Paying Rent At Home

Sadderday

Zillah wrote: »

So much of this is loaded with the assumption that the child in question is an entitled little shit and doesn't understand the basics of life and finance. Is it really so hard to imagine that a person can actually grow up as a mature, responsible person, who understands the value of money, without having been charged rent by their own parents the second it was feasible? I've never paid rent to my parents and I seem to be a hell of lot more sensible with my money than most people I know. There are better ways to teach a child to be responsible.

We're not talking about problem children here. If the topic was "My son is 26 and has never had a job and seems like he wants to live at home forever" then my response would be different. But that's not the topic, most people here are talking about charging their children rent as soon as they are 18 or when they get their first job, and making comments about how 'they know where the door is' or 'they'd be paying more than that if they got a place of their own' - of course they would, they'd have a complete stranger for a landlord who doesn't give a toss about them! Not the best comparison for a parent/child relationship.

As I said earlier, if money is tight for the parents and the contribution from their child would actually make a real difference to the household that's a different story, but I really don't think a lot of the people posting here are talking about that situation - they sound more like the "I had a hard time of life and my children shouldn't get it any easier" variety, which I think is petty and mean.

well I think its a disgrace that parents will allow their working adult children to live for free... my presumption is they are very well off and dont need the money or dont care for it.

If I couldn't pay they wouldn't force it, but I wouldn't ever think that I could earn money and not contribute.

Whether they need the money or not - you could save the money to send them on holiday or show your appreciation somehow.

Not saying everyone turns out spoilt I just do not understand how you don't feel guilty.

OldNotWIse

miamee wrote: »

At what stage should parents stop treating their offspring as children though? 18? 21? 30? 50? Just let them live with them free of charge forever?!

I think any parent has a duty to both themselves and to their adult child to make sure that an adult child with a full-time job pays their way. It is disrespectful in my opinion to your parent(s) to expect them to pick up your tab on their own (possibly single) full-time wage while the adult child fritters their wage away on whatever they feel like.
Expecting mammy and daddy to still feed and house you free of charge when you have finished your education and started working is incredibly immature and something that a parent should be educating their adult child about asap. Asking them to pay their own way is a mutually beneficial situation.

Indeed, I mean, dont the tables turn eventually? I know when my dad had his own business and things were good, they gave my nanny money every month because she was widowed young and had very little.(They also made sure their kids never wanted for anything) My brother and myself took on parents existing mortgage when dad got too sick to work. Dont mind, it will come back to us someday anyway and I'd rather make sacrifices than see them turfed out of their home. I always just figure they do their bit and then you do yours.

Alas they have made a sucker of me! Profiteering b*stards! I shall run amok later with this new information! :pac:

Call Me Jimmy

I think as a parent it would be hard to take someone's last bit of money, essentially their socialising money, in a situation where you are not stuck for cash, the child has already moved out and fended for themselves but are in a bit of financial difficulty. Personally I'd prefer they have their one night a week out after working.

OldNotWIse

Call Me Jimmy wrote: »

I think as a parent it would be hard to take someone's last bit of money, essentially their socialising money, in a situation where you are not stuck for cash, the child has already moved out and fended for themselves but are in a bit of financial difficulty. Personally I'd prefer they have their one night a week out after working.

I moved home at Christmas for a month, and gave my parents 300. They were genuinely shocked because they were happy to have me back and didnt think about taking anything, but I couldnt live off them for nothing. Anyway no more was said about it and at the end my mum gave it back to me to pay my college fees Nice surprise. I got the money back but scored brownie points too

Sadderday

Call Me Jimmy wrote: »

I think as a parent it would be hard to take someone's last bit of money, essentially their socialising money, in a situation where you are not stuck for cash, the child has already moved out and fended for themselves but are in a bit of financial difficulty. Personally I'd prefer they have their one night a week out after working.

we're not talking about taking someones last bit of money, but if an adult can afford to socialise they can afford to pay their way.

If the parent has to sacrifice their social life in order to fund their childs social life once they begin working - thats not really an ok situation in my eyes.

My parents wouldnt accept my last bit of money if I was stuck but I wouldnt go out for drinks knowing that they are at home hanging on to their cash because the ESB bill is due. Thats not really right either.

TimeToShine

The issue here is that the kid was "shocked" that he was asked to pay.

There's nothing wrong with living with your parents without paying. It's arguable that there's nothing wrong with not offering to pay them either, but having the gall at 22 to be surprised when you are asked to contribute is beyond laughable.

clint_silver

TimeToShine wrote: »

The issue here is that the kid was "shocked" that he was asked to pay.

There's nothing wrong with living with your parents without paying, It's arguable that there's nothing wrong with not offering to pay them, but having the gall at 22 to be surprised when you are asked to contribute is beyond laughable.

Im not so sure its laughable, it depends on how they were brought up. If they always had things done for them and never had real life and living matters explained, being shocked would be a natural reaction.

Lots of not very street smart 22 year olds out there who dont know what the done thing is. They might not have had that kind of conversation ever before either with parents or more importantly with friends of a similar age who all pay themselves which can form opinions in minds that would mean if theyre concientious they would then offer it without asking..

Call Me Jimmy

Exactly. If he was shocked it means it hasn't been mentioned to him before when he didn't have a job. He was probably feeling a bit good about having gotten a job (I'm presuming by the age that he finished college) and was expecting a lot of pats on the back and wasn't expecting to have to pay, not knowing any better.

I always think 'if you were them you'd be the exact same because you would be them', makes it easier to relate to people.

OldNotWIse

TimeToShine wrote: »

The issue here is that the kid was "shocked" that he was asked to pay.

There's nothing wrong with living with your parents without paying, It's arguable that there's nothing wrong with not offering to pay them, but having the gall at 22 to be surprised when you are asked to contribute is beyond laughable.

I had a friend like that. Never had to hand anything up. Tight as a fuucking ducks backside. The type who would be delighted if she was sent to the shop with a tenner to buy milk and dad forgot to ask for change back. Probably still has communion money. I remember being baffled at the end of one summer, we'd both had full time jobs before returning to school, and she every single paycheque unopened still in her room. Never handed up a penny.

Cue ten years later, she gets knocked up and has nowhere to live. What do mammy and daddy do? Spend their entire life savings building her an extensiont to live in rent free!

Last I time I spoke to her she told me my birthday present was in the boot of her car....the same place as last years.

meoklmrk91

My own personal opinion is that once you have any money coming in you should be contributing to the house you are living in, when I lived with my mother I paid for half of everything, when I lived with my father he wouldn't take anything on a weekly basis or let me pay for half of anything but I had to buy own groceries etc, and if he wanted money for a bill or anything he came to me and I handed it up happily. If I had my own children I would want them to hand up, more for themselves than anything, to teach them the value of money, the importance of saving and how to handle money.

I have seen people who were let run amock in this regard and they would eat their parents out of house and home and take their mothers late €20 if they wanted something. I know of a man in his thirties who won't give money to the house, he had one bill to take care of which was €20-€30 a month and he couldn't even manage that, has no savings, no car, no kids no real bills but every penny he has goes to waste while his mammy pays all his bills for him.

Paddy Cow

GarIT wrote: »

I never suggested anyone should live off their parents.

Do you have any proof of that or is it just a saying you heard? I'm pretty sure giving a child detailed lessons on money management is much more effective than saying "give me x amount of money because you need to experience real life" I don't even understand that, any reasonably educated child would see that money is paid for a reason and not just because real life. Posters actually suggested taking full rent from children so that they don't get a shock when they have to pay rent later, how is a shock now and loosing a lot of money needlessly better than the exact same shock later when you actually get something for it and what do they even learn from that.

In life, whether you are an adult or a child, there are two types of learning. Theoretical and practical. You can teach anyone the theory of anything but until they have practical experience, they won't truly understand the situation. Why do you think that graduates who have spent four years earning their degree get paid less than someone who has a degree and experience?

It's the same with kids. You can tell them until you are blue in the face but until they have experience of a situation, they won't "get" it. Having teenagers from 15/16+ pay a portion of their wage to the household prepares them for the real world. At that age they won't be earning a lot and lets face it, if they really needed money in an emergency, the parents would help them. The small amount they would be paying to their parents isn't going to make the parent's rich but it will make the child think about budgeting and getting used to the idea that take home pay does not mean disposable income.

It's a different story when the "child" is in their 20's and working full time. I agree with you when you say that parents will always see their children as children but when you hit your 20's the relationship does change. To have a healthy relationship with your parents, you need to transition from having an adult-child relationship to having an adult-adult relationship. Part of this is contributing to the household. I honestly don't know how an adult could live with their parents and not contribute.

Some parents actually think they are entitled to extra money from their children and those few people need to realise having children is not an investment having children is charity work with no expected return.

I don't think anyone has children with the idea that they will make a killing from taking money off their children once they are working. There are a small minority of parents who put undue pressure on their kids but like I said, these are the minority. Any decent parent does not take more than their kid can afford.

The only investment parents are likely to make off their children is emotional. Pride when they see their child grow up into an emotionally stable adult who is happy in life. Contentment when they can finally treat their kids like adults and have a grown up relationship with them.

If you want financial rewards, invest in the stock exchange, not children.

Posters here have suggested more than 50% actually. But you have completely missed my point, the point about handing up money had nothing at all to do with the amount, the point was all about the context of handing up money, if done to educate the children it's not a good way of doing things.

Posters have not suggest this. One poster told a story about a father with ten kids who actually incorporated your view into his parenting style. He drummed it into his kids from 14/15 that if they went to college/got a trade they wouldn't contribute. If they got a job or went on the dole they would have to contribute 50% of their income. The result was that his kids did college or a trade. Sounds like a great parent who explained how the world works to his kids early on.

GarIT wrote: »

I think you completely missed my point. You asked if my problem was only the reasoning, and I explained why the reasoning is my problem. I'm not saying there is no reason for giving money I meant why give money if you are specifically told there is not reason for doing so. Hence the reason why they are giving money is important. Having a child pay for themselves is completely reasonable.

This paragraph is a jumbled mess but I think you are saying that taking money off your kid without giving them a reason is unfair. I have yet to meet someone who contributed to the household who didn't know why they were doing so. I have yet to meet a parent who said "hand over x amount of your wages, no questions asked".

However saying give me money monthly to see what real life is like is in no way education and you'd be mad if you thought it was. Real life is a lot more complicated than just having money taken off you, if you are going to use it as an educational tool you need to do much more than say because real life. Other parents have advocated taking much more than the child actually costs just to teach the child what 'real life' is like, the parents just pocketed the extra money while the child learnt about 'real life' all I'm saying is that is wrong. I keep having to re-explain my original point in different ways and everytime I do someone else takes it up wrong.

You seem to have a real chip on your shoulder about some parents taking too much money off their kid. I'm sure that happens but it's not the norm. Most parents take a percentage (usually around 25%) and even that wouldn't be the same as if the kid was paying for themselves in rented accommodation. You made a point earlier that the % system wasn't fair, as if a child was earning €1000 a week, that would mean they were contributing €330 to the household. A child does not earn €1000 a week. An adult in their 20's does not earn €1000 a week (unless they are very lucky) so your point falls down.

The reason parents give a % of earnings fee is because the "child" is either a teenager who's meagre wages change from week or it's someone who has an entry level job with low pay. In either situation the contribution the "child" makes would not cover them if they had to live outside the home. This clearly shows that parents are not saying "pay me this much or move out". In some cases, where the parents can afford it, they save the money and give it to their "child" when they really need it (like a deposit for a house etc). Generally as the "child" moves up the pay grade, the contribution can reach as high as €100 a week but I have yet to meet someone paying this, who resents it. I know someone who felt he should have being giving his mother more but she wouldn't hear of it.

I honestly don't know why you are so against parents taking a % of their kids earnings once they are old enough to enter the working market. A lot of posts on this thread has been from people who are now adults and who contributed to the household from 15/16 and have nothing but praise for their parents. I have yet to read a post where someone was asked to contribute and it had a negative effect on them.


Getting back on topic. OP €60 per month is very low. I find it astounding that any adult at 22 would balk at paying €60 per month. You need to sit him down and explain that adults have responsibilities bills to pay. He is 22 and from the sounds of it either he has no idea how the world works or he is taking you for a ride.

In my opinion, you should be charging him €60 p/wk. I live in Galway and that wouldn't even cover my rent. And that's before other bills.

dwayneshintzy

I moved back home at the end of January, to save up money for a course starting in September (didn't wanna sign a lease on a new place).

I'm giving my parents 150 euro a fortnight at the moment.

qdawg86

NormalBob Ubiquitypants wrote: »

If you expect him to pay, no matter how nominal an amount then the relationship between you has to change as well. It becomes less family and more landlord tenant in my opinion. I didn't pay rent to family but I always did things at home including buying things that were needed around the house.
I think you ought to consider how this looks from his perspective- I noticed you said you were the step parent. I am not aware of the dynamic between you as a family, but it could be seen as give us money or get out.

I don't think families should charge or take money from each other period. That's what landlords, bankers and employers are for. It's your family and there is an issue of loyalty in my opinion. If you are concerned that he is not progressing enough with getting his own place etc then start encouraging out the door but never force someone out.

Money between families changes things no matter how small an amount.

Good luck.

For me, forcing my parents to pay my bills, rent and food when I'm an adult in full time work would 'change things' more and not for the better.

My parents have worked hard to raise me so I never had to want for anything. I couldn't bring myself to take advantage of them like that.

OldNotWIse

qdawg86 wrote: »

For me, forcing my parents to pay my bills, rent and food when I'm an adult in full time work would 'change things' more and not for the better.

My parents have worked hard to raise me so I never had to want for anything. I couldn't bring myself to take advantage of them like that.

Likewise. I handed up because I wanted to not because I had to. My salary is more than my parent's combined pension - how is it fair that I live off them? When they had money I never wanted for anything. What goes around comes around. Do people not realise that food and utilities cost money?

MammaZita

Haven't read all the responses so apologies if I'm repeating.

Once a child is finished full time education be it university or a trade etc then they should pay their way. I would have thought €100 pw would be realistic for own room, food and bills. That's only €400 PM- everything else is for themselves.

It's a valuable lesson and regardless of what they're earning, it teaches a young person the realities of paying your way in life and might inspire them to work a bit harder and improve their future earning potential. If a young person was on job seekers, then let them hand over most of that.

Now how you choose to use this money is up to you. Perhaps you could set aside some of it and after a year or so you could give him say €1k towards a car or something he may be saving for.

You can only financially support a "child" for so long or they will always remain a child. I'd never take money off a child while studying- I'd prefer if they used this money to fully support themselves.

My children are only young but this is how I intend brining them up.

Neyite

I moved out when I was 18. So I've been about 21 years flatsharing. I can spot the flatmates who never had to hand up any money to their parents within days.

They are the ones who blatantly use your food /detergents/bog roll without asking, yet never replace it, sometimes even complaining to you when it runs out, they are the ones who leave the heating on all night, yet give out yards when the esb bill comes in because of the size of the bill, and the ones who are slow to pay their share of any the bills, if at all, without lots of reminders, and a lot of bad grace.

Typically I have found that these ones also are the very folk who have no regard for you getting up to do an early shift and throw a party without checking with you, letting their friends have your bed when you are away for the weekend, and also give out about the stack of dirty dishes/ state of the place, but yet do a token amount of housework in spite of being the filthiest flatmate of us all.

In short, they are major pains in the hole to live with. Parents who dont ask their precious snowflakes for a few quid or help with household chores are doing the rest of us a big disservice.

The flatmates who handed up money from their summer jobs, who had chores and responsibilities from a young age were a dream to live with in a flatshare.

Its not about money - its about moulding them into adults who have to interact and co-exist with other adults.

Jackal756

Firstly let me put my hands up and say I do not pay rent per se
I do however help with groceries and pay the odd bill
Let me give you two differing scenarios
Friends of mine both in their mid 20s
Friend A unemployed but trying hard to find work gets €188 a week of which his parents expect €150!
Friend B 26 working part time with a kid drinks heavily a complete drain and huge worry on his parents wrecked a car which his father bought for him
Surely the first guy could be cut some slack and the second guy needs a kick up the backside
The point I'm making is if you have an all round good kid who is no hassle to have around try and be reasonable you could just as easily be saddled with a waste of space bleeding you dry
Weigh it up and count your blessings

Murt10

Parents of friend A are being completely unreasonable in this case.

Solution - move out.

OldNotWIse

Jackal756 wrote: »

Firstly let me put my hands up and say I do not pay rent per se
I do however help with groceries and pay the odd bill
Let me give you two differing scenarios
Friends of mine both in their mid 20s
Friend A unemployed but trying hard to find work gets €188 a week of which his parents expect €150!
Friend B 26 working part time with a kid drinks heavily a complete drain and huge worry on his parents wrecked a car which his father bought for him
Surely the first guy could be cut some slack and the second guy needs a kick up the backside
The point I'm making is if you have an all round good kid who is no hassle to have around try and be reasonable you could just as easily be saddled with a waste of space bleeding you dry
Weigh it up and count your blessings

I wouldnt expect my elderly parents to support me as a reward for not growing up as a complete waste of space.

Jackal756

OldNotWIse wrote: »

I wouldnt expect my elderly parents to support me as a reward for not growing up as a complete waste of space.

Nor I but if I were a parent I think I'd rather have a decent kid not paying me rent than an layabout getting into trouble and taking drugs who let's face it will end up costing you a lot more in the long run not just financially but emotionally

OldNotWIse

Jackal756 wrote: »

Nor I but if I were a parent I think I'd rather have a decent kid not paying me rent than an layabout getting into trouble and taking drugs who let's face it will end up costing you a lot more in the long run not just financially but emotionally

True. But the mutual exclusivity argument is just that. The reality is that most kids are normal, and not tearaways, and capable of handing up. Thankfully most parents dont have to choose between getting rent and avoiding anti social behaviour.

Jackal756

OldNotWIse wrote: »

True. But the mutual exclusivity argument is just that. The reality is that most kids are normal, and not tearaways, and capable of handing up. Thankfully most parents dont have to choose between getting rent and avoiding anti social behaviour

Personally I was always encouraged to save my parents belief being that as they had more than sufficient income to meet their outgoings it would be pointless me giving them money which I could save for my own future now don't get me wrong I realise everybody Is not in this position but a kid with their head screwed on right in the first place will give their parents peace of mind which is worth a lot more than money

OldNotWIse

Jackal756 wrote: »

OldNotWIse wrote: »

True. But the mutual exclusivity argument is just that. The reality is that most kids are normal, and not tearaways, and capable of handing up. Thankfully most parents dont have to choose between getting rent and avoiding anti social behaviour

Personally I was always encouraged to save my parents belief being that as they had more than sufficient income to meet their outgoings it would be pointless me giving them money which I could save for my own future now don't get me wrong I realise everybody Is not in this position but a kid with their head screwed on right in the first place will give their parents peace of mind which is worth a lot more than money

You're right, not everbody is in that position. We were encouraged to save too - again, the two are not mutually exclusive. Its easy to save when you're not handing up. We saved, we handed up and we have our heads screwed on and (as far as I know/hope) I dont cause my parents unnecessary stress.

Jackal756

OldNotWIse wrote: »

Jackal756 wrote: »

You're right, not everbody is in that position. We were encouraged to save too - again, the two are not mutually exclusive. Its easy to save when you're not handing up. We saved, we handed up and we have our heads screwed on and (as far as I know/hope) I dont cause my parents unnecessary stress.

There seems to be a belief here that not charging your child rent automatically means they will grow up a spoiled brat
This may be true of some children but I feel giving your child a chance to get a bit of a head start in life will pay dividends later on in terms of the appreciation they will show for helping them get on their feet I realise there are two sides to the whole preparing for real life argument but in my 5 years earning I have accumulated 30k plus in savings and I am not financially irresponsible this I feel means I will be more financially secure and independent in the long term

OldNotWIse

Jackal756 wrote: »

OldNotWIse wrote: »

There seems to be a belief here that not charging your child rent automatically means they will grow up a spoiled brat
This may be true of some children but I feel giving your child a chance to get a bit of a head start in life will pay dividends later on in terms of the appreciation they will show for helping them get on their feet I realise there are two sides to the whole preparing for real life argument but in my 5 years earning I have accumulated 30k plus in savings and I am not financially irresponsible this I feel means I will be more financially secure and independent in the long term

There are also plenty of ways of giving your children a head start in life that do not involve money. I appreciate everything my parents did for me, they made plenty of sacrifices so that I could have the best in life, but they didnt let me live for nothing. I may not have 30k in savings but my head is screwed on and I can afford to pay my own rent, their mortgage and 6k a year college fees.

Jackal756

OldNotWIse wrote: »

Jackal756 wrote: »

There are also plenty of ways of giving your children a head start in life that do not involve money. I appreciate everything my parents did for me, they made plenty of sacrifices so that I could have the best in life, but they didnt let me live for nothing. I may not have 30k in savings but my head is screwed on and I can afford to pay my own rent, their mortgage and 6k a year college fees.

Your paying their mortgage fair enough but is that not just the same thing in reverse ie the parent living off their child which I wouldn't agree with either

OldNotWIse

Jackal756 wrote: »

I finally got to thank my own post

Have a good weekend!