Damage to Furniture

wandererz

I got a blinds company in <SNIP> Industrial estate in to measure some blinds 2 days ago.

Their first name reflects upon <SNIP>Their second name reflects upon blinds, which is what they do.

That is rather unfortunate.

After the guy measured, showed me the options, gave me the price and left i noticed 4 pen/ink marks on my white leather couch. The couch is only about 5 weeks old.

I had noticed the guy kneeling on it and i offered to move it, but he said "No, that was ok, and he'd be off it in a moment."

Anyway, i went in to their shop and they called up the owner who said she would speak to the guy and then meet me in 20mins.

She turns up approx 30-40mins later and says that she spoke to the guy, who said that he did no such thing and that i had work being done.

I tried to explain that some of the work had already been done weeks before the couch was delivered, and that the other work was painting (done by me, and no relation to the couch whatsoever...different colours etc). A pen mark is quite distinctive anyway.

All of the above had no bearing to the pen marks which were not there before he turned up.

She went into total lock-down, denial mode.

Would not even entertain looking at my pictures of the problem.

Instead decided to comment on a conversation she had with a manager at homestore on her way over and mention of some famous singer (who i haven't even heard of) and a problem they had.

I stopped her then, told her it had no bearing to my immediate problem at hand. And asked her to look at the problem.

She refused, outright. Stuck to her guns and would not entertain anything.

Her people/company damaged my property.

Now, i can probably get this mended via the insurance coverage i have.

But there was no attempt whatsoever at reconciliation i.e. no offer to get the marks removed, no apology...nothing.

I only wish i had recorded the conversation.

Is this the way that business is conducted these days? No attempt to deal respectfully with problems, no attempt at customer support.

She lost a customer who had the original blinds installed by them 10 years ago, as well as any future business.

Typical example of small two person owned business and lacking in customer empathy.


What do i do now?
How do i get a simple "We apologise, we done wrong".

That's all that should have happened before she went into denial mode.

Onthe3rdDay

wandererz wrote: »

What do i do now?
How do i get a simple "We apologise, we done wrong".

That's all that should have happened before she went into denial mode.

I understand your upset but you'd never get a "We apologise, we done wrong" even if they knew they had done something wrong. It would open them up to all types of claims. Basically in situations where shops might be at fault they're told by insurance companies to admit nothing.

wandererz

Onthe3rdDay wrote: »

I understand your upset but you'd never get a "We apologise, we done wrong" even if they knew they had done something wrong. It would open them up to all types of claims. Basically in situations where shops might be at fault they're told by insurance companies to admit nothing.

Thanks. And of course.
There is no sense of accountability.

My wife couldn't believe it when she arrived back home that evening.

What happens now, do i take them to the small claims court just to get a simple recognition of the fact that this happened after they arrived?

A simple sorry will do. I don't want any money, just accountability.

slimjimmc

It's going to be nigh on impossible to prove the blinds guy marked the sofa though the balance of probability may be in your favour. But before you can go the the SCC you need to exhaust all avenues with the shop and you need be clear on what it is you're seeking from the process, a new sofa?, professional cleaning?

Claiming off your insurance may not be worth it if your excess is high.

If you fancy it, there are a number of DIY methods of cleaning ball-pen ink from leather, test on an inconspicuous area first.
http://www.wikihow.com/Remove-an-Ink-Stain-from-a-Couch
Your wife's hairspray may even work apparently http://www.diynot.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=2716

wandererz

slimjimmc wrote: »

It's going to be nigh on impossible to prove the blinds guy marked the sofa though.
Claiming off your insurance may not be worth it if your excess is high.

If you fancy it, there are a number of DIY methods of cleaning ball-pen ink from leather, test on an inconspicuous area first.
http://www.wikihow.com/Remove-an-Ink-Stain-from-a-Couch
Your wife's hairspray may even work apparently http://www.diynot.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=2716

Thanks slimjimmc,

In fact, I don't care about how to remove the stain, i have a 5 year stain protection warranty which will fix the issue.

The problem is with the shop/owner:
- total non-responsiveness,
- their total lack of help
- would not even look at the images i took.
- totally stood by the word of their employee and not accept that anything could have gone wrong.
- no sorry, no apology, not even an offer to get it cleaned.

<SNIP>

You FAIL!!

And people need to know about your total lack of responsiveness, lest they fall into the same trap.

Cabaal

I'm curious why you'd expect them to offer help to clean it when the say it wasn't them? They'd be idiots to offer to pay to clean it in such a situation

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

You have stain protection cover for just such occasions. You have no proof he did this damage. I'm sure, if he did, then it was an accident. The store can't accept liability because they have no evidence and do not want to leave themselves open to a claim. I don't get what you want from them.

dharma200

A person came in to your house, accidently marked sofa which has stain protection. Not sure what the problem is. There is no proof other than your word, ofcourse shop is not going to admit liability, it would mean they would open the floodgates and every home visit is a potential claim.
Sorry, think what judge Judy would say. Because it seems this is the kind of case on,y her court would hear... Get sofa cleaned, end of....

BabysCoffee

You have no proof that damage was caused by this person (all you have is the actual damaged item)

Get it cleaned. End of.

weisses

Could a company not try to help out without being deemed liable ?

emeldc

I'd be interested to hear how the insurance company will deal with it. I clean suede and leather here and I reckon ball point ink on cream leather will be next to impossible to remove completely. It will need to be resprayed or possibly re-covered. It's as well the suite is quite new as the skin will hopefully be still available.

dudara

@wandererz I removed the name of the company and owner yesterday. Today I've had to clean up a second attempt from you to name the company. Please do not do this again. I do not want the company named.

dudara

wandererz

I understand and i apologize.

It's difficult to understand however when complaints to larger (national/multi-nationsl) companies can be made on this forum, but not something like this to warn other consumers.

skelligs

wandererz wrote: »

I understand and i apologize.

It's difficult to understand however when complaints to larger (national/multi-nationsl) companies can be made on this forum, but not something like this to warn other consumers.

I've read the thread and you have not shown anywhere that you have PROOF that it was damaged by the guy from the blind company.

Do you religiously inspect the couch every single day. Does nobody in your house use pens and also you did not see anyone mark the couch.

But you think you can then "name and shame" them in public?

I think you need to get a basic understanding of libel. This company, if their name was left in the thread, would take you to the cleaners (excuse the pun) for reputational damage as you have zero proof of your claims.

wandererz

skelligs wrote: »

Do you religiously inspect the couch every single day. Does nobody in your house use pens and also you did not see anyone mark the couch.

But you think you can then "name and shame" them in public?

I think you need to get a basic understanding of libel. This company, if their name was left in the thread, would take you to the cleaners (excuse the pun) for reputational damage as you have zero proof of your claims.

Hey, that's a great comment and kudo's to you for the thanks you've received for that comment.

The fact is, this is a couch which was only a few weeks old at the time.
We spent close to 4 thousand euro on it, so yes we take great care not to damage it.

Any marks are quite readily visible, so i'm SURE they weren't there beforehand.

Also, I am the only person in the house who used pens in the timeframe before and after the incident. They were used away from the lounge area.

I don't have kids etc. who could have done the damage either.
And believe you me, none of us is the type of person who willfully takes a ballpoint pen to our own property...no matter how much we may yearn for the yesteryear of our childhoods.

My wife looked at this when she arrived home from work and was as shocked as i was.

So what are you trying to say: her employee damages my property, she refutes all responsibility and then can sue me for libel simply because i don't have the video evidence?? My word and that of my wife counts for nothing??

Keep in mind that:
1) i am not asking for a new suite
2) this can be taken care of by a professional leather restorer

What would you do if this happened to you and the response was total and utter deniability?? What about the fact that the owner in question was not even there on the day...so her opinion does not really count does it?

So perhaps one needs to install video cameras throughout the home now before getting work of any kind done.

Do you do that????
Would you do that?

slimjimmc

You can be sued for libel if a third party hears you say something which you can't prove to be true. While it's highly likely to have happened as you claim the fact is you need proof, neither you nor you wife witnessed the damage being done so you're left with supposition.

Look at it another way (no need to reply, just think about the scenario).
Consider a man knocked on your door claiming Mrs Wanderez dented the door of his brand new Audi A6. He's convinced she did it because he didn't notice the dent before and he saw her car was later parked beside his for a while, however he can't prove she actually caused the damage. What would you do, accept him at his word, apologise and hope he doesn't look for expensive compensation, or would you get the cheque book out or would you deny any responsibility because your wife doesn't recall any incident and he has no real proof (is his word not enough)?
How would you feel if you believe he's wrong but that man went around telling people your wife caused damage and wouldn't apologise?
Be honest.