Are we in 1930's Mississippi?

Nodin

Senor Fancy Pants wrote: »

So, if someone had a bad experience with the travelling community, are they not allowed say it and/or hate them for it?

Hating the individuals is up to you. That's not whats happening here, however.

Essien wrote:

Of course every one hates them, why wouldn't we?

The day there (..............)for good.

Good for you. I'd imagine those responsible for the bad experiences have similar excuses with regards to you.

mikemac1

efb wrote: »

To celebrate denying them housing as an achievement is disgusting IMO

They could join the local authority list and wait 5-7 years for a house

It's what everyone else has to do

comongethappy

mikemac1 wrote: »

They could join the local authority list and wait 5-7 years for a house

It's what everyone else has to do

Aah.... But that doesn't perpetuate the endless victimhood.

Gatling

A Vincent Brown story covered the subject perfectly when they interviewed traveller families ,for some there own words ,we cant and won't live by other people's rules and won't live anywhere unless there surrounded by there immediate and extended families,

My sister bought a house in mixed development ,privately owned ,local authority housing and other social housing ,
My sister house in the center of one single road ,now in sdcc wisdom they housed traveller families on the four corners of the street ,
Now the estate opened on a friday before that happened a joint residents and sdcc meeting was called where the rules for living in the estate were discussed ,
Three specific rules targeted the traveller families ,no mobile homes ,or caravans allowed under any circumstances ,no car selling under any circumstances ie no selling cars/car parts outside houses or limited green spaces ,and no trailers storing household waste or white items ,
That was a friday by the sunday 6 mobile homes were lifted into front and back gardens for 4 houses ,3 of the 4 traveller families were involved in various feudals which resulted in a garda public order unit having to be deployed several times in the course of a few days ,
Now when my sister and 2 of her neighbors who bought on the same street and paint thrown over there front and back gardens and Windows broken ,
That was in the space of a two week period ,
Its not all travellers who are bad ,
But I've personally only ever known 3/4 that were not trouble makers vs the few hundred I've met that nothing but trouble

efb

comongethappy wrote: »

How is housing denied?

A traveller, you, me, a polish fellow are all equally entitled to work and acquire property.

And we all have a right to housing too

RobbingBandit

No business men selling apples as of yet, no segregation, no wheelchair bound president with polio.

Stavros Murphy

bumper234 wrote: »

The smell as well.

Not being funny either, there is a certain bang of smoke/oil/wet dog off the males. Anyone who says they couldn't spot a traveler a mile off is either lying or has led a very sheltered life with minimal contact with this section of society. I used to work as a doorman for many years and have a proud record of never letting one past me into any premises i worked.

Not being PC, as I have had that gland removed, but that does strike me as being off- none, none at all? Even just a couple out for a drink together? Now that is just blind discrimination and going too far. I know staff in service-stations cringe when they see a Travveler filling up as it is a lottery as to wether they intend paying or not - "I forgot my money" and a shrug, or the classic - me and a mate were queuing to pay and a "lad" goes to my mate -"I forgot my wallet, you pay for my fuel" My mate goes "feck off will ya" and yer man says "miserable mean b*llix". I kinda lolled, but the staff didn't. "We're calling the Gards" goes the manager, "yeah, whatever you like" goes yer man, and walks off to his car.

bumper234

efb wrote: »

And we all have a right to housing too

Yup


As asked already why can't they put their names on the housing lists like everyone else and wait the 7/8 years for a house to become available?

bumper234

Stavros Murphy wrote: »

Not being PC, as I have had that gland removed, but that does strike me as being off- none, none at all? Even just a couple out for a drink together? Now that is just blind discrimination and going too far. I know staff in service-stations cringe when they see a Travveler filling up as it is a lottery as to wether they intend paying or not - "I forgot my money" and a shrug, or the classic - me and a mate were queuing to pay and a "lad" goes to my mate -"I forgot my wallet, you pay for my fuel" My mate goes "feck off will ya" and yer man says "miserable mean b*llix". I kinda lolled, but the staff didn't. "We're calling the Gards" goes the manager, "yeah, whatever you like" goes yer man, and walks off to his car.

Never a one in all the time i worked security. Had many turn up and i'm sure some were lovely people but i would rather turn them away in the knowledge that they won't get the chance to cause me any grief. Have heard about them doing the petrol scam and as you say even if guards are called what's gonna happen? Cars rarely registered in their name so no tracking them down.

anncoates

efb wrote: »

Well that's absolutely non refutable evidence. Is there a box marked traveller they have to tick or do you know them all?

A halting site address on the CV....

efb

bumper234 wrote: »

Yup


As asked already why can't they put their names on the housing lists like everyone else and wait the 7/8 years for a house to become available?

How do you know they haven't? Getting traveller accommodation is a long battle

Ghost Buster

efb wrote: »

How do you know they haven't? Getting traveller accommodation is a long battle

Ummm. If the average wait is 7/8 years then its a level playing field... But if its travellers its discrimination eh;)

Renegade Mechanic

efb wrote: »

How do you know they haven't? Getting traveller accommodation is a long battle

Indeed it is. And stuff like this:

Gatling wrote: »

A Vincent Brown story covered the subject perfectly when they interviewed traveller families ,for some there own words ,we cant and won't live by other people's rules and won't live anywhere unless there surrounded by there immediate and extended families,

My sister bought a house in mixed development ,privately owned ,local authority housing and other social housing ,
My sister house in the center of one single road ,now in sdcc wisdom they housed traveller families on the four corners of the street ,
Now the estate opened on a friday before that happened a joint residents and sdcc meeting was called where the rules for living in the estate were discussed ,
Three specific rules targeted the traveller families ,no mobile homes ,or caravans allowed under any circumstances ,no car selling under any circumstances ie no selling cars/car parts outside houses or limited green spaces ,and no trailers storing household waste or white items ,
That was a friday by the sunday 6 mobile homes were lifted into front and back gardens for 4 houses ,3 of the 4 traveller families were involved in various feudals which resulted in a garda public order unit having to be deployed several times in the course of a few days ,
Now when my sister and 2 of her neighbors who bought on the same street and paint thrown over there front and back gardens and Windows broken ,
That was in the space of a two week period ,
Its not all travellers who are bad ,
But I've personally only ever known 3/4 that were not trouble makers vs the few hundred I've met that nothing but trouble

Doesn't help their case. On another note near my own neck of the woods, the accommodation built specifically for them in Cashel has been wrecked twice at least and each time the council just pay and get it fixed.

Stavros Murphy

Renegade Mechanic wrote: »

Indeed it is. And stuff like this:



Doesn't help their case. On another note near my own neck of the woods, the accommodation built specifically for them in Cashel has been wrecked twice at least and each time the council just pay and get it fixed.

Yours truly did work on some of those, and they were seriously built - far, far tougher than normal houses, solid block walls, stainless steel heavy duty plumbing and sinks/toilets - "vandal proof" and they cost an absolute bomb per unit completed. In shyte in jig time as it happens. But a Caravan that they buy with their own money?? Spotless, utterly spotless and untouched. So the "sure they know no different" argument is rubbish.

bumper234

efb wrote: »

How do you know they haven't? Getting traveller accommodation is a long battle

But it's a walk in the park for young families who are trying to secure properties for themselves?

efb

bumper234 wrote: »

But it's a walk in the park for young families who are trying to secure properties for themselves?

I never said it was, but the Cllr would happily deny them too as preventing social housing was another of her celebrated achievements...

bumper234

Was driving from Blanchardstown to Finglas last year across the back roads and on the approach to Finglas near Cappagh hospital the road was almost undrivable due to a massive black cloud of smoke. 15 minutes later and the smoke clears to show a massive bonfire on a halting site just off the road. They had been burning the rubber coating off a load of copper wiring and a pile of tyres caught fire too. If i lit a fire to burn some leaves in my back garden i would be fined.

anncoates

comongethappy wrote: »

Aah.... But that doesn't perpetuate the endless victimhood.

I suspect travelers really are many liberal people's weak spot.

Not so much individual travelers but the fact of the bogus race /cultural designations assigned to travelers by guilty middle class liberals that have never and will never live in proximity with travelers and that any attempt to point out the highly disproportionate social issues - not least school absenteeism, littering, animal cruelty, unemployment - within the traveler population is shouted down as racism.

I can understand and appreciate that discrimination exists against travelers but to compare a societal group like travelers whose segregation from society is elective to oppressed African Americans historically seeking integration to society is crackers stuff.

efb

bumper234 wrote: »

Was driving from Blanchardstown to Finglas last year across the back roads and on the approach to Finglas near Cappagh hospital the road was almost undrivable due to a massive black cloud of smoke. 15 minutes later and the smoke clears to show a massive bonfire on a halting site just off the road. They had been burning the rubber coating off a load of copper wiring and a pile of tyres caught fire too. If i lit a fire to burn some leaves in my back garden i would be fined.

Have you been?

StinkyMunkey

Id want to live beside a traveller about as much as id like to be kicked in the face with steel cap boots.

Stavros Murphy

efb wrote: »

I never said it was, but the Cllr would happily deny them too as preventing social housing was another of her celebrated achievements...

You could build three normal homes for the cost of one travveler spec house. Also, the travveler spec version comes with free, always emptied, skips(yup) space to park a mobile or caravan, feck all chance of any meters being read/power being cut off and a "we'll rebuild it even if ye wreck it on purpose" guarantee. Do settled people get that? Do they feck.

bumper234

efb wrote: »

Have you been?

No

But then i don't think i can break the laws and just ignore them.

bumper234

StinkyMunkey wrote: »

Id want to live beside a traveller about as much as id like to be kicked in the face with steel cap boots.

One could precede the other

Femme_Fatale

Arranged marriage, keeping it in the family, those "grabbing" rituals, no contraception (is it right for a 30-year-old woman in 21st century Ireland to have 12 children and be living in poverty, as was the case I encountered once?), virtually no education, a disproportionate amount of violence - to animals as well as humans, various criminal behaviours, unsanitary conditions, high infant mortality rate, lowered life expectancy, bareknuckle boxing as part of their culture, extreme machismo - women as inferior... the list goes on. These are problematic elements of traveller culture, which, yes, are found in settled society, but not anywhere near the same proportion. There's no point denying it.

The above are viewed as problems usually, but within traveller society much of them are deemed legitimate parts of their culture.

There is just no argument tbh.

WilyCoyote

efb wrote: »

How do you know they haven't? Getting traveller accommodation is a long battle

And they fucking up the neighbourhood is a short one

Donkey Oaty

Any suggestions from anyone as to what can be done about all this?

StinkyMunkey

Femme_Fatale wrote: »

Arranged marriage, keeping it in the family, those "grabbing" rituals, no contraception (is it right for a 30-year-old woman in 21st century Ireland to have 12 children and be living in poverty, as was the case I encountered once?), virtually no education, a disproportionate amount of violence - to animals as well as humans, various criminal behaviours, unsanitary conditions, high infant mortality rate, lowered life expectancy, bareknuckle boxing as part of their culture, extreme machismo - women as inferior... the list goes on. These are problematic elements of traveller culture, which, yes, are found in settled society, but not anywhere near the same proportion. There's no point denying it.

The above are viewed as problems usually, but within traveller society much of them are deemed legitimate parts of their culture.

There is just no argument tbh.

The people fighting the good fight for those poor misunderstood/demonised travellers couldnt give a crap about that sort of thing.

They are most interested in demonisng people who just wanna live the quiet life in their own home without any problems.

I dont wanna live beside travellers, no amount of PC BS on boards will ever change that, if that makes me a dickhead, so be it, ill be a dickhead in my nice quiet house with my nice quiet neighbours.

efb

Femme_Fatale wrote: »

Arranged marriage, keeping it in the family, those "grabbing" rituals, no contraception (is it right for a 30-year-old woman in 21st century Ireland to have 12 children and be living in poverty, as was the case I encountered once?), virtually no education, a disproportionate amount of violence - to animals as well as humans, various criminal behaviours, unsanitary conditions, high infant mortality rate, lowered life expectancy, bareknuckle boxing as part of their culture, extreme machismo - women as inferior... the list goes on. These are problematic elements of traveller culture, which, yes, are found in settled society, but not anywhere near the same proportion. There's no point denying it.

The above are viewed as problems usually, but within traveller society much of them are deemed legitimate parts of their culture.

There is just no argument tbh.

Is My Big Fat Gypsy Wedding your only reference point?

Femme_Fatale

efb wrote: »

Is My Big Fat Gypsy Wedding your only reference point?

'Fraid not. I'm just not living in denial in order to be holier-than-thou.

Donkey Oaty

efb wrote: »

Is My Big Fat Gypsy Wedding your only reference point?

That was a sanitised love letter compared to the stories in this thread.