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Irish Teen Fears Execution in Egypt

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    #5012
    Means Of Escape
    Registered Users Posts: 1,897 ✭✭✭Means Of Escape


    Wright wrote: »
    It's not though. If you want to create a thread defaming his family fire ahead. But that's not what the thread was about.

    The rebellious son had defamed his family .


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    #5013
    Wright
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,120 ✭✭✭Wright


    Means Of Escape wrote: »
    The rebellious son had defamed his family .

    Not sure you understand what defamation means.


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    #5014
    jimboblep
    Registered Users Posts: 546 ✭✭✭jimboblep


    Wright wrote: »
    You can present certain facts to colour things in the way that suits you. Simple enough concept. If I had a problem with any race or creed I could give you lots of facts that paint them in a bad light.

    You do realize when we talk of extremists or sympathizers or extremists we're realistically talking about 0.000001% or even less, of all people who follow Islam. Yet I see rarely ever see that mentioned. Suppose we've been conditioned by the media; they are excellent at training their camera on that 0.000001%. Little excuse though.

    I think you need to have a look at your numbers again, they are way off. Going by your numbers that would mean only a thousand or so extremists or sympathisers worldwide based on aprox i billion members of the islamic faith. Which is patently incorrect with isis alone estimated at 30000 fighters.Oh and do you have a source for your stats or did you just make it up


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    #5015
    weldoninhio
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,311 ✭✭✭✭weldoninhio


    Wright wrote: »
    You can present certain facts to colour things in the way that suits you. Simple enough concept. If I had a problem with any race or creed I could give you lots of facts that paint them in a bad light.

    You do realize when we talk of extremists or sympathizers or extremists we're realistically talking about 0.000001% or even less, of all people who follow Islam. Yet I see rarely ever see that mentioned. Suppose we've been conditioned by the media; they are excellent at training their camera on that 0.000001%. Little excuse though.

    Have you anything to back up your stats??


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    #5016
    weldoninhio
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,311 ✭✭✭✭weldoninhio


    Wright wrote: »
    Duh?

    Remarking on their stance on gay marriage still has no place in this thread.

    As such, to post it, the only correlation between that and the on topic discussion, would be anti-islamic sentiment.

    Honestly its people like you and darkpagandeathwhatever that helps people like this lad to radicalize. No doubt their elders and the internet are the primary offenders but when they see this kind of ignorant carry-on from the westerner their elder has told them is out to get them... well; kinda proves it for them doesn't it? This 'them and us' attitude festers on both sides. As someone who is not fully Irish I can tell you growing up here was horrendous. In my town to this day places Polish kids frequent are frequently sprayed with swastikas by Irish kids. Basketball court is covered with them. Throw radicalism in that mix of resentment and division. What do you get? No wonder we're seeing tens of thousands from the British Isles off joining Daesh of all bloody things! You're part of the problem.

    Tens of thousands from the British Isles alone, yet only 0.000001 are radicalised?? Maths not your strong point??


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    #5017
    ohnonotgmail
    Registered Users Posts: 40,413 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    Wright wrote: »
    Duh?

    Remarking on their stance on gay marriage still has no place in this thread.

    As such, to post it, the only correlation between that and the on topic discussion, would be anti-islamic sentiment.

    Honestly its people like you and darkpagandeathwhatever that helps people like this lad to radicalize. No doubt their elders and the internet are the primary offenders but when they see this kind of ignorant carry-on from the westerner their elder has told them is out to get them... well; kinda proves it for them doesn't it? This 'them and us' attitude festers on both sides. As someone who is not fully Irish I can tell you growing up here was horrendous. In my town to this day places Polish kids frequent are frequently sprayed with swastikas by Irish kids. Basketball court is covered with them. Throw radicalism in that mix of resentment and division. What do you get? No wonder we're seeing tens of thousands from the British Isles off joining Daesh of all bloody things! You're part of the problem.


    original post deleted. you're not worth getting an infraction for.


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    #5018
    Hans Bricks
    Registered Users Posts: 850 ✭✭✭Hans Bricks


    Wright wrote: »
    I'd be moderately right wing myself so that's a fairly dumb assumption right off the bat. Not a great start was it...

    Sorry, but first impressions and all that.

    I only ever see that irritating term used on threads by the same sanctimonious apologists if an ugly truth or negative fact is brought up about an individual(s) who happens to be Muslim or affiliated to a sect of Islam/political movement. Coining disdain for a religion as a new age phobia is just pure arrogance.


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    #5019
    darkpagandeath
    Closed Accounts Posts: 24,465 ✭✭✭✭darkpagandeath


    Wright wrote: »
    It's not though. If you want to create a thread defaming his family fire ahead. But that's not what the thread was about.

    Read up who the Muslim Brotherhood are ... Jesus.


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    #5020
    darkpagandeath
    Closed Accounts Posts: 24,465 ✭✭✭✭darkpagandeath


    Wright wrote: »
    I don't have issue with any of that. Thank you for taking the time to fill me in on what's happened as I've not been here.

    His local mosque's actions during the vote are completely off-topic however, and is used to paint the mosque and Islam in a negative light. No other way to slice it I'm afraid.

    Toss out The Islam card all one likes. An Egyptian is being held in Egypt charged under Egyptian law.


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    #5021
    ohnonotgmail
    Registered Users Posts: 40,413 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    Wright wrote: »
    It's not though. If you want to create a thread defaming his family fire ahead. But that's not what the thread was about.


    you do realise that it is not defamation if it is the truth, right?


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    #5022
    darkpagandeath
    Closed Accounts Posts: 24,465 ✭✭✭✭darkpagandeath


    Wright wrote: »
    Duh?

    Remarking on their stance on gay marriage still has no place in this thread.

    As such, to post it, the only correlation between that and the on topic discussion, would be anti-islamic sentiment.

    Honestly its people like you and darkpagandeathwhatever that helps people like this lad to radicalize. No doubt their elders and the internet are the primary offenders but when they see this kind of ignorant carry-on from the westerner their elder has told them is out to get them... well; kinda proves it for them doesn't it? This 'them and us' attitude festers on both sides. As someone who is not fully Irish I can tell you growing up here was horrendous. In my town to this day places Polish kids frequent are frequently sprayed with swastikas by Irish kids. Basketball court is covered with them. Throw radicalism in that mix of resentment and division. What do you get? No wonder we're seeing tens of thousands from the British Isles off joining Daesh of all bloody things! You're part of the problem.

    I'm not a Christian or a Muslim how have I radicalised this lad ?


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    #5023
    weldoninhio
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,311 ✭✭✭✭weldoninhio


    darkpagandeath wrote: »
    I'm not a Christian or a Muslim how have I radicalised this lad ?

    He's not worth engaging with. In his eyes it is entirely impossible that Ibrahim might just be a bad egg. It HAS to be someone/something else's fault.


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    #5024
    hatrickpatrick
    Registered Users Posts: 17,797 ✭✭✭✭hatrickpatrick


    Wright wrote: »
    I'd be moderately right wing myself so that's a fairly dumb assumption right off the bat. Not a great start was it...

    Don't you mean....

    *takes off glasses*

    ...Wright wing? ;) :pac:


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    #5025
    Wright
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,120 ✭✭✭Wright


    darkpagandeath wrote: »
    Toss out The Islam card all one likes. An Egyptian is being held in Egypt charged under Egyptian law.

    An Irish citizen is being held in Egypt.


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    #5026
    Wright
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,120 ✭✭✭Wright


    hatrickpatrick wrote: »
    Don't you mean....

    *takes off glasses*

    ...Wright wing? ;) :pac:

    That's a good one :D
    weldoninhio wrote: »
    He's not worth engaging with. In his eyes it is entirely impossible that Ibrahim might just be a bad egg. It HAS to be someone/something else's fault.

    That's some serious reading comprehension failure, I've remarked a number of times about the fact that if he wants to stay there, leave him there. Him choosing to stay certainly suggests he is heavily indoctrinated in the radicalized side of his faith.

    Learn to read please.


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    #5027
    ohnonotgmail
    Registered Users Posts: 40,413 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    Wright wrote: »
    An Irish citizen is being held in Egypt.

    a dual irish-egyptian citizen. who entered eqypt on his egyptian passport.


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    #5028
    Wright
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,120 ✭✭✭Wright


    ohnonotgmail wrote: »
    a dual irish-egyptian citizen. who entered eqypt on his egyptian passport.

    Therefore, he is an Irish citizen no matter how you slice it. Think you need to look up 'dual' in the dictionary.


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    #5029
    weldoninhio
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,311 ✭✭✭✭weldoninhio


    Wright wrote: »
    Therefore, he is an Irish citizen no matter how you slice it. Think you need to look up 'dual' in the dictionary.

    Think you need to look up international law. In the eyes of the Egyptian legal system, he is recognised as an Egyptian citizen. It's down to the kindness of the Egyptians that the Irish consulate have any access to him at all.

    If they wanted to the Egyptians could deny the Irish consulate any visits, or any information, and it would be perfectly legal and within their remit to do so.


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    #5030
    Wright
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,120 ✭✭✭Wright


    weldoninhio wrote: »
    Think you need to look up international law. In the eyes of the Egyptian legal system, he is recognised as an Egyptian citizen. It's down to the kindness of the Egyptians that the Irish consulate have any access to him at all.

    If they wanted to the Egyptians could deny the Irish consulate any visits, or any information, and it would be perfectly legal and within their remit to do so.

    What your willfully missing is that Egypt is not exactly a fair and open democracy right now; 'perfectly legal' in their book could be some messed up ♡♡♡♡, hence the whole hubbub in the first place. If this lad got arrested in Sweden or somewhere, no fuss, no thread. Your logic centres fail you.


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    #5031
    darkpagandeath
    Closed Accounts Posts: 24,465 ✭✭✭✭darkpagandeath


    Wright wrote: »
    Therefore, he is an Irish citizen no matter how you slice it. Think you need to look up 'dual' in the dictionary.

    Yes one does, Most countries do no recognise the other passport when you are in said country you have citizenship in.

    I find it tiresome one expecting everyone to summarise what's been going on and basically making stuff up as one goes along. Chucking out the “Phobia card” even though there is no such thing as a religious Phobia. I would argue the sisters have their citizenship removed by the minister as they obviously want to live in Egypt under the MB. As naturalisation is not the same as being born here and has conditions. They are currently fugitives of the law.


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    #5032
    darkpagandeath
    Closed Accounts Posts: 24,465 ✭✭✭✭darkpagandeath


    Wright wrote: »
    What your willfully missing is that Egypt is not exactly a fair and open democracy right now; 'perfectly legal' in their book could be some messed up ♡♡♡♡, hence the whole hubbub in the first place. If this lad got arrested in Sweden or somewhere, no fuss, no thread. Your logic centres fail you.

    Neither was it Under the MB they were in the process of giving the President absolute power. What one thinks of their legal system is ones right. But A person cannot go to a country incite violence then expect a Green shirt to get you out once you have been rumbled as a MB supporter. The video evidence has sunk him no need for anything else. We have laws here to do with inciting violence.

    The MB are a terrorist organisation.


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    #5033
    ohnonotgmail
    Registered Users Posts: 40,413 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    Wright wrote: »
    What your willfully missing is that Egypt is not exactly a fair and open democracy right now; 'perfectly legal' in their book could be some messed up ♡♡♡♡, hence the whole hubbub in the first place. If this lad got arrested in Sweden or somewhere, no fuss, no thread. Your logic centres fail you.

    your opinion of the state of the Egyptian government is irrelevant. and thankfully so. the government that is there is recognised internationally. that is all that matters.


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    #5034
    Wright
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,120 ✭✭✭Wright


    darkpagandeath wrote: »
    We have laws here to do with inciting violence.

    No way? Really? Why'd you reckon I suggested having him detained as soon as he came back? So the Gards could give him a massage?


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    #5035
    ohnonotgmail
    Registered Users Posts: 40,413 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    Wright wrote: »
    Therefore, he is an Irish citizen no matter how you slice it. Think you need to look up 'dual' in the dictionary.

    i am well aware of what dual means. I am also aware of what dual means when you are in one of the countries you hold citizenship of. when he is in eqypt his irish citizenship is irrelevant. he is treated as an eqyptian citizen. he did enter egypt on an egyptian passport after all. Ireland has no claim to him. the irish consulate in Cairo doesnt even have the right to talk to him. the egyptians have allowed us to provide consular services. the key word there is allowed. we have no right under international law to do so.


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    #5036
    ohnonotgmail
    Registered Users Posts: 40,413 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    Wright wrote: »
    No way? Really? Why'd you reckon I suggested having him detained as soon as he came back? So the Gards could give him a massage?

    why we would detain him? he hasnt broken any laws here. he has allegedly broken them in Egypt so it is the eqyptian authorities that are dealing with him.


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    #5037
    darkpagandeath
    Closed Accounts Posts: 24,465 ✭✭✭✭darkpagandeath


    Wright wrote: »
    No way? Really? Why'd you reckon I suggested having him detained as soon as he came back? So the Gards could give him a massage?

    One is advocating getting the chap out of Egypt for stuff that is illegal here, He is being held in Egypt as they have evidence he broke the law. It's that simple. He could be called paddy and have ginger hair, would not change my stance on inciting violence and supporting a terrorist organisation. It's all the more worrying as the family seem to be the same.

    Also look at them supporting that charity that does not condemn extremism. You know that one that says that lad who likes beheading people was a nice chap.


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    #5038
    Wright
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,120 ✭✭✭Wright


    ohnonotgmail wrote: »
    why we would detain him? he hasnt broken any laws here. he has allegedly broken them in Egypt so it is the eqyptian authorities that are dealing with him.

    It's like your brain resets every 2 minutes and I have to explain it again! :D


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    #5039
    Wright
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,120 ✭✭✭Wright


    darkpagandeath wrote: »
    He could be called paddy and have ginger hair, would not change my stance

    Oh but it would, I mentioned we've done this for western Irish citizens before, you bolded 'western' when quoting me and gave a little :P
    That's about when you showed your 'I'm a massive racist' card.

    Did you think we'd forget?


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    #5040
    ohnonotgmail
    Registered Users Posts: 40,413 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    Wright wrote: »
    It's like your brain resets every 2 minutes and I have to explain it again! :D

    just for old times sake why not explain it again for stupid old me. why would the irish government detain him for crimes committed abroad?


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    #5041
    darkpagandeath
    Closed Accounts Posts: 24,465 ✭✭✭✭darkpagandeath


    Wright wrote: »
    It's like your brain resets every 2 minutes and I have to explain it again! :D

    One has not explained anything please elaborate ?


This discussion has been closed.
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