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Off-record transaction on property purchase

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  • 12-03-2014 10:29pm
    #1
    tmg52
    Registered Users Posts: 26 ✭


    I am looking to buy a property and the seller is asking for the sale price to be under valued by 40,000 giving a declared sale price of 200,000, this goes back to the defaulting mortage bank. The remaining amount is pocketed by the seller.
    I am not inclined to do any under the table deals without legal ties as I would need the mortage bank to confirm that the Mortage on the property was lifted. There is a tax dodge for both the seller and the buyer but I am concerned on the legal risk.
    Has anybody done this arrangement on a purchase. I am told by my solicitor that this is becomming more common. All advice welcome.


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    #2
    johnnyskeleton
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 14,505 Mod ✭✭✭✭johnnyskeleton


    Don't get involved in tax evasion/fraud.

    You get no benefit and you potentially go to jail.


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    #3
    Oral Surgeon
    Registered Users Posts: 3,240 ✭✭✭Oral Surgeon


    tmg52 wrote: »
    I am looking to buy a property and the seller is asking for the sale price to be under valued by 40,000 giving a declared sale price of 200,000, this goes back to the defaulting mortage bank. The remaining amount is pocketed by the seller.
    I am not inclined to do any under the table deals without legal ties as I would need the mortage bank to confirm that the Mortage on the property was lifted. There is a tax dodge for both the seller and the buyer but I am concerned on the legal risk.
    Has anybody done this arrangement on a purchase. I am told by my solicitor that this is becomming more common. All advice welcome.

    Walk away, very fast, actually run....


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    #4
    P. Breathnach
    Registered Users Posts: 12,089 ✭✭✭✭P. Breathnach


    tmg52 wrote: »
    ... I am told by my solicitor that this is becomming more common....
    This is the bit that worries me: did your solicitor not also tell you that it is fraudulent, and that you should not consider it?


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    #5
    El_Dangeroso
    Users Awaiting Email Confirmation Posts: 5,620 ✭✭✭El_Dangeroso


    Don't walk away from this. Run.

    There will always be a paper trail that will make it very easy to follow what happened. Presumably you don't have 40K hidden under the mattress, so there will be weird transactions to explain no matter what you do.

    Consider reporting the seller also. I know there's a sense of of not wanting to be a snitch in this country but that's how you end up with corruption on an endemic scale.


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    #6
    hfallada
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,180 ✭✭✭hfallada


    More importantly if the house every becomes an investment property. If you sell it, you are liable for CGT on that €40,000 that wasnt declared. The bank might pull the sale from the seller and sell it themselves. I have heard of people about to sign for a house and the bank decides they now want to sell it.

    OP you have nothing to gain. Tell them no and if they dont agree walk away


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    #7
    The_Conductor
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 32,285 Mod ✭✭✭✭The_Conductor


    tmg52 wrote: »
    I am told by my solicitor that this is becomming more common. All advice welcome.

    My advice?
    Report your solicitor to the Law Society.
    Do not countenance this transaction under any circumstances.


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    #8
    murphaph
    Registered Users Posts: 19,022 ✭✭✭✭murphaph


    The_Conductor wrote: »
    My advice?
    Report your solicitor to the Law Society.
    Do not countenance this transaction under any circumstances.
    ...better report him to Revenue tbh. but agree wholeheartedly that any under declaration of this nature should not even be considered. Perhaps the OP's solicitor did caution of the risks and did advise against, the OP will need to clarify that.


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    #9
    Roger_007
    Registered Users Posts: 21,886 ✭✭✭✭Roger_007


    How are you going to account for the fact that you paid €240k and the vendor apparently only received €200k. Unless you are dealing entirely in cash there will be a paper trail. Your solicitor would also be facilitating a fraudulent transaction. Methinks I would be looking for another solicitor.


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    #10
    touts
    Registered Users Posts: 6,502 ✭✭✭touts


    This is fraud. Report the whole thing to the bank and report the solicitor.

    Then walk away from the house. If this guy is willing to commit fraud to hide the money can you really trust any work he may have done in the house. God only knows what a thin skim of plaster and some superglue might be hiding.


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    #11
    Arbiter of Good Taste
    Registered Users Posts: 2,200 ✭✭✭Arbiter of Good Taste


    Is your solicitor XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX?

    Seriously though, I am shocked that the solicitor did not tell you to run a mile.

    It's guys like this that give solicitors a bad name and unfortunately there are too many him in this country.

    What the seller is suggesting is fraud and tax evasion.


    Edit: The_Conductor - It's not a real solicitor! Have you never seen Breaking Bad? LOL


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    #12
    IrishAngel75
    Registered Users Posts: 4 ✭IrishAngel75


    omg this isnt a new move. this has always been done in ireland. whats the harm.


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    #13
    The_Conductor
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 32,285 Mod ✭✭✭✭The_Conductor


    IrishAngel75 wrote: »
    omg this isnt a new move. this has always been done in ireland. whats the harm.

    Tax evasion.
    Criminal fraud.
    Theft.
    Need I go on?

    Frankly I don't understand why anyone puts up with this sort of crap.
    This sort of 'cute hoor-ism' and parochial politics- where people refuse to see how their actions impacts on every other person in the state- is at least partially responsible for the fact that your children, my children, our grandchildren- will be repaying debts that should never have been ours.


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