CSO - Dublin House prices fall in Feb 2014, 2nd month in a row

dubrov

MouseTail wrote: »

That article states no such thing, it states what we have discussed many times on here, that the CSO data excludes cash sales. Where does it make them out to be liars?

"Why the State's own property monitor is today recording falling prices in Dublin when the exact opposite is clearly the case is one question that needs to be answered. But why yet another Irish Government is prepared to tolerate comical house price data from its own monitor is quite another.

Some would say it's a complete joke"

It is hardly complimentary of the CSO figures.

I like the use of the phrase "is clearly the case" to try and pass off opinion as fact. Fantastic reporting

Das Reich

There will not be a fall in prices if a fall in rents no happens. And a fall on the rents in Dublin will not fall as population increases, foreigners have not much option and some students pay as much as 750 € to share a bedroom with other 2 people (250 € each) in city center. Out of city center the price is stil 500 € and very expensive if compared with Europe, the problem of Dublin is that have low property density by square km, not big block buildings with 1 bedroom apartments like in other european cities that you have to go at least 10 km from the city center to find houses.

I not see how the prices on rent will fall if there are too many people looking for rent, and with large yields the price of houses would also increase.

Jesus Wept

**** this low density ****.

handlemaster

Das Reich wrote: »

There will not be a fall in prices if a fall in rents no happens. And a fall on the rents in Dublin will not fall as population increases, foreigners have not much option and some students pay as much as 750 € to share a bedroom with other 2 people (250 € each) in city center. Out of city center the price is stil 500 € and very expensive if compared with Europe, the problem of Dublin is that have low property density by square km, not big block buildings with 1 bedroom apartments like in other european cities that you have to go at least 10 km from the city center to find houses.

I not see how the prices on rent will fall if there are too many people looking for rent, and with large yields the price of houses would also increase.

Ans on a post card..
Could you be a little clearer

harpsman

handlemaster wrote: »

Ans on a post card..
Could you be a little clearer

Seems clear enough to me,its obviously not this guys first language, but he/she have made their point well enough.

The_Conductor

harpsman wrote: »

Seems clear enough to me,its obviously not this guys first language, but he/she have made their point well enough.

Yes- and several people who really should know better- were being mean to the guy. I did German in school- but my level of fluency certainly wouldn't be on parr with this guy's English. Its not hard to be civil towards one another- however the comments around here, were anything but.

gmisk

I honestly dont think prices are dropping atm.
I feel I am not priced out of the market totally.
For example
http://www.myhome.ie/residential/brochure/59-glenealy-road-crumlin-dublin-12/2724952
On at 150k....offer of 187k

http://www.myhome.ie/residential/brochure/3-faussagh-avenue-cabra-dublin-7/2775260
On at 169k....offer of 194k

Its pretty much the same story for anything in my price range <170K

Anyone who thinks prices in this range in general in Dublin areas that people want to buy are dropping or leveling of is delusional.

Cuddlesworth

gmisk wrote: »

I honestly dont think prices are dropping atm.
I feel I am not priced out of the market totally.
For example
http://www.myhome.ie/residential/brochure/59-glenealy-road-crumlin-dublin-12/2724952
On at 150k....offer of 187k

http://www.myhome.ie/residential/brochure/3-faussagh-avenue-cabra-dublin-7/2775260
On at 169k....offer of 194k

Its pretty much the same story for anything in my price range <170K

Anyone who thinks prices in this range in general in Dublin areas that people want to buy are dropping or leveling of is delusional.

Big difference between a offer and a sale. Especially when that "offer" is coming from a Estate agents mouth.

gmisk

Cuddlesworth wrote: »

Big difference between a offer and a sale. Especially when that "offer" is coming from a Estate agents mouth.

That might be true.....but tbh...its true
I know a few people who are bidding and they are saying the same thing.

Merli

There are also a lot of delusional bidders out there. Through no fault of their own, these bidders honestly believe they will get final drawdown of the amount they are bidding. This is not the case.

Unfortunately, these bidders are unknowing pawns in the process as they are raising the prices for 'genuine' bidders and cash buyers.

http://www.herald.ie/opinion/columnists/dan-white/banksmortgage-approval-trick-pushes-up-prices-30170535.html

View the house, make your bid if it ticks most of your requirements and most importantly make the estate aware of all possible advantages you may have over other 'bidders' e.g. Not in a chain, 50% cash buyer, flexibility around closing dates etc.

Then walk away - If you are up against a delusional bidder, let the game play out and wait for that phone call down the road to see if you're still interested.

With 'Ghost' bidders and 'Delusional' bidders aplenty, care must be take not to add to the current bidding wars that are taking place.

GavMan

gmisk wrote: »

http://www.myhome.ie/residential/brochure/3-faussagh-avenue-cabra-dublin-7/2775260
On at 169k....offer of 194k

Who in their right mind would pay approaching 200k for that?? Keep an eye on the PPR to see what it goes for in the end (could take a while)

As shown by moxin, most properties are not making their asking price when the asking price is known. And those that are exceeding, are not exceeding by 20odd k

gmisk

GavMan wrote: »

Who in their right mind would pay approaching 200k for that?? Keep an eye on the PPR to see what it goes for in the end (could take a while)

I honestly have no idea....I thought 150 was stretching it considering the massive damp problem in the house...but hey what do I know.

I wouldnt get drawn in to some bidding war for it believe me.

who_ru

Very good, informative article in the herald about the banks manipulating price rises so as to make their balance sheets appear healthier prior to stress tests by the ECB.

http://www.herald.ie/opinion/columnists/dan-white/banksmortgage-approval-trick-pushes-up-prices-30170535.html

Zamboni

who_ru wrote: »

Very good, informative article in the herald about the banks manipulating price rises so as to make their balance sheets appear healthier prior to stress tests by the ECB.

http://www.herald.ie/opinion/columnists/dan-white/banksmortgage-approval-trick-pushes-up-prices-30170535.html

Want to check I am following this right...
So banks issue tons of approvals.
Approved purchasers enter the market and bid up properties but ultimately don't get to draw down the mortgage and cash buyers end up with highest bid and close sales.
So it's a big scam by banks to use FTBers to mass phantom bid against cash buyers???

spockety

Zamboni wrote: »

Want to check I am following this right...
So banks issue tons of approvals.
Approved purchasers enter the market and bid up properties but ultimately don't get to draw down the mortgage and cash buyers end up with highest bid and close sales.
So it's a big scam by banks to use FTBers to mass phantom bid against cash buyers???

Not only cash bidders, but also the cream of the mortgage crop.

stevedublin

clever, innit?

ionapaul

Zamboni wrote: »

Want to check I am following this right...
So banks issue tons of approvals.
Approved purchasers enter the market and bid up properties but ultimately don't get to draw down the mortgage and cash buyers end up with highest bid and close sales.
So it's a big scam by banks to use FTBers to mass phantom bid against cash buyers???

Or those with rock-solid approval - basically ensuring that those who end up purchasing do so using 100% of their savings and the max mortgage amount approved.

We're actually mortgage approved ATM and it won't be drawing down, as we're talking to another bank about approval with them (much better APR for the LTV % we're looking at). But for argument's sake, I could bid on a property (or five properties) tomorrow, drive up the offer and perhaps lead to a higher sales price despite never really planning to draw down on the mortgage approval I currently have.

Mr.McLovin

While the banks may be approving more mortgages, the number of mortgages actually being drawn down is still falling.

maybe the reason being that there are so little properties available its the same few being approved after their initial approval was issued as they can't find a house. others buying in NE (see that thread most have had to reapply for their mortgage due to the length of the process)

no wonder 8 out 10 mortgages are approved, they been approved already!

gmisk

Mr.McLovin wrote: »

others buying in NE (see that thread most have had to reapply for their mortgage due to the length of the process)

no wonder 8 out 10 mortgages are approved, they been approved already!

Techinically I have now been approved for a mortgage......4 times.....3 with AIB and 1 with BOI I am helping the statistics!

LG1234

Can anyone tell me why after we built so many housesduring the boom (I know a lot were in places people don't want to live, butlots were built in Dublin) and the massive net emigration we've had (biggest inEurope) hows there's now a housing shortage? There wasn’t a housing shortage in2007 and the population has decreased since?

The Spider

LG1234 wrote: »

Can anyone tell me why after we built so many housesduring the boom (I know a lot were in places people don't want to live, butlots were built in Dublin) and the massive net emigration we've had (biggest inEurope) hows there's now a housing shortage? There wasn’t a housing shortage in2007 and the population has decreased since?

Economy is on the up, apart from that, there needs to be a certain amount of houses bought and sold every year to keep the market functioning.

Because of the crash no one sold any houses for over 5 years, creating a backlog of demand. People still wont sell their houses until the prices rise to wipe out the negative equity incurred.

No houses have been built either and at the moment building a house wont cover the costs.

The only way for more houses to become available is for prices to rise, that way sellers can sell, make a profit and not end up owing money on their houses, builders can build houses and make a profit selling them.

(I'll wait for the inevitable post about repossessions and people not paying their mortgage, this is a small amount of people in the grand scheme of things. The fact is most people in negative equity are paying their mortgages, the issue is none of them are selling their properties to either retire downsize or whatever, because the return is either too low, or they'll end up owing the bank money.)

So you see the only way there will ever be enough houses to meet demand in Dublin is for the prices to rise.

Villa05

How is it not viable to build a house in dublin at current prices?
Surely that statement is rubbish

The Spider

Villa05 wrote: »

How is it not viable to build a house in dublin at current prices?
Surely that statement is rubbish

How is it viable? Costs are more than the build when you take into account the site materials wages etc.

Having gotten some work done I can tell you builders aint cheap, and this was last year, and not in Dublin.

So surely your statement is uninformed, guesswork and speculation?

LG1234

If it wasnt viable to build houses at current prices then why are the boom time builders starting to build again?

http://www.independent.ie/business/irish/boom-developers-back-building-new-homes-in-dublin-30158163.html

Theboinkmaster

So what's going to happen for the remaining 9 months of 2014?

And 2015 and 2016?

Are prices going to keep rising and rising?!

€0.5m for an average 3 bed semi D in somewhere like Ballinteer D16 just seems insane....

McGrath5

Its madness in Dublin ATM.

I know of somebody who offered well over the asking price for a property, but because it was not cash offer ie he was taking out a mortgage on the property, the estate agent would not pass the offer onto the vendor. The estate told him that they would only be accepting cash offers.

Is this normal practice now?

MysticalRain

The Spider wrote: »

How is it viable? Costs are more than the build when you take into account the site materials wages etc.

Having gotten some work done I can tell you builders aint cheap, and this was last year, and not in Dublin.

I think the obvious point you're missing is that the construction industry should trim their costs rather than expect the rest of the economy to subsidise their own uncompetitive industry.

So surely your statement is uninformed, guesswork and speculation?

No more so than the anecdotal evidence you're using to back up your points.

nellykelly

Has anyone a clue what is going on with the up and up Dublin house prices? Been to a few viewings of late and there seems to be a siege mentality. I overheard one woman saying to another we will buy anything we are that desperate. I am wondering is it worth hanging on or should I too jump on the bandwagon. I am loathe to buy a house in an area I don't particularly want to live in just because its all I can afford.

The Spider

MysticalRain wrote: »

I think the obvious point you're missing is that the construction industry should trim their costs rather than expect the rest of the economy to subsidise their own uncompetitive industry.


No more so than the anecdotal evidence you're using to back up your points.

No, no I'm not materials cost what they cost, the only area to trim would be wages, typical nonsense I've come to expect.

Let's get them working for nothing, how dare they charge for their labour.

Or are you suggesting cutting corners like priory hall??

So tell me again what point am I missing!

Villa05

The Spider wrote: »

Economy is on the up, apart from that, there needs to be a certain amount of houses bought and sold every year to keep the market functioning.

Because of the crash no one sold any houses for over 5 years, creating a backlog of demand. People still wont sell their houses until the prices rise to wipe out the negative equity incurred.

No houses have been built either and at the moment building a house wont cover the costs.

The only way for more houses to become available is for prices to rise, that way sellers can sell, make a profit and not end up owing money on their houses, builders can build houses and make a profit selling them.

(I'll wait for the inevitable post about repossessions and people not paying their mortgage, this is a small amount of people in the grand scheme of things. The fact is most people in negative equity are paying their mortgages, the issue is none of them are selling their properties to either retire downsize or whatever, because the return is either too low, or they'll end up owing the bank money.)

So you see the only way there will ever be enough houses to meet demand in Dublin is for the prices to rise.

This poster said my post was
"uninformed, guesswork and speculation?"

:rolleyes: