I comply just because most people do? If many of you are willing to be coerced into working many hours of your lives just to survive, good luck to you, like a little worker ant in a colony, you will have served your purpose. A small ant, insignificant, just one of many carrying out the duty to their Queen.

I suppose Im glad most do comply, because its all your tax that pays for infrastructure that I can use for free. So thank you for that. I have not been clamped, but it would last about 2 minutes if I was.

Shanotheslayer

TireeTerror wrote: »

I get on great doing it, been doing it for years. Never been stopped ever. I couldn't care less, they would have to physically shoot me before I would let them take my property.

There isnt much point in these debates right enough, because the reality is that most people are blind to the truth, they dont even want to see it, you get by, it could be worse. That is the mentality that allows the few to control the many. Its a pathetic weakness in the human race. Like the Jews walking into the gas chambers, thousands of them, shuffling in, knowing their fate. Bred to comply.

As a creature of this earth, I never chose to participate in society, I never chose to be born, Im just here. Why should I comply just because most people do? If many of you are willing to be coerced into working many hours of your lives just to survive, good luck to you, like a little worker ant in a colony, you will have served your purpose. A small ant, insignificant, just one of many carrying out the duty to their Queen.

I suppose Im glad most do comply, because its all your tax that pays for infrastructure that I can use for free. So thank you for that. I have not been clamped, but it would last about 2 minutes if I was.

Dafuq did I just read

TireeTerror

Shanotheslayer wrote: »

Dafuq did I just read

The truth.

OPen your eyes, look beyond and you will be amazed at what you will see.

cloud493

TireeTerror wrote: »

I get on great doing it, been doing it for years. Never been stopped ever. I couldn't care less, they would have to physically shoot me before I would let them take my property.

There isnt much point in these debates right enough, because the reality is that most people are blind to the truth, they dont even want to see it, you get by, it could be worse. That is the mentality that allows the few to control the many. Its a pathetic weakness in the human race. Like the Jews walking into the gas chambers, thousands of them, shuffling in, knowing their fate. Bred to comply.

As a creature of this earth, I never chose to participate in society, I never chose to be born, Im just here. Why should I comply just because most people do? If many of you are willing to be coerced into working many hours of your lives just to survive, good luck to you, like a little worker ant in a colony, you will have served your purpose. A small ant, insignificant, just one of many carrying out the duty to their Queen.

I suppose Im glad most do comply, because its all your tax that pays for infrastructure that I can use for free. So thank you for that. I have not been clamped, but it would last about 2 minutes if I was.

I feel stupider for reading that.

JustAddWater

[quote="TireeTerror;89372693" I dont agree with land ownership either. How can someone own land? Its a place on a planet which shouldnt belong to anyone. [/quote]

TireeTerror wrote: »

I get on great doing it, been doing it for years. Never been stopped ever. I couldn't care less, they would have to physically shoot me before I would let them take my property.

You're contradicting yourself now. More holes than a sieve but isn't that what this whole freeman rubbish is. Make it up as you go along

TireeTerror

JustAddWater wrote: »

You're contradicting yourself now. More holes than a sieve but isn't that what this whole freeman rubbish is. Make it up as you go along

Where am I contradicting myself? I never mentioned being a freeman blah blah, Im literally just saying I couldnt care less for the current systems in place whereby people are forced to work like slaves to fund the rich. Its morally wrong and I wont be a part of it.

I never said I couldnt own anything, if I buy something its mine. If some Government tries to take it off me, I would hold whatever officers personally responsible, whether they are acting on behalf of an official body or not. They would use physical violence against me to take what I own, so I would use the same back. If it meant I had to back down and then be sneaky about it to seek revenge, then thats exactly what I would do. It wouldn't get my car back, but I would steal enough from them to compensate myself and then replace whatever they took.

All this law abiding stuff is drivel, purely intended to control us. Those that enforce the law are the biggest law breakers themselves, if people dont want to see that, then thats their choice, I just know what mine is and I would rather be locked up standing up for myself than bend over and spend a lifetime working like a slave.

Guy:Incognito

TireeTerror wrote: »

I get on great doing it, been doing it for years. Never been stopped ever. I couldn't care less, they would have to physically shoot me before I would let them take my property.

There isnt much point in these debates right enough, because the reality is that most people are blind to the truth, they dont even want to see it, you get by, it could be worse. That is the mentality that allows the few to control the many. Its a pathetic weakness in the human race. Like the Jews walking into the gas chambers, thousands of them, shuffling in, knowing their fate. Bred to comply.

As a creature of this earth, I never chose to participate in society, I never chose to be born, Im just here. Why should I comply just because most people do? If many of you are willing to be coerced into working many hours of your lives just to survive, good luck to you, like a little worker ant in a colony, you will have served your purpose. A small ant, insignificant, just one of many carrying out the duty to their Queen.

I suppose Im glad most do comply, because its all your tax that pays for infrastructure that I can use for free. So thank you for that. I have not been clamped, but it would last about 2 minutes if I was.

TireeTerror wrote: »

Where am I contradicting myself? I never mentioned being a freeman blah blah, Im literally just saying I couldnt care less for the current systems in place whereby people are forced to work like slaves to fund the rich. Its morally wrong and I wont be a part of it.

.
Good man not participating in the tax take that builds the infrastructure or anything else or involving yourself in society...........

TireeTerror wrote: »

Im the residential sales manager for Energia in Dublin..

I'm sure they are glad you steal your tv service from sky aswell rather than using the money they pay you to get it legally.

So why is it okay for you to steal what a company owns but it's not on for anyone to take anything from you?

Tiddlypeeps

I don't park like an arse so I have never been clamped and I can't imagine I ever will be.

I still don't agree with clamping even tho it will probably never affect me. If it was regulated properly then that would be one thing, but private clampers are skirting the law at the moment so I have no time for that. If correct legislation was brought in to accommodate this method of deterrent then I'd feel a little better about it.

I have an issue with clamping in general as a solution. If a car is trespassing or blocking access I really can't understand why the best method to address this seems to be to immobilise the car. That just seems completely stupid to me.

To use the example mentioned earlier of stealing from a shop, could you imagine if the solution to this was to detain the person until they paid out a fine? That's not how it works tho and it would be stupid if it were. The guards take the person away and deal with it from there. The same should apply for vehicles that are trespassing. I think the government should run a toe truck service removing the vehicles in question and then placing them at a storage facility where they can be collected by the owner for a fairly hefty fee, covering the cost of running the service.

There should be a solution for people who have someone trespass or block access to their property, but that solution should not be to give pretty much anyone the right to illegally detain someone else's property.

TireeTerror

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

.
Good man not participating in the tax take that builds the infrastructure or anything else or involving yourself in society...........


I'm sure they are glad you steal your tv service from sky as well rather than using the money they pay you to get it legally.

If people want to build roads, and infrastructure, then I will use it. I dont mean Im like a recluse, I work the same as most people because I want to have things and enjoy life, but I will do it by contributing as little as possible.

I'm not stealing Sky either, I think you need to read up some more on the legal definition of theft.

As for work, Im a self-employed contractor who has many roles, in a few different countries. So contributions are easy enough to minimise, minimise to the point of having none other than when paying VAT on transactions.

Guy:Incognito

TireeTerror wrote: »

If people want to build roads, and infrastructure, then I will use it. I dont mean Im like a recluse, I work the same as most people because I want to have things and enjoy life, but I will do it by contributing as little as possible.

I'm not stealing Sky either, I think you need to read up some more on the legal definition of theft.

As for work, Im a self-employed contractor who has many roles, in a few different countries. So contributions are easy enough to minimise, minimise to the point of having none other than when paying VAT on transactions.

You are required to pay for sky TV. Not paying and watching anyway is theft of service.

TireeTerror

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

You are required to pay for sky TV. Not paying and watching anyway is theft of service.

Youre meant to pay for a TV licence too......

Guy:Incognito

Tiddlypeeps wrote: »

I don't park like an arse so I have never been clamped and I can't imagine I ever will be.

I still don't agree with clamping even tho it will probably never affect me. If it was regulated properly then that would be one thing, but private clampers are skirting the law at the moment so I have no time for that. If correct legislation was brought in to accommodate this method of deterrent then I'd feel a little better about it.

I have an issue with clamping in general as a solution. If a car is trespassing or blocking access I really can't understand why the best method to address this seems to be to immobilise the car. That just seems completely stupid to me.

To use the example mentioned earlier of stealing from a shop, could you imagine if the solution to this was to detain the person until they paid out a fine? That's not how it works tho and it would be stupid if it were. The guards take the person away and deal with it from there. The same should apply for vehicles that are trespassing. I think the government should run a toe truck service removing the vehicles in question and then placing them at a storage facility where they can be collected by the owner for a fairly hefty fee, covering the cost of running the service.

There should be a solution for people who have someone trespass or block access to their property, but that solution should not be to give pretty much anyone the right to illegally detain someone else's property.

How many extra gardai would be needed to call out to every case where a person has overstayed or not paid for parking? Then after that how many extra court hours would be needed ?

you'd still need to detain the person till the gards arrived. Considering plenty of people are waiting hours for them to arrive after a break in how long would you be happy to be detained for and then hauled down to the garda station over a parking ticket?

Guy:Incognito

TireeTerror wrote: »

Youre meant to pay for a TV licence too......

Yes. Presumably you don't do that either cos your such the rebel.

sure someone as cool as you probably doesn't tax or insure their car either. Duck whoever you crash in to they can pay to fix their own car.

Tiddlypeeps

TireeTerror wrote: »

If people want to build roads, and infrastructure, then I will use it. I dont mean Im like a recluse, I work the same as most people because I want to have things and enjoy life, but I will do it by contributing as little as possible.

I'm not stealing Sky either, I think you need to read up some more on the legal definition of theft.

As for work, Im a self-employed contractor who has many roles, in a few different countries. So contributions are easy enough to minimise, minimise to the point of having none other than when paying VAT on transactions.

All I'm reading from all your posts is that you want access to everything but want to contribute nothing, using very skewed logic to try and convince yourself that you are not just acting selfishly.

If you want to gain from the system then you need to contribute to the system. You might get away with a few opportunities to stick it to the man but your obligation to contribute to the system in most cases is not optional unless you want to end up in prison.

You say you won't allow them to take "your property" away from you, yet without the system there is no concept of ownership, there is only possession and that is only good for as long as you can manage to maintain that possession.

If you have that much of a problem with the system there are still places in the world that you can go and live a nomadic lifestyle free of state influence. I can't imagine the lifestyle in these places will be quite as cushy as you have it here tho so I imagine you will continue to stay put taking advantage of the system, mostly playing by the rules and contributing to the system all the while spouting rubbish on the internet about how you stick it to the man.

TireeTerror

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

Yes. Presumably you don't do that either cos your such the rebel.

Not because Im a rebel, because I dont want to pay for it. I dont watch RTE or any Irish channel for that matter. If RTE cant fund itself by the fee forced upon people, then its not commercially viable and should be scrapped. To imprison people for not buying a tv licence, to watch crap tv, with crap presenters while also having the audacity to subject them to commercial breaks is embarrassing. How on earth people dont have the strength to stand up to these criminals is beyond me. I personally have no interest in starting a revolution, Ive better things to be doing with my time, but at least I wont pay for it, and I never ever ever will.

TireeTerror

Tiddlypeeps wrote: »

All I'm reading from all your posts is that you want access to everything but want to contribute nothing, using very skewed logic to try and convince yourself that you are not just acting selfishly.

If you want to gain from the system then you need to contribute to the system. You might get away with a few opportunities to stick it to the man but your obligation to contribute to the system in most cases is not optional unless you want to end up in prison.

You say you won't allow them to take "your property" away from you, yet without the system there is no concept of ownership, there is only possession and that is only good for as long as you can manage to maintain that possession.

If you have that much of a problem with the system there are still places in the world that you can go and live a nomadic lifestyle free of state influence. I can't imagine the lifestyle in these places will be quite as cushy as you have it here tho so I imagine you will continue to stay put taking advantage of the system, mostly playing by the rules and contributing to the system all the while spouting rubbish on the internet about how you stick it to the man.

The only thing I contribute is VAT on purchases, I contribute nothing else. If I knew an easy way to avoid paying the VAT in general shops, I would do that too. I have put loads of things though various friends companies to not pay VAT, but that was for bigger items when it was worth the hassle. For food shopping etc, I stump up like everyone else.

Tiddlypeeps

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

How many extra gardai would be needed to call out to every case where a person has overstayed or not paid for parking? Then after that how many extra court hours would be needed ?

you'd still need to detain the person till the gards arrived. Considering plenty of people are waiting hours for them to arrive after a break in how long would you be happy to be detained for and then hauled down to the garda station over a parking ticket?

You'd only need a couple per county council area. They don't even need to be gardai, just trained and regulated and run by the state. They wouldn't get to every single incident on time but they would be a pretty good deterrent because the release fee would be quite high.

Why would the person need to be detained? It's only the car that is the issue and the owner is usually not around so it can just be towed off.

There might be a better solution than towing, but it doesn't change the fact that clamping is a bloody awful solution to the issue.

Cedrus

I think the anti clamping posters in this thread are proof positive that dublin is not a city of any international worth. You're all just boggers despite your self opinion.
Lash it up the haggart nora.

Guy:Incognito

Tiddlypeeps wrote: »

There might be a better solution than towing, but it doesn't change the fact that clamping is a bloody awful solution to the issue.

How? its the perfect solution. Having to have a massive impound (loads of them in reality) ends up costing much more and takes much longer for each case to be sorted.
For the most part we are talking about small short term rental of a parking space ( a couple of hours) to involve the Gardaí or treating it like shoplifters is overcomplicating a system that can be sorted out quickly and easily between the user, the landowner and a properly regulated clamping company.


Instead of moaning about landowners ensuring their property is used the way they want it to be , perhaps people should be lobbying the government to regulate clamping.

TireeTerror

Why do you have to pay for the parking anyway? I dont mean private car parks, I mean to park in a street, that was funded by revenue raised through motorists. If the space is available, then you should be able to park there without fee provided you are not causing an obstruction.

Where does the money go to and what is it used for?

Guy:Incognito

TireeTerror wrote: »

Not because Im a rebel, because I dont want to pay for it. I dont watch RTE or any Irish channel for that matter. If RTE cant fund itself by the fee forced upon people, then its not commercially viable and should be scrapped. To imprison people for not buying a tv licence, to watch crap tv, with crap presenters while also having the audacity to subject them to commercial breaks is embarrassing. How on earth people dont have the strength to stand up to these criminals is beyond me. I personally have no interest in starting a revolution, Ive better things to be doing with my time, but at least I wont pay for it, and I never ever ever will.

Nobody is imprisoned for not paying their tv licence. They are imprisoned for defying court orders by not paying fines. that has been done to death and doesn't need doing here. You get to the point with some people where continually issueing them fines to not pay is pointless.

Tiddlypeeps

TireeTerror wrote: »

The only thing I contribute is VAT on purchases, I contribute nothing else. If I knew an easy way to avoid paying the VAT in general shops, I would do that too. I have put loads of things though various friends companies to not pay VAT, but that was for bigger items when it was worth the hassle. For food shopping etc, I stump up like everyone else.

I assume you are on the dole so?

Why pay for anything at all so, why not just take it?

You selfishness has just been solidified for me if you are willing to risk getting a friend in trouble just to avoid paying a few quid. If they are audited they will be in considerable trouble because of you. It's just as much their own fault for doing it for you, but it's pretty selfish to ask them to put themselves in that position in the first place. You sound like a good friend....

You ignored the point I made about moving to somewhere you can live a nomadic lifestyle free of state influence. Why don't you do this?

TireeTerror

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

Nobody is imprisoned for not paying their tv licence. They are imprisoned for defying court orders by not paying fines. that has been done to death and doesn't need doing here. You get to the point with some people where continually issueing them fines to not pay is pointless.

Fair enough its probably been covered before. Regardless of how you want to try and explain it, as a result of not paying for a tv licence you face imprisonment. Its disgusting.

Anyway, Im bowing out for now, Rangers are playing in the Scottish Cup live on Sky Sports 1 HD, Im away to watch it at a bargain price!!!

Guy:Incognito

TireeTerror wrote: »

Why do you have to pay for the parking anyway? I dont mean private car parks, I mean to park in a street, that was funded by revenue raised through motorists. If the space is available, then you should be able to park there without fee provided you are not causing an obstruction.

Because people take the piss and theres never parking for the people that the businesses need to survive. All the workers will take up the spaces during the trading hours. Parking near where you live is also helpful for people..

It would be helpful if you could post your address if you have a driveway btw. Seeing as its wrong to own land I'm sure there's a few commuters that might like to make use of that driveway while they bus or walk to work.

If your renting , why are you doing that? Why not just squat in it for free instead or build a shack in the corner of the garden?

Guy:Incognito

TireeTerror wrote: »

Fair enough its probably been covered before. Regardless of how you want to try and explain it, as a result of not paying for a tv licence you face imprisonment. Its disgusting.

Its not disgusting. It's sorting out arseholes that think laws dont apply to them.

Tiddlypeeps

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

How? its the perfect solution. Having to have a massive impound (loads of them in reality) ends up costing much more and takes much longer for each case to be sorted.
For the most part we are talking about small short term rental of a parking space ( a couple of hours) to involve the Gardaí or treating it like shoplifters is overcomplicating a system that can be sorted out quickly and easily between the user, the landowner and a properly regulated clamping company.


Instead of moaning about landowners ensuring their property is used the way they want it to be , perhaps people should be lobbying the government to regulate clamping.

It works in the US. You don't need that many lots, Ireland is not that big.

The issue that needs to be solved is that private property owners need a way to remove vehicles that are trespassing or blocking access. Clamping does not solve this issue so it is in no way a perfect solution.

It is the property owners that have the issue, so the onus is on them to lobby the government to come up with a solution to the issue, whatever that may be. At the moment private clamping operations are illegal, so for as long as this continues people will continue to remove the illegal clamps themselves, it's quite possible to do this without breaking any laws.

As I said already I haven't been clamped and probably never will be. But if I was I would have no problem removing the clamp myself, I wont' pay into a system that is operating illegally even if I have myself done wrong. Two wrongs do not make a right. If private property owners are having big problems with this then they need to petition the government to solve the problem, continuing to operate illegal services is not going to fix the issue.

Amirani

TireeTerror wrote: »

I never said I couldnt own anything, if I buy something its mine.

You said people shouldn't be able to own land. How do you reconcile that?