new ICBF Proofs

Bellview

wiggy123 wrote:

mean re pedigree business in general like.. stars wise mayb not-that's icbf

Need to put up a few actions then as broad statements like that don't really help clarify what you would like to see...too many lads like that making general statements but when you ask for a solution that have none...bit like some rural tds in the daily complain but no solutions

wiggy123

I'm at work at present, hence short response..will clarify soon

Donegalforever

I had a lovely heifer calf this year by FTY out of a AAx cow. Red in colour.
It would have made a lovely cow. Except for one major fault:
It was stone made, so I sold it as a weanling. Wouldn't even think of keeping it for breeding.

tanko

You're not the first person on here who has had wild cattle of FTY.

TPF2012

Have a quiet Fty heifer here. Mother died when heifer was 4 month and I put her in shed and pampered her for 2 months as she wasn't thriving.

FeelTheBern

Is there any date for next round of ICBF beef proofs? Have young bull here that dropped from 4 to 3 Star on last round and hoping he might rally back to 4 on next round.

charolais0153

FeelTheBern wrote: »

Is there any date for next round of ICBF beef proofs? Have young bull here that dropped from 4 to 3 Star on last round and hoping he might rally back to 4 on next round.

Its in june

tanko

Its supposed to be May 16th

patsy_mccabe

tanko wrote: »

Its supposed to be May 16th

GiantPencil

They're up! No work will be done for the rest of today now

patsy_mccabe

Well any movers or shakers? I see Lodge Hamlet (LM4058) has creeped up a bit.

tanko

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

Well any movers or shakers? I see Lodge Hamlet (LM4052) has creeped up a bit.

Hamlet is 4058, these new codes are a pain, very easy to mix them up.
Hamlet is best used on big cows id say.

Havent come across any big changes yet.

patsy_mccabe

Cheers Tanko. Changed it there.

Could someone explain to me how, a bull in the UK Limousin database could be in the top 10% for docility there at 53% Rel and the same bull be in the bottom 10% here at 51% Rel?

Donegalforever

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

Cheers Tanko. Changed it there.

Could someone explain to me how, a bull in the UK Limousin database could be in the top 10% for docility there at 53% Rel and the same bull be in the bottom 10% here at 51% Rel?

I think it proves that the figures we are given are at best only a guide.

charolais0153

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

Cheers Tanko. Changed it there.

Could someone explain to me how, a bull in the UK Limousin database could be in the top 10% for docility there at 53% Rel and the same bull be in the bottom 10% here at 51% Rel?

https://youtu.be/t8TjwIjrDQA

blue5000

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

Cheers Tanko. Changed it there.

Could someone explain to me how, a bull in the UK Limousin database could be in the top 10% for docility there at 53% Rel and the same bull be in the bottom 10% here at 51% Rel?

No.:p All I can say is 'there's lies, damn lies, and then there's statistics'.

https://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/lies-damned-lies-and-statistics.html

Bellview

Looking at angus i see Goulding man o man calving is now 4.6 per cent ..must be double muscle mypstatin causing hard calving..eventhough a number of folks disagreed with me on myostatin would cause calving difficulty..it now appears the numbers are proving myostatin equals hard calving . I also see that Goulding jumbo king has dropped in maternal ..unfortunately a lot of folks have used him and rossiter resulting in bad scores now.
Must do some more reading tomorrow

wiggy123

few bulls went up or down... wonder how accurate the figures are, its relying on folks honesty when entering information in.. re calving details, etc...

FeelTheBern

wiggy123 wrote: »

few bulls went up or down... wonder how accurate the figures are, its relying on folks honesty when entering information in.. re calving details, etc...

An interesting statistic would be to see what % of pedigree calvings (other than blues) are recorded on ICBF as unassisted - 100% perhaps????

GiantPencil

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

Cheers Tanko. Changed it there.

Could someone explain to me how, a bull in the UK Limousin database could be in the top 10% for docility there at 53% Rel and the same bull be in the bottom 10% here at 51% Rel?

What bull are you referring to?

Bellview

FeelTheBern wrote:

An interesting statistic would be to see what % of pedigree calvings (other than blues) are recorded on ICBF as unassisted - 100% perhaps????

Depends on breed...but I can confirm it's not 100 per cent as I have marked calves that came backward as assisted...and I have angus...but I do agree there are pedigree breeders that play with the numbers as I know from angus there are bulls who are cow killers and their calving stats are low

tanko

GiantPencil wrote: »

What bull are you referring to?

I think its Lodge Hamlet.

GiantPencil

That's what I thought too but Hamlet is .01 here which is 5 star within and 3 across breeds so I imagine he's referring to a different bull

patsy_mccabe

GiantPencil wrote: »

What bull are you referring to?

Sorry, only saw this now. Norman Inventor is the bull.

https://webapp.icbf.com/bull-search/view/1293612863

https://www.taurusdata.co.uk/beef/animalmanager/animaldetails/id/9592774



New proofs up tomorrow folks;
https://www.icbf.com/wp/?p=9918

patsy_mccabe

I see they're up now.

GiantPencil

Anyone notice any big swings? Didn't see any big changes myself only that cows I had genotyped had their milk figures come closer to my expectations

charolais0153

GiantPencil wrote: »

Anyone notice any big swings? Didn't see any big changes myself only that cows I had genotyped had their milk figures come closer to my expectations

Some genotyped cows had their figures swung. Cows whos calves are 40 kilos lighter than calves born the same day went down and others went up

patsy_mccabe

Tis like the stock exchange, some up and some down.

Bellview

patsy_mccabe wrote:

Tis like the stock exchange, some up and some down.

Agreed. The next logical step for stars will be the carbon emissions as I see icbf have already started making statements that 5 star are more environmentally friendly.
I have given up thinking about the stars as they defy all logic
I used an old Angus bull jbn and luckily I had a nice heifer. She is probably one of very few calves off him in last 10 years but when I ai he was 4 star and now he is 2 star...there has been very little new data on him so just surprising.
I also notice my old friend goulding jumbo king has taken a big drop...which is also surprising as there was lots of data on him for years and his usage has declined a lot recently...

patsy_mccabe

Bellview wrote: »

Agreed. The next logical step for stars will be the carbon emissions as I see icbf have already started making statements that 5 star are more environmentally friendly.
I have given up thinking about the stars as they defy all logic
I used an old Angus bull jbn and luckily I had a nice heifer. She is probably one of very few calves off him in last 10 years but when I ai he was 4 star and now he is 2 star...there has been very little new data on him so just surprising.
I also notice my old friend goulding jumbo king has taken a big drop...which is also surprising as there was lots of data on him for years and his usage has declined a lot recently...

I think that drop has to do with data coming in from Daughters Calving Interval (fertility). That takes years to come through. The same happened the mighty Wilodge Cerberus (WGE) in the limousin breed. Replacement index has dropped like a stone. Gone from 5 stars at 83% rel to 1 star at 91%. If you look at the previous evaluations for the bull, you can see it's the daughter calving interval that's killing him. I wonder will his straws still be selling at €90 a pop.

It's the Genomic testing that I don't understand. When you genomic test an animal, there is feck all change in their figures. If there was so much to learn about the animal from genomics, why aren't the changes bigger? It's as if the whole project is still in 'work in prigress' mode and they have identified feck all genomic makers to date.