Brock vs Undertaker WM30 Discussion *WM30 Spoilers*

gnfnrhead

Diabhal Beag wrote: »

Honestly think it was worth it just for that moment. No need to pin the blame on anybody. Was an amazing moment and one of the rare genuine shockers you'll ever see.

Watch the crowd during the actual count. It's amazing.

One - Everybody counts along
Two - Everybody counts along
Kic.... Three - Gasps :eek:

I've watched that bit over and over already and it gets better every time.

Eire-Dearg

It was either win and leave undefeated (there's no way he's coming back again) or lose and build up someone for the future.

It was too early to put someone like Roman in that position. CM Punk bailed, but what would he have achieved as the taker of Taker's streak? Still a hugely over guy that could go back to being a face next week.

Lesnar. Lesnar is the monster heel that needed to be re-monsterized and that's what they've done. They've now recreated a character reviled enough to balance Daniel Bryan in a possible title exchange, or to take on Roman Reigns and build him up more credibly than an old Taker in an undoubtedly better match.

Roman v Lesnar at WM31 would be huge, not least for the title.

Itssoeasy

So will taker get a ric flair style retirement send off ? I think that's the last we see of taker in a wwe ring. I think he will ride off into the sunset now and be inducted into the HOF as soon as he wants to be inducted.

JP Liz V1

I always thought Brock and Taker didn't get on off screen and had real backstage heat

Donegal Dan

Whats going on here then?

Hmmmmm!

Sean Waltman @TheRealXPac • 2h
It was a knee jerk reaction & I shouldn't have tweeted my opinion without knowing the facts. I'm not at liberty to comment further

Sean Waltman @TheRealXPac • 2h
My thoughts go out to Taker, I realize what happened now and I apologize for publicly questioning the finish. That's all I'm going to say.

savemejebus

gnfnrhead wrote: »

Watch the crowd during the actual count. It's amazing.

One - Everybody counts along
Two - Everybody counts along
Kic.... Three - Gasps :eek:

I've watched that bit over and over already and it gets better every time.

Only interesting bit of the match tbh, such a disappointing performance regardless of result, think Brock v Goldberg was more entertaining

A Rogue Hobo

Seeing as everyone is throwing out mental conspiracy theories that make no sense figure I may as well join the bandwagon. It seems quite clear now that yonks ago when Taker confronted Lesnar at UFC asking him "So you wanna do it?" was directly about him joining WWE or even possibly about breaking the streak. Months later he appears night after Wrestlemania and he's signed to a 1 year contract with the option of WWE renewing it for a further year which they chose to take and also decided to sign him for additional year. At least thats the information that people online seem to know.

Is it possible, that Taker planned on giving the streak to Lesnar 2 years ago? But WWE/Vince being smart wanted to make sure Lesnar was in this for the long haul? That he wasn't going to beat Taker then leave them high and dry for a second time? So they had him lose to Cena and HHH then work with Punk just to see if he was being serious about the whole thing then once again as his contract is about to expire tell him that he can have his match with Taker but only if he signs a longer contract? Someone in this thread earlier said that Lesnar doesn't have any passion for wrestling which I'd disagree with, he left wrestling 2/3 years before Benoit/Eddie. And I think it's fair to say the world of pro wrestling and how wrestlers are treated is very different since Benoit/Eddie. Fair to say he always had a passion for wrestling, but wrestling and its schedule killed his passion?

RobbingBandit

I would say X-Pac got torn a new one for posting last night, maybe Lesnar is gonna go on a short run now for a few weeks/months would love to see him vs Batista for the title at Summerslam

Strongbow10

A Rogue Hobo wrote: »

Seeing as everyone is throwing out mental conspiracy theories that make no sense figure I may as well join the bandwagon. It seems quite clear now that yonks ago when Taker confronted Lesnar at UFC asking him "So you wanna do it?" was directly about him joining WWE or even possibly about breaking the streak. Months later he appears night after Wrestlemania and he's signed to a 1 year contract with the option of WWE renewing it for a further year which they chose to take and also decided to sign him for additional year. At least thats the information that people online seem to know.

Is it possible, that Taker planned on giving the streak to Lesnar 2 years ago? But WWE/Vince being smart wanted to make sure Lesnar was in this for the long haul? That he wasn't going to beat Taker then leave them high and dry for a second time? So they had him lose to Cena and HHH then work with Punk just to see if he was being serious about the whole thing then once again as his contract is about to expire tell him that he can have his match with Taker but only if he signs a longer contract? Someone in this thread earlier said that Lesnar doesn't have any passion for wrestling which I'd disagree with, he left wrestling 2/3 years before Benoit/Eddie. And I think it's fair to say the world of pro wrestling and how wrestlers are treated is very different since Benoit/Eddie. Fair to say he always had a passion for wrestling, but wrestling and its schedule killed his passion?

doubt that "being offered the streak" would be any great carrot to Lesnar. Its quite clear how he sees pro wrestling and thats as a money making venture. This time around he is in a position to make alot of money for alot less work.

I get the impression Lesnar cares little about legacy in his pro wrestling career, if a loss to Santino netted him a big paycheck he would do it in a heartbeat id imagine.

krudler

gnfnrhead wrote: »

Watch the crowd during the actual count. It's amazing.

One - Everybody counts along
Two - Everybody counts along
Kic.... Three - Gasps :eek:

I've watched that bit over and over already and it gets better every time.

Same, so here it is again :pac:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NNZMUMb5E6g

Those reaction shots will be played forever

A Rogue Hobo

Strongbow10 wrote: »

doubt that "being offered the streak" would be any great carrot to Lesnar. Its quite clear how he sees pro wrestling and thats as a money making venture. This time around he is in a position to make alot of money for alot less work.

I get the impression Lesnar cares little about legacy in his pro wrestling career, if a loss to Santino netted him a big paycheck he would do it in a heartbeat id imagine.

I think that a little bit of a quick assumption to make. This is the same guy that turned down one of the biggest contracts ever offered by WWE to pursue an unsuccessful money-losing NFL career. At this stage of his life, he doesn't strike me as a guy that only does things for money but rather will only do something he cares about if the right money is offered. Because quite frankly, he doesn't even need the money.

Strongbow10

A Rogue Hobo wrote: »

I think that a little bit of a quick assumption to make. This is the same guy that turned down one of the biggest contracts ever offered by WWE to pursue an unsuccessful money-losing NFL career. At this stage of his life, he doesn't strike me as a guy that only does things for money but rather will only do something he cares about if the right money is offered. Because quite frankly, he doesn't even need the money.

The reason he is back in WWE is to make money. Nothing to do with his legacy in the pro wrestling business.

He is only back due to retirement from MMA. He has exhausted other avenues in terms of being a legit sports star and he has found success.

People can cling to the notion he has a new found love/respect for the business but its purely for the $$$$

And I love watching the guy for what its worth. But lets be real about it

A Rogue Hobo

Strongbow10 wrote: »

The reason he is back in WWE is to make money. Nothing to do with his legacy in the pro wrestling business.

He is only back due to retirement from MMA. He has exhausted other avenues in terms of being a legit sports star and he has found success.

People can cling to the notion he has a new found love/respect for the business but its purely for the $$$$

And I love watching the guy for what its worth. But lets be real about it

I still think it's a little bit of column A and little bit of column B really. He could easily find easy paydays in Hollywood with an even lighter schedule if he was arsed but he chose Pro Wrestling. Something to be said for that in my opinion.

Ape Lincoln

A Rogue Hobo wrote: »

Seeing as everyone is throwing out mental conspiracy theories that make no sense figure I may as well join the bandwagon. It seems quite clear now that yonks ago when Taker confronted Lesnar at UFC asking him "So you wanna do it?" was directly about him joining WWE or even possibly about breaking the streak. Months later he appears night after Wrestlemania and he's signed to a 1 year contract with the option of WWE renewing it for a further year which they chose to take and also decided to sign him for additional year. At least thats the information that people online seem to know.

Is it possible, that Taker planned on giving the streak to Lesnar 2 years ago? But WWE/Vince being smart wanted to make sure Lesnar was in this for the long haul? That he wasn't going to beat Taker then leave them high and dry for a second time? So they had him lose to Cena and HHH then work with Punk just to see if he was being serious about the whole thing then once again as his contract is about to expire tell him that he can have his match with Taker but only if he signs a longer contract? Someone in this thread earlier said that Lesnar doesn't have any passion for wrestling which I'd disagree with, he left wrestling 2/3 years before Benoit/Eddie. And I think it's fair to say the world of pro wrestling and how wrestlers are treated is very different since Benoit/Eddie. Fair to say he always had a passion for wrestling, but wrestling and its schedule killed his passion?

Not a conspiracy theory per se. WWE were in negotiations back around then about bringing Brock in and Taker had offered to lose to Lesnar. I don't understand why they didn't do the match last year other than maybe someone likes round numbers and three Xs.

It's pretty well documented that Lesnar lacks the passion for pro wrestling that Eddie et al would have had. If UFC had've been as big as it became in 2000 then he would've gone straight there.

Corholio

They talk about proper Wrestlemania 'moment's, they're genuinely hasn't been a huge amount of them the past few years. That was certainly a bonafide one. I loved that it happened like that, gave me that shocked gut feeling that I haven't had in quite a while from wrestling.

Qs

I think Lesnar just couldn't deal with the schedule. Obviously he wants to earn money, everyone does but its not like he hates wrestling.

I also don't really believe Lesnar was offered the streak in negotiations. A very small group of people knew about the match finish on Sunday, certainly no other wrestlers. I don't think they could have kept it that quiet right up until Sunday if it had been agreed 3 years ago.

salacious crumb

Ape Lincoln wrote: »

I hope this means there won't be a match with Sting the gasbag next year.

Christ, no!

seandotcomm wrote: »

Taker probably got wind of the Sting plans for next year and was "lolz, cya's ladzzz"

Sensible choice.

spiralism wrote: »

Taker's headlined before on a streak match hasn't he? Or would i be wrong and it was a title one?

He headlined v Batista in a streak v title match.

spiralism wrote: »

Essentially tonight summed up why Vince is the one who's made millions in television and smarks are just smarks. They build up to Wrestlemania all year and this one was one of the best and possibly the most memorable.

....just had a Wrestlemania that TV history was made in.

Agreed 100%.

I was just thinking though, what if Knux is Knux Calloway, and Taker's the dad he doesn't get along with....... :pac:

















Yeah. That was a joke.

salacious crumb

gnfnrhead wrote: »

He was babyface for the Angle Wrestlemania match. Since about November as best I can recall. Not sure when he changed back.

Yeah, Heyman screwed him over and sided with Big Show. Lasted a couple of months.

rovert

A video of a banjaxed Undertaker yesterday:
http://instagram.com/p/mgReBFnj5D

Necro

salacious crumb wrote: »

Yeah, Heyman screwed him over and sided with Big Show. Lasted a couple of months.

Didn't he turn heel again right about the time Angle returned from his injury layoff after WM that year? I seem to remember them having a brilliant match on Smackdown around Summerslam time, and they also fought at Summerslam I think?

CSF

Necrominus wrote: »

Didn't he turn heel again right about the time Angle returned from his injury layoff after WM that year? I seem to remember them having a brilliant match on Smackdown around Summerslam time, and they also fought at Summerslam I think?

Yeah think that was the time of the hilarious Zach Gowen assaults

Moneymaker

Necrominus wrote: »

Didn't he turn heel again right about the time Angle returned from his injury layoff after WM that year? I seem to remember them having a brilliant match on Smackdown around Summerslam time, and they also fought at Summerslam I think?

Iron Man match, it was incredible

Ape Lincoln

rovert wrote: »

A video of a banjaxed Undertaker yesterday:
http://instagram.com/p/mgReBFnj5D

Showed this to my nephew and he said Taker was walking how his 60+yr old grandad (who had a hip replacement) walks.

Itssoeasy

Ape Lincoln wrote: »

Showed this to my nephew and he said Taker was walking how his 60+yr old grandad (who had a hip replacement) walks.

Hasn't taker had a partial hip replacement ? Didn't Scott hall say it in one of those videos around his own hip surgery ? He said his was different to takers one ?

buckfasterer

rovert wrote: »

A video of a banjaxed Undertaker yesterday:
http://instagram.com/p/mgReBFnj5D

Man thats such a shame. Seeing him like that makes you wish he'd called it quits a few years ago. I know there was a concussion but he's obviously not up to it anymore!

Agent Coulson

Agent Coulson

The Iron Sheik a Conspiracy!:eek::D

http://www.tmz.com/2014/04/08/iron-sheik-undertaker-brock-lesnar-wrestlemania-30-conspiracy/

Dep!

Agent Coulson wrote: »

The Iron Sheik a Conspiracy!:eek::D

http://www.tmz.com/2014/04/08/iron-sheik-undertaker-brock-lesnar-wrestlemania-30-conspiracy/

Could the concussion have sparked a change in direction?

The Iron Sheik has joined the grassy knoll lunch club ... claiming The Undertaker's loss at WrestleMania 30 was an off-the-cuff conspiracy triggered by an injury during the match.

It was a shocking loss ... breaking a record 21 wins in a row.

Undertaker suffered a serious concussion during his match against Brock Lesnar. A fringe cell -- including Iron Sheik -- believes Undertaker was supposed to win but after the injury there was a mad scramble to change the plan because Undertaker wasn't physically able to seal the deal.

The problem with the theory -- lots of people at the center of the WWE say Undertaker handpicked Brock years ago and more than likely planned to pass the torch at Sunday's event.

CSF

Agent Coulson wrote: »

The Iron Sheik a Conspiracy!:eek::D

http://www.tmz.com/2014/04/08/iron-sheik-undertaker-brock-lesnar-wrestlemania-30-conspiracy/

No way is that the best part of the interview though, the Ultimate Warrior bit, gold.

Dep!

Man loses £35,000 on Taker bet



More tweets from him here http://imgur.com/a/AgEJa

Corholio

He even has a nickname now :pac:

He actually has quite a cool story, especially when he met Triple H. His answer to that is worth a read.

http://www.wwe.com/inside/shocked-undertaker-fan-speaks-26225224

D.Q

Dep! wrote: »

Man loses £35,000 on Taker bet



More tweets from him here http://imgur.com/a/AgEJa

definitely fake, no bookies would take 35,000 on a novelty.

Penn

And why would anyone bother just to make a return of $500? Easy money or not, the risk vs reward of that bet is just ridiculous.

Cianan2

Corholio wrote: »

He even has a nickname now :pac:

He actually has quite a cool story, especially when he met Triple H. His answer to that is worth a read.

http://www.wwe.com/inside/shocked-undertaker-fan-speaks-26225224

I've read this interview, and its deja vu. "Shocked undertaker fan" is a boards regular, because the Triple H story has been told here before!! Time to start digging...!

Edit: http://touch.boards.ie/thread/2056921465/45/#post86004127[\url]

kronsington

That promo Heyman cut on Raw about the Streak ending is one of the best in years without a doubt.

Agent Coulson

Comedy Gold.

Dep!

Agent Coulson wrote: »

Comedy Gold.

"Dont worry, he'll be happier when he finds out Daniel Bryan won"

Agent Coulson

I lol at That's it I'm cancelling The Network after my 6 month commitment even if it means missing Legends House. :pac:

Soft Falling Rain

The irony is that these fanboys don't realise that the streak, indirectly, is STILL going to make a superstar. Lesnar has been put over as not only as a major monster, but also a monster that kayfabe wise, is still in his peak. There's unlimited storylines to be told by this.

Agent Coulson

Michael Cole interviews Paul Heyman this week.. More Comedy Gold.

http://www.wwe.com/videos/playlists/exclusive-interviews-with-michael-cole

Rjd2

Penn wrote: »

And why would anyone bother just to make a return of $500? Easy money or not, the risk vs reward of that bet is just ridiculous.

Nah, people have bet much sillier odds to win much smaller amounts, but nope no bookie would take that on a novelty event.

CSF

Rjd2 wrote: »

Nah, people have bet much sillier odds to win much smaller amounts, but nope no bookie would take that on a novelty event.

I've never seen a max on these kind of markets, granted I've never thrown anything more than 2 euro on them either.

rovert

According to the new Wrestling Observer Chad Patton the referee wasn't told Brock was winning. No one the 3 count was funny. Imagine what was going on in his head those few seconds. :eek:

B.A._Baracus

rovert wrote: »

According to the new Wrestling Observer Chad Patton the referee wasn't told Brock was winning. No one the 3 count was funny. Imagine what was going on in his head those few seconds. :eek:

Wouldn't believe that.
There was no way he went out there not knowing the finish. Would allow for errors to happen. Such as pinning Brock in one of the false finishes.

He is just selling to so called 'secrecy' behind the result.

rovert

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

Wouldn't believe that.
There was no way he went out there not knowing the finish. Would allow for errors to happen. Such as pinning Brock in one of the false finishes.

He is just selling to so called 'secrecy' behind the result.

He knew the finish going out there. Just the wrong one/what others were told Undertaker winning. Watch/listen to the 3 count again it was off. So off people on Twitter at least thought it was a botch.

In the last 5 years referees have been told to officate matche if real. If a wrestler doesn't break from the ropes at 5 he will be DQ'd. Referees are praised backstage if they catch out not kicking out before 3 too.

Ape Lincoln

rovert wrote: »

In the last 5 years referees have been told to officate matche if real. If a wrestler doesn't break from the ropes at 5 he will be DQ'd. Referees are praised backstage if they catch out not kicking out before 3 too.

Always thought that was silly. There were parts in the match were either guy could've been counted for three eg. during each guy's kimura spot - the guy on the bottom is being pinned.

B.A._Baracus

ohhh... he was told the wrong finish?

Geez, thats pretty messed up knowing the match in question

*edit*
Just watched the count again... nothing wrong with it.

Ape Lincoln

rovert wrote: »

Watch/listen to the 3 count again it was off. So off people on Twitter at least thought it was a botch.

.

The three count wasn't off, it was a normal three count. Ref didn't hesitate at all.

D.Q

I definitely thought it was off watching it live. Listen to the cadence.

B.A._Baracus

Ape Lincoln wrote: »

The three count wasn't off, it was a normal three count. Ref didn't hesitate at all.

Exactly what I saw.
I think people are just looking into this finish too much.