the price of some horses.

monflat

Just been looking through a few websites lately.

There is an awful amount of horses 12 - 19 years old for sale.
The owners are looking for savage money like 2500e for a hacker.
Like come on if you really think in this day and age a person would pay that for a hacker or an aged horse who has a increased possibility of developing joint problems or other health problems .


I know i would not pay it
Would anyone here ??

marley123

A horse that hacks alone & in company that is super safe is worth its weight in gold!! Wouldnt think 12 is that old tbh

monflat wrote: »

Just been looking through a few websites lately.

There is an awful amount of horses 12 - 19 years old for sale.
The owners are looking for savage money like 2500e for a hacker.
Like come on if you really think in this day and age a person would pay that for a hacker or an aged horse who has a increased possibility of developing joint problems or other health problems .


I know i would not pay it
Would anyone here ??

Billiethepup

marley123 wrote: »

A horse that hacks alone & in company that is super safe is worth its weight in gold!! Wouldnt think 12 is that old tbh

+1

I'd pay that and more for a 12 yr old, in fact I have on numerous occasions. Well looked after horses happily hack to 20. I've never quite worked out why everyone wants to ride a 6/7yr old...unless they're an experienced jockey these go wrong time and time again, if I had a euro for every young horse disaster I saw I could retire early.

Buying for amateur/riding club market and/or happy hacker I'd never go younger than 9/10 and certainly 12/13 wouldn't bother me in slightest.

Rips

12 is not old, but 2500k is too rich now for anything much older unless it is proven in a particular discipline, especially when there are such a number of horses.

I suspect, if they are selling, then they are genuinely bombproof, and the owners are probably taking substantially less on the day for a sale.

borrch

I really don't agree Rips. After all you get what you pay for. 12 is still young. My sister bought a 20 yr old horse this year. He's age was reflected in his price, but all the same he has loads of showjumping miles, a few points short of grade A jumping 1.30 tracks. Perfect for her jumping 80cm - 1m. And believe me he does not act his age at all. He has more energy than my 3 yr old horse. My first pony is still going strong (still on the Irish gymkanna pony club team) and he's in his mid twenties.

However, I do believe that horses that have spent most of their life just standing in the field have little or no value.

It costs a lot of money training horses, bringing them to shows etc. It should be reflected in the price of the animal.

monflat

To pay 2500 for a 12 yr old is totally different to paying 2500 for a 19yr old.

Especially something that is only for hacking.
Im talking only about animals suitable for hacking only
Happy hackers not all rounders who can do a bit of everything RC sj or xc

Its a big risk spending 2500 on a 19 yr old horse who can only hack.




Maybe it depends on your area in the country
My friend has a well bred gelding paid 5000 as a 3 yr old
Mainly done hunting hacking every day charity rides beach woods hacking all through summer safe out with lorries tractors etc

He looking for 1500 for him he is safe out brilliant on a drain 12 yrs old

No blemishes
I must tell him to up his price that there are people out there that would pay more !!




So those of you who would pay this money for a horse of 19 YEARS would you be getting x rays and blood tests too ?


Personally i would not purchase an animal over 9 yrs but thats my choice for many reasons.

monflat

marley123 wrote: »

A horse that hacks alone & in company that is super safe is worth its weight in gold!! Wouldnt think 12 is that old tbh

No but do you think 19 is old and 2500 is a bit steep.
Im not talki g about riding club all rounders who do 90- 1m 1m 10
Im just talking about hackers who can go on road through woods .etc etc

Rips

borrch wrote: »

I really don't agree Rips. After all you get what you pay for. 12 is still young. My sister bought a 20 yr old horse this year. He's age was reflected in his price, but all the same he has loads of showjumping miles, a few points short of grade A jumping 1.30 tracks. Perfect for her jumping 80cm - 1m. And believe me he does not act his age at all. He has more energy than my 3 yr old horse. My first pony is still going strong (still on the Irish gymkanna pony club team) and he's in his mid twenties.

However, I do believe that horses that have spent most of their life just standing in the field have little or no value.

It costs a lot of money training horses, bringing them to shows etc. It should be reflected in the price of the animal.

You missed the part where I said 'unless the horse is proven in a particular discipline' then.

Still the market for that type of horse is small. There are very few competitive riders that want a proven schoolmaster, which may be exempt from classes or need to be downgraded. No disrespect to your sister, but where is the enjoyment in jumping around 80cm tracks on a horse that is a proven at 1.30?


Its a bigger market in jumping ponies, because the riders are children, and the horse is only required for 1 -3 years at most.

convert

Rips wrote: »

No disrespect to your sister, but where is the enjoyment in jumping around 80cm tracks on a horse that is a proven at 1.30?

I think you're being exceptionally harsh with that comment, Rips, and, in fairness, is a little over-simplistic. While I don't always agree with novice riders being over-horsed (believe me, I've seen the problems which can arise from that), I don't see why novice adult riders should be treated any differently from novice child riders. There are hundreds of ponies out there who are former grade As and have been downgraded so the children can compete over courses suitable to their standard. Having a school master jump around a course suitable to its rider's standard is far better than over-facing the rider and causing unnecessary problems and, potentially, accidents. Then, as the rider improves, they can move up the ranks with the horse.

Moreover, your comment re. enjoyment is unfair and subjective. For a rider who's starting out, or getting confidence competing, jumping around any course successfully can give enjoyment, and the realisation that they're improving and making progress is exceptionally rewarding.

marley123

Totally agree! My Boy has jumped around much bigger tracks than we are currently jumping - BUT he was bought to get my confidence up over fences so he is doing is job by taking me around what we are jumping at the moment!

convert wrote: »

I think you're being exceptionally harsh with that comment, Rips, and, in fairness, is a little over-simplistic. While I don't always agree with novice riders being over-horsed (believe me, I've seen the problems which can arise from that), I don't see why novice adult riders should be treated any differently from novice child riders. There are hundreds of ponies out there who are former grade As and have been downgraded so the children can compete over courses suitable to their standard. Having a school master jump around a course suitable to its rider's standard is far better than over-facing the rider and causing unnecessary problems and, potentially, accidents. Then, as the rider improves, they can move up the ranks with the horse.

Moreover, your comment re. enjoyment is unfair and subjective. For a rider who's starting out, or getting confidence competing, jumping around any course successfully can give enjoyment, and the realisation that they're improving and making progress is exceptionally rewarding.

paddi22

Rips wrote: »

No disrespect to your sister, but where is the enjoyment in jumping around 80cm tracks on a horse that is a proven at 1.30?

The enjoyment is that someone has a schoolmaster to bring them on. I've seen some people come on leaps and bounds, especially cross country, with older horses who are stepped down a level but know their job inside out.

I'd prefer to see 100 schoolmasters cruising round a course, rather than a novice confusing a young green horse, with neither having a clue what to do.

The horse also benefits by still getting out and about but at a easier level with less wear and tear. One of my horses would be a cracking schoolmaster in a few years. He knows his job, enjoys competitions and days out, and would be bored rigid retired or just hacking.

borrch

Hi Rips, your comment is unfair. Where do you think these 1.30 horses go when they retire? He's 20 yrs old and healthy but realistically his 1.30 days are behind him. Do you not think that the perfect life for these horses is to semi retire going around the smaller tracks? He suits my sister perfectly as she took a break after having a family.

I've seen too many adult novice riders buying inexperienced horses, which does nothing to bring the rider on or give confidence. A lot of adult riders are not confident enough to jump a 1.30 track so does that she should just stay at home since clearly there's no enjoyment jumping around smaller tracks????

But yes €2500 for a 19 yr old happy hacker is steep but not a 12 yr old.

TG1

I have to agree with the other posters here, 2500 for a safe 12 year old doesn't strike me as hugely expensive.

Buying something that is completely genuine is expensive,no matter what you want to do with it. I've known good riding club animals who can do all disciplines and are 12-16 bring in much more than 2500 in the last couple of years and I wouldn't say they were worth less!

As for hackers, many people in the market for these are (at the risk of generalisation...) nervy, and possibly older, and so the idea of safety and confidence in a horse becomes priceless.

That being said genuine horses are rare, and I think the problem is a lot of horses sold are not what they say they are and people end up paying too much for them...

byhookorbycrook

I paid €3,500 for my cob. He has represented Ireland at Pony club level and is a machine out hunting. My days of both are well over due to a disability, but he is worth every penny to me, he backs himself into the mounting block, he can open the gate for me going in and out of the arena (I can't dismount/mount alone and without the block)He waits for me to slither down and once or twice when I couldn't stand, he didn't mind me using his tail as a climbing rope!He is ABSOLUTELY bombproof and switches down to slow mode when I get up but will zip up the gears with someone in full health.

I knew where he came from and his full history, you'd be amazed at the lack of scruples in people even when you tell them you have a disability!

Billiethepup

I paid €3k for my 13year old. He does everything I want, jumps amateurs, goes to every open riding club gig, hunter trials etcetc. I can hack on my own anywhere and he self loads in the horse box and happily ties up at events while I sort myself out as I'm usually flying solo. I have one horse only so I need it to be dependable. I've no interest in producing a youngster as I'm paying for livery so it makes sense to have a horse I can use and have fun on right now!

€3k...honestly I would of paid double.

monflat

Billiethepup wrote: »

I paid €3k for my 13year old. He does everything I want, jumps amateurs, goes to every open riding club gig, hunter trials etcetc. I can hack on my own anywhere and he self loads in the horse box and happily ties up at events while I sort myself out as I'm usually flying solo. I have one horse only so I need it to be dependable. I've no interest in producing a youngster as I'm paying for livery so it makes sense to have a horse I can use and have fun on right now!

Thats great and i know what u are saying
But if you re read my original first post im talking about hackers only
Horses that people only hack out and lookin for 3k for a horse that can only hack ( because it has an injury ) is a bit much.

This thread has gone off topic i was not lookin for peoole who said they paid 3 k for a perfect alrounder i was talkin about hackin horses ones that people try to sell you for 3k and it has a list of injuries as long as your arm

mystika121

OP, I think it depends on what you consider 'hacking out'. If I hack I would be out for 2 hours plus, lots of roadwork, a fair bit of cantering and jumping where I find it. To pay 2.5k for a horse that will do all that is good value, regardless of the age of the horse.

If to you, hacking out is a quarter mile stroll on a country road then yes, a 20 year old horse, with a pre-existing condition/injury that means that is the most he can ever do is expensive.

monflat

mystika121 wrote: »

OP, I think it depends on what you consider 'hacking out'. If I hack I would be out for 2 hours plus, lots of roadwork, a fair bit of cantering and jumping where I find it. To pay 2.5k for a horse that will do all that is good value, regardless of the age of the horse.

If to you, hacking out is a quarter mile stroll on a country road then yes, a 20 year old horse, with a pre-existing condition/injury that means that is the most he can ever do is expensive.

No hackin is no where that "to me" WHAT IM.TRYIN TO SAY hacking means that to those people SELLING those horses.

All horses ive had were ALWAYS completely safe on the roads etc ive put that work into them

What im trying to get acros is there are some people out there selling horses for 2500 and can only do hacking NO JUMPING OR XC if a horse is safe on the road just that i would not pay 2500 for him if i cant jump or compete.
And i surely ME PERSONALLY would not pay
over 1000 for a horse over 16 yrs of age.

When i have a really safe horse again il know where to come then as ye all will offer big money.

Im just amazed at people selling off a horse at 18-20 yrs of age.

Billiethepup

monflat wrote: »

Billiethepup wrote: »

I paid €3k for my 13year old. He does everything I want, jumps amateurs, goes to every open riding club gig, hunter trials etcetc. I can hack on my own anywhere and he self loads in the horse box and happily ties up at events while I sort myself out as I'm usually flying solo. I have one horse only so I need it to be dependable. I've no interest in producing a youngster as I'm paying for livery so it makes sense to have a horse I can use and have fun on right now!

Thats great and i know what u are saying
But if you re read my original first post im talking about hackers only
Horses that people only hack out and lookin for 3k for a horse that can only hack ( because it has an injury ) is a bit much.

This thread has gone off topic i was not lookin for peoole who said they paid 3 k for a perfect alrounder i was talkin about hackin horses ones that people try to sell you for 3k and it has a list of injuries as long as your arm

Except you never said 'injuries as long as your arm' in your original post or that the horse even had an injury. If the horse is injured its a whole other ball game!

Ave Sodalis

Billiethepup wrote: »

Except you never said 'injuries as long as your arm' in your original post or that the horse even had an injury. If the horse is injured its a whole other ball game!

Isn't that not why happy hackers usually are exactly that though? Cause they aren't capable of doing much else? I would have thought they woud be otherwise all-rounders type or have another specific dicipline. Generally, horses are focused on one sport cause that's what they're good at and not really so good at others. With jumping, dressage etc, there's a market there cause there's a sport where money can be made or competitions gone to, and so on. Hacking itself isnt really a sport, there is no competitions for it (unless you could endurance but I would think that's a bit different). I think that's what the OP is trying to say (could be wrong), that hacking is more an addition to other trainings, so why have a big price for something that can only hack, given how limited that market is.

whupdedo

byhookorbycrook wrote: »

I paid €3,500 for my cob. He has represented Ireland at Pony club level and is a machine out hunting. My days of both are well over due to a disability, but he is worth every penny to me, he backs himself into the mounting block, he can open the gate for me going in and out of the arena (I can't dismount/mount alone and without the block)He waits for me to slither down and once or twice when I couldn't stand, he didn't mind me using his tail as a climbing rope!He is ABSOLUTELY bombproof and switches down to slow mode when I get up but will zip up the gears with someone in full health.

I knew where he came from and his full history, you'd be amazed at the lack of scruples in people even when you tell them you have a disability!

Now that's what you call a horse being worth his weight in gold, got sold a dud a few years ago, I never buy now unless I know their safe or else I breed myself

TG1

I think the definition of a hacker is the key here, I wouldn't class a 19 year old horse with a lifelong injury as a happy hacker, I'd class it as semi-retired and looking for a good home...

I'd class a horse that is bombproof on roads, well behaved in a crowd or by itself, used to children, bikes, dogs etc., and capable of doing tough enough ride outs with walk trot and cantering on roads or trails, up mountains, through rivers etc. as a happy hacker...

The former I wouldn't take for free, the latter I know people who would pay a lot of money for, as they have ridden as children and some as adults and are now in their 50s/60s/70s and want the social side of horses, as well as the bond with an animal, but don't want to risk breaking hips or pelvises or other body parts!

Billiethepup

sup_dude wrote: »

Isn't that not why happy hackers usually are exactly that though? Cause they aren't capable of doing much else? I would have thought they woud be otherwise all-rounders type or have another specific dicipline. Generally, horses are focused on one sport cause that's what they're good at and not really so good at others. With jumping, dressage etc, there's a market there cause there's a sport where money can be made or competitions gone to, and so on. Hacking itself isnt really a sport, there is no competitions for it (unless you could endurance but I would think that's a bit different). I think that's what the OP is trying to say (could be wrong), that hacking is more an addition to other trainings, so why have a big price for something that can only hack, given how limited that market is.

In my mind a happy hacker isn't at all injured, or decrepit, or retired, its a kind bombproof horse suitable for an amateur to ride everywhere and anywhere. Its not sport related, plenty of people have horses for the love of the animal rather than wanting to compete in anything. The last poster summed it up perfectly!

Ave Sodalis

Billiethepup wrote: »

In my mind a happy hacker isn't at all injured, or decrepit, or retired, its a kind bombproof horse suitable for an amateur to ride everywhere and anywhere. Its not sport related, plenty of people have horses for the love of the animal rather than wanting to compete in anything. The last poster summed it up perfectly!

Not injuries, per say but can do little else. It's really hard to explain what I mean cause I'm exhausted and my mind is a bit of a muddle :P
I guess what I'm trying to say in summary is that, personally, I wouldn't pay that much for a horse that can only hack. Bombproofing and fittening only takes a bit of training and can be done with most horses, except the most reactive and flighty.

marizpan

A happy hacker in my mind is a horse that can:
Be safe and reliable always, on the road, with dogs, bikes, children, through woods or mountain treks.
That is capable of long hacks in walk, trot and canter, pop a log if out in the woods.
That can be ridden just at weekends, and still be safe and reliable, no freshness.
That is perfectly safe and therefore fun.

An aged injured horse is a retirement horse. Completely different by my view.
I would pay nothing and wouldn't buy a retirement horse but I would gladly pay good money for the happy hacker.

TG1

sup_dude wrote: »

I guess what I'm trying to say in summary is that, personally, I wouldn't pay that much for a horse that can only hack. Bombproofing and fittening only takes a bit of training and can be done with most horses, except the most reactive and flighty.

I totally agree with this, personally I wouldn't buy a horse advertised as a happy hacker, I'd want something that could have a go at anything, and if I had a horse that I thought was never going to jump or do dressage I would be looking to sell it or give it away, as they are an expensive pet to keep!

That being said, the people I know who want a hacker/ horse as a pet will pay anything to avoid having to do the bomb-proofing themselves, as they either wouldn't be capable, or would be nervous of tackling it.

For example, I knew a fab 20+ cob whose owner told me on the first day I worked in that yard that he was dangerous to jump as he was too excitable... We had a guy in the yard who initially was just doing maintenance, mucking out etc. and who wanted to start riding. Within months he was jumping the cob, because he was the most reliable in the yard... The owner just didn't want to jump because she was in her 60's and terrified. She is the type of person who will pay 2500 + for a 12 -19 year old hacker!

fits

You can't put a price on your own safety.

A friend of mine once told me that a lot of people spend 30grand on a 4x4 and 1000 on a horse and the logic in that is completely messed up.

My own horse wasn't expensive. He is absolutely 100% on roads and Id trust a toddler to handle him at home. He does get a bit silly(strong) out hunting now but is still excellent over any country. Jumps open courses in hunter trials no problem.