Defying the laws of nutrition

Voodoomelon

Hey all.
I've been into fitness and nutrition for the last six years or so and know a good deal on both topics.

But my current concern is for a friend who I see periodically and is defying a lot of what I know about the above. He's early thirties, about 6' 2" and currently weighs 11.5 stone. This man, in my eyes, has something of a compulsive personality and often has the blinkers on when it comes to other people giving him advice. He has a one track mind with an end goal and he has to see it through.

He's gotten it in his head that he needs to be as thin as possible. He sees everyone he's surrounded by as being "fat" and abhors the average persons look and diet. He wants to be as skinny as possible, and boy do I mean skinny. Even based upon the figures I've given above, you can imagine he is already well below his ideal weight.

What sparked me to write this thread is based on what he told me at the weekend. His dietary intake during the working week consists of waking up and going to work with no breakfast. He eats nothing until 6.30pm apart from two apples. For dinner he eats (no lie) 1.5 onions fried in a pan along with a can of tomatoes and a can of tuna.

He eats NOTHING ELSE for the rest of the day and eats the same thing EVERY day. Now get this. He goes to the gym straight after and does at least an hour on the crosstrainer, at high intensity, exceeding 1000 calories on the readout. Now I know these are only an indicator, but still. This is Monday to Friday.

He claims that he is absolutely not affected by this at work or in his daily life, he functions perfectly, is not tired and leads a normal life. He is exhilarated that he is operating for the last 6 months or more on a calorie neutral, and often calorie deficient diet. Defying daily calorie guildlines seems to be spurring him on.

The only variance to the above is on the weekend, when he will have a takeaway and a pile of pints on one night.

I've argued that he is running on fumes and can only be depleting muscle and what virtually non existent fat he has remaining to make up his deficits. He can only be damaging his health long term if he continues.

Am I wrong? What can I say to help him out? Or am I interfering with something that is none of my concern/of little concern?

His goal by the way is to be another 0.5-1 stone lighter.

Transform

Voodoomelon wrote: »

Hey all.
I've been into fitness and nutrition for the last six years or so and know a good deal on both topics.

But my current concern is for a friend who I see periodically and is defying a lot of what I know about the above. He's early thirties, about 6' 2" and currently weighs 11.5 stone. This man, in my eyes, has something of a compulsive personality and often has the blinkers on when it comes to other people giving him advice. He has a one track mind with an end goal and he has to see it through.

He's gotten it in his head that he needs to be as thin as possible. He sees everyone he's surrounded by as being "fat" and abhors the average persons look and diet. He wants to be as skinny as possible, and boy do I mean skinny. Even based upon the figures I've given above, you can imagine he is already well below his ideal weight.

What sparked me to write this thread is based on what he told me at the weekend. His dietary intake during the working week consists of waking up and going to work with no breakfast. He eats nothing until 6.30pm apart from two apples. For dinner he eats (no lie) 1.5 onions fried in a pan along with a can of tomatoes and a can of tuna.

He eats NOTHING ELSE for the rest of the day and eats the same thing EVERY day. Now get this. He goes to the gym straight after and does at least an hour on the crosstrainer, at high intensity, exceeding 1000 calories on the readout. Now I know these are only an indicator, but still. This is Monday to Friday.

He claims that he is absolutely not affected by this at work or in his daily life, he functions perfectly, is not tired and leads a normal life. He is exhilarated that he is operating for the last 6 months or more on a calorie neutral, and often calorie deficient diet. Defying daily calorie guildlines seems to be spurring him on.

The only variance to the above is on the weekend, when he will have a takeaway and a pile of pints on one night.

I've argued that he is running on fumes and can only be depleting muscle and what virtually non existent fat he has remaining to make up his deficits. He can only be damaging his health long term if he continues.

Am I wrong? What can I say to help him out? Or am I interfering with something that is none of my concern/of little concern?

His goal by the way is to be another 0.5-1 stone lighter.

i used to see guys and more often women like this when i worked and trained in commercial gyms years ago.

No talking to them and strangly so compulsive they -

A) wore the EXACT same clothes for their 'workouts' every single session, for years!

they looked sick and tired all the time

C) their 'workout' consisted of the very exercises that they needed the least i.e. hours of cross trainer/bike/treadmill and what sticks in my mind is a girl in weestwood in sandymount on a revolving stairs EVERY time i was there and still on it after my own workout

D) people can do amazing things through pig headed willpower.

IMO there is not much you can do and from my experience most people like that need help from someone external to their friends and family to point out the errors in their thinking.

Hope he turns a corner but the reality is its not likely until he crashes first

Alf Veedersane

You're right to be worried. He clearly has an issue. There's something there that's causing him to pick out all these people he sees as being fat and wanting to lose more weight despite being underweight.

Yes he can function when he's getting so few calories on board and going to the gym but while he might feel fine he's almost certainly doing damage to himself.

The problem is, unless he gets a wake-up call he's not going to do anything about it because he doesn't think there's a problem.

2xj3hplqgsbkym

This has nothing to do with nutrition. He needs medical help, he has an eating disorder. You can only be there for him if he needs you.

bbam

The guy has an eating disorder or body image disorder.
And it's not unusual for people with such issues to lie to others about their food intake. Often reporting what they wish they were eating.
Not much you can do. Let him know your there to talk at any time and wait for the train wreck to arrive as it will some day.

Greenmachine

OP has your work friend already lost alot of weight. While he is not currently underweight, if he continues to lose weight, he will veer closer to becoming underweight. People are not always honest about exactly what they eat, even to themselves without making a food diary.

Alf Veedersane

The bigger problem is the mental one.

Alf. A. Male

Voodoomelon wrote: »

Am I wrong?

No, you're almost certainly right about how unhealthy it is.

Voodoomelon wrote: »

What can I say to help him out?

I'm guessing that you and others have already said it plenty, so there's little point in wasting your time talking to someone who's not listening.

Voodoomelon wrote: »

Or am I interfering with something that is none of my concern/of little concern?

You're not interfering, you're attempting to influence, big difference. Almost certainly a waste of time though.

oscar_mike

When he starts to feel the effects of organ failure he might start listening to you

runawaybishop

Voodoomelon wrote: »

He claims that he is absolutely not affected by this at work or in his daily life, he functions perfectly, is not tired and leads a normal life. He is exhilarated that he is operating for the last 6 months or more on a calorie neutral, and often calorie deficient diet. Defying daily calorie guildlines seems to be spurring him on.

Sounds exactly like the young anorexic girl on the Ray Darcy show when she was discussing her overtraining and undereating. She said she felt great all the time, yet her athletic performance had gone to crap (understandably).

What exactly have you said to him - have you mentioned anything about a potential eating disorder.


edit: Heres the podcast of the show, the girl i was referring to was the first guest - http://player.todayfm.com/Anorexia-Panel-

Voodoomelon

Everyone above is correct, I too believe he has an eating disorder and has a very unhealthy view of what is actually healthy.

I agree with a poster above that he might be secretly snacking somewhere in the day as I'm really not sure how he could still be standing.

I'll talk more to him and see how things go, thanks folks.

Mellor

What did he weigh 6 months ago?

rubadub

Voodoomelon wrote: »

He goes to the gym straight after and does at least an hour on the crosstrainer, at high intensity, exceeding 1000 calories on the readout. Now I know these are only an indicator, but still.

These estimates are almost always overestimated. This makes sense since the manufacturers want to cheat you into thinking their machine is very good. Just like some restaurants & takeaways are now quoting stupidly low figures for their dishes, to attract people in.

MugMugs

Jazmin Unimportant Goalkeeper wrote: »

This has nothing to do with nutrition. He needs medical help, he has an eating disorder. You can only be there for him if he needs you.

This just sums it up perfectly.

Voodoomelon wrote: »

I agree with a poster above that he might be secretly snacking somewhere in the day as I'm really not sure how he could still be standing.

He may well not be.

He could be just whittling down until something snaps and he keels over or worse.

thegreatiam

Voodoomelon wrote: »

Hey all.
I've been into fitness and nutrition for the last six years or so and know a good deal on both topics.

But my current concern is for a friend who I see periodically and is defying a lot of what I know about the above. He's early thirties, about 6' 2" and currently weighs 11.5 stone. This man, in my eyes, has something of a compulsive personality and often has the blinkers on when it comes to other people giving him advice. He has a one track mind with an end goal and he has to see it through.

He's gotten it in his head that he needs to be as thin as possible. He sees everyone he's surrounded by as being "fat" and abhors the average persons look and diet. He wants to be as skinny as possible, and boy do I mean skinny. Even based upon the figures I've given above, you can imagine he is already well below his ideal weight.

What sparked me to write this thread is based on what he told me at the weekend. His dietary intake during the working week consists of waking up and going to work with no breakfast. He eats nothing until 6.30pm apart from two apples. For dinner he eats (no lie) 1.5 onions fried in a pan along with a can of tomatoes and a can of tuna.

He eats NOTHING ELSE for the rest of the day and eats the same thing EVERY day. Now get this. He goes to the gym straight after and does at least an hour on the crosstrainer, at high intensity, exceeding 1000 calories on the readout. Now I know these are only an indicator, but still. This is Monday to Friday.

He claims that he is absolutely not affected by this at work or in his daily life, he functions perfectly, is not tired and leads a normal life. He is exhilarated that he is operating for the last 6 months or more on a calorie neutral, and often calorie deficient diet. Defying daily calorie guildlines seems to be spurring him on.

The only variance to the above is on the weekend, when he will have a takeaway and a pile of pints on one night.

I've argued that he is running on fumes and can only be depleting muscle and what virtually non existent fat he has remaining to make up his deficits. He can only be damaging his health long term if he continues.

Am I wrong? What can I say to help him out? Or am I interfering with something that is none of my concern/of little concern?

His goal by the way is to be another 0.5-1 stone lighter.

tbh i see this as a lot of speculation, you can only guess to what he is doing behind closed doors.

The numbers on the machine mean nothing, he isnt burning 1000 calories in a session.

You have no way of telling what he actually eats.

Sure its nice to worry, but unless he is actually showing signs of poor health it is not really any of your concern.

By all means make your self available to him by being approachable and involved in his life, but dont directly interfere because yo uthink he is being unhealthy.

watch from aa distance and kkeep an eye on dramatic signs of poor health, massive rapid weight loss, sickness, passing out, extreme lack of energy. You say his work is not affected and he feels good, youll just have to take his word for it ntil something happens to contradict this.

be a friend not a busybody, maybe suggest activities to do with a group of friends, a camping trip or something for a week or so. Go out for a meal with him, see how he handles regular food. Head to somewhere with a limited menu like aussie BBQ and watch to see how he handles tucking into a thick burger or plate of meat.

if you want to help him then do it by guiding and influencing him, not by interfering or pressuring him.

If I had a friend who said they were worried about me in the way you have addressed they'd be told to get ****ed and mind their own.

in a situation where someone is single minded they are constantly fighting with their own doubts and are more than capable of ignoring your doubts too.
You cant break that sort of defence with a direct approach, you have to be more subtle. Leave him to his own devices as long as his health remains good, he will eventually realise that his method isnt valid and look elsewhere. When he does you need to be there with the correct information. If you try to break his determination now then he will simply ignore you and you wont be in a position to help him when he is ready.