Season 4 Episode 1 "Two Swords" : HAVE read the books

FunLover18

jackjustjumped wrote: »

Thing is, most of my show-only friends adore Syrio and Jaqen so I reckon any mention of Braavos will be well received.

I think the non bookies assume that Arya will go on a huge revenge spree now though. The same way they assume Dany will soon be back in Westeros

Tzar Chasm

Dany is on her way back to westeros, and she's bringing eleventygazillion soldiers and a thousand dragons, its gonna be epic, EPIC I tells ya.

any day now, just you wait

GerB40

Tzar Chasm wrote: »

Dany is on her way back to westeros, and she's bringing eleventygazillion soldiers and a thousand dragons, its gonna be epic, EPIC I tells ya.

any day now, just you wait

You're in denial man....

Liam O

Arya adding the red woman to her list of names could be a potential spoiler for future books.

username123

Tzar Chasm wrote: »

Dany is on her way back to westeros, and she's bringing eleventygazillion soldiers and a thousand dragons, its gonna be epic, EPIC I tells ya.

any day now, just you wait

Oh the Battle for Westeros, a thousand dragons and eleventygazillion soldiers facing off against an endless white walker army of frozen Others, with Jon Snowas chief dragon rider alongside Daenarys Targeryan, with Bran warging from dragon to white walker as needed.......

Barna77

I know this guy, non book reader. I asked him today about his reaction to the RW, and he wasn't very happy.

Waiting for what he has to say next week

Witcher

I think I'd like her if there was more action. So much of her storyline is them just walking to different places and her right-hand man being thoroughly friendzoned. She hasn't faced any true adversity in her travels yet, whereas a lot of other characters are encountering problems all over the place. Her journey just seems a bit smooth and uneventful compared to others.

Quote about Dany from the other thread...amen brother:pac:

Michael D Not Higgins

Barna77 wrote: »

I know this guy, non book reader. I asked him today about his reaction to the RW, and he wasn't very happy.

Waiting for what he has to say next week

I watch with my non-book reading girlfriend. She could sense something was going to happen at the red wedding about 5 minutes before it all kicked off. I've given her a bit of a red herring by saying after this episode "oh they're just setting up stuff for later in the season where all the action will be again". I'm hoping for genuine shock next week.

Turtyturd

Michael D Not Higgins wrote: »

I watch with my non-book reading girlfriend. She could sense something was going to happen at the red wedding about 5 minutes before it all kicked off. I've given her a bit of a red herring by saying after this episode "oh they're just setting up stuff for later in the season where all the action will be again". I'm hoping for genuine shock next week.

The use of 'The Rains of Castemere' in that scene was a big giveaway...I always thought it began too early.

Paddy Cow

Bacchus wrote: »

I too would like to see a bit of a shake-up of her story. It has progressed well over the 3 seasons but another siege on another slave city seems a bit repetitive at this point.

However, she's been through LOADs of adversity so far....
- Brother sold her to a savage who raped her repeatedly
- After finally turning that situation to her advantage, he dies and she's abandoned in the desert with no food, water or shelter
- Her followers were slaughtered and her dragons stolen from her in Quath
- She was temporarily held hostage by the warlocks (who are still after her... wonder will they come back into it soon?)
- She quite skilfully dealt with the slave army liberation

Since then she has freed a bunch of cities and things have been going better for her, which is why I hope something new is done with her soon. I doubt it will happen this season but I really hope at the end of season 4, she'll be on a boat with her army heading for Westeros.

Looks like non book readers will be sharing a lot of our frustrations with regards Dani

GerB40

Paddy Cow wrote: »

Looks like non book readers will be sharing a lot of our frustrations with regards Dani

Poor fúckers don't know what they're in for...

Daith

GerB40 wrote: »

Poor fúckers don't know what they're in for...

I think we're really going to get a backlash around Season 5 and complaints that the story is dragging it's heels or claws....

Michael D Not Higgins

Daith wrote: »

I think we're really going to get a backlash around Season 5 and complaints that the story is dragging it's heels or claws....

This is where flashbacks to the back story from Bran could inject some action to the dull periods. I don't know how it would work in practice though.

GerB40

Daith wrote: »

I think we're really going to get a backlash around Season 5 and complaints that the story is dragging it's heels or claws....

Well unless there's some drastic deviations from the books Danys story will be dragged out too much so they won't be wrong by complaining..

Witcher

You can already see them getting impatient about Dany over on the other thread:pac:

martingriff

I have not finished reading all the books yet on number 5 part 2

but do we actually know the Hound is dead. From what I remember Arya left him bleeding

.

Have not seen EP. 1 so do not know if the scene is in this epuisode or not

Mr Freeze

Edit. martingriff don't read this post.

GerB40 wrote: »

Well unless there's some drastic deviations from the books Danys story will be dragged out too much so they won't be wrong by complaining..

The Harpy killings (could be this season) & wedding, Quentyn and the Dragons, The Fighting pit, Barsiton going badass. Tyrion going east, Tyrion and Jorah heading towards Dany getting mixed up with Pirates and Slavers in Yunkai, ending up in the armies outside Meereen, and escaping to the Second Sons.

Massive battles in and around Meereen involving Barristons leading Dany's forces, the Merc's changing sides, and the Greyjoy fleet landing and attacking also.

And there are other characters on their way to see and bring Dany back to Westeros.

All that might not include Dany, but she is central to all those plots, and it might make for some seriously entertaining TV once they get the boring Meereen book bits out of the way. (this coming from someone who fecking hates Book Daenerys Targaryen).

Michael D Not Higgins

martingriff wrote: »

I have not finished reading all the books yet on number 5 part 2 but do we actually know the Hound is dead. From what I remember

Arya left him bleeding

Since he dies out of sight of a POV character, there's numerous possibilities for his return. There are theories he's the gravedigger at the Quiet Isle.

martingriff

Michael D Not Higgins wrote: »

Since he dies out of sight of a POV character, there's numerous possibilities for his return. There are theories he's the gravedigger at the Quiet Isle.

Ya was not the thread I should have posted on to be fair. Thanks

Washington Irving

martingriff wrote: »

I have not finished reading all the books yet on number 5 part 2

but do we actually know the Hound is dead. From what I remember Arya left him bleeding

.

Have not seen EP. 1 so do not know if the scene is in this epuisode or not

A Feast for Crows

You're right about Arya leaving the Hound bleeding, but it is strongly hinted at, at the end of AFFC, that 'Sandor Clegane' is still alive when Brienne visits the Quiet Isle and there is a Hound-sized gravedigger.

I can't remember exactly, but the septon says something to suggest that 'the Hound' is dead, but Sandor Clegane is possibly still alive and has probably renounced violence and now lives a 'gravedigging monk'.

Daith

Mr Freeze wrote: »

Edit. martingriff don't read this post.



The Harpy killings (could be this season) & wedding, Quentyn and the Dragons, The Fighting pit, Barsiton going badass. Tyrion going east, Tyrion and Jorah heading towards Dany getting mixed up with Pirates and Slavers in Yunkai, ending up in the armies outside Meereen, and escaping to the Second Sons.

Massive battles in and around Meereen involving Barristons leading Dany's forces, the Merc's changing sides, and the Greyjoy fleet landing and attacking also.

And there are other characters on their way to see and bring Dany back to Westeros.

All that might not include Dany, but she is central to all those plots, and it might make for some seriously entertaining TV once they get the boring Meereen book bits out of the way. (this coming from someone who fecking hates Book Daenerys Targaryen).

All valid points but the problem is that none of them are "and Dany arrives in Westeros" or even gets on a boat!

Nerdlingr

Just a theory about The Hound. Think I read somewhere Maisie Williams said that the book readers may be in for a liitle suprise with Arya this season. Is it possible she grants The Hound his wish of mercy? Always thought it was a little cruel of her to leave him bleeding like that, like it or not he did kind of look after her on their travels!!

Mr Freeze

Daith wrote: »

All valid points but the problem is that none of them are "and Dany arrives in Westeros" or even gets on a boat!

Well at this rate, I don't think she will ever get there. The House with the Red door in Braavos might be as far as he gets.

This whole riding Dragons and beating the White Walkers seems like the kind of thing that Martin will let us think, then just kill all the dragons in Meereen.

username123

Nerdlingr wrote: »

Just a theory about The Hound. Think I read somewhere Maisie Williams said that the book readers may be in for a liitle suprise with Arya this season. Is it possible she grants The Hound his wish of mercy? Always thought it was a little cruel of her to leave him bleeding like that, like it or not he did kind of look after her on their travels!!

And he tried to help Sansa. I like the Hound, he has a soft spot for the Stark girls at least. He could have raped or beaten either Sansa OR Arya (and probably still gone about giving her back to whatever family member was still alive for money). But he didnt.

He also saved Ser Loras from what was most likely a beheading at the hands of Gregor. Although he did that out of his hatred for Gregor rather than his sense of justice for Loras. But he still did it.

GerB40

Nerdlingr wrote: »

Just a theory about The Hound. Think I read somewhere Maisie Williams said that the book readers may be in for a liitle suprise with Arya this season. Is it possible she grants The Hound his wish of mercy? Always thought it was a little cruel of her to leave him bleeding like that, like it or not he did kind of look after her on their travels!!

But he was on the list. Despite the weird brother/sister, father/daughter (or whatever the fúck) relationship they had, Arya will always remember Mycah the butchers boy.
She has gained the trust of the hound and just like Polliver may give him his deserving death..
More proof that bad-ass Arya might be coming sooner rather then later.

GerB40

username123 wrote: »

And he tried to help Sansa. I like the Hound, he has a soft spot for the Stark girls at least. He could have raped or beaten either Sansa OR Arya (and probably still gone about giving her back to whatever family member was still alive for money). But he didnt.

He also saved Ser Loras from what was most likely a beheading at the hands of Gregor. Although he did that out of his hatred for Gregor rather than his sense of justice for Loras. But he still did it.

Every man has his code... (Omar Comin)

lynski

GerB40 wrote: »

Every man has his code... (Omar Comin)

That is a nice touch.
I think the hound is a decent guy, serving bad kings and doing as he was told made him less so, but the more time away from the king the more moral he becomes. There is no mention in the books of him partaking in rape unlike his bro.
I am so hoping my other half does not hear the phrase purple wedding this week. He has no idea. Tyrian and Tywyn are his favs so this is going to be a fun season.

Daith

Yeah "Purple" Wedding is being thrown around so I've had friends connecting Red Wedding to be Robb's death to Purple being Joffreys.

Sleepy

Nerdlingr wrote: »

Just a theory about The Hound. Think I read somewhere Maisie Williams said that the book readers may be in for a liitle suprise with Arya this season. Is it possible she grants The Hound his wish of mercy? Always thought it was a little cruel of her to leave him bleeding like that, like it or not he did kind of look after her on their travels!!

I'd be surprised. It's always seemed to me that the Clegane brothers have to come to a head at some point and Cersei's upcoming trial by the faith would seem an obvious time for that to happen: "Ser Robert Strong" being her champion and the "Gravedigging Monk" as the champion of the faith...

It's a scene many are expecting to happen and, tbh, even if it's possibly a litttle too predictable/cliché, I really want it to because, well, it's the hound versus the mountain!

I do wonder, however, if she might end up travelling to Bravos with Tyrion. The showrunners seem to recognise Williams talent and some of her best non-book scenes to date were her acting against Charles Dance's Tywin... wonder if she'll somehow replace Penny or simply end up on the same ship as him only to escape from him off to begin her story in the House of Black and White...

username123

Sleepy wrote: »

I really want it to because, well, it's the hound versus the mountain!

Oh yes. Poetic justice in the form of the Hound mashing Ser Roberts helmed head into a brazier and then helm to fall off and reveal...........

lynski

I know this is a book readers thread but in case anyone has not finished the books i'm spoilering

Love seeing Brianne this season as I was surprised to be so upset when she and Pod got hung. Just the most harmless characters and so unnecessary. It was a relief to see them again.

Dave_The_Sheep

I really need to re-read the books, because I don't remember Sandor Clegane dying at all ... given from what most of you have been saying... he has. Weird.

Shazbot

Dave_The_Sheep wrote: »

I really need to re-read the books, because I don't remember Sandor Clegane dying at all ... given from what most of you have been saying... he has. Weird.

Well we don't know he's dead. All we know is that he was left to die by Arya after the fight in the inn and she refused him a quick death. When Brienne is on the Quiet Isle, the Elder Brother there tells Brienne that the Hound is dead and he buried him. People think that this just means The Hound aspect of his personality is dead and that he is Sandor now. It's speculated that the new gravedigger is Sandor and he's found peace since he can't kill his brother.

GerB40

Daith wrote: »

Yeah "Purple" Wedding is being thrown around so I've had friends connecting Red Wedding to be Robb's death to Purple being Joffreys.

But red = Dexter style blood bath.
Purple = ???
Purple Wedding could mean anything. I don't know how people could relate PW to Joff gettin what's comin.

Plus loads of show fans expect bad people to live long and prosper while the goodies continue to get slaughtered.

One thing's for certain, episode 2 will shock a lot of people....

kksaints

GerB40 wrote: »

But red = Dexter style blood bath.
Purple = ???
Purple Wedding could mean anything. I don't know how people could relate PW to Joff gettin what's comin.

Plus loads of show fans expect bad people to live long and prosper while the goodies continue to get slaughtered.

One thing's for certain, episode 2 will shock a lot of people....

Purple would be generally regarded as the colour of royalty so it would be easy enough to see why people would think it would affect Joffery in some way.

omicron

kksaints wrote: »

Purple would be generally regarded as the colour of royalty so it would be easy enough to see why people would think it would affect Joffery in some way.

Well obviously it affects him, it's his wedding, doesn't really signify what happens though?!

Oranage2

GerB40 wrote: »

Well unless there's some drastic deviations from the books Danys story will be dragged out too much so they won't be wrong by complaining..

They'll probably put a 15 minute scene of her getting it on with one of her maids - that should keep everybody happy for awhile.

GerB40

Oranage2 wrote: »

They'll probably put a 15 minute scene of her getting it on with one of her maids - that should keep everybody happy for awhile.

If they did that with her story people would go mental but I for one wouldn't mind one bit :-). I love me some Daenerys....

Washington Irving

GerB40 wrote: »

If they did that with her story people would go mental but I for one wouldn't mind one bit :-). I love me some Daenerys....

Why? It is staying true to the books after all. Just a shame they killed off Doreah.

Barna77

Well, Daenerys' storyline is quite frustrating for book readers, I suppose non readers will go crazy about her staying in Mereen for ages sitting on her backside learning the art of ruling.

If the producers make some changes to speed things up in order to please viewers, and there would be uproar on the readers side.

I hope GRR Martin has something good for her after all that.

And I see lots of hate for the new Daario.




PS: the housemate is about to watch the RW, around 20 minutes to meltdown

FunLover18

Barna77 wrote: »

Well, Daenerys' storyline is quite frustrating for book readers, I suppose non readers will go crazy about her staying in Mereen for ages sitting on her backside learning the art of ruling.

A sitcom episode about the mishaps that occur while Barriston tries to find her a cushion to sit on

GerB40

Barna77 wrote: »

Well, Daenerys' storyline is quite frustrating for book readers, I suppose non readers will go crazy about her staying in Mereen for ages sitting on her backside learning the art of ruling.

If the producers make some changes to speed things up in order to please viewers, and there would be uproar on the readers side.

I hope GRR Martin has something good for her after all that.

And I see lots of hate for the new Daario.




PS: the housemate is about to watch the RW, around 20 minutes to meltdown

Record the RW reaction, some of them were gas...

Barna77

GerB40 wrote: »

Record the RW reaction, some of them were gas...

So the butchering begins, he's like wtf! ....

... And flash player crashes....

Ffs

PopePalpatine

The flash player knows what's up. :pac:

johnnyskeleton

Liam O wrote: »

Ellaria being shunted for a conversation with Tyrion completely goes against his book character too where if I remember correctly he made a point of saying that she was to hear everything he did.

More surprisingly, they talk about rhaegar and Ellia, how he "left her for another woman". As clear a sign from GRRM that voluntary eloping, rather than kidnap of Lyanna is the way they're going. Not a surprise to most, but I thought the books were sufficiently subtle that it was always uncertain.

username123

johnnyskeleton wrote: »

More surprisingly, they talk about rhaegar and Ellia, how he "left her for another woman". As clear a sign from GRRM that voluntary eloping, rather than kidnap of Lyanna is the way they're going. Not a surprise to most, but I thought the books were sufficiently subtle that it was always uncertain.

Was it not just that the "public" gossip had to maintain her innocence as a high born maid in order to protect her honour so it had to be pretended that she had been kidnapped, but that those in the know (Ned Stark for example) always knew she had loved Rhaegar?

GerB40

username123 wrote: »

Was it not just that the "public" gossip had to maintain her innocence as a high born maid in order to protect her honour so it had to be pretended that she had been kidnapped, but that those in the know (Ned Stark for example) always knew she had loved Rhaegar?

Yeah I think you're right. The only person who talks shít about Rhaegar in the books is Robert and seeing as he's a king surrounded mostly by yes men nobody was gonna openly disagree with him.. Nobody else even mentions kidnapping so it seems R+L=J is basically confirmed in the first book.

Kunkka

If that was the case in the books why did Ned's father & brother march to Kingslanding to demand her back which lead to their gruesome death? If they knew she went willingly they wouldn't have gone about it that way?

Witcher

Kunkka wrote: »

If that was the case in the books why did Ned's father & brother march to Kingslanding to demand her back which lead to their gruesome death? If they knew she went willingly they wouldn't have gone about it that way?

Because Rhaegar was married and she was bethrothed. Women are property in this story, they don't get to make decisions like that.

Maybe if your father was a petty lord you could marry for love but when he's a Lord Paramount, marriages are political.

GerB40

Kunkka wrote: »

If that was the case in the books why did Ned's father & brother march to Kingslanding to demand her back which lead to their gruesome death? If they knew she went willingly they wouldn't have gone about it that way?

Maybe they went to KL to demand her to come home.. If she did run away with Rhaegar it would have been fairly shameful to the Starks so they would have tried to hush it up.