Season 4; Episode 2: 'The Lion and the Rose'; *Have NOT* Read the Books

Sulla Felix

coL wrote: »

That is true but I was assuming that in light of the potential prize (her being "The Queen") the Tyrells would be prepared to endure a little hardship and risk Margery's wellbeing a little.

It being a calculated risk as Joffrey would be unlikely to do anything too extreme to his new wife if only because of the novelty and him not being sick/bored of her yet. It would have made a lot more sense to consumate the marriage and for her to get knocked up as quickly as possible and then arrange for Joffrey to have an "unfortunate accident". Same end result but she is the mother of the future king.

Was the incident with Roz and the other prostitute not meant to be his "first time"? So if he's doing that right off the bat...

kryogen

seligehgit wrote: »

Margaerys appeared to place the goblet on a table adjacent to that of Oleanna's,tricky for her to place the poison unnoticed?
Does anybody think Sansa will eventually fall in love with Tyrion?

I think Tyrion will either be dead or exiled following this! Hopefully exiled (that way he can come back) Cersei hates him, this is her chance to get rid of him once and for all surely?

His father also hates him but I don't know if he hates him enough to have him killed or if he would see exile as the best way forward?

From a purely tv pov I hope he gets exiled, I think it would make more sense if he is (wrongly) found guilty of the murder and killed though, gonna be interesting thats for sure!

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One thing that really bugs me is Tywin is so intelligent, so pragmatic and yet he has such a blind spot when it comes to his children, Jamie has no interest in ruling or politics, Cersei is clearly not up to the job, the one who is most like him, the one who would actually be able to carry on the Lannister legacy is hated by him (and the rest really) and rejected.

If Tywin had invested his efforts in Tyrion and accepted him as his heir and the one who is most like him, most politically sound, most pragmatic etc I think that would have been of huge benefit to the family. It strikes me as odd that he has such a blind spot there, I understand the anger at how his wife died, but family, the name and his legacy seem too important to him to ignore the obvious like this. Not to mention his pragmatism!!

Artful_Badger

Tywin is no fool and cant see him standing for a Lannister being branded a traiter when the real culprit gets ahead eveneven if its tyrion who gets shafted.

Dan_Solo

Artful_Badger wrote: »

Tywin is no fool and cant see him standing for a Lannister being branded a traiter when the real culprit gets ahead eveneven if its tyrion who gets shafted.

I'd have to ask again why he was so bloody useless at the wedding then? Last season we saw him smacking down Joffrey whenever he was out of line.

Saganist

Dan_Solo wrote: »

I'd have to ask again why he was so bloody useless at the wedding then? Last season we saw him smacking down Joffrey whenever he was out of line.

His smack downs of Joffery in past episodes where in private family meetings, plus granted the low key Tyrion and Sansa wedding.

This was the Kings wedding.

Much bigger occasion with a lot more prying eyes.

Artful_Badger

Dan_Solo wrote: »

I'd have to ask again why he was so bloody useless at the wedding then? Last season we saw him smacking down Joffrey whenever he was out of line.

I dont think there was much he could do even if he wanted to which he probably didnt. It was mostly just insulting to Sansa and Tyrion who Tywin had no time for anyway. Like Cersei he seemed bemused by Joffreys treatment of Tyrion. And given it was the kings wedding with everyone who's anyone there to question or attempt to chastise the king (particularly a nutbag like Joffrey) wouldn't have been a good idea.

Dan_Solo

Saganist wrote: »

His smack downs of Joffery in past episodes where in private family meetings, plus granted the low key Tyrion and Sansa wedding.

This was the Kings wedding.

Much bigger occasion with a lot more prying eyes.

More prying eyes, including the new in-laws, seeing Joffrey is a complete nut job is surely more damaging than them all seeing a level headed old hand is really in charge? It's not as if everyone didn't already know Tywin runs the show, and why would he want anyone to think differently?
The Tywin we knew would've dreamed up some "emergency" to get Joffrey bundled off centre stage ASAP as the PR disaster was unfolding.

Bacchus

Tywin is is the brains of the operation and as the brains of the operation he knows, do not put yourself in Joffrey's line of fire when his Kingsguard are in earshot. One word from Joffrey and it's beheading time for Tywin. He knows this. He picks his moments to influence Joffrey subtly without giving Joffrey reason to turn against him. Joffrey was clearly gunning for a bit of action during the wedding, Tywin was probably just holding his tongue... or maybe HE'S THE KILLER!!

Grimebox

I'd love if they massively deviated from how it happened in the books to **** with them snooty book readers :pac:

snausages

This episode was less 'ding dong the witch is dead' and more 'holy ****ing **** that's pretty nasty, ****er bled out of his eyes and everything'. Maybe I'm just too soft.

snausages

Even if Tywin isn't the killer I'd say he isn't particularly heartbroken at his grandson's bloody demise.

I expect Shae is going to get it. There's no other reason for that scene where Cersei points her out at the Wedding. That'll be her retribution.

kryogen

Grimebox wrote: »

I'd love if they massively deviated from how it happened in the books to **** with them snooty book readers :pac:

Would be a great way to **** with everyone alright!

Da Shins Kelly

Watched an old episode from season 3 with my housemate who is catching up, and the scenes between Oleanna Tyrell and Tywin are great. Hope to see more of them together this season. Oleanna is quite crafty and did not seem happy to marry both of her grandchildren to Lannisters. Wouldn't be surprised at all if it was her doing.

GerB40

Grimebox wrote: »

I'd love if they massively deviated from how it happened in the books to **** with them snooty book readers :pac:

Just to let you know, a lot of "them snooty book readers" love the deviations from the books. Seeing as we already know what's gonna happen it's a joy when a character/situation catches us completely off guard.
There has been deviations so far which were amazing and there's bound to be more down the line which I personally can't wait to see.
As long as they keep the huge 'WHAT THE FÙCK????' moments in then both viewers and readers should be relatively happy.