Xbox One General Discussion - Part 2 (Please Read 1st Post)

NORTH1

pleasant Co. wrote: »

What system is being exploited? The store MS has put in place is being used as it has been designed to be used so you're surely not referring to that system.
Is it the traditional, localised, physical copy distribution system that you feel is being "exploited" in some way?

I'm sure there are regional reasons for the price differences, that question needs to be put to Microsoft. As Failsafe pointed out there are local import taxes and vat. And as Failsafe also pointed out, the Microsoft exec didn't seem to have an issue with its subscribers trying to avoid this payment.

But it does seem to fuel the chancer mentality.

runawaybishop

Benzino wrote: »

At the end of the day, MS get the money so it's no big deal to them. I think they are happy to let it happen, as it is encouraging digital purchases from their store, which is what they want. Now if/when digital purchases are the main or only method of purchasing games, then they might start clamping down on it.

As mentioned above, people have been doing this for all sorts of services for years without any issues.

People have been banned from xbl for life for this previously and/or access to content removed. That was before the announcement of region free gaming though.

calex71

If microsoft was really concerned they would lock it down, no doubt about it, and they can do it , the same thing was possible on the 360 but there were things you absolutely could not buy by simply changing region of the console or account, one that comes to mind is Jurassic Park that was 100% region locked and required a VPN/ US DNS and IP Range to buy.

NORTH1

Myrddin wrote: »

Can't the same thing be done using Sony US accounts? People evade geo restrictions all the time from Netflix, to PSN, to XBL, to cheap PC cd key sites etc...it doesn't seem that big of a deal?

I don't know anything about Sony accounts. Netflix regional avoidance is a copy rights issue, and they have bigger fish to fry at the moment.

The digital copies or software might be the reason they are not to concerned about the tax implications?

As I said above it's a risk I would not be happy taking with a 500 euro plus piece of equipment, just to save a couple of euro, not with Microsoft anyway.

Stone Deaf 4evr

The fact that you can buy games which are region free from the store, but not movies,says it all really. it'd be as simple as anything for them to close this loophole, but for whatever reason they're deliberately overlooking it.

NORTH1

calex71 wrote: »

If microsoft was really concerned they would lock it down, no doubt about it, and they can do it , the same thing was possible on the 360 but there were things you absolutely could not buy by simply changing region of the console or account, one that comes to mind is Jurassic Park that was 100% region locked and required a VPN/ US DNS and IP Range to buy.

So they don't, and you take this as there acceptance?

If they want region free gaming, why not have one store? Surely that would be easier? What are the restrictions they won't get rid of? But have no issue with the consumer circumventing them.

pleasant Co.

NORTH1 wrote: »

I'm sure there are regional reasons for the price differences, that question needs to be put to Microsoft. As Failsafe pointed out there are local import taxes and vat. And as Failsafe also pointed out, the Microsoft exec didn't seem to have an issue with its subscribers trying to avoid this payment.

But it does seem to fuel the chancer mentality.

That doesn't clearly answer the question I asked you but it does imply that you feel that the VAT system is the one being exploited, that's not clear though because this is the first time you've mentioned it.
If that's not the system that you feel is being exploited maybe you could be much clearer about what system you do feel is being exploited?

recyclops

in all honesty the loophole will be of benefit to the companies too

digital downloads can in essence take a large chunk out of gamestops second hand sales

i would much rather buy a game for 44 as a digital download than go to gamestop and pay 30 for second hand

thats just me of course

NORTH1

pleasant Co. wrote: »

That doesn't clearly answer the question I asked you but it does imply that you feel that the VAT system is the one being exploited, that's not clear though because this is the first time you've mentioned it.
If that's not the system that you feel is being exploited maybe you could be much clearer about what system you do feel is being exploited?

Sorry, I thought it was obvious, of course it's Microsoft's systems that are been exploited. Their transaction systems. By pretending to be somewhere you are not, into fooling the transaction system into giving you a cheaper product them you would had payed if you had not exploited the system in the first place.

Microsoft have a history of letting things run for a bit before they swinging the ban hammer.

Anyway it's all over my head, I just wouldn't feel safe doing it.

pleasant Co.

Stone Deaf 4evr wrote: »

The fact that you can buy games which are region free from the store, but not movies,says it all really. it'd be as simple as anything for them to close this loophole, but for whatever reason they're deliberately overlooking it.

It says/implies that there are rights issues with movies that don't exist with videogames, possibly due to Microsoft being the console manufacturer for which videogames are being made and having the only store from which downloadable xbox games can be bought, giving them a much stronger hand in regards to how they chose to distribute those games.

Benzino

runawaybishop wrote: »

People have been banned from xbl for life for this previously and/or access to content removed. That was before the announcement of region free gaming though.

Were they not banned for switching their region to get certain games free? I don't think anybody has been banned for purchasing games from another reason.

miju

NORTH1 wrote: »

Without a doubt they can't let it continue.

But this is fueling the contempt for the rules, we have a whole new bunch of people coming through like with the last console, that now feel Microsoft has given them leeway to see if there is possible to find ways to exploit the system.

I wouldnt say it will stop anytime soon, MS want to encourage digital downloads and purchases and they have freely said this is allowed.

It just got drowned out at the start with all the shouting about DRM management etc

Myrddin wrote: »

Can't the same thing be done using Sony US accounts? People evade geo restrictions all the time from Netflix, to PSN, to XBL, to cheap PC cd key sites etc...it doesn't seem that big of a deal?

I aksed over on another thread apparently they can but the DLC for games is region locked. So you buy Titanfall in US Sony store you can only buy DLC in Ireland and it wont work or something like that.

runawaybishop wrote: »

People have been banned from xbl for life for this previously and/or access to content removed. That was before the announcement of region free gaming though.

MS announced that this policy was to be completely scrapped for XB1, they are well aware of what they are doing and facilitating. I guess they look at it, better they get €40 from me in Ireland rather than me paying €65 odd quid to Gamestop for a physical copy.

miju

NORTH1 wrote: »

So they don't, and you take this as there acceptance?

If they want region free gaming, why not have one store? Surely that would be easier? What are the restrictions they won't get rid of? But have no issue with the consumer circumventing them.

It's do with currency flux and MS essentially losing cash that way. This is why they allow you setup 13 odd difference payment profiles so they dont lose out and the currency cost is passed onto the consumer.

Perfect example when I was getting refunded for BF4 from MS the agent specifically said to me she cannot refund to my US or UK account and only my Irish account as it was in Euro currency that the game was bought and they cannot retroactively convert to a different currency.

So they are fully aware and encouraging it thank fook for being behind sales on the PS4 I guess it will continue for sometime as I'm loving having day 1 console releases for €25 odd and for that price trade in value is a non issue.

Where this is being exploited is that DLC can also be shared as well as games between gamertags.

Benzino

miju wrote: »

I'm loving having day 1 console releases for €25 odd and for that price trade in value is a non issue.

:eek: How much are games on the US store? That's crazy cheap!

miju

Benzino wrote: »

:eek: How much are games on the US store? That's crazy cheap!

Usually work out at between €40 - €50 . If you have someone you can trust you can halve that price again.

On release I got Titanfall and Season pass for a total of €58 which was €7 cheaper than just the game in Gamestop and that was before I found someone up for buddying up.

FAILSAFE 00

Its okay with Microsoft so I am delighted with the great prices

NeoGAF wrote:

Responding to gamers on NeoGAF, Microsoft’s Albert Penello clarified a few points about Xbox One importing. He stressed that all Xbox One games are ‘world-wide signed’ (region-free), and that he console will work anywhere, but cautioned gamers to bear in mind power supplies in different territories.

He added of payment details by country, “You can use one of the 13 digital marketplaces corresponding to our launch markets, assuming you have a valid payment instrument for those countries. Lots of people in Europe specifically travel, move, and visit family.

Game sharing isn't actually an exploit. Its a feature.

Originally it was meant to be share your games with up to 5 Xbox Live members as part of their family plan but then they scrubbed that and made it just one. The idea behind it is if I go to college and access an Xbox One there I can download and play my games. The magic is that any other profile on that console can also play my games.

I can confirm that DLC on Xbox One is not region locked. I bought TitanFall on digital download from the US store and then I used credit from my Irish account to buy the DLC. Worked fine also we got TitanFall a good few days before release here :P

I have actually spent less money on Xbox One games than I ever spent on 360 games and now I get most of them a few days early.

As it stands Microsoft have absolutely no problem with it. Not one gamer has been banned and their director of gaming says it okay.

On the Xbox 360 people were banned for changing the region of their profile to get games that were free only in those markets in a time when all Xbox games both physical and digital were all region locked.

Things have changed. make hay while the sun shines

NORTH1

FAILSAFE 00 wrote: »

Its okay with Microsoft so I am delighted with the great prices



Game sharing isn't actually an exploit. Its a feature.

Originally it was meant to be share your games with up to 5 Xbox Live members as part of their family plan but then they scrubbed that and made it just one. The idea behind it is if I go to college and access an Xbox One there I can download and play my games. The magic is that any other profile on that console can also play my games.

I can confirm that DLC on Xbox One is not region locked. I bought TitanFall on digital download from the US store and then I used credit from my Irish account to buy the DLC. Worked fine also we got TitanFall a good few days before release here :P

I have actually spent less money on Xbox One games than I ever spent on 360 games and now I get most of them a few days early.

As it stands Microsoft have absolutely no problem with it. Not one gamer has been banned and their director of gaming says it okay.

On the Xbox 360 people were banned for changing the region of their profile to get games that were free only in those markets in a time when all Xbox games both physical and digital were all region locked.

Things have changed. make hay while the sun shines

The language used is probably purposely ambiguous. But he does state that it is the consumer that is traveling from Europe that this is suppose to suit. Actual travel not virtual travel. ......

FAILSAFE 00

NORTH1 wrote: »

The language used is probably purposely ambiguous. But he does state that it is the consumer that is traveling from Europe that this is suppose to suit. Actual travel not virtual travel. ......

It appears to be a very clear statement to me. Also it adds weight that in 6 months since the launch of Xbox One not 1 owner has been banned for buying games and content from MS stores located outside each owners local region.

Instructions for buying games on the US store from countries in Europe can be found on popular websites such as Reddit and Neogaf. Where Microsoft have official profiles.

Also on Xbox One some content is restricted such as renting movies from the US region. This tells us that Microsoft can geo-lock anything on the console and they have decided to not geo-lock game purchases.

:cool:

NORTH1

FAILSAFE 00 wrote: »

It appears to be a very clear statement to me. Also it adds weight that in 6 months since the launch of Xbox One not 1 owner has been banned for buying games and content from MS stores located outside each owners local region.

Instructions for buying games on the US store from countries in Europe can be found on popular websites such as Reddit and Neogaf. Where Microsoft have official profiles.

Also on Xbox One some content is restricted such as renting movies from the US region. This tells us that Microsoft can geo-lock anything on the console and they have decided to not geo-lock game purchases.

:cool:

I'm sure that would make for a wonderful press release. I doubt they will ban for anything during the first 12 months. That would be just poor business.......

They use third party Web sites with official profiles? Why not stick it up on the console dash board if it's all above board? Does someone thing think it's not legit?

The movie industry actively protect its copy rights.

Snake Plisken

I suppose if Microsoft wanted to stop people buying from their US store, they could just take awaycthe region change option with an update, I don't see them banning people who have already done this as it would drive more consumers over to ps4 and give the Xbox one more negative press! I for one have bought forza and Wolfenstien via the US store and its a risk I'm willing to take!

FAILSAFE 00

NORTH1 wrote: »

I'm sure that would make for a wonderful press release. I thought they will ban for anything during the first 12 months. That would be just poor business.......

They use third party Web sites with official profiles? Why not stick it up on the console dash board if it's all above board? Does someone thing think it's not legit?

The movie industry actively protect its copy rights.

You'll need to ask Microsoft about their reasons/motivations for releasing statements regarding the purchasing of games from many marketplaces and having profiles on gaming websites.

I simply make hay while the sun shines :cool:

If there is an opportunity to avail of cheaper games I'll take it.

I can understand why Microsoft have no interest in banning Xbox One owners for buying games from the US store. Its just as cheap to order a physical disc of a game from countries like Canada so why punish someone for buying the digital download when you are trying to convert Xbox One owners to buy digital content.

Regardless of which MS store you buy digital games from Microsoft makes more money per game sale than they make from a consumer buying a game at Gamestop and other bricks and mortar shops. They are cutting out the middle men.

miju

NORTH1 wrote: »

The movie industry actively protect its copy rights.

Your confusing the issue completely. In the case of games MS are licensed to sell worldwide so the developers are still getting their cash

fifth

Found this interesting:

Article

The Xbox One went on sale yesterday at retailers worldwide, and GameStop is already seeing a boost in business as a result, according to senior vice president of merchandising Bob Puzon.

"They went on sale in GameStop yesterday; these things started to fly off the shelves," Puzon told GameSpot at E3 today in Los Angeles. "It's a huge win and a huge opportunity for us."

Also, I check in on the Reddit Xbox One board from time to time and post E3 I've noticed a few 'new Xbox owners' posting pictures of their receipts and new Xboxes - plus - I've read about a few people in the US saying that they can't find stock of the titanfall bundle etc. There generally seems to be a renewed interest in the console at the minute.

Paully D

Has there ever been any more said about whether we here in Ireland would get the proper use of the NFL apps like our American counterparts?

Fingleberries

So, has anyone else used the new Official Xbox Feedback site? (http://feedback.xbox.com)

Microsoft use a similar system for Windows Phone 8 to prioritise features based on what people actually want rather than just what they have an idea that might be popular. There's no guarantee that any suggestion will be added, but Microsoft are actually monitoring the input and I have seen them link several suggestions that were for the same suggestion into a single item (making it one item with all the total votes, rather than three or four separate ones with single votes for each).

It's actually quite good and there are some good ideas there and ones that have a lot of votes (e.g. Lower Digital Prices: 9,000+ votes; Backwards Compatibility: 4,500+ votes; Cortana (Digital Assistant) on Xbox: 2,500+ votes).

Of course, I could use this opportunity to plug one of my own suggestions to get RTÉ Player on Xbox One (as it currently has a paltry 5 votes), but that would be wrong to shamelessly self-promote the idea, right?

Although the great thing would be that even if my suggestion ends up with only 5 votes, well, at least Microsoft get the idea that it's not entirely a deal breaker for the system if they don't get around to it.

Lord TSC

Lads, I went to buy something on the store about 30 minutes ago and the store wasn't loading. Hit the console off, tried to turn it back on and now it won't turn on. Instead, it's just flashing the power icon on the machine, blinking on and off slowly.

Think I read it's just that it's downloading some updates but was there an update due today? Or is something bigger wrong?

Teamshadowclan

Teamshadowclan wrote: »

Lads, I went to buy something on the store about 30 minutes ago and the store wasn't loading. Hit the console off, tried to turn it back on and now it won't turn on. Instead, it's just flashing the power icon on the machine, blinking on and off slowly.

Think I read it's just that it's downloading some updates but was there an update due today? Or is something bigger wrong?

A hard reset should sort it out from the sounds of it. Have you unplugged from the power supply?

Lord TSC

No, didn't want to if it was a update...didn't want to interupt it and damage the system...

Teamshadowclan

Teamshadowclan wrote: »

No, didn't want to if it was a update...didn't want to interupt it and damage the system...

As long as it's just downloading then it should be ok. If it's writing to the HDD then be careful.

Take this with a warning, don't want to be the cause of you bricking your system.

Is the Ethernet port flashing at the back of the console? Are you connected to network wired or wireless?

dor83

So the July update will allow you to use voice commands in Ireland, it's not specifically tailored for us but you will be able to select another English speaking country for voice commands while your console is set to Ireland.

Snap Mode for Achievements. As we showed at our E3 Green Carpet event before the show, we’re offering an easier way to track and view your achievements in the moment. With Achievement Snap, you can track your achievement progress in real time without ever leaving the game. You can also ‘Get Help’ on any Achievements you’re struggling with. Xbox will scan the web for you and deliver relevant tips and strategy content right to your TV.
Double-tap to Snap. Double-tap the button on your controller to bring up Snap Center, where you can launch Achievements or any other snap-able app, without leaving your game. Already have an app snapped? Double-tap quickly switches between your game and the snapped app.
Choice of Spoken Language. Folks in New Zealand, Ireland and Austria, with this update in July, will be able to select voice control using the English or German voice models from other countries. And if you’re an expat in an English-speaking country, you, too, can choose any of the other English language models that fit you.
Future Digital Bundles and Compilation Discs. We’re doing some work now so that publishers will have options for great digital bundle and disc compilation offerings in the future. As we test this feature, we’ll be seeing more flexible combinations of game titles and game content.
‘Like’ Game DVR clips. We’re adding the ability to ‘Like’ all your favorite Game DVR clips as well as activity feed items in SmartGlass.