"Government is prepared for railway closures"

end of the road

corktina wrote: »

Quite true. Were we to wind back to Day One it would be a different matter, but the Motorways are there now and won't go away. Rail is now outclassed in everything except InterCity and suburban and needs to concentrate on those as has been said ad nauseum.

What should happen next is improving commuter services around Dublin (which is slooowly happening) and increase InterCity speeds dramatically* (and quality) so that it knocks Motorway competition into a Cocked Hat

*125mph like the UK did in the 1970s will do...140 would be better

not forgetting sligo rosslare tralee and so on which need speed improvements, sadly 125 is doubtful here though, still a good speed can be got

corktina

As far as I know Sligo Rosslare and Tralee aren't Cities.

Less facetious answer: These lines have a place and although they are way down the priority list, improvements could be got no doubt without huge spending. On the Tralee line , a certain amount of level crossing removal has been taking place, and the Rosslare line could immediately be improved by using suitable rolling stock! The Sligo line I know little of, being single line seems to be a problem...perhaps more loops with modern computer control might help?

foggy_lad

corktina wrote: »

Quite true. Were we to wind back to Day One it would be a different matter, but the Motorways are there now and won't go away. Rail is now outclassed in everything except InterCity and suburban and needs to concentrate on those as has been said ad nauseum.

What should happen next is improving commuter services around Dublin (which is slooowly happening) and increase InterCity speeds dramatically* (and quality) so that it knocks Motorway competition into a Cocked Hat

*125mph like the UK did in the 1970s will do...140 would be better

Also required is lower intercity fares on all lines not just on the slow single track lines to wexford and sligo. Intercity needs to target families and to do this they need to be better than the family car for price as well as comfort and reliability, If trains are so short that a family can't sit together they will not be back as parents don't like being seperate from younger children on trains. The booking office fares must come down to match the online web fares so that a family can travel say waterford to dublin for under €30 day return and under €50 open return(currently €69.50 and €122 from Waterford). Family tickets also need to cater cheaply for extra children as currently Irish Rail don't cater for families with more than 2 adults and 2 children or 1 adult and 4 children.

goingnowhere

Rules for family tickets

1 adult + 1 child min
2 adults + 4 child max

Grandeeod

Realistically the best we can get or hope for is 100mph running on most of the IC network. Thats all current rolling stock is capable of. Even then it wont be enough to turn things around. The boat was missed years ago. I blame the clowns in IE and make no apology for it. I have yet to see evidence of any business case for high speed running being put forward during the good times. It was all relays and new rolling stock. Didnt anyone in
Connolly notice all those motorways being planned and at least say something. Show me concrete evidence.

Victor

corktina wrote: »

did you make that up about Stobart opening a Rosslare depot?

Play nice

Moderator

Grandeeod

Victor wrote: »

Play nice

Moderator

Do you know something to the contrary? Because I can't see it being a runner either.

flutered

coylemj wrote: »

How? It only runs from Limerick to Galway, hardly anyone other than pensioners with free travel use it and everyone knows it will never go any further because the people who campaigned for it used wildly optimistic projections of traffic numbers to justify reopening it so why would it affect Enda if it was shut down?

also the bus is quicker and as comfortable.

dowlingm

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

Re directing freight isn't going to happen for a number of reasons, it's run for profit only and custoemrs are not going to foot the fuel bill to have trains running slower and over a longer route. There is lots of scope to increase feright on current routes however it is constrainted because of the single galway line but that won't be for ever.

Running freight Claremorris-Limerick-Waterford wouldn't be THAT much slower, since freight is limited to 50mph - the question would be how much speed you could wring out of the Tuam section for the least cash, prioritising signalling and automated crossings over maximum speed. Putting it out of the way makes room for far faster 22000 services to Mayo, Galway and Waterford. There would be a reverse in Limerick Yard (Athenry would be straight through) but I'd argue better there than Kildare station. Meanwhile the freight could use WRC midday slots on trains you could fire grapeshot through without hitting a soul

Jamie2k9

Grandeeod wrote: »

Realistically the best we can get or hope for is 100mph running on most of the IC network. Thats all current rolling stock is capable of. Even then it wont be enough to turn things around. The boat was missed years ago. I blame the clowns in IE and make no apology for it. I have yet to see evidence of any business case for high speed running being put forward during the good times. It was all relays and new rolling stock. Didnt anyone in
Connolly notice all those motorways being planned and at least say something. Show me concrete evidence.

IE yes have a lot to answer for however the previous administration was all about personal treatment and public transport wasn't near the top of the list.

IE would of needed billions to bring the network up to 100 or 125mph running and people who think otherwise are away with the fairies.

100mph is more than enough for the network to match road transport. Getting the Cork route fully 100 and capable for 125 should be the main objective.

The real problem with the network is lack of doubling tracking which impacts on times. Around 10 minutes of journeys is scheduled to allow crossings and that's just an average there is easily more on many services. That is the average for two crossings on routes so routes could easily have up to 15.

Yes there is room for speed improvements but more tracking is needed to have a good rail service.

Being realistic nobody expects all routes to be doubled however what is possible and best solution to problems on the network is passing loops which are a number of miles long and this would cut the times as both trains provided timetabling is done well can cross while operating at normal speed or even at reduced speed but still moving. That's at least 5-7 minutes cut of one service and a little less off another. For example having Clara to Athlone 100mph capable is pointless when both trains have to slow down approaching (can't remember the loop between) and in many cases having to stop is completely pointless increasing speed when it will only benefit possible 2 or 3 out of the 7 or 8 services on the route.

Many routes could easily handle sections of double tracking without major costs to do it. It works perfectly well outside of Ireland.

The WRC is the reason future rail investment will fail. This was predicted many years before it reopened. Politicians get sucked into grandiose schemes. When they fail, like the WRC, they revert back to the talk you have heard over previous years. The WRC has killed any further chance of rail development in Ireland. Due to its unfairly created high profile via spin and BS, it will be the benchmark that all is judged against.

Your probably right apart from Dublin commuter however IE need to make the main intercity routes work to justify investment to.

Jamie2k9

Running freight Claremorris-Limerick-Waterford wouldn't be THAT much slower, since freight is limited to 50mph - the question would be how much speed you could wring out of the Tuam section for the least cash, prioritising signalling and automated crossings over maximum speed. Putting it out of the way makes room for far faster 22000 services to Mayo, Galway and Waterford. There would be a reverse in Limerick Yard (Athenry would be straight through) but I'd argue better there than Kildare station. Meanwhile the freight could use WRC midday slots on trains you could fire grapeshot through without hitting a soul

The current freight workings are not affecting passenger services, they are not given priority. Speed wouldn't make a difference. Kildare once could be considered a problem area but that was when commuter services terminated at Kildare but now that doesn't happen. Currently the loco change only requires one non stop service having to use the up loop instead of the centre line through the station.

Think a more cost effective solution would be construction of link between Waterford and Cork lines just after Cherryville and cut out Kildare. From what I can tell they own a little bit of land just as the lines branch off and it will be a sharp bend but should be doable (see bing maps) and services would have clear runs.

Judgement Day

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

The current freight workings are not affecting passenger services, they are not given priority. Speed wouldn't make a difference. Kildare once could be considered a problem area but that was when commuter services terminated at Kildare but now that doesn't happen. Currently the loco change only requires one non stop service having to use the up loop instead of the centre line through the station.

Think a more cost effective solution would be construction of link between Waterford and Cork lines just after Cherryville and cut out Kildare. From what I can tell they own a little bit of land just as the lines branch off and it will be a sharp bend but should be doable (see bing maps) and services would have clear runs.

+1

One of the of first of your posts that I actually agree with.

Avoiding/Direct curves should have been put in years ago at Ballybrophy, Limerick Junction (for Waterford) and joining the South Wexford to the Rosslare/Dublin line. They could have been done for a pittance but the foresight is beyond CIE/IE.

man98

The idea about Stobart's plans for a Rosslare Depot are true. I saw something in a local paper a good while ago about it but unfortunately the Wexford People does not have an online archive. Although, Rosslare is brilliantly placed. Cheap land, empty port and close to England. Going to Belview may add on 3 hours each way to a freighter's journey and the railway could go Rosslare - Waterford - Cork/Belfast/ Dublin/ Galway etc. Of course, the amount of tunnels at Greystones would make it impossible to transport freight. Not to mention, these trains could bring produce from factories to Britain on the way back...

corktina

Yes, no doubt a depot there might be an idea, but a rail depot?

The line to Waterford is closed, it has no end of manual crossings which would be very expensive to man were it to re-open and a swing bridge.
The line via Wexford already has capacity problems which prevent synchronising train and ferry times. The Northern end of it is DART territory and very busy.

Were traffic for Tesco to be handled this way, then more depots would be needed countrywide to transfer the goods to the road to travel to all the various stores. I can't see anyway orders can be put together in Rosslare for individual stores other than containers , which would mean having handling cranes at numerous locations throughout the Country.

Rail operations in the UK involve one trunk haul over 400 miles or so....what you are proposing is any number of short trains heading to all points of the compass.

end of the road

corktina wrote: »

Yes, no doubt a depot there might be an idea, but a rail depot?

The line to Waterford is closed, it has no end of manual crossings which would be very expensive to man were it to re-open and a swing bridge.
The line via Wexford already has capacity problems which prevent synchronising train and ferry times. The Northern end of it is DART territory and very busy.

Were traffic for Tesco to be handled this way, then more depots would be needed countrywide to transfer the goods to the road to travel to all the various stores. I can't see anyway orders can be put together in Rosslare for individual stores other than containers , which would mean having handling cranes at numerous locations throughout the Country.

Rail operations in the UK involve one trunk haul over 400 miles or so....what you are proposing is any number of short trains heading to all points of the compass.

i'm sure rail freight handling in this day and age could be made a lot easier then what your suggesting, level crossings on the rosslare waterford section of the ireland cross country corridor are a problem but they could be replaced

corktina

end of the road wrote: »

i'm sure rail freight handling in this day and age could be made a lot easier then what your suggesting, level crossings on the rosslare waterford section of the ireland cross country corridor are a problem but they could be replaced

Level crossings could be replaced but would the cost make the whole idea a non-starter.

Just how would you envisage handling taking place? Quite apart from the extra handling (and cost) involved with most methods...where do you run the trains too and how much shunting and remarshaling would be needed en route? How many depots and sidings would be needed to be put in .

Rail usage like this would only work with a big train travelling big mileage. What is suggested here is many little trains travelling fairly small distances.

Losty Dublin

man98 wrote: »

Of course, the amount of tunnels at Greystones would make it impossible to transport freight. Not to mention, these trains could bring produce from factories to Britain on the way back...

The tunnels are no barrier. Container trains have used the line in the past, just not regularly

end of the road

corktina wrote: »

Level crossings could be replaced but would the cost make the whole idea a non-starter.

Just how would you envisage handling taking place? Quite apart from the extra handling (and cost) involved with most methods...where do you run the trains too and how much shunting and remarshaling would be needed en route? How many depots and sidings would be needed to be put in .

Rail usage like this would only work with a big train travelling big mileage. What is suggested here is many little trains travelling fairly small distances.

all that would be up to the companies to decide what they need and to see the costs and whether its worth it or not, but first we need to get the message out that the railway is open for business to those who want to use it, it could be many little trains but if it gets trucks off the road or gets trucks doing less of a journey then i won't complain

corktina

But it's the very "many little trains" bit that make it a non starter IMO... economies of scale in reverse. Stobart don't do it this way in the UK, why would they do it here?

Judgement Day

According to the latest from my sources within the NTA, the imminent swap of Sir Lancelot Spratt for Leo Varadkar is the only hope of saving the railways. My sources tell me that six (!) lines are currently being considered for closure. No doubt nothing will be announced until the local/European elections are out of the way.

Judgement Day

It seems that the IRRS also anticipate the Waterford/Limerick Jn and Limerick/Ballybrophy closures judging from the itinerary of their forthcoming railtour. http://irishrailwaynews.com/topic/2834/IRRS-Diesel-Railtour-Saturday-19th-July-2014

Losty Dublin

Judgement Day wrote: »

It seems that the IRRS also anticipate the Waterford/Limerick Jn and Limerick/Ballybrophy closures judging from the itinerary of their forthcoming railtour. http://irishrailwaynews.com/topic/2834/IRRS-Diesel-Railtour-Saturday-19th-July-2014

Sure, the IRRS have been anticipating these closures for the last 50 years. Why is this tour any different?

corktina

Judgement Day wrote: »

According to the latest from my sources within the NTA, the imminent swap of Sir Lancelot Spratt for Leo Varadkar is the only hope of saving the railways. My sources tell me that six (!) lines are currently being considered for closure. No doubt nothing will be announced until the local/European elections are out of the way.

Sir Lancelot Spratt was in the "doctor" films , not the "carry on" films.

Anyone want to speculate on the 6?

end of the road

well if this does happen, and if, is all it is at the moment, i guess, limerick waterford, limerick ballybroaphy, i would put in ennis athenry but i'd doubt it, lines with more use will go before it IMO, rosslare graystones, longford sligo, mallow tralee, athlone galway? can't see westport/ballena or carlow waterford going due to freight unless leo expects IE to give that up? i hope speculation is all this will be as we were here before and nothing happened, but varadker is someone i'm very warey of, he has made threats and not acted but is it the case he's holding off until after elections and then will rip the railway or even state run public transport in general to shreads? who knows, wait and see i guess, and hope like last time nothing so drastic and pointless will happen

corktina

i'd say:

Limerick Ballybrophy
Lim Junction Waterford
Wexford Rosslare
Ennis Athenry
Killarney Tralee
hard to see a sixth...surely Sligo and Galway and the Belfast line are safe....maybe the Wexford line beyond the DART? That only leaves Ballina/ Westport and Kilkenny /Waterford...seems unlikely. Maybe the 6 is a Harcourt St scenario, where they back off on a couple of them due to public pressure....(or just plain speculation)

Judgement Day

I'd say that you could add Longford/Sligo, Mallow/Tralee and Gorey/Rosslare to that list. There's also the possibility of relegating the likes of the Ballina branch to freight only status.

All the talk of the need to reduce CO2 and other greenhouse gas emissions and the 'elephant in the room' is clearly Ireland's infatuation with private motoring and road transport. Power stations contribute to greenhouse gases - even cows do - but not road transport apparently. :rolleyes:

end of the road

corktina wrote: »

i'd say:
Limerick Ballybrophy
Lim Junction Waterford

they would be 2 definites

corktina wrote: »

Wexford Rosslare

i'd say that all though i'd say the whole lot could go, the government doesn't seem to like wexford or rosslare port for whatever reason

corktina wrote: »

Ennis Athenry

can't see it going

corktina wrote: »

Killarney Tralee

i'd say the lot from mallow would go TBH, closing Killarney Tralee would be pointless and surely save nothing (mind you at this stage closing any more then LJ waterford or limerick ballybroaphy or ennis athenry would mean that the last straw will be complete closure and removal of the lot)

corktina wrote: »

hard to see a sixth...surely Sligo and Galway and the Belfast line are safe....maybe the Wexford line beyond the DART? That only leaves Ballina/ Westport and Kilkenny /Waterford...seems unlikely.

i don't think anything outside the greater dublin area bar belfast is safe TBH, i know i'm probably reading to much into it but IMO i don't trust varadkar as far as i could throw him and i don't think he's capible of realizing how much damage more large scale closures would do to the country and to the railway, even in the last round of large scale closures large parts of the country were simply left without rather then look to rationalization first (for example closing the small stations) and if theirs a town on the line running the railway to it from wherever the traffic is greater and mothballing the rest (probably 1 or 2 lines could only have had that option though)

corktina wrote: »

Maybe the 6 is a Harcourt St scenario, where they back off on a couple of them due to public pressure

yet discustingly and shamefully they didn't back off on the Harcourt St line, or navan, or dispite the large protests the whole west cork network which was completely removed probably so it could never reopen

end of the road

Judgement Day wrote: »

I'd say that you could add Longford/Sligo, Mallow/Tralee and Gorey/Rosslare to that list. There's also the possibility of relegating the likes of the Ballina branch to freight only status.

All the talk of the need to reduce CO2 and other greenhouse gas emissions and the 'elephant in the room' is clearly Ireland's infatuation with private motoring and road transport. Power stations contribute to greenhouse gases - even cows do - but not road transport apparently.

its laughable all right, road transport brings in revenue and revenue means good roads for the state cars and of course votes, no good roads and the road lobbiests whether it be trucks busses or cars would, well i don't know, it wouldn't be pretty anyway thats for sure

Jamie2k9

Closing Waterford would save IE millions which is needed to either move or improve Waterford station! :rolleyes:

Judgement Day while your source may well be right I don't believe any of the main routes are going to be closed, there is no way it will happen. BB-Limerick is definite just a matter of time (whenever Alan Kelly gets the chop as junior transport minister!). Not sure Limerick J to Waterford will close as long term IE won't make a lot of savings but then again the NTA might.

What I think will happen before the end of the year on all routes especially if staff don't accept pay cuts is a frequency reduction and major jobs cuts in IE to reduces losses.

Remember will Leo V being transport minister by year end?

end of the road

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

Closing Waterford would save IE millions which is needed to either move or improve Waterford station!

a bit lost here, if they closed the waterford line then they wouldn't need to move or improve the station, they could just shut it as no trains apart from freight would be coming through and they could be re-routed away from the cliff?

corktina

Judgement Day wrote: »

I'd say that you could add Longford/Sligo, Mallow/Tralee and Gorey/Rosslare to that list. There's also the possibility of relegating the likes of the Ballina branch to freight only status.

All the talk of the need to reduce CO2 and other greenhouse gas emissions and the 'elephant in the room' is clearly Ireland's infatuation with private motoring and road transport. Power stations contribute to greenhouse gases - even cows do - but not road transport apparently. :rolleyes:

How do the 22Ks stack up pollution-wise compared to a class 201? The reason I ask is that road transport, particularly trucks, have markedly improved their emissions in the last decade or two, whereas rail has lagged behind. Were the 22Ks an improvement on this front?

Markcheese

Are railways an end in themselves (kind of like art or historic buildings) or do we have them for strategic reasons ?
Should they be left to slowly fade (like the canals that rail made obsolete) or should they be used and made best value of ? Basically for rural lines or non core lines drip feeding them money (for staffing and minimum maintenence) while keeping them as they are is strangling them and giving F all return to the state,IE, or the communities they travel through...
How much radical thinking are people,(and the state and IE) for, to preserve lines/allignments or just have them do something worthwhile...
Should somelines just become greenways?
Or this velorail/converted golfbuggy lark ?
Or even run as heritage railways/tourist lines to specific locations and timetabled to suit tourists rather than IE staff,( don't think that's as bad as it used to be)
Closing a line and shedding staff costs, could some of this cash pay for the staff to work lines in a different way ...

Jamie2k9

corktina wrote: »

How do the 22Ks stack up pollution-wise compared to a class 201? The reason I ask is that road transport, particularly trucks, have markedly improved their emissions in the last decade or two, whereas rail has lagged behind. Were the 22Ks an improvement on this front?

The 22's are the most fuel efficient stock in Europe when they were ordered, can't think of many changes since then.

loyatemu

How much CO2 is saved by running empty trains around the country?

of course the counter-argument is to get people out of their cars and onto the trains but IE don't seem capable of doing that on many of the routes, and they're not going to be attractive to any other operator without massive subsidies...

from an environmental point of view better to target investment at urban public transport to get people out of traffic jams in Dublin and into trams and trains.

corktina

I suppose if there are closures, there could be enough 22Ks available to get shot of the Mk4s altogether?

Jamie2k9

How much CO2 is saved by running empty trains around the country?

of course the counter-argument is to get people out of their cars and onto the trains but IE don't seem capable of doing that on many of the routes, and they're not going to be attractive to any other operator without massive subsidies...

from an environmental point of view better to target investment at urban public transport to get people out of traffic jams in Dublin and into trams and trains.

4 lane motorways verses single lines, the last Government did not once consider double tracking anywhere.

Cork and Dublin commuter will be the primary investment over the next 10 years I expect.

I suppose if there are closures, there could be enough 22Ks available to get shot of the Mk4s altogether?

Can't see a complete withdrawal:
1 - City Gold revenue on peak Cork services still exists and must bring in good cash for IE.
2 - May of the route closures have very few 22's operating.

corktina

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

4 lane motorways verses single lines, the last Government did not once consider double tracking anywhere.

Cork and Dublin commuter will be the primary investment over the next 10 years I expect.



Can't see a complete withdrawal:
1 - City Gold revenue on peak Cork services still exists and must bring in good cash for IE.
2 - May of the route closures have very few 22's operating.

Using the €6 per mile quoted elsewhere, i'd say City gold wouldn't cover the costs of the extra coach needed.

end of the road

corktina wrote: »

I suppose if there are closures, there could be enough 22Ks available to get shot of the Mk4s altogether?

and get rid of whatever IE boss decides to get shot of them and whatever minister stands by such waste? IE should be banned from "storing" rolling stock now TBH, 22ks would surely end up being stored along with other commuter railcars if more mass closures happened, no doubt the 2800s would go and the 2600s, unless some 29s would be stored for spairs? i think more mass closures would do more damage to the railway then good, only 2 or 3 lines that have "emptyish" trains on them, the rest are doing fine, yes they could do better but to close them rather then keeping them would be pointless and only mean more cars, maybe 1 day the government will wake up and realize the railway is better off alive then dead, the british government and BR did

corktina

In fairness the British are subsidising their privatised lines and renationalizing parts of the system using money that we simply don't have. They are worth subsidising because they are full of passsngers. We have lines running today that would have gone to the wall long ago in the UK

mickydoomsux

As someone who works in IE I firmly believe that there are certain lines that need to be closed. Some areas of the country simply don't have the population density to support intercity rail and could be much better served by buses. It would also free up rolling stock/staff for areas that need it.

The only thing keeping some lines open is parish pump stuff by some TDs and a tiny amount of vocal protesters who barely use the line but don't want it gone for whatever reason. The government has a large majority now so it is the ideal time to put an end to these costly, underused lines.

It won't happen though. We'll see the closures that we've all been expecting for the past decade and that will be it.

end of the road

their are only 2 3 lines that have few passengers, 2 of these are expected closures and have been for years, those 3 would be about the only type of line that would have gone to the wall in the UK long ago, as for the nonsense about places being "better served by busses" no, they would be better served by people buying cars if a bus is to replace the rail service, the majority of lines in this country are fine and i would expect the politicians to make sure they stay open, places like rosslare sligo tralee waterford and so on losing the rail service would achieve nothing but more cars, busses have their market but they would be for the most part people who would never use the rail service anyway and never did, the idea that me and others would suddenly switch to a bus if we lost the rail service is laughable, in my case its just not going to happen, in my case i'd have to drive to the bus anyway so may as well keep driving, however i don't mind driving to the railway because it offers me what i want, the bus never will, people say railways are kept open for political reasons, but mass closures were also down to and if they happen again will be down to politics and vested interests such as the roads lobby who want no alternative what so ever, its road or nothing, at least rail supporters are happy to have both

corktina

I imagine you could argue that a line such as Mallow to Tralee (my local line) could be served as well if not better by buses which would stop in more places en route.
Coming out of Mallow (as an example) it could serve the Racecourse, Lombardstown Cross, Roskeen. Banteer, Ballymcquirke Cross, Dromoch, Snadpit House Cross, and Drishane on it's way to Millstreet...along with others..an improvement on rail which only serves Banteer of that list.

end of the road

mickydoomsux wrote: »

As someone who works in IE I firmly believe that there are certain lines that need to be closed. Some areas of the country simply don't have the population density to support intercity rail and could be much better served by buses.

nonsense, only 3 as i said could be closed, any more and the rest of the network would be undermined, if the rail service goes one would be better off buying a car as in mine and many others cases we will not be better served by a bus which doesn't and will never meet our needs.

mickydoomsux wrote: »

It would also free up rolling stock/staff for areas that need it.

or staff redundantsies and more rolling stock stored

mickydoomsux wrote: »

The government has a large majority now so it is the ideal time to put an end to these costly, underused lines.

with elections coming? people aren't stupid these days, even if they did mass closures after the elections it would be one of many straws that would see FG out and gone, hopefully with varadkars days in politics coming to an end.

mickydoomsux wrote: »

We'll see the closures that we've all been expecting for the past decade and that will be it.

thats all it should be, any more and you may as well close the lot and be done with it as we'l have nothing left

end of the road

corktina wrote: »

I imagine you could argue that a line such as Mallow to Tralee (my local line) could be served as well if not better by buses which would stop in more places en route.
Coming out of Mallow (as an example) it could serve the Racecourse, Lombardstown Cross, Roskeen. Banteer, Ballymcquirke Cross, Dromoch, Snadpit House Cross, and Drishane on it's way to Millstreet...along with others..an improvement on rail which only serves Banteer of that list.

the idea that the mallow tralee line would be better served by a bus stopping in all sorts of places, and probably taking longer is not something i buy, nothing stopping a bus serving the other towns you mention not served by rail and bringing those customers to the railhead

corktina

It was merely an example but it would facilitate many more journeys than the train does, giving a service into and out of the large towns to a very much larger number of people. It would take longer without a doubt(none of them are towns,and few are even villages). It is however an N road corridor , with deviations, served only at Banteer, Millstreet and Rathmore currently, whereas a bus could serve literally dozens of strategic points. en route to Killarney
I don't believe this line to be under threat anyway, given the investment in level crossing replacement of late by overpasses

Julius Seizure

This stuff about 6 lines closing is a rumour and a load of nonsense tbh, Waterford/Galway etc aren't going anywhere... Fine loadings, also would be political suicide. Perhaps they mean officially closing lines that are open without service eg Mullingar to Athlone, South Wexford (I think) etc.

end of the road

Julius Seizure wrote: »

This stuff about 6 lines closing is a rumour and a load of nonsense tbh, Waterford/Galway etc aren't going anywhere... Fine loadings, also would be political suicide. Perhaps they mean officially closing lines that are open without service eg Mullingar to Athlone, South Wexford (I think) etc.

no need to, or point in officially closing them though, they don't cost anything specially athlone mullingar, south wexford is a handy way of swapping around rolling stock when rock fall or flooding along the rosslare dublin line happens, their would be no point in officially closing it anyway as apart from the weedsprayer it seems no other maintenence is carried out on the line itself, all though probably the barrow bridge receives an inspection, but if so thats probably done when a crew is around anyway meaning no extra costs

Judgement Day

Julius Seizure wrote: »

This stuff about 6 lines closing is a rumour and a load of nonsense tbh, Waterford/Galway etc aren't going anywhere... Fine loadings, also would be political suicide. Perhaps they mean officially closing lines that are open without service eg Mullingar to Athlone, South Wexford (I think) etc.

And your source of information is?

Judgement Day

corktina wrote: »

I suppose if there are closures, there could be enough 22Ks available to get shot of the Mk4s altogether?

Great idea - waste more money getting rid of virtually new rolling stock.

Judgement Day

mickydoomsux wrote: »

As someone who works in IE I firmly believe that there are certain lines that need to be closed. Some areas of the country simply don't have the population density to support intercity rail and could be much better served by buses. It would also free up rolling stock/staff for areas that need it.

The only thing keeping some lines open is parish pump stuff by some TDs and a tiny amount of vocal protesters who barely use the line but don't want it gone for whatever reason. The government has a large majority now so it is the ideal time to put an end to these costly, underused lines.

It won't happen though. We'll see the closures that we've all been expecting for the past decade and that will be it.

In fairness, you work in the clerical end of CIE/IE - correct me if I'm wrong - and in common with many others working in your grade haven't a bull's notion about the bigger picture - save for the lump and collecting as big a payout as you can for any change in work practices. Correct me if I'm wrong as this is my experience of the many CIE/IE staff that I know.