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NCT passed but car not roadworthy ?

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2

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    #32
    goz83
    Registered Users Posts: 8,034 ✭✭✭goz83


    christy02 wrote: »
    That's rubbish. I myself am selling a car for little over 1k that is in good shape for miles and year.
    It is my family car and am just after a change.

    I always sell and buy my cars privately and "touches wood" have never bought a dud.

    The one dud I did buy was from a dealer and I lowered my gaurd a bit thinking this guy must be selling good cars.

    Plenty of bargains out there, however been realistic the amount of 98 fiestas without rust is fairly small. A bit of research before buying would have told you that.

    I'm scratching my head wondering what you're on about. Your post in essence only serves to validate my point.

    With regards to the post you're quoting; i was responding to another poster who did not mention the fiesta specifically, but rather the price of a car (€1000) causing alarm bells to ring.

    And i am not the op. I didn't buy the fiesta. A bit of research would have told you that.


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    #33
    slimjimmc
    Registered Users Posts: 7,787 ✭✭✭slimjimmc


    christy02 wrote: »
    Also remember op that the seller may not be aware of the rust underneath any more than you were.
    Just because you are selling a car does not mean that you are aware of all its faults.

    How do you know he works at the nct test centre?

    You may not know every fault but ignorance of a dangerous defect does not absolve you of any responsibility for the consequences of selling a dangerously defective car.

    The OP's son should to get a engineer's formal report on the car and if the car is confirmed as dangerous then at the very least he is entitled to his money back or have it repaired at no cost.


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    #34
    christy02
    Registered Users Posts: 656 ✭✭✭christy02


    goz83 wrote: »
    I'm scratching my head wondering what you're on about. Your post in essence only serves to validate my point.

    With regards to the post you're quoting; i was responding to another poster who did not mention the fiesta specifically, but rather the price of a car (€1000) causing alarm bells to ring.

    And i am not the op. I didn't buy the fiesta. A bit of research would have told you that.

    I was agreeing with you. No need to be so smart.

    If I was buying a fiesta of that vintage I would research common problems is all I was saying.


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    #35
    goz83
    Registered Users Posts: 8,034 ✭✭✭goz83


    christy02 wrote: »
    I was agreeing with you. No need to be so smart.

    If I was buying a fiesta of that vintage I would research common problems is all I was saying.

    Hence the head scratching. Your opening line seemed to disagree with my post and it looked like you thought i had bought the fiesta. No harm so:pac:


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    #36
    colm_mcm
    Registered Users Posts: 73,454 ✭✭✭✭colm_mcm


    I'd find it hard to believe an nct tester would tell you they were one if they were selling a car with a dodgy test.


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    #37
    the culture of deference
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,196 ✭✭✭the culture of deference


    Contact NCT head office and explain the situation.

    Get them to arrange for someone to inspect the rust and tell you if it should have passed.

    Get the NCT investigator to go back to where it was NCT tested and see what happens.


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    #38
    colm_mcm
    Registered Users Posts: 73,454 ✭✭✭✭colm_mcm


    Isn't there a good chance that the OP will just end up with a car without NCT then?

    They could just say the rust mightn't have been there before and there's nothing they can do?

    Granted the disc doesn't make the car roadworthy.


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    #39
    goz83
    Registered Users Posts: 8,034 ✭✭✭goz83


    colm_mcm wrote: »
    Isn't there a good chance that the OP will just end up with a car without NCT then?

    They could just say the rust mightn't have been there before and there's nothing they can do?

    Granted the disc doesn't make the car roadworthy.

    They couldn't rescind the current cert, could they?


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    #40
    colm_mcm
    Registered Users Posts: 73,454 ✭✭✭✭colm_mcm


    goz83 wrote: »
    They couldn't rescind the current cert, could they?

    I know they don't do that if you bring in a car for test with remaining test and the car is deemed unsafe to drive


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    #41
    kona
    Registered Users Posts: 7,525 ✭✭✭kona


    People should treat the nct for what it is, another tax. It's not even a road worthiness test


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    #42
    colm_mcm
    Registered Users Posts: 73,454 ✭✭✭✭colm_mcm


    kona wrote: »
    It's not even a road worthiness test

    How is it not a roadworthiness test? Is that not exactly what it is?


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    #43
    Honestcars
    Registered Users Posts: 11 ✭Honestcars


    OP I doubt the Nct cert is genuine, ring the Nct centre in the morning with the car reg, they will verify it. Also i doubt the seller works for the local Nct centre, have you tried to contact him since? Was the log book in his name? My guess is hes a bit of a wheeler dealer, Google his mobile number
    I agree with some of what Stella Virgo is saying, too many people tend to go by an Nct cert to judge the overall condition of a car.
    All the Nct means is that the car is deemed roadworthy by the tester at the time of testing.


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    #44
    goz83
    Registered Users Posts: 8,034 ✭✭✭goz83


    Honestcars wrote: »
    All the Nct means is that the car is deemed roadworthy by the tester at the time of testing.

    ;)


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    #45
    kona
    Registered Users Posts: 7,525 ✭✭✭kona


    colm_mcm wrote: »
    How is it not a roadworthiness test? Is that not exactly what it is?

    A racket tbh, they call it a road worthiness test but there's so much bull**** from them it just makes it look like it a scam.

    Since when is a vin number a road worthiness item for example? ( now I know your going to say prevents ringing, BUT I wouldn't class it as road worthiness tbh)
    Another is two cars pass the same test on the same day, one gets 6 months the other 2 years.
    Another is the op example.
    Pre 80 doesn't need it , 80- +10 years is a year, under ten is two years. Why does the same test have different lengths of validity?

    Then another is if you've a LSD fitted and they lash it on the brake tester and destroy it.

    To be fair it has removed alot of ****e from the road but IMO it leaves alot to be desired.


    Sorry bout the smiley above don't know how it got there!


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    #46
    Guy:Incognito
    Registered Users Posts: 38,247 ✭✭✭✭Guy:Incognito


    kona wrote: »

    Since when is a vin number a road worthiness item for example? ( now I know your going to say prevents ringing, BUT I wouldn't class it as road worthiness tbh).

    So what?, never bother checking Vin numbers on cars? Let people ring cars, swap plates and do as they please? If your sold a car that's a cut and shut then a vin most definitely becomes a roadworthiness item.

    The NCT is the handiest place to have various things checked while they are in for a test. a car that's in order is never going to fail on a Vin number issue so whats the problem? It makes the most sense. But don't let that get in the way of a good moan.

    Would you rather have to go in for a second test to check all the things you don't think should be done on a roadworthiness test?
    kona wrote: »

    Then another is if you've a LSD fitted and they lash it on the brake tester and destroy it.

    The NCT wrecking your car in error is irrelevant to a rant about it being a tax.


    You seem to just want to give out, but don't have a proper direction for it. A periodic check for cars is a good thing, end of.

    Cars over 10 years getting a one year cert will happen either way, regardless of what younger cars get . Would you rather it was a 1 year cert from the time the car turns 1? I have a feeling that regardless of the make up of it, you'll find something to give out about.


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    #47
    corktina
    Closed Accounts Posts: 17,733 ✭✭✭✭corktina


    your example of one car getting 6 months and another 2 years has an obvious flaw. The guy who got6 months is long overdue for the test . You can do it three months early there's no excuse for doing it 6 months late.(with the exception of a newly registered import)


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    #48
    Kenny Logins
    Registered Users Posts: 9,060 ✭✭✭Kenny Logins


    The reason for checking the VIN is to confirm the car's identity. I thought that was obvious.


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    #49
    kona
    Registered Users Posts: 7,525 ✭✭✭kona


    corktina wrote: »
    your example of one car getting 6 months and another 2 years has an obvious flaw. The guy who got6 months is long overdue for the test . You can do it three months early there's no excuse for doing it 6 months late.(with the exception of a newly registered import)

    That's totally irrelevant in the case of a "test". Both cars should get the same time, also it's to do with your year of registration not how overdue it is.

    Nct is enforced and lack of punished by road traffic acts not the nct themselves.


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    #50
    kona
    Registered Users Posts: 7,525 ✭✭✭kona


    Kenny Logins wrote: »
    The reason for checking the VIN is to confirm the car's identity. I thought that was obvious.

    It is obvious


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    #51
    blackplum123
    Registered Users Posts: 266 ✭✭blackplum123


    aquarius10 wrote: »
    My 20 yr old son bought a 1998 car for €1000 recently through done deal and paid cash. it had just passed the NCT And looked ok. You'd think it would be a Safe bet ?

    He has since put it up on a lift and checked by a mechanic who cannot believe it recently passed an NCT due to the amount of rust & corrosion on the chassis underneath. It will need a lot of work done to pass the next NCT.

    The person who sold the car works in the local NCT centre. Alarm bells ringing in my head !

    Before we phone the seller, have we any comeback ? Is there an ombudsman or what should we do ... I honestly think he has pulled a fast one, advice please

    can I ask what part of the country the car was purchased in. I am in a similar kind situation.

    Regards


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    #52
    Guy:Incognito
    Registered Users Posts: 38,247 ✭✭✭✭Guy:Incognito


    kona wrote: »
    It is obvious

    So whats the issue with them checking the VIN then?


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    #53
    kona
    Registered Users Posts: 7,525 ✭✭✭kona


    Guy:Incognito wrote: »
    So what?, never bother checking Vin numbers on cars? Let people ring cars, swap plates and do as they please? If your sold a car that's a cut and shut then a vin most definitely becomes a roadworthiness item.

    You should check the vin when you are buying the car. They won't issue a "road worthiness " cert IF they cannot either read it or find it or it's wrong.
    VIN isn't a road worthiness item. Bald tyres are for example.
    Guy:Incognito wrote: »
    The NCT is the handiest place to have various things checked while they are in for a test. a car that's in order is never going to fail on a Vin number issue so whats the problem? It makes the most sense. But don't let that get in the way of a good moan.

    Yes it is handy, but you get what you pay for which is a poor inconsistent test.
    Guy:Incognito wrote: »
    Would you rather have to go in for a second test to check all the things you don't think should be done on a roadworthiness test?

    I'd rather not have to go take a "tester " by the hand and do his job for him which I've had to do to get my cert.
    I'd rather they leave a road worthiness test to road worthiness items.
    Guy:Incognito wrote: »
    you seem to just want to give out, but don't have a proper direction for it. A periodic check for cars is a good thing, end of.
    Yes it's a good thing, however it's a **** test that's open to abuse, people should treat nct as a guide it's in no way a indication of road worthiness.

    Guy:Incognito wrote: »
    Cars over 10 years getting a one year cert will happen either way, regardless of what younger cars get . Would you rather it was a 1 year cert from the time the car turns 1? I have a feeling that regardless of the make up of it, you'll find something to give out about.
    Yea I would rather that or every car gets 2 years. Instead of manipulating a "road worthiness" test to force people to buy new cars and support a industry


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    #54
    colm_mcm
    Registered Users Posts: 73,454 ✭✭✭✭colm_mcm


    kona wrote: »
    A racket tbh, they call it a road worthiness test but there's so much bull**** from them it just makes it look like it a scam.

    Since when is a vin number a road worthiness item for example? ( now I know your going to say prevents ringing, BUT I wouldn't class it as road worthiness tbh)
    Another is two cars pass the same test on the same day, one gets 6 months the other 2 years.
    Another is the op example.
    Pre 80 doesn't need it , 80- +10 years is a year, under ten is two years. Why does the same test have different lengths of validity?

    Then another is if you've a LSD fitted and they lash it on the brake tester and destroy it.

    To be fair it has removed alot of ****e from the road but IMO it leaves alot to be desired.


    Sorry bout the smiley above don't know how it got there!

    None of the above makes the NCT a racket. Any test in any civilized country you can mention will have some sort of brake test using rollers - it's not a situation unique to Ireland.

    Re the length of test you get on the day, if you get 6 months test, it means you're either 6 or 18 months late.
    Giving someone who has not kept their test up to date a 2 year cert is effectively rewarding them for putting the test off.


    Re the 4/10 year thing, the logic probably is that owners of brand new cars can afford to maintain them, and will service them and keep them roadworthy.

    Cars over 10 years old are usually worth very little, so there are potentially more bad ones out there, so an annual test keeps them in check. Certainly judging on threads here on boards, a car with a new NCT seems to represent one that has had all its faults fixed, and an NCT date is a deadline to get all the little defects building up for the last year fixed.

    Of course you will also occasionally have people with 10 year old cars who religiously maintain them, and new cars that are abused.

    Checking VIN seems logical to prevent ringing, and prevent the same car being tested many times using number plates from deathtraps of the same model/colour. It also removes any leeway that the tester or customer may have on what exact car was tested on the day.

    Its clear that the NCT isn't 100% perfect! but is still superior to the likes of the UK MOT where a garage does it.

    Fair enough if you don't like the NCT, but your reasons for calling it a racket are a little unlikely.


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    #55
    kona
    Registered Users Posts: 7,525 ✭✭✭kona


    Guy:Incognito wrote: »
    So whats the issue with them checking the VIN then?

    I've a issue with them FAILING a car on it. What's wrong with a advisory?


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    #56
    Guy:Incognito
    Registered Users Posts: 38,247 ✭✭✭✭Guy:Incognito


    kona wrote: »
    I've a issue with them FAILING a car on it. What's wrong with a advisory?

    So if I get your car, that's the same model and colour as mine, stick my plates on it to try get an NCT for my car, which is a ****heap, it should pass?


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    #57
    colm_mcm
    Registered Users Posts: 73,454 ✭✭✭✭colm_mcm


    kona wrote: »
    I've a issue with them FAILING a car on it. What's wrong with a advisory?

    What, they advise you that your car isn't the same as the one in the reg documents?

    I'd imagine that sort of thing IS important and the only way you should get an NCT disc is if your car is the exact one on the ownership docs,


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    #58
    kona
    Registered Users Posts: 7,525 ✭✭✭kona


    Guy:Incognito wrote: »
    So if I get your car, that's the same model and colour as mine, stick my plates on it to try get an NCT for my car, which is a ****heap, it should pass?

    I take it you've swapped the vin plates, engine numbers and possibly glass over too?

    A stamp is a stamp too nothing a hour with filler , paint and a hammer And stamps wouldn't solve.


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    #59
    slimjimmc
    Registered Users Posts: 7,787 ✭✭✭slimjimmc


    goz83 wrote: »
    They couldn't rescind the current cert, could they?
    They can rescind if the cert should not have been issued in the first place.

    kona wrote: »
    That's totally irrelevant in the case of a "test". Both cars should get the same time, also it's to do with your year of registration not how overdue it is.

    Nct is enforced and lack of punished by road traffic acts not the nct themselves.

    There is specific NCT legislation which specifies how and when certs are issued and expire. NCTS just follow the law, they have no say in the expiry date.


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    #60
    Guy:Incognito
    Registered Users Posts: 38,247 ✭✭✭✭Guy:Incognito


    kona wrote: »
    I take it you've swapped the vin plates, engine numbers and possibly glass over too?

    Why? Sure itd only be an advisory under your system. Sure I could just grind them off altogether.


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    #61
    kona
    Registered Users Posts: 7,525 ✭✭✭kona


    Guy:Incognito wrote: »
    Why? Sure itd only be an advisory under your system. Sure I could just grind them off altogether.

    So you would fail a car presented for a road worthiness test with the engine number vin plate , etched glass all matching docs but you couldn't find the chassis stamp?


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